Lakota Indians Withdraw Treaties Signed With U.S.

Originally posted by cavscout

Originally posted by sizzle

Her claim is that she was adopted and raised by a white family by force of the U.S. gov. She says that there was an attempt by our gov about 30-40 yrs ago to seperate all children born to NA families, in order to force extinction of the NA's in this country. Any one know anything about this?

The last time the federal government did anything like this was longer ago than 40 years, more like before the world wars.

It did happen, though. Usually it was more like sending the children to special schools where their hair was cut short and they were beaten if caught speaking native tongues.. [sarcasm]What self respecting white man would want to adopt a savage, after all[/sarcasm]

Ok, so I was wrong again. I talked to my family about this and it did happen rather recently under called the indian child welfare act, or something similarly named.

Apparently there were many adoptions to white families.

I am only 27, so this was just a little before my time.

Pertaining to natives and the white man:

War is a way for mankind to commit genocide. “What if war is a way to defend freedom”, you say? Defense means a boundary is being protected. Freedom does not have a boundary. You only need to “defend freedom” when your “freedom” is false.

The united states of america were founded when the white man made contracts with the natives and then the contracts were breached by the white man. Now the government wants americans to honor their contracts, as if contracts are now something to be honored, while the foundation is based upon broken contracts.

“Love it or leave it!”, you say? Does saying “love it or leave it” invalidate the preceding paragraph? No, it does not! Saying “love it or leave it” only serves to protect tyrants and the dishonorable.

The white man has no honor. The white man pretends to have honor in the name of "progress" or the "common good" or "god" so the white man may commit his dishonorable acts with a clear conscience.

“Progress” is anything which expands or refines the ability of tyrants to keep people as economic slaves. (Tyrants are: bankers, judges, authorities, the “immune”, pseudo entities,....) "Progress" creates a hierarchy of injustice.

The “common good” does not protect the individual. The “common good” protects the ability of tyrants to keep people as economic slaves.

“God” means whatever tyrants and the dishonorable want “god” to mean in order to achieve their illegitimate goals. Even if the meaning is contradictory.

There can be no god amongst the just/equal because the term “god” is intrinsically hierarchal. Hierarchy and justice are mutually exclusive. (Anyone opposing this is either brainwashed with the “unequal justice” oxymoron or a liar.) Justice has no place for god. Only injustice has a place for god. Do you foolishly believe god wants justice? The claim of god being a “just god” is an oxymoron. A "just god” would have to stop being “god” and become an equal. God worshipers respond to this by saying: “God was referring to another kind of justice.” What other kind of justice is there?

False justice allows a rich and poor hierarchy. True justice prevents a rich and poor hierarchy. The existence of rich and poor proves the “justice” of this world is false. (The courts are partial toward the social mechanism of money and therefore the courts are a fraud with a conflict of interest.) The courts and authorities claim to be legitimate and it is a colossal lie.

Urbanization and suburbanization cannot exist where there is true justice because there cannot be a hierarchy of proletariat and officials. Many will not accept a life of rural subsistence and this is why the blight of “progress” exists. This indicates a fundamental flaw in human existence which is probably due to extra-mundane manipulation/experimentation.

No one belongs in this world of broken contracts, false justice and lies.

This world of broken contracts, false justice and lies does not belong anywhere.

(I am a white man, by the way. The unusual urge to write these words occurred on a July morning, 2007. These words are in another thread but they also pertain to this thread.)

Hi cavscout. any details you could provide on these forced adoptions would be helpful.
my friend was around 32 yoa when she told me of this, and this was about 7 yrs ago. that is just an approximate guess if it helps any.

Are there any maps showing the territory of this new Nation?

Originally posted by Becker44
Yeah good for them. I think some of the supporters on this thread should join this new and wonderful country! It seems they have a utopia for all to enjoy.

Lakota teen suicides are 150 per cent above the norm for the U.S.; infant mortality is five times higher than the U.S. average; and unemployment is rife, according to the Lakota freedom movement's website.

www.foxnews.com...

I also love the fact Bush has been brought into this argument. Of course this silly propaganda by the Indians is Bush's fault. How moronic of me not to notice.

pffft!

Becker

I really hope it works out for them.

Hell If they succeed, I'll pack up here & go live there lol

I have several friends here in AU who are Lakota. They immigrated here some time ago to get away from the US & its crap.

I'm sure that when they hear bout this, they might also considere returnung home again.

Originally posted by IgnoranceIsntBlisss
Are there any maps showing the territory of this new Nation?

Someone ought to read whole threads in future. Look at page 2 or 3, chum.

On another note, I noticed some members here tried to pin the blame for the horrible treatment of the NA on the British, French and Spanish.

Well, while the Spanish may have been keen on slaughtering the natives (see Tenochtitlan 1/4 million dead when the city fell), British and French settlers were actually quite friendly with the Natives, on the whole.

The British even allied with them (Iroquois) against the fledgling USA during the Rebellion. Maybe this is why the Americans treated them so badly afterwards.

Seeing as the US has been independent for over 230 years, and the greatest atrocities were committed 150 years ago, it seems somewhat childish and "slopey-shouldered" to blame someone else, although judging by reactions to other threads, Americans accepting blame for anything is akin to the moon turning purple and calling itself Frank.

All you have to do is see how Canadians treat (and treated when under British rule) their Natives compared to how the US treated theirs, and you'll see that it is in fact entirely the fault of the US Government and no amount of revisionist history will change what was done.

Originally posted by Xtrozero
When you say "we lost" why is it that you associate with something that happened in our history? I guess I could sue the German Government over WWII and what they did to my more resent German relatives who were killed.

Actually, the Germans paid and still do pay huge reparations to victims of the Holocaust and other things. They also got stiffed after the War with their country being split in two because the super powers started bickering like kids.

Originally posted by Harlequin
` - but what will the world do if the native indians are brutally supressed?

a better question is what will we do?

i grew up like 50 miles from sitting bulls grave near a reservation. i have mixed feelings about all this but the bigger part of the mix is screaming things i cant type on here due to the t&c but the last word im screaming is "....YEAH!"

glad im not in the local guard unit up there...id hate to have to go and help "sort the situation out" though since about half that unit is made up of Lakota Sioux...wonder how they would anyway.

ideally our next pres will be someone of honor and will FINALLY get a new realistic treaty with the tribes and will honor it. (yeah yeah sunshine and lollipops i know..)

Originally posted by JohnnyCanuck
Hmmm...just out of idle curiousity, what's the financial base for their tax-free declaration? Oil?

sadly, casinos

[edit on 21-12-2007 by Damocles]

reply to post by mythatsabigprobe

well its illogical to assume that they're just going to "take back" as a whole the listed states.

but for the record, if you were wondering how the states (US states that is) are going to deal with the loss of income tax...south dakota at least has no state income tax

This sovereign movement to withdraw treaties has a lot of attention now. For those who want to know what drives the lakota spirit for freedom, just watch the video of Indian honor and how it was respected when presented. I hope Russel has the backing of the elders as stated for this monumental event. After the video read the wounded knee link. Will this event again be as it was in 73.

Wounded knee 1973

reply to post by Damocles


Here's a map of the Lakota land that was posted earlier by Beachcoma.



You're right, it's not the entire 5 states we're talking about but it's most of South Dakota and Nebraska, and a big chunk of all the others. Florida also has no (state) income tax, but if the Lakota's manage to form their own country there would be no Federal income tax either.

yeah based on the map it wont affect my family a lot, we're from the white part of south dakota (on the map people gees) and honestly, so long as they dont outlaw rock climbing in the paha sapa (black hills) im quite alright with their taking it all back

wonder if this will pave the way for "indigeouns" people in Europe reclaiming land in the future..................

I did find a little info on forced adoptions of the American Indian children. I hope to find more. But for now, here is an excerpt:

2. The Disruption of Indian Family Life

The forced separation of Indian children and youth from their families has long been a Bureau of Indian Affairs' practice. The establishment of boarding schools historically has been to rupture the cultural and value ties of the home and nation and the rising generation of Indian youth (see Note 22). The so-called civilizing effect of institutional rearing has been designed to aid in the de-Indianization of the young. Long distances separate children from their parents, and a conscious effort to scatter youth far from their homes seems to prevail. Additionally, Christian churches have developed massive programs for adoption of Indian children. Adoption of Indian youth is some 20 times the national average (see Note 23). For Navajos alone, some 2,000 children are spirited away for adoption annually by a single agency, the Mormon Church (see Note 24). The cultural impact of placement in non-Indian homes usually results in marginality or rejection of Indianness, a not unintended aim.

Finally, in this account, family life has been altered or destroyed by Federal relocation efforts of the 1950s and by lack of economic opportunity on reservations. Both have signaled an Indian exodus to the cities. Usually unemployable, due to lack of technical skills, racist hiring practices, or both, the migrant Indian often ends in an urban slum, cut off from his/her family and nation, and the family on the reservation is robbed of the out-migrant's contribution to the family economy, as well as his/her presence in the household.

jaie.asu.edu...

Hope this is not too far off-topic, but it might help others to understand the real plight of the American Indian and why they would want to separate from the U.S. Another excerpt:

6. The Elimination of Indian Life

Sterilization has become an ominous word in Indian country. Senator Abourezk's Committee in 1978 heard reports of some 25,000 Native women being victims of sterilization in 1975. In one community, Claremore, Oklahoma, it was claimed that 132 women were rendered sterile in 1973 (see Note 29). The surgical procedures, in the main, took place in Federal Indian Health Service facilities and were most often forced upon the victim or accomplished without her knowledge. DHEW informed consent regulations were ignored, and records of the event were frequently "lost" (see Note 30). Full bloods seemed to be disproportionately in the number of victims and, it has been argued, that phenomenon is not accidental but evidence of a further effort or campaign to acquire Indian lands by eliminating the potential inheritors of both the land and the tradition of Indian societies (see Note 31). Additional examples, such as the high suicide rate among Indians or the failure to bring murderers of Indian people to justice throughout the Great Plains states, can add little to the impact of the sterilization campaign.

jaie.asu.edu...

all this victim bollix- if an Indian killed a loved one of mine do I have a right to want to separate from Indians?

Looks like their is some evidence of truth to my friend's story on yet another website:

Two historical eras played an important role in the creation of the ICWA—the “Boarding School Era” (1880s–1950s) and the “Indian Adoption Era” (1950s–1978). During both eras Indian children were forcibly removed from their families and cultures so they could be “assimilated,” or re-educated to fit into mainstream society. During these eras, churches and private organizations received money (in the form of grants) to help them “civilize,” “save,” and “cleanse” the Indian population.

www.helpstartshere.org...

What Was the Indian Adoption Era?

As part of the Child Welfare League of America’s Indian Adoption Project, the U.S. Bureau of Indian Affairs and the Child Welfare League of America worked together to conduct a 10-year experiment. During this time, 650 children taken from tribes were placed in non-Indian homes, resulting in 395 adoptions. Throughout this era private/public agencies were “rescuing” children from their own culture, families and tribes.

www.helpstartshere.org...

Originally posted by blueorder
all this victim bollix- if an Indian killed a loved one of mine do I have a right to want to separate from Indians?

I believe you have a right to want to. Why such insensitivity? Try putting yourself in their shoes and suffer the kinds of things they have. How would you feel if the guv spirited away your children?

Originally posted by blueorder
all this victim bollix- if an Indian killed a loved one of mine do I have a right to want to separate from Indians?

Victim? 150 years of government oppression what would you do? I take it you didn't read their website. Did anyone? They were doing just fine before they came in snatching lands from them.

You know what makes me furious- Is the condition that the Indians are living in today. Its unacceptable and inexcuseable!! This is why they broke off from the U.S.
____________
From website source

Lakota men have a life expectancy of less than 44 years, lowest of any country in the World (excluding AIDS) including Haiti.

Lakota death rate is the highest in the United States.

The Lakota infant mortality rate is 300% more than the U.S. Average.

More than half the Reservation's adults battle addiction and disease.
The Tuberculosis rate on Lakota reservations is approx 800% higher than the U.S national average.

Alcoholism affects 8 in 10 families.

Median income is approximately $2,600 to $3,500 per year.

1/3 of the homes lack basic clean water and sewage while 40% lack electricty.

60% of housing is infected with potentially fatal black molds.

97% of our Lakota people live below the poverty line.

Unemployment rates on our reservations is 85% or higher.

Federal Commodity Food Program provides high sugar foods that kill Native people through diabetes and heart disease.

Teenage suicide rate is 150% higher than the U.S national average for this group.

Our Lakota language is an Endangered Language, on the verge of extinction.

www.lakotafreedom.com...

____________________

The Lakota are living in way below standard conditions. That is wrong!!!

I will refrain from saying anything else to you since you have no clue.

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Added 'ex' tags and a link to external material

Please read Posting work written by others

www.abovetopsecret.com...



[edit on 21/12/07 by masqua]

Oh, this is great news. I believe it is time for the South to breakaway again as well. We are quite tired of fighting yankee wars to fill industrialists pockets.