No NTSB Investigation

Originally posted by Boone 870

Over 60 Safety Board employees worked around the clock in Virginia, Pennsylvania, New York, and at our headquarters in Washington, D. C., assisting with aircraft parts identification, searching for and analyzing flight recorders, and working with the air carriers to assist the victims' families.

NSTB

As the crashes of the four airliners on Tuesday are criminal acts, the FBI is the lead investigative agency and will release all information on the progress of the investigation.

NTSB

To ensure that Safety Board investigations focus only on improving

So where are the reports on the parts and did the FBI ever admit to finding the black boxes at the WTC?

So where are the FBI and NTSB reports?

Originally posted by ULTIMA1

Originally posted by Caustic Logic
Indestructible black boxes: 8 total, three survive (1 at Pentagon, 2 at Shanksville) we're told.

It is suspicious.

We were also told that information could not be gathered off some the ones that survived, which would be a first.

Yes. To be more exact then, each plane has an FDR and a cockpit voice recorder. So 4 were found (officially) but the Pentagon CVR was useless, so 3 survived from a data perspective - two w/flight data and one with audio.

Originally posted by Caustic Logic
Yes. To be more exact then, each plane has an FDR and a cockpit voice recorder. So 4 were found (officially) but the Pentagon CVR was useless, so 3 survived from a data perspective - two w/flight data and one with audio.

Yes, i have the information from the Flight 77 FDR. I filed a FOIA request with the NTSB.

DAMAGED OR DESTROYED BLACK BOXES


This One. 24 survivors

This One. CVR and FDR

Originally posted by Boone 870
DAMAGED OR DESTROYED BLACK BOXES

I have never heard of a black box surviving and not being able to read the tape.

Also where are the black boxes from the WTC.

Originally posted by ULTIMA1

Originally posted by Boone 870
DAMAGED OR DESTROYED BLACK BOXES

I have never heard of a black box surviving and not being able to read the tape.

Also where are the black boxes from the WTC.

If this is to be a thread about the WTC black boxes, that should be a new thread IMO. This one is about no NTSB investigation. We've shown the NTSB did several investigations, but apparently NOT its parts-assembly/number matching/crime scene investigation thing, at least not that anyone can find. So how about a re-cap, Ultima1, of where things stand on this issue? Maybe you can ammend the thread title to reflect that "no NTSB investigation" is not quite correct, but otherwise your point is made, and remind us of what this shows.

originally posted by Ultima 1
I have never heard of a black box surviving and not being able to read the tape.

If the purpose of the black box is to be able to record data and survive the crash with the data intact, then why would you consider not being able to recover the data as surviving?

The digital CVR was severely damaged; however, the memory module was recovered and brought by the CAAC to the NTSB laboratory for examination. The recording is of high quality.

The flight data recorder was destroyed by impact, and only fragments of the tape have been recovered.

NTSB Korean Air MD-11

Originally posted by Boone 870
The flight data recorder was destroyed by impact, and only fragments of the tape have been recovered.

So what about the 9/11 black boxes?

reply to post by ULTIMA1


What about the 9/11 black boxes? Four of them were found, three of them were analyzed and one of them could not be just like on the Korean air MD-11.

Originally posted by Boone 870
What about the 9/11 black boxes? Four of them were found, three of them were analyzed and one of them could not be just like on the Korean air MD-11.

But the FBI stated 1 of the voice recorders was not able to be read. What happened to the black boxes at the WTC?

Please read the FBI pages.

reply to post by ULTIMA1


The NTSB also said that the CVR from flight 77 could not be analyzed because of damage, just like on the other aircraft that I linked to.

Which FBI papers are you referring to? One of your links on the first page doesn't work. I'll be happy to read them if you can point me in the right direction.

Originally posted by Boone 870

Which FBI papers are you referring to? One of your links on the first page doesn't work. I'll be happy to read them if you can point me in the right direction.

usinfo.state.gov...

At his afternoon briefing September 13, the Attorney General said that the electronic flight data and voice recorder boxes of the hijacked planes had not been found. That statement was overtaken by events later in the day when the so-called "black boxes" were found at two of the crash sites -- the U.S. Department of Defense headquarters, and the Pennsylvania site where one of the hijacked planes crashed.

reply to post by ULTIMA1


I'm kind of dense Ultima 1, will you explain what you're getting at?

Originally posted by Boone 870
I'm kind of dense Ultima 1, will you explain what you're getting at?

After the initial statement that the black boxes have not been found at the WTC, there has been no statement that they have been found.

So lets look at the facts.

1. No black boxes at the WTC.

2. No FBI or NTSB reports on the planes at the WTC.

So we have no actaul evdence of what planes hit the WTC.

reply to post by ULTIMA1


Except for the recorded radar data studies, United Airlines and American Airlines saying which aircraft were lost, and DNA from the passengers found at ground zero.

Originally posted by Boone 870
Except for the recorded radar data studies, United Airlines and American Airlines saying which aircraft were lost, and DNA from the passengers found at ground zero.

How does the radar data tell us what planes? The transponders were turned off. So the aircraft were lost, that does not state they hit the buildings does it?

We do not have the black boxes to give us more detailed information.

You mean DNA test that back in 2001 could not be used on DNA that had been destroyed by heat. The new NIST DNA tests were not ready until 2002. So how did the all those bodies get identified without a proper test?

originally posted by ULTIMA1
How does the radar data tell us what planes? The transponders were turned off. So the aircraft were lost, that does not state they hit the buildings does it?

That's a common misconception. Yes the transponders were turned off, but that does not mean that the flights disappeared from radar. I will post the link that shows the Recorded Radar Data that was put together after the attacks using the data from multiple radar sources that were combined to track the flight paths of all four flights.

According to this link, all four aircraft were recorded by at least one type of radar for the duration of the entire flight.

Originally posted by Boone 870

That's a common misconception. Yes the transponders were turned off, but that does not mean that the flights disappeared from radar. I will post the link that shows the Recorded Radar Data that was put together after the attacks using the data from multiple radar sources that were combined to track the flight paths of all four flights.

No, there is not misconception i know how radars work. When the transponders were turnbed off the planes would have blended into the other blips on the radar.

Also FLight 77 was off the radar for several moments.

And you still have no physical evidence or FBI and NTSB reports what flights hit the towers or Pentagon.

originally posted by Ultima 1
No, there is not misconception i know how radars work. When the transponders were turnbed off the planes would have blended into the other blips on the radar.

Also FLight 77 was off the radar for several moments.

Notice that the link I provided says, Recorded Radar Data.

I agree that the planes would have blended in with other airplanes on the controller screen. That's why it's important to understand Recorded Radar Data. Whoever put the information together had the benefit of being able to use the data to plot out the flight paths.

Flight 77 wasn't tracked for nine minutes. Once it returned to primary radar coverage it was tracked right back to the Pentagon and the flight data recorder.

Originally posted by Boone 870
Flight 77 wasn't tracked for nine minutes. Once it returned to primary radar coverage it was tracked right back to the Pentagon and the flight data recorder.

How do you know it was flight 77 that returned to primary radar? The transponder was turned off, all you had was a blip.

I have the data from the flight data recorder and there are some differences between what the FDR states and the official story states.