Americans need to go on strike!

Originally posted by stellawayten
The corporations and governement make money from us working. They depend on it. If we are slaves like some have said then just stop. Stop working, stop consuming. Just stop. Of course it won't work if just a handful participate. We have to beat them at their own game. In fact, lets ALL go on welfare. Let's take money from them. (Them being the gov't and corporate scabs that continue to work.)

This is silly, and infuriating.

You claim we are slaves to the government and corporations, so to remedy this, you propose we should all become dependent on the government (which exactly what welfare is). Then you dare turn around and call those very people who will be paying for your dependence "scabs." Yes, how dare they pay for your welfare! How dare they work to essentially take care of you! The nerve!

Who is going to work to create your electricity? Oh sure, like you say, you can buy generators, but you must think that generators grow on trees -- people have to work to make them. How are you going to get the gas for the generators, if there is no one working the pumps, or bringing the gasoline to the gas-stations. What about your food? Oh yes, you say we can grow crops and you and your husband can get wild-boar. Fantastic! But we all don't have the means to grow crops; but you'll feed us all, right? Then again, how are you going to get it to us when there's no gasoline? We can keep going on with this, but we already know the answer.

The answer...who is going to do all this, to make sure society is running, who are you going to be dependent on to make sure you still have your basic services? That's right, "the scabs!" Those horrible, evil people you are dependent on for your gas, your electricity, your heating, and who will bringing your lazy behind your welfare check! The very people you will be taking money from (you yourself said you would be taking money from them). You whine that you are a slave, and that the evil government and corporations are stealing your money, yet for some reason you think you have a right to the "scabs" money. What gives you a right to anyone else's money, or the fruit of their labors?

How would any of this beat them at "their own game?" How is making yourself dependent on other people somehow freeing you from your "slavery." If anything, it further moves you down the path to slavery.

I was wrong...this isn't just silly, it's the height of stupidity. You should be ashamed of yourself.

[edit on 13-2-2008 by SaviorComplex]

Do you know how backed up the irs is? AHAHAHAHAHAH Its laughable. It really is...all these laws and tax codes are scare tactics because non of them are based on human or civil rights in any constitutional context or global economic sovereignty conext as well. Its all an illusion!! They dont understand all the laws themselves but have to deal with them because of how complex our BS monetary system is. Ever wonder why it takes years and years to get audited? HAHAHAHA...what a bunch of jokers. THey could be doing so much more good helping people and families INVEST their hard earned money instead of persecuting them for paying BS taxes.

reply to post by SaviorComplex



Well...if you dont think we are all economic slaves to a monetary system then try not paying for food. HA! Basic human needs attached to superficial means of wants and desires manifested on paper!! IT RUNS OUT....human interaction does not. THAT is how we will survive my friend. You ask me how we will PAY for food and then i ask you why it always has to be about money. You answer that specific question and you will have found your own conclusions about who is really in control in this world and your life either directly or indirectly.

Money doesnt help people...people help people. The illusion is that we need paper backed by BS government laws which control every aspect of it for the benefit of larger entities other than the single hard working man to survive as humans and reach accomplishments. EVeer wonder what a world without money would be like? HAHAH try and answer that question for yoruself....once you stop thinking about saving money, making money, taking money and dealing with it you will HAVE to find a NEW WAY to live.


THAT Is the point here my friend. No divisions just a new thought process other than what we were taught by our schools which coincidently are RUN by large corporations covertly through banks. Think about it.....debt, cash, central banking systems, the human condition and the nature of its emotions. LAbor for money to have life have been congruent for centuries when the truth is that the only we we should be laboring for is our collective existence so that we cqan evolve spiritually, mentally and physically in a world of peace. Stop asking how you will PAY for things and start asking how you can help people without asking the to PAY.

Originally posted by GUICE2
Basic human needs attached to superficial means of wants and desires manifested on paper!! IT RUNS OUT....human interaction does not.

Stop asking how you will PAY for things and start asking how you can help people without asking the to PAY.

Wow, you used a lot of words to say absolutely nothing at all. You did demonstrate your ability to use buzzwords, but unfortunately for you, that isn't a real-world skill.

You need to go back and read what I actually wrote. Did you actually read it? I doubt it. Where did I ask about how would we pay for things? What I asked was who would be running things, the services you need to survive, if everyone went on strikes. It's the OP's hated "scabs" who provide for her and everyone that agrees with her while they are depending on "welfare" during their "strike."

Human interaction does run out. We only have 24 hours in a day, we do not have the ability to work for infinite amounts of time. We do not have access to unlimited resources. Our ability to produce is finite, as finite as money.

[edit on 13-2-2008 by SaviorComplex]

It's a wonderful idea, but nothing more than flight of fancy. This could not and would not work. Why? Because people, in and of themselves, are greedy and self-serving. Therein lies the heart of the problem. There once was a time when people had to rely on each other, hence the saying "It takes a village" - because once upon a time, it did.

Modern society has marketed, advertised and indictrinated the masses to believe that each person is "Individually special" and that they are "Entitled" to life's excessive indulgences. That's why you always have the Smiths trying desperately to keep up with Jones'. As someone mentioned earlier, money is the root of the problem and the tool that enslaves us. The mainstream media and its never-ending mantra to consume and spoil one's self is the mechanism. Any attempt to pull the plug on this system will be met with complete anarchy.

Let's examine for a moment... There is a contingent of the population, the "Have's" who could easily weather out such a strike. They have ample amounts of money and resources at their disposal to do so. These are also the people that the "Have Not's" would be striking against. Think logiocally for a moment... how long would it be before people were collaborating with the "Haves" in order to provide for themselve sand their families? How long would it be before the "Have Nots" took to the streets and began to loot, incite violence against the "Haves" and organize into angry mobs destroying everything in sight? Who would stop them? Hurricane Katrina is a perfect example of what happens when society breaks-down. A nation-wide strike is simply an organized shutting-down of modern society.

On the other hand, there would be those people anxious to exploit a strike and would work for increased wages for those who had the resources to pay them (Supply and Demand). They would care not about the welfare of mankind, the over-all benefit that the strike effect could have on society and instead serve their own selfish interests. They would take advantage of the sacrifices made by some to advance their own cause. It would, in turn, negate much of the effect and impact of the strike.

So you see, in this modern and Capitalist society an organized strike would have little overall effect due to the lack of total participation and the inability to keep order. Instead, a steady awakening of people needs to be undertaken and more and people need to "Drop out" of the existing system. People need to focus on consuming locally, trading products and services amongst neighbors, families and friends and conserving. Until the core fo the system is converted a strike won't accomplish anything as we will simply return to the way it was before the strike.

reply to post by stellawayten



I agree we need to do something.

I have already cut way back on my consumption, turn down the heat turn off the lights, quit buying gasoline, and eat light.

I already heard gas prices will fall by 50 cents by summer if we keep buying less.
Which apparently we are.

reply to post by SaviorComplex


You didnt answer my question....you only said that my points are null because we are forced into a pissing contest when discussing these issues. Same side, im not the enemy. Misunderstandings rule over threads on this forum so lets try and find common ground. Welfare doesnt exist in my world because i beleive that when someone NEEDS help they should get it. The fact that we attach money to human needs is sickening to me. That's what i was saying so dont tell me i didnt say anything
Answer my question...what do you have when a world doesnt want to anxiety of a monetary system? You have people....yes resources are finite but cooperation and understanding will lead to a new day ruled by compassion and unification. So money and profit dont enter into the picture right? You would love to see world peace right? They wouldnt be SCABS in my world because i understand that we are all FORCED to labor for money just to be able to live in this society and when the working population (even the corporate fat cats whose wealth is all based in debt) realize this they will see who is actually controlling our infrastructure. Not only physically though...they control our definitions and our education and manipulate it so that people like me and you will be divided when our goal is a commone one.

SO....does this put us on the same page? Can we discuss how to save the human race instead of how to tread water in a failing economy and therefore society? Can you not see how these societal contexts, definitions and beleif structures inherently divide us? The best tool used to control the human race and the working populace is divide and conquer. We fight amongst ourselves....we lose. I dont know if you have noticed but lately i see a lot of fighting.

So now what do you think about what i have to say?

reply to post by stellawayten


the trick here is to get EVERYONE to participate and in a society full of people who really dont care about anyone but themselves..it sadly will not work.

Originally posted by GUICE2
Welfare doesnt exist in my world because i beleive that when someone NEEDS help they should get it.

They wouldnt be SCABS in my world because i understand that we are all FORCED to labor for money just to be able to live in this society and when the working population (even the corporate fat cats whose wealth is all based in debt) realize this they will see who is actually controlling our infrastructure.

SO....does this put us on the same page?

So now what do you think about what i have to say?

That it's incredibly stupid. That's what I think of it. And no, we are not on the same page.

No matter what, no matter what kind of system you want to inact, be it a the horribly eeeeeeeeeeeeeevil capitalist system or a subsistance barter system like you want, you are FORCED to labor. Your needs force you. Even in your stupid little barter system (which will bring about human utopia! *PUKE!*) you still have to work (or as you see it, in your incredibly lazy ways -- forced labor) to provide for yourself. It doesn't change.

Of course, you want someone else do do it for you.

reply to post by MuseInPink


Why would you want *everyone* to participate in your lazy dreams? Where is your heating coming from? Your electricity? Your food? Who is going to bring it to you when there is no gasoline, or anyone to drive the trucks?

Of course, you want to rely on the scabs, take their money, so you can be lazy while "sticking it to the man."

It will only be so long before the producers, those who actually work, get tired of supporting you lazy sacks.

Just thought i could share a link with everyone, hope it will contribute to the upcoming world of peace.
eraofpeace.org...

Originally posted by SaviorComplex

Originally posted by GUICE2
Welfare doesnt exist in my world because i beleive that when someone NEEDS help they should get it.

They wouldnt be SCABS in my world because i understand that we are all FORCED to labor for money just to be able to live in this society and when the working population (even the corporate fat cats whose wealth is all based in debt) realize this they will see who is actually controlling our infrastructure.

SO....does this put us on the same page?

So now what do you think about what i have to say?

That it's incredibly stupid. That's what I think of it. And no, we are not on the same page.

No matter what, no matter what kind of system you want to inact, be it a the horribly eeeeeeeeeeeeeevil capitalist system or a subsistance barter system like you want, you are FORCED to labor. Your needs force you. Even in your stupid little barter system (which will bring about human utopia! *PUKE!*) you still have to work (or as you see it, in your incredibly lazy ways -- forced labor) to provide for yourself. It doesn't change.

Of course, you want someone else do do it for you.

Just another form of Ignorance, Nobody listen to this guy, all he wants to do is promote the way society is now.

Originally posted by darcon
Just another form of Ignorance, Nobody listen to this guy, all he wants to do is promote the way society is now.

What is ignorant is the desire for other people to produce for you, to think that you somehow have a right to the "scabs" money because they dare to actual work and produce. What is ignorant is thinking that even in the most basic society that you don't have to work. What is ignorant is thinking you can be lazy, and take money from people, and they won't get fed up with it.

All you want to promote is laziness. What you want is other people to do the work for you.

And what you ulimately what is to promote a society where human potential is not realized. In your stupid little dream society, where we have to scrap and subsist on the most basic level, nothing is achieved other than base survival. If your waking hours are devoted exclusively to worrying about keeping warm, producing your food, protecting your family, and so forth, there is never time for anything else. Human creativity becomes stagnant.

You can whine all you want about the horrors of a capitalistic society, how horrible it is to be a "slave" to the government and corporations and money, and whatever other moronic buzzword you want to use. But think about this. Do you think the wonderful inventions you are using to whine about this could have ever been created in either you world of laziness, or your world of basic subsistence? What about great works of art? The answer? No! Because evil things like corporations and money freed people from the basic drudgeries of existence, allowing them to exercise their imagination and creativity.

[edit on 13-2-2008 by SaviorComplex]

reply to post by SaviorComplex


Wow...youre one of those huh?
Well... i never said anything about not wanting to Labor for life. I said stop laboring for money which we are forced to exchange for life. I dont know how to put it much more simply. Money grows on trees for banks because they are allowed to created credits through creative accounting....just search for fractional reserve lending and you will see the cause for any economic collapse. You dont understand why money is in existence....you are absolutely right. WE need to work for our infrastructure but first we had to be taught, like you say, not to be lazy. SO....the promise of wealth is a pretty good muse dont you think? Yet you can see how agendas can become corrupt when profit become the focul point and i think what the op is trying to say is that the organizations for which profit is the focul point run our society instead of the people which yes of course, should be laboring for their society. So understand this....money had its purpose in human evolution but is detrimental for the next level of existence. We are on the same page because i understand that humans have to labor for their existence...in fact that is exactly what i said you just missed it. I dont know maybe you are a disinfo agent or something, you arent right?
I said we should labor for our lives and not for money in a system where we are forced to exhange it for the right to our lives.....why dont you get that? So this means....barter or not, who the hell needs bartering? You call it bartering i call it common sense. If they need people at the power plant for societies infrastructure fill the jobs with people who care about having lights and electricity....wait a second, that is everyone isnt it? So therein lies your motivation...not monetary wealth. Making that switch in direction for what we want to what we need is the difficult decision. THe problem here is that you beleive in the artificial world of money too much....and i dont. I beleive in human nature...will some people be left behind? sure they will, will most not understand and persecute me for preaching love and compassion not profits and wealth? Sure they will.....but i dont Effing care. The loss of humanity in this society is such that it gives me nightmares because i do not accept it in any way shape or form. I dont get why most people accept authority as truth and not the other way around. Im dont with this thread because its too damn exhuasting so blast me if you will but the message is clear i hope to those who have open hearts and minds to listen. Peace to you my man and remember never to bow to money and let it control your human emotions. My point was to help you realize that you are already defeated and that we all should stop perpetuating thought processes that divide us. You see someone who needs heat? Stop asking how to PAY for it and make them a fire.

Originally posted by SaviorComplex


That it's incredibly stupid. That's what I think of it. And no, we are not on the same page.

No matter what, no matter what kind of system you want to inact, be it a the horribly eeeeeeeeeeeeeevil capitalist system or a subsistance barter system like you want, you are FORCED to labor. Your needs force you. Even in your stupid little barter system (which will bring about human utopia! *PUKE!*) you still have to work (or as you see it, in your incredibly lazy ways -- forced labor) to provide for yourself. It doesn't change.

Of course, you want someone else do do it for you.

No one is saying anything about not having to work. We just won't have to work for corporations. And just because you don't have a job that pays you in money doesn't mean that you are lazy. The only reason I said anything about welfare is because I thought that it might break the government sooner.

You need to go back and re-read what myself and others are saying. This isn't about being lazy. Not one bit! This is about taking the control back, taking our lives back, taking our country back.

reply to post by SaviorComplex


Im sorry but people like you are the reason why human growth is stagnant. Yes we were brought here because of the muse of wealth and profit....blah blah blah we get it. What the enlightened ones are saying is that we must realize that we actually got here on our own sweat and tears and the existence of paper money was the teacher to our life lesson. Your the type of guy that would see a homeless man in the street and call him lazy right? If im wrong please tell me....please tell me im wrong. If you want to stop human suffering you have to change how youthink first. you need a lot of soul searching my friend but i still love you and would die for youre freedom to live if it came to that.

No one wants to be lazy, they just want to not be manipulated. I cant beleive this is such an argument for people.....

Originally posted by GUICE2
You see someone who needs heat? Stop asking how to PAY for it and make them a fire.

Awesome! I'll do just that! But wait...if I build it in their house, then they could get carbon monoxide poisoning, or it could burn down their house. We could build it outside, but that would leave them exposed to the elements like rain and snow. Then they get sick from exposure, or injured by carbon monoxide poisoning or burn when their house goes up, I could take them to the hospital. Except, I don't have gas for a car (or even a car at all); even if I got them to the hospital, there's no power because no one is producing electricity, or medicines because no one is producing those. I guess they are as good as dead.

Now, where did I ask how to "pay" for anything; I asked how things are going to get done. There is a big difference, but in your ignorance you think there are on in the same. Of course, the scenario above ignores the idea of limited resources...

I could build them a fire, but I can't just give away my wood...it's a limited resource. What if I don't have enough, or what if they cannot give me anything in return (I'm assuming you couldn't, since you refuse to work). Why should I give you part of my limited resource when you either cannot help me in return or refuse to? Why should I hurt myself?

Originally posted by stellawayten
No one is saying anything about not having to work. We just won't have to work for corporations. And just because you don't have a job that pays you in money doesn't mean that you are lazy. The only reason I said anything about welfare is because I thought that it might break the government sooner.

You need to go back and re-read what myself and others are saying. This isn't about being lazy. Not one bit! This is about taking the control back, taking our lives back, taking our country back.

None of that is what you originally said. You wanted to be on welfare, so other people have to pick up the tab for a while. You are just a leech!

You want to take it back, by being on welfare, by not working? That makes since. You want to take back your lives by being dependent on the "scabs." That makes sense.

Oh sure, everyone being on welfare will break the government; but then you'll start whining you aren't getting the services you actually want. You'll be demanding the "scabs" produce more for you.

The producers will get tired of it, get tired of you being a leech, and cut you off. Let you starve and go cold.

And society will be better off without you.

[edit on 13-2-2008 by SaviorComplex]

reply to post by stellawayten

I'm not sure shutting down the country as we know it through a mass 'sit in' is the answer but believe that passive resistance is an excellent option. Walk the walk so to speak and sacrifice a little toward good.
One very small example of what I'm talking about is that I won't set foot in a Wal-Mart because I abhor their work practices. If I have to pay more to mom&pop or just do without, so be it. Now if everyone would start doing things like that and cutting back on fuel usage ect like a previous poster mentioned (the list goes on and on), it would have to have a positive effect.
I'm getting wound up here but you can make a difference, -I've seen it.
Be wise and act.

reply to post by SaviorComplex

you are unbelievable, for someone to say that i want to promote laziness!?!?!?! I want to Promote peace, And to get out of a Society where Money Controls everything, Money is the Root of all evil my friend. And to say that i want to promote a society where human potential is not realized!!!!, it is the exact opposite of what i am Promoting. By being slaves to the Government we are hiding are true potential. You really are piece of work you know that.