Gunman opens fire in Illinois classroom.

reply to post by grimreaper797


Was the story of the 14 year old, shot at school, also in a gun free zone. He was killed because he was gay, and it freaked out his male classmates. I see no thread on that, just how wild are american schools?

reply to post by andy1033


If it was at school, then it was a "gun free zone". Well, gun free for the people who follow the law. Its gun free until somebody snaps, finds there parents gun (which is a jailable offense for the parents), then goes into school and starts shooting the place. Then its no longer a gun free zone. Its a one gun zone, one gun that is in the hands of a highly dangerous individual. A "gun free zone" is the last place I want to be because in one crazy persons decision it can become the most dangerous place to be.

Everywhere on the huge college/university campus and there is only one gun...and its being pointed at you. THAT is what needs to be changed.

reply to post by grimreaper797


don't know where it was, here is a news page about it.

www.interstateq.com...

Anyone know where OXNARD, VENTURA COUNTY, is. The kid shot, the 14 year old boy, for being gay, in the head. This i assume should of had its own thread, as it still shows, that the gay issue is still a big uncomfortable issue.

It always seems to involve medications, lack of medication, and mental illness.

Here is the sad part. There are people out here like myself that are bipolar and all the sudden we are the bad guys..feared and watched.

Heres my conspiracy paranoid take on the subject:
What if its all a campaign to begin weeding out the undesirables? folks with mental problems

Originally posted by fastwalker23
What if its all a campaign to begin weeding out the undesirables? folks with mental problems

Could be. If we're supposed to adopt a universal health system given that we're already bankrupt and after 50 or so years the UK is beginning to pick and choose who they can afford to give care to and Canada is sending people down here for care establishing a solid foundation for the inevitable eugenic "solution" to the expense of it all would make sense.

Beyond demonizing the "undesireables" I think the medication=madness concept will be used to extend the revocation of gun ownership rights to anyone who has ever been prescribed Claritin effectively disarming the nation.

I guess they go hand in hand. It would have been much harder for the Nazi's to round up gas their crippled/handicapped/Jewish population if they were armed.

All pushing to the purging of the population.

OXNARD, VENTURA COUNTY,

is just north of Malibu and west of L.A. small town with a military base and lots of prostitution. I happen to get lost there a couple years ago exploring the 101, and left as quickly as I came.

On a side note about mental health and rights. By demonizing the ones that have mental health issues and taking away their citizen rights, alot less people are going to want to seek treatment for their problems. I know I would.

[edit on 15-2-2008 by octoberbug]

[edit on 15-2-2008 by octoberbug]

At the very least, Security should be allowed to carry firearms. At the best, I'd want every teacher to have a snub nose. People are crazy, and guns are easy to come by. I'd rather know that if somebody snaps, theres at least one other person with a gun in that situation.

I just registered on ATS because of this topic.

After the Virgina Tech massacre, I noticed that killer Seung-Hui Cho was a Junior at Westfield High School in Chantilly, Virginia, (outside Washington DC), at the same time in May, 2002 when the annual Bilderburg meeting was being held at the Marriott Westfields almost right next door. Now, right next door to both are the new, very fancy headquarters of the extra secretive NRO (National Reconnaissance Office), the same people who seem to need to have their satellite destroyed next week before it crashes to Earth exposing its secret technology.

(To see the geographical relationship of these complexes look at Wikimapia
wikimapia.org...=38.880777&lon=-77.457004&z=15&l=0&m=a&v=2
These coordinates 38.881 -77.457 on other maps will put your reference between these three campuses.)

You may have heard the conspiracy theory that Cho was a contemporary MKULTRA trainee.
The Virgina Tech shootings happened when the Bush Cabal's Justice Department-head Alberto Gonzalez was being investigated, in part for spying on Americans.
Right now the Bush Cabal is once again in serious danger of being exposed because they are having a little difficulty getting a new law in effect to forgive current and past illegal government/corporate mass surveillance of Americans. (Mass surveilance using National Security Agency Narus-6400 supercomputer taps at major telecommunication hubs around the country.)

It is amazing to me that this was a 27 year old graduate student in Sociology publishing papers.

It is all just too weird.

how about instead of making teachers carry guns, just make the guns harder to get full stop! theres no need for people to buy so many weapons. In Australia there is a lot of gun control, and funnily enough there are no school shootings, coincedence?

stop going for the extremes, look at the middle ground.

reply to post by Korsyn01


The only one talking extremes is you, by telling AMERICANS that they should willingly give up their guns because some nut case shoots a place up.

How about this. We sane gun owners KEEP our guns, other sane people go get guns, and next time a nut case grabs a gun, we will be there to protect you and your illogical theories about gun control. Ill give you a cellphone with 911 on speed dial, you give me a .45, we will have a nutcase break into each of our homes with the intent to kill. Lets see whos still alive at the end of the day.

Found something odd, about the Shooter

news.yahoo.com...

He also had a short-lived stint in the Army. He enlisted in the Army in September 2001, but was discharged in February 2002 for an "unspecified" reason, said Army spokesman Paul Boyce.

Can anyone dig anything else up about this?


[edit on 15/2/08 by MikeboydUS]

Ever wonder why the wild west is not "wild" anymore??

Because most folks don't want to be strapped going about their daily business.

My father was a decorated front line combat infantryman and once back home never owned another gun. He was not anti gun mind you, but never measured his masculinity by guns.

You see he never talked about what happened but I learned through 3rd parties later in life. He was a great hunter and excellent marksmen before the war. After the war and all the killing he saw guns differently and never hunted or used guns for sport. I guess that happens after you have killed a number of people. That is if you are sane.

He once received a letter from a Dr in Ohio who thanked him for saving his life...apparently they were on a search and destroy patrol and this man stepped on a mine. My dad carried him several miles back to safety. My mom showed me that letter but dad never mentioned it...He has Alzheimers now and he is gone. But indirectly he taught me that life is about living and loving... I guess that's where I am with guns.

Rarely is the real answer to violence more violence.

reply to post by Leo Strauss


Going out and killing somebody for shooting a family member is wrong. Defending a family member from being shot by shooting the criminal, that is right. War does horrible things to a person, war gets innocent people killed, war is often not an act of self defense, but an act of following the orders of other people.

Originally posted by Korsyn01
how about instead of making teachers carry guns, just make the guns harder to get full stop! theres no need for people to buy so many weapons. In Australia there is a lot of gun control, and funnily enough there are no school shootings, coincedence?

stop going for the extremes, look at the middle ground.

History Lesson Time. The American Revolution started in April 1774, when British troops went to Lexington and Concord to seize the weapons and ammunition stored there by the citizens for self-defense.

The Revolution wasn't sparked by the unpopular taxes or the Stamp Act or the Boston Massacre or any other offenses mentioned in the Declaration of Independence. It was the attempt to disarm Americans that started the shooting.

Until recently, every male 18-65 in Switzerland was required to maintain their own rifle in their home as part of being a member of the military reserves. Switzerland hasn't been invaded in centuries and they have one of the lowest crime rates in the world. Would you break into a house, if you knew the owner had a gun and knew how to use it?

More guns are the answer to "gun crime" not less guns.

Anybody else notice that these mass shootings have one thing in common? That they occur where the victims are prohibited from having a gun to defend themselves. Just one person in the crowd of over 200 could have stopped this. All the gun control in the world will not stop a criminal from getting or using a gun. We need more armed law-biding citizens out there to both deter and stop these acts in their tracks, as happened in the recent Colorado church shooting.

Anybody that thinks arms control has any chance of taking guns out of the hands of criminals need only to look how successful our war against drugs has been keeping drugs off the streets.

This is absolute insanity. We have had this shooting, the city hall shooting, the lands end shooting and the shooting of that poor gay student all in the past 3 weeks.

What happened to offing yourself the old fashioned way? I will never understand these sociopaths who have to take out their suffering on anyone but themselves.

Its a sick, sad world, stories like these barely even make an impact on the social consciousness anymore despite how often stuff like this seems to happen.

reply to post by DancedWithWolves

There was a lecture I saw given by Michael Tsarion in which he says "Insanity is a sane reaction to an insane society" or something to that effect. People say 'oh well I didn't ever see the signs' but that just means they never stopped to look because everybody needs to connect.

Another one, what a drag!

Eventually this is going to happen so often that people are just going to turn a blind eye. It's inevitable! It's not just schools either, it's everywhere. I honestly don't think banning guns will stop this madness. People will find a way if they're dead on doing something.

What a sad way to go, not only for the victims, but for the victimizer! That persons family has to live with that for the rest of their lives. "My son/daughter want on a mass killing spree, and then killed him/herself." Can you imagine that?

I know what this person did affected everyone in a horrific way, but maybe his intentions were good?

Nevermind me, I just have a weird way of thinking!

reply to post by MikeboydUS


The Yahoo News story continues with this:

but he told a friend he'd gotten a psychological discharge.

One other interesting point Yahoo News and others already posted here mention:

story link...

Same gun dealer sold to 2 campus killers

MADISON, Wis. - The online gun dealer who sold a weapon to the Virginia Tech shooter said it was an unnerving coincidence that he also sold handgun accessories to the man who killed five students at Northern Illinois University.

It's hard to say what set this off in the shooter's mind. Perhaps just being off meds. Perhaps splitting up with girlfriend. The Yahoo story mentioned he had a tatto of a doll from "Saw" on his arm I believe. I don't know if this matters any but who knows.


Aria Pano

First a warm ATS welcome to you! I added the star to you reply.

I don't know if any MKULTRA connection can ever be proven here or not. It's along my thinking anyway. How are we to know that the anti-gun lobby is not behind all of these with the upcomming election in mind.
It's a simple solution. Convince a few mentally ill to go off their meds and plant a suggestion in their head of why they need to go on a shooting rampage. The campus buses were not running on the day of the shooting either. Perhaps it one big conspiracy. Perhaps just another school shooting.


From Blacklisted News.com...

Another story on the killings with photo belived to be that of the killer

Edited by Sanity Lost for not spelling a few things correctly

[edit on 16-2-2008 by Sanity Lost]

reply to post by Aria Pano

Thank you so much for your post, that is such important information right now. I agree with you completely, there are way too many dots to connect here for it to just be all totally unrelated.


[edit on 17-2-2008 by intronaut]