Obese should buy two plane seats, says Australia survey

This is a fascinating subject seeing as I am flying for the first time in 11 years this Sunday, now I am very grateful that I am flying with my boss, so the likelyhood of me getting seated next to an obese person is lowered slightly. On topic I think that if you take up more seat than you bought then you need to pay for it. It's that simple. As far as the "fat haters" here, I have to agree with you, I am so completly angry with fat people and I will tell you why, I may be losing my mother in law before Christmas because she is grossly overwieght, she has a huge cancerous tumor growing in her abdomen and the cancer has spread everywhere. Had she been fit and healthy she would have known something was wrong when this tumor first started making her breathing labored because it was pushing on her body parts. But her doc thought she was just fat causing her not to breath. For a year he told her to lose weight or be forced to be on oxygen for the rest of her life. Turned out it's a dang tumor! Being fit would have caught the cancer sooner, I mean, let's get real, a fit person knows if their body is not right, an obese person thinks they are just getting fatter. So yes, I dislike the choices that fat people make because I may lose the person I admire most, due to her lack of self control. You chose to eat too much you have health issues and have to pay more for an airline seat. Get over it and eat a salad!

But what of the people who really cant do anything? What of people like me who have been on medicine that has those side effects, and already has bad genetics? It has been proved almost impossible for people naturally fat to lose weight and keep it off. Yes there are people who just eat to much, and too much of the wrong foods, but to group them all together is a bit less than fair. As for the seating issue, some airlines have done, or at least tried to do this, where the either judge based on your weight, or on the necessity of a belt extender. Is that fair for people with wide waists but skinny arms and legs? Its not usually the waist sticking into the other seat. Or what of the team of football players? They aren't fat, they are just big guys, by the standards the should have to pay for the room they take up, but there is no standard for how that is to be measured.

I agree that there are some insensitive posts on this thread, but there are also some very resonable ones.

I just fail to wrap my mind around why people think it is ok for everyone but the overweight people to bear the burden of this situation. It makes sense to charge for an extra seat if you take up more than one.

It makes financial sense. The airlines run such on such a thin profit margin, that they couldn't possibly afford to just give out an extra seat to an overweight person. Most don't even include meals anymore due to cost cutting and trying to stay in business. They are not scrutinized when they charge you a "baggage fee" if your bag weighs over 50lbs. So, if anything they probably lose money when a lot of overweight people fly.

It makes social sense. People do not enjoy having their personal space violated. They payed for their small seat and they should not be forced to allow someone else to sit in it. You wouldn't want someone parking their car in your driveway, simply because they chose to buy too many and can't park it in their own. It isn't your obligation to just give them your own private space because they have used all of theirs up.

It is unfortunate that people are not nicer to overweight people. However, I don't think it is fair for the other passengers or the airlines to have to absorb the burden that is created.

It's not discrimination, it is common sense. It is disturbing to me that people are so quick to scream discrimination at this issue. It's called being practical.

It isn't discrimination to require children to be a certain height to ride a carnival ride.

The post office isn't discriminating when they charge you more based on the size of the package you choose to mail.

It isn't discrimination that adult clothes cost more than childrens clothes.

It isn't discrimination that Dump Trucks have to pay a higher road tax than standard cars due to the wear and tear they put on the roads.

It isn't discrimination when you have to pay extra to "biggie size" a fast food meal.

When people think that the airlines should accomidate overweight people, it just brings to mind the image of a child with his fingers in his ears screaming "NA NA NA NA NA, I'M NOT LISTENING! YOU'RE WRONG.....NA NA NA". Maybe I am doing the same thing though, because I firmly believe what I am saying. I just haven't seen any convincing arguments to convince me otherwise.

I appologize if I have offended anyone.

Question:

Should skinny people get a discount?

I mean, they weigh less and therefore cost less fuel/energy to move. They also can pass each other in the aisles much more easily, thus adding to the experience for the rest of the passengers.

How about rather than charging more, you simply have a Fat Section? Could be amusing to see all the flabbies wedged in together into one solid wall of jiggly flesh. Might just give 'em a little insight into why people don't want to sit next to them.

Yes, I'm being horribly politically incorrect.
I've got many other politically incorrect things I could say about the fat population, but I'll refrain. I'll simply state that the majority have no-one to blame other than themselves (and maybe mass-media) for their lifestyle choices.

My one beef with this airline charging more is that I'm reasonably sure they'll still cram other people into the seats next to fat people. It won't make for a better experience for anyone... other than the airlines who would be making more money.

Edit to add:
On the topic of discrimination... this isn't like race or gender issues.
The truth is that the majority of overweight people could do something about it if they choose. True, there are some people with medical conditions, but they are a tiny fraction of the fat population.
I should also note that when I say "fat", I don't mean a bit overweight. I mean the people that are at obvious health risk and still don't bother to do anything about it.

[edit on 12-12-2007 by BitRaiser]

And, if it's in the middle, you are four times more likely to die! And if it's in the front, twice as likely! Looking at the statistics here at least. In fact, if you sit in the middle you sit on top of the reserve fuel tank:

In modern airliners the likelyhood of crashing is more or less impossible.

I think the airlines should then construct an airplane for all the overweight users then. call it the "Large Plane". "All over 300 please go to terminal X" and this plane would have larger seats all around, at the same price compared to the regular people.

If it were the same price as normal people yet larger seats, that would mean there are less seats and that means - less people.

Given the extremely low margins that airliners currently operate from, there is no way that will ever happen. And if it does, it won't last long untill the airline was bankrupt.

That way they can make up for the displaced air, the weight imbalance on the plane

Displaced air is not going to make the plane any heavier.

well said, how about a gym in one of those airbuses? have you seen those? they can fit a gym, pool, treadmills.

But no airline is actually going to do that. Again, they are NOT going to be making any money doing that.

reply to post by mattifikation



reply to post by Blaine91555


What do you want them to do? Mess with outflow valves so diferential pressure is so high the fuselage explodes? Cruise lower, going slower and burning more jet fuel?

Or have seats similar in size to first class with prices jacked up so high it costs similar to first class?

If that were the case, I'd like to see ANY airline make money that way.

dont you realise this is yet another scam for airline companies to make more profit and nothing else

As a pilot in training, it really fustrates me when people say this. It's really no wonder maintainence is being OUTSOURCED, pilot are getting payed LESS and LESS, flight schools are EMPTY, and many airlines are going broke. You know why?

Because people, like you, are supporting the consencus that pilots are merely overpaid busdrivers working for rich companies designed to rape the consumee. It's everywhere really. Everywhere.


[edit on 12/12/2007 by C0bzz]

I find this thread somewhat offensive. I'm not a large obese person at all, i'm 240 6tf tall. But I think it's disgusting the way some of you speak of the sick. those people need help not torture.

Originally posted by BitRaiser
Question:

Should skinny people get a discount?

I mean, they weigh less and therefore cost less fuel/energy to move. They also can pass each other in the aisles much more easily, thus adding to the experience for the rest of the passengers.

IIRC this Australian story was first floated in the media back in the summer - I recall watching something on it, possibly via the BBC.

One of the ideas that was being passed around was a maximum combined weight - I think it was 150kg. You and your luggage. If you go over, you either leave stuff behind, or pay for a second seat.

For waifish people like my gf, that means you can probably subsidize the price of your plane ticket completely by taking on courier packages for fed-ex. For guys like me, it means I`m entitled to a slight increase in my baggage limit. Nice.

For others, it means traveling light- or coughing up a bit of extra cash.

From 2002: Crushed Flier Wins Obesity Payout

Virgin Atlantic has paid a woman passenger £13,000 (US$20,289) compensation, after she was squashed by an obese person who sat next to her on a transatlantic flight.

Barbara Hewson, from Swansea, south Wales, suffered injuries including a blood clot in her chest, torn leg muscles and acute sciatica and remains in pain two years on.

The obese passenger had only been able to fit into her seat by raising the arm rest, which meant her body parts weighed down on Mrs Hewson.

.....

Before taking off, the freelance writer had complained in the first instance to the cabin crew about sitting next to the overweight woman, who had booked two seats on her outward bound flight to London, but not on the return leg.

Attendants told Mrs Hewson the flight was full, with no other seats available.

So, to recap, this poor lady got stuck on an 11 hour flight - with no option of where to sit - and has health problems for the rest of her days - because of someone who knew enough to buy 2 seats on one leg of the flight, but decided to just inconvenience someone on the return leg.

Someone called it "passive obesity". I kind of like the sound of that.

would it be ok to bring my sticky model like girlfriend and have her sit on my lap? and we just pay for one seat?

Originally posted by jedimiller
would it be ok to bring my sticky model like girlfriend and have her sit on my lap? and we just pay for one seat?

Sticky?


.... nah, I`m not touching that one

reply to post by jedimiller


well essentially... yes. I mean, the airplane is design to take people from A to B. If you can fit 100 skinny people on a flight, and the total amount of $ for the tickets is $10,000 - that's $100 per person (assuming they are all the same size -for ease of example), which is a price relative to their size.

If it's a flight of larger people, perhaps only 80 can fit - but the price of the flight is the same, $10,000. Now it costs $125 per person (assuming they are all the same size, like before).

I don't think it would be out of line to employ something like that.

Originally posted by pepsi78
What happens if a person does not fit in 2 seats, what then? there are people of that magnitude, this with 2 seats would not work on everyone, if some one is even larger than 2 seats than I think special airplanes for people like this should be designed where only one category of people fly on that plain, that way no one is bothering no one, and problem is solved.

But why should airlines be forced to do this and probably lose money in the process? Haven't you noticed the reduction in flights? That most flights are full? And yes- that the seats are getting smaller? It's because they are still trying to run a business like everyone else. A "FAT" plane is probably something that they would deem a losing proposition, and take a pass on.

I think the idea of having seats earmarked for "large" people at a higher price is a good idea. This could be lucrative for all parties involved.

2PacSade-

I haven't laughed this much in years! Thanks!
I agree totally that obese people should pay more...in fact, my aunt (who is absolutely huge) had to pay for two airplane tickets to fly from Cape Town to Bloemfontein and that was about 20 years ago. As to the excuse of "genetics" being the cause for someone being obese, I can't believe that. Almost everyone in my family is extremely large - not tall but wide. I, however, refused to allow myself to get like that and make a point of eating healthily (I eat a huge amount but its all healthy stuff like veggies, fruit and fish - I am not a vegetarian as I love my steak but I just don't have it every night) and very rarely eat any sort of fast food. I also power walk every day for about half an hour. I am 1.5metres tall and weigh in at 38kgs. My aunts and uncles, my father, my grandparents and one of my siblings are all hugely overweight and I have no problem in pointing out to them that if they just stopped stuffing their faces with burgers, chips, cola and such and maybe, just maybe, getting off their butts for a few minutes each day instead of lounging in front of the TV, they may find that life is incredibly pleasant when you can move around freely, wear "off the rack" clothes instead of tents and actually enjoy eating as much as you want (as long as its healthy). Just my personal experience.

Originally posted by jedimiller
I find this thread somewhat offensive. I'm not a large obese person at all, i'm 240 6tf tall. But I think it's disgusting the way some of you speak of the sick. those people need help not torture.

I am sorry to be the one to break it to you, but you are obese.

At 6'4", 240lbs... your BMI is 33 and you are obese. Your ideal weight 6' 0" 160 - 196 lbs.

You can run the numbers yourself if you would like.

californiabariatrics.net...

Originally posted by Karlhungis
I am sorry to be the one to break it to you, but you are obese.

At 6'4", 240lbs... your BMI is 33 and you are obese. Your ideal weight 6' 0" 160 - 196 lbs.

Are you trying to make me laugh? I am not obese, please!

Those numbers mean nothing to me. I have muscle mass, water and bone mass and that's alot. And I know that, I have pictures, when I was skinny and running in track at high school and I was 210lbs. No fat in sight. I am only 30lbs overweight, but far from obese.

those charts are for fools!

Originally posted by jedimiller
would it be ok to bring my sticky model like girlfriend and have her sit on my lap? and we just pay for one seat?

No. That would be insanely unsafe during takeoff and landing and probably violate a ton of FAA regulations.

Everyone on board sits in at least one seat and pays for however many seats they use. I don't care if it's offensive, it's logic. It's business. It's FAIR TO EVERYONE ELSE.

The woman who got squashed should have got more money. Normally I'm against lawsuit happy people but 20,000 is not enough for 2+ years of pain over something that could have been avoided so easily.

reply to post by jedimiller


That must not be you in your avatar then? Because the face in that pic, fits the profile of a 6' 240lb obese person.

Originally posted by Karlhungis

That must not be you in your avatar then? Because the face in that pic, fits the profile of a 6' 240lb obese person.

Well, yes that's me in the avatar. I guess if you think i'm obese that's fine with me, but I think the definition of obese is like 60+ overweight. I'm not going to worry about it, but I tell you what I shouldn't have to pay anymore for a seat than you.

This thread is cracking me up!

Discrimination against fat people........yes it is....do I have a problem with that....no I don't!

I live in the UK, we are seeing more and more obese children and adults every year. Soon we'll be reaching US levels of obesity! Why...because do gooders are saying "it's ok to be fat"
For me, that's a disgrace! I pay tax, a lot of it! I pay national insurance...a lot of it! A large proportion of that goes to sorting out health problems caused by obesity! Fat people already cost me money, their selfish attitude to health costs me money! Their lazy attitude to exercise, their lazy ignorance towards good nutrition, their greedyness, is all caused because they get told it's OK to be fat......RUBBISH! It's not OK to be fat, it's bad for you and it's bad for everyone else.
Now, on this forum I'm hearing people telling me it's bad to discriminate against fat people, that takes the micky! Discrimination against disabled people is wrong, or against people with an illness....it's not wrong if someone CHOOSES to be fat, which they do! Ever see any ancient cave drawings with fatty's in them? No! If they CHOOSE to be fat then that's their CHOICE, they already cost me money and now they want to steal my seat.....sod that!
This nanny society is rediculous, and it's the whole reason that obesity is on the up! How many fatty's were there during the war compared to today?

People on here are saying it's the airlines wanting to make more profit. LOL How does that work then? Take one full airliner, two slim people use two seats, one fat person uses two seats, increase in profit...nothing!

Moving on....some poster mentioned fat doctors....if I was in an emergency and a fat doctor offered help, yes I'd take it, in the same way that anyone would. If I was going to see my doctor about my lifestyle and he was sitting there munching mars bars and smoking cigarettes I'd hardly take his advice seriously! Rubbish arguement! I don't know any really fat doctors anyway!

Fat children.....very sad! I genuinly feel sorry for them. They cannot feed themselves, it's is absolutely the parents fault if their children are fat, and i bet 9 times out of 10 the parents are over weight! Stop letting them sit there all night on their x-boxes and munching snacks and send them out to play, or play with them yourself......Parents making children obese are just plain bad parents...

FATTIES SHOULD PAY THEIR WAY!


phew....i feel better for that rant....

Cheers

Robbie

reply to post by Karlhungis


Well that must be you in your avatar, because anyone who hunts for a chance at insulting someone in a thread by calling them fat must be a ZERO