Why I know God Exists.

reply to post by dbates


Ok, but the bible also mentions that men disgrace themsleves with long hair. And should also groom their hair and selves..

"Does not even nature itself teach you that if a man has long hair it is a disgrace to him, but that if a woman has long hair, it is her glory? For her hair is given to her as a covering." (1 Corinthians 11:13-15)

I am not trying to stirr anything up, I just thought I would point it out because it was really ironic.

Also, I don't follow the bible or any religion. I'm agnostic.

But back on topic...

Originally posted by John_Q_Llama

My aunt has always been a heavy drinker, promiscuous, loose with her language, and a poor role model. Why would God spare this woman from that car accident?

AND

Tell me, why would God spare my aunt, and then let this young woman get killed the way she was?

AND

The only thing mysterious to me is why this God would create evil, and then allow that evil to harm humans, who were created in his own image, and most beloved.

I don't know why God "spares" one and doesn't spare another. I don't know why I was "spared"

It always seems to come down to people looking around them and developing arguments as to why "I do not believe because".

Has anyone who has developed an "I do not believe because" argument developed an "I believe because" argument and based on careful consideration chosen which one to follow?

I think most will not approach that task, and stop halfway. Halfway is no way to make an eternal decision. Maybe the eternal is too scary to approach, so we make arguments we can live with and stop there.

BTW God did not create evil. Humans did in thier free will. (Another thread please, do not sidetrack this one. If you want to go there, develop it and post new.)

Originally posted by ChronMan
reply to post by dbates

 

Ok, but the bible also mentions that men disgrace themsleves with long hair. And should also groom their hair and selves..

"Does not even nature itself teach you that if a man has long hair it is a disgrace to him, but that if a woman has long hair, it is her glory? For her hair is given to her as a covering." (1 Corinthians 11:13-15)

I am not trying to stirr anything up, I just thought I would point it out because it was really ironic.

Also, I don't follow the bible or any religion. I'm agnostic.

But back on topic...

A dart thrower. Taking bits and pieces for the sake of misderection and obfuscation.

It's like this. - I open the opearting manual of a nuclear submarine. I read the part where it says to blow the tanks of air and it makes the submarine go underwater. I close the book and exclaim

"Nuclear submarines cannot work! If you blow the air out of the tanks it will sink, but cannot get back up! - Everyone will die!"

You must read the manual in its entirety and become informed. Do not weary others with making them (in many posts) explain that you carry compressed air to fill the tanks, or to explain how to compress air for that matter.

ah, i love when these topics come up. so many opinions, quite a lot compelling, but if you know god exists, then why feel the need?
you know within yourself he does, thats all you need.
personally, i think all religions are too tribalistic and barbaric. most who have read "lord of the flies" could possibly see where im coming from?

reply to post by Skunky


I think he made an excellent point. One that I think was not adequately addressed.

You believe God exists because of the favorable circumstances of your life, yet there are many that do not share this "luck". Those that live favorably tend to be more ardent believers as opposed to those that fall in the "have not" category. That is usually the case. I wonder how each would feel if those roles were reversed?

I've worked with the homeless on more than one occasion and the ones that do mention how they feel about their situation (most try not to think about it) tend to feel abandoned by God even if they still believe in one and some even feel cursed.

This topic sort of reminds me of the people that occasionally remark about the groups of guardian angels they believe they have. I mean like...10 plus guardian angels. Makes me wonder why some of those angels aren't out there with the people that actually need help. I read recently that they discovered the unidentified body of a little boy in a suitcase in a river as I recall. That poor kid could have used at least one.

If good luck equals God, then bad luck either equals no God or no favoritism from a God.

Whether your luck runs out or not is irrelevant to the fact that privilege or favorable happenstance is no proof of the existence of God in my humble opinion. That said, I'm glad you have found something positive to believe in and I wish you the best of luck.

All of you.

- Lee

it seems you are confusing luck with divine intervention. The only difference between a coincidence and a miracle, is a person's interpretation of it.

reply to post by jaywoo


sorry, but your title is wrong. you don't KNOW anything here, this is still a simple belief. you THINK god exists
you BELIEVE god exists
you HOPE god exists
you HAVE FAITH that god exists

but, at the end of the day, you cannot know.

reply to post by SpeakerofTruth


...personal spiritual experience that ACTUALLY happened...

That statement is an meaningless to us as the intellectual elitist spouting his theorems. It is a host of "personal" experiences that he attributes to God. But there is no "proof" that his experiences are anything more than random chance. Unless you are preaching to the choir (sorry..pun intended). Some of us aren't members of the choir though.

I'm happy for him that his life has gone so well. But bad things also do happen to good people also. Age old question...no real answers though.

Raf

reply to post by Raf_50



As someone who has ACTUALLY had experiences that go beyond what he is talking about, I can say beyond a shadow of a doubt the I KNOW there is a God... Whether you, or anyone else believes or not really matters little to me... But don't tell me that something isn't real when I know it is... That is like being told you can't do something when you've already done it? Understand? It's irritating.

Originally posted by SpeakerofTruth
reply to post by Raf_50

 

I can say beyond a shadow of a doubt the I KNOW there is a God...

Thats what you believe, it doesnt mean there is a god. I dont believ in god, but that doesnt mean there isnt a god...get it?

Originally posted by SpeakerofTruth
Whether you, or anyone else believes or not really matters little to me... But don't tell me that something isn't real when I know it is...

Again, its what you believe is real, there is no proof that he exists, except for that one book that tells you so

So, you're telling me that I haven't seen and experienced what I know I have, eh? As I said, that is like being told you can't do something when you have already done it... If anyone has ever told you that you can't do something that you've already done, then you know how irritating it is.

reply to post by SpeakerofTruth


I didnt say that at all. I was merely stating that you believe in god, therefore, in your mind he exists, whether you were brought up in a religious family or whatever, its your belief that he exists. In my case, I dont believ in god, i was never bought up with religion so therefore, I do not believe that he exists.

Was just trying to state why I think that you believe he/she/it is real. I made no mention of whether or not you had a vision, voice etc

I'm intrigued, what kind of experience did you have, that provided you with proof, beyond that shadow of a doubt, that there is most certainly a god (ignoring the definition of faith)? How did you ascertain this was divinity, and not a chemical reaction, or anything else?

i have had many experiences and close brushes with death that seemed to me, exactly what some people describe as "religious awakenings" and etc. but I just interpreted it in a different way, that makes more sense to me. I also recognize something which I could understand others interpreting as a god, and worshiping on their hands and knees.

reply to post by SpeakerofTruth


Again...as with the original post. Your experiences are personal. They are anecdotal. I'm not saying they aren't valid, by any means. They meant something to you.

Anyone can expound on their experiences or beliefs. But that is not evidence to a total stranger. Nor is it a measurable...quality...that could be used to support your claim to this audience.

Raf

A testimony of God in ones life is a wonderful thing. But believers go through valleys of weeping too. But as Psalm 84 states. They go "through" those valleys and turn them into springs of water and refreshing.
Some people are just blessed to have God in their life. it is true God wants some and does not want others. Some people come to God in their life and some never will. Being in the number of the lucky ones. all I can say is I'm grateful that God chose to open my eyes to the truth about his plan of salvation through his son Jesus Christ. It is open to all but sadly most will not be chosen because of their constant unbelief. I guess it is God's way of filtering out undesirables in his kingdom. and BTW, that kingdom is coming to this earth soon. cantyousee

reply to post by SpeakerofTruth


personal experience is highly flawed. from personal experience the earth is flat, the sun goes round the earth, and other ridiculous assertions seem true.

and how do you know you've ascribed these apparent events to the right phenomenon?
seems like you believe in god enough to label them as such without giving them proper thought

Originally posted by cantyousee
A testimony of God in ones life is a wonderful thing. But believers go through valleys of weeping too. But as Psalm 84 states. They go "through" those valleys and turn them into springs of water and refreshing.

I'm very happy for you that you have this experience. I am just as happy without the testimony of a god.

Some people are just blessed to have God in their life. it is true God wants some and does not want others.

How do you know this, are you privvy to some information that the rest of us are not?

It is open to all but sadly most will not be chosen because of their constant unbelief. I guess it is God's way of filtering out undesirables in his kingdom. and BTW, that kingdom is coming to this earth soon. cantyousee

Have you ever thought that we don't want to be one of the 'chosen' so why is this sad? Is it sad that everyone doesn't agree with your views - have you ever thought that we might find it sad that you still prescribe to an outdated belief?.
Again where is your information coming from that this 'kingdom' is coming soon other than your personal belief. Please don't make claims without providing a source of evidence.

Oh and what other Earth is there?

G

Again it comes down to those who want proof before they believe and others who have decided to open thier minds and hearts and approach the unknown "God" (to them) humbly and see what he might say. The proof comes after the humility. If one approaches God in thier own personal context, they do so knowing they are asking The God himself, or if they are asking the "forces or powers that be..." On can approach the "powers" easily for they are undefined and maneagable. One cannot approach the God that they know we Christians profess, Jesus himself without trepidation. The proof seekers willl never humble first and find proof after that humility. Those that have humbled first can never explain what it is to be spirit and know what is only seen in the spirit.

As for humility? yes, he requires that. If you created the world, the universe, Time, cosmic strings and nutrinos (what purpose do they serve?), one would have to say "you are bigger than me, and I want to know why you made me".

-edit fixed typos.

[edit on 7-11-2007 by jaywoo]

there is no such thing as blind faith, that is a myth.

religion is largely a human creation, a device to control other men.

i am aware of intentional creation of our universe, and possibly others (perhaps other creators had a hand in those, or not) because of the chaotic orderliness of everything in it. from superstrings to the background radiation 'noise' of the big bang.

the more science reveals the true nature of our realm, the more evident that a deliberate hand was involved in the creation of it.

theres no reason for anything to exist at all, but everything does.

the marriage of physics and mathematics will uncover what many have known all along, and its doing so more profoundly every day.

Originally posted by planetfall
there is no such thing as blind faith, that is a myth.

religion is largely a human creation, a device to control other men.

the more science reveals the true nature of our realm, the more evident that a deliberate hand was involved in the creation of it.

theres no reason for anything to exist at all, but everything does.

the marriage of physics and mathematics will uncover what many have known all along, and its doing so more profoundly every day.

Profound and well spoken. Especially this;

"religion is largely a human creation, a device to control other men."

Religion is the problem. Jesus was crucified in his attempt to disband humanities insistance upon religion.




[edit on 7-11-2007 by jaywoo]