Putin accuses U.S., NATO of reviving an 'arms race'

Putin accuses U.S., NATO of reviving an 'arms race'

www.washingtontimes.com

He repeated old complaints that NATO took advantage of Moscow's weakness in the wake of the collapse of the Soviet Union to expand the alliance to Russia's borders and to boost spending on missile defense systems and other programs despite the end of the Cold War.



"We closed [Soviet-era] bases in Cuba and Vietnam. What did we get? New American bases in Romania, Bulgaria, a new third missile defense system in Poland," Mr. Putin said.



Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice and other top U.S. officials insist the modest missile defense system being considered in Poland and the Czech Republic poses no threat to Russia's vast missile arsenal — an argument the Kremlin has never accepted.

(visit the link for the full news article)

the last thing the US should want to do is start something up with Russia again, but, who would have guessed, they are. Putin has right to be bothered by things like this, and although he says he doesnt want to be involved in an arms race, i think there will be one. i think both countries are just looking for excuses to mess with each other.

What do you guys think? Comments?

www.washingtontimes.com
(visit the link for the full news article)

Originally posted by wisefoolishness


the last thing the US should want to do is start something up with Russia again, but, who would have guessed, they are. Putin has right to be bothered by things like this, and although he says he doesnt want to be involved in an arms race, i think there will be one. i think both countries are just looking for excuses to mess with each other.

What do you guys think? Comments?

www.washingtontimes.com
(visit the link for the full news article)

Actually that is the first nation we should take out. So much cyber crime originates from there. They are a huge ally of our enemies, and the US could use the strategic locations.

I say strike now while they have a divided state. Use Putin's enemies against him, and make Russia an Extension of the USAsia

reply to post by Quazga


i dont think that the US should be looking to start crap with anyone, because as soon as they start something with one country, a chain reaction will happen.

I lurk in Russian forum and people there feel the same as Putin does.
US - f-22, Boing + laser, EM gun, Huge US defence budget, gps artillery, and ctr. All this seen as arms race, with it's goal to overthrow current government and then install "orange" democrats (which are referred to as sh-ee-tocrats) who will be western puppets.
Even those who see that current government is corrupt,to say the least, worry about such possibility.
I think that the situation is very dangerous. Unstable Russia + nukes = Earth looking like Mars.

Originally posted by wisefoolishness
reply to post by Quazga

 

i dont think that the US should be looking to start crap with anyone, because as soon as they start something with one country, a chain reaction will happen.

The thing is, the chain reaction is going to occur at some point. The only answer to world peace is a one world government. And the only way to reach that is hegemonic imperialism.

Take Russia out now, which will weaken both Iran and China, and yes it will press the issue, but if we don't do it now, then we will have to do it later when they have gained much more than they have now. It will be much tougher then. Islam realizes this, which is why they are attempting to re-instate the Caliphate. Unfortunately Americans don't have the backbone that Arabs do.

You gotta strike while the iron is hot.

Originally posted by ZeroKnowledge
I lurk in Russian forum and people there feel the same as Putin does.
US - f-22, Boing + laser, EM gun, Huge US defence budget, gps artillery, and ctr. All this seen as arms race, with it's goal to overthrow current government and then install "orange" democrats (which are referred to as sh-ee-tocrats) who will be western puppets.
Even those who see that current government is corrupt,to say the least, worry about such possibility.
I think that the situation is very dangerous. Unstable Russia + nukes = Earth looking like Mars.

And this is why we have to infiltrate now. We must remove Russia, China, and Iran in order to have any hope for mankind.

reply to post by Quazga


if the US were to attack Russia, then China, and Iran would both Attack the US. America can't handle three large foes at once, as we cant even handle untrained Iraqi civilians.

Originally posted by Quazga
And this is why we have to infiltrate now. We must remove Russia, China, and Iran in order to have any hope for mankind.

Hmm, how are you going to deal with Russian nukes? Their new warheads are unstopable. Start something with Russia, and it's bye bye America. If you disagree you are delusional. So don't embaress your self more than you did already.

Fax

Originally posted by FaxMachine

Originally posted by Quazga
And this is why we have to infiltrate now. We must remove Russia, China, and Iran in order to have any hope for mankind.

Hmm, how are you going to deal with Russian nukes? Their new warheads are unstopable. Start something with Russia, and it's bye bye America. If you disagree you are delusional. So don't embaress your self more than you did already.

Fax

So you think we should just prolong the inevitable? If they don't use them now, they will use them later. I rather get it overwith now, then live under the political oppression that we have now.

Confront the enemy, NOW. Yes it will cause war on a scale we have never seen, but it will be much much worse in the future if we don't do it now. And if you dont think so, then *you* my fellow colleague are delusional

Originally posted by wisefoolishness
reply to post by Quazga

 

if the US were to attack Russia, then China, and Iran would both Attack the US. America can't handle three large foes at once, as we cant even handle untrained Iraqi civilians.

I agree, We definitely need to plan for this much better than the current administration has done. We need a plan that creates a military force like never before seen. We need to drop a nuke on Tehran, Moscow, and Beijing, all without warning, but it has to look like it was internal terrorists. So it can't be launched via missile, it has to be done in tandem with their own internal insurgents.

reply to post by Quazga


the US is rather good at pointing fingers, and has done so rather successfully in previous wars, but dropping 3 or 4 nukes on 3 or 4 major cities in rival countries would make it pretty obvious that the US was behind it, wouldn't you agree?

It reminds me of

"you give your enemy an inch and they take a mile"

This is what putin means, he knows nato and usa want it all. Russia is virtually the only country staying in the way of the nwo, they thought they beat them, but putin has given them back there country.

Russia knows america has very high techs, and all russia has to do is, defend itself, and show the world, that america can be held back, if its possible.

You lot should hear who is behind, barack obama(people should not be voting for him), there whole clan want to take over russia. So this is something russia knows, can it hold them back.

For any of you that say that the world would be better of with just one power, puting is right, when saying why is american way the right way, and the world would be better of with a balance, of two sides.

[edit on 2/9/2008 by andy1033]

Originally posted by wisefoolishness
reply to post by Quazga

 

the US is rather good at pointing fingers, and has done so rather successfully in previous wars, but dropping 3 or 4 nukes on 3 or 4 major cities in rival countries would make it pretty obvious that the US was behind it, wouldn't you agree?

Not necessarily, especially if we speak out against it in the media immediately. Think 9/11.

Originally posted by Quazga


And this is why we have to infiltrate now. We must remove Russia, China, and Iran in order to have any hope for mankind.

iow, Gorbachev made a huge mistake.


do you honestlys believe world government (which afaics is little more than a formality, considering it does not matter if you're commanded about by corrupt clan in city A or city B) would change the fact that a certain creed of people are intermittently trying to gain an advantage by destroying others' lives for the sake of their own grandeur and egotism? (although the jury's still out why they're really doing it)

world gov't would first and foremost destroy much if not most of humanity, not necessarily in a physical sense, although that has to be expected. people who are constanly looking for enemies will never stop as long as they breathe, so they will keep going no matter if the world is subjugated already, in fact i'd wager the mayhem would only start at this point, because this is not about political or military goals, but about philosophy. their inherent reliability plays a crucial role on the downward leg of civilisation, obviously.

most empires are debasing themselves, so no outside influence is required, but you'll probably find out soon enough.


PS: you mentioned somewhere that you're a member of Infraguard? could've sworn....

reply to post by Quazga


maybe if it was just one nuke, but more than one makes it obvious. we would have to get the bomb there quietly, leave quietly, and have it set off.

Originally posted by wisefoolishness
reply to post by Quazga

 

maybe if it was just one nuke, but more than one makes it obvious. we would have to get the bomb there quietly, leave quietly, and have it set off.

Yeah you are probably right about that. It would be easier to play it off in a slow drawn out process.

Originally posted by Long Lance

Originally posted by Quazga


And this is why we have to infiltrate now. We must remove Russia, China, and Iran in order to have any hope for mankind.

iow, Gorbachev made a huge mistake.


do you honestlys believe world government (which afaics is little more than a formality, considering it does not matter if you're commanded about by corrupt clan in city A or city B) would change the fact that a certain creed of people are intermittently trying to gain an advantage by destroying others' lives for the sake of their own grandeur and egotism? (although the jury's still out why they're really doing it)

world gov't would first and foremost destroy much if not most of humanity, not necessarily in a physical sense, although that has to be expected. people who are constanly looking for enemies will never stop as long as they breathe, so they will keep going no matter if the world is subjugated already, in fact i'd wager the mayhem would only start at this point, because this is not about political or military goals, but about philosophy. their inherent reliability plays a crucial role on the downward leg of civilisation, obviously.

most empires are debasing themselves, so no outside influence is required, but you'll probably find out soon enough.


PS: you mentioned somewhere that you're a member of Infraguard? could've sworn....

The thing that causes the most civilization demise is two things

1. Generating a market for mercenaries
2. Not exterminating them when through

The ancient civilizations of the hellenic period were destroyed by the very paramilitary they developed to fight wars for them.

Rome had the same issue.

We will as well if we defeat our enemies and don't exterminate the mercenary forces developed for it, because then they will need jobs and will, as you stated above, find work with the people who have money + philosophical axes to grind.

But that's an entirely different problem.

My thesis is this. The way our geopolitical existence is today begs a three-fold question:

1. Tread water and leave the current geopolitical dynamic to future generations to figure out?
2. Confront the demon we are facing and follow the plan of the NeoCons
3. Forget it all and go back to tribalism

No matter what we do moving forward, we will be doing at least one of these. We have been operating on #1 Ever since the cold war began. I find much more meaning in 3 and 2 in that order. However, I'm pretty much alone in my philosophical beliefs about #3, so I put all of my political effort toward number 2.

Yes I am a member of Infragard, on the cyber defense front.

Originally posted by FaxMachine

Originally posted by Quazga
And this is why we have to infiltrate now. We must remove Russia, China, and Iran in order to have any hope for mankind.

Hmm, how are you going to deal with Russian nukes? Their new warheads are unstopable. Start something with Russia, and it's bye bye America. If you disagree you are delusional. So don't embaress your self more than you did already.

Fax

The nuke option will be obsolete soon enough. With advancements in US anti missile defense systems, along with space forces such as FALCON and SUSTAIN, kinetic strike platforms orbiting space, with the capability to take out deeply buried targets anywhere in the world with in mere minutes, russias military along with chinas, will be obsolete when compared to americas forces. This could trigger an altercation between russian, china, against the US before russia and chinas conventional forces become obsolete. And the nuclear option for russia will more then likely become obsolete within a decade, if it isnt already..

Just look at what DARPA and the pentagon have lined out for US forces.

Google Video Link

link in case the video doesnt work.
video.google.com...


Further more, I am by no means advocating war with russia.



[edit on 9-2-2008 by West Coast]

I would also like to point out that I am not in favor of starting war with anyone, and am only discussing possibilities.