The Greatest lie ever told - The Bible

A popular theory states is that the Bible is in fact written by multiple people. The old testament is thought to have been written by at least 4 different figures (according to this theory) with different views (Jahwist, Elowist, Priestly, and Deuteronaomic). Therefore of course the stories will be different in some ways.

Moses and the Red Sea. Though it is true that no physical evidence suggests that the Jews were in Egypt, The fact that this plays such a large role in their story in their story leads me to believe that there must be some truth to it. Just because evidence has not yet been uncovered does not mean that it will not someday be uncovered.



[edit on 9/23/2007 by NJE03]

[edit on 9/23/2007 by NJE03]

Originally posted by K-illuminati
Quantum my simple simple friend,

i did state in an earlier post of the summerian tablet flood stories being the source of bible flood story..so i am not as simple as you may believe.


Besides annunaki , 12th planet etc is somewhat unrelated to this thread i feel as its addressing the Bible as the book in its current form.

i know a lot about nibiru etc have read up a lot so pls don't attack me on a different subject when you have no idea what i know about said subject.

What I find entertaining re religion, the Bible, The Kuran etc etc is that they all ask you to believe in them and if you don't you will face a dreadful place in hell or whatever and yet (as they say) there can only be one true one that you can believe in.

I personally have no feeling towards religion (although I do feel we were created) because I originally was born in Belfast with parents of different religions. Trust me, that's not a place to be in with that over the family, we had to leave one night after a 2nd series of death threats and just jump on a boat to England with nothing but the minor bit of money we had. For me, religion was just seeing people being kneecapped, tarred and feathered as a child of 6.

Religion on there was nothing but organised pain and terror placed upon people for no 'good' reason.

As for trusting a bible etc, well they are littered with mistakes, cryptic nonsense and have no absolute proof that any person such as Jesus ever lived, they are just passed on stories created to control in my honest opinion.

If people who have an open mind would just watch the movie Zeitgeist on the web, it goes a long way to explain what people think they believe.

Still, if it makes a person happy I say good luck to them, but that's hard to say with all the worldwide bloodshed in the name of these religions thats going on.

reply to post by Quantum_Squirrel


Ya, I saw this Pen and Teller video on YouTube TOO! What a lame-o, posting it as if he is raising his own questions instead of plagerizing Pen & Teller:

youtube.com...

Originally posted by thatblissguy
reply to post by Quantum_Squirrel

 

Ya, I saw this Pen and Teller video on YouTube TOO! What a lame-o, posting it as if he is raising his own questions instead of plagerizing Pen & Teller:

This video is old , and as the bottom of my original post states , this is gathered from various sources and includes my own opinions....

the only reason i could not quote sources is because i was already way way over my character amount allowed per post (6500) infact my original post is a highly cut down version of the wordpad text i wrote

at no point does the post say this is all my own work , the first bit is heavy Penn & Teller, the 2nd bit is from a site the greatest lie ever told, and the 3rs section and longest parts are my own perosnal opinions... problem with that?

[edit on 23/9/07 by Quantum_Squirrel]

[edit on 23/9/07 by Quantum_Squirrel]

reply to post by Quantum_Squirrel


You've more guts than I.

Any person who has an ounce of logic in their head should look at the whole of religion and realize that whatever they believe is no more likely right or wrong than what someone else believes. There is no point in attempting to use logic to speak to people who have abandoned it in whatever part of the mind religion is resides. If someone reads "Humpty Dumpty" and believes it as a literal story and goes to a group once a week to meet with other "Humpty Believers" there's not a whole lot you can do to speak rationally to that person about "Humpty". People may laugh at the analogy, but from my perspective religion and Humpty Dumpty are the same thing.

It's not about being right or wrong. It's about finding the truth in life. It's about figuring out how this world works and why so little of it makes absolutely no sense. People are too scared or stupid to question their faith/belief system, as the old adage goes, change can only come from within.

You have more guts than I. It's a rough game tearing apart a book of fiction and putting it under the microscope. You're attempting to counter a belief system which is personalized for each believer - they can freely pick and choose what they want to belief or not (which of course, the "true" believers then denounce). Good luck.

Consider this:

1. If God is so great, why does He create so many imperfect beings (so many selfish, stubborn and greedy people that we all have to put up with)? and leave people to suffer from famine and epidemic, or worse, even pandemic like the Black Death? medical science would have no place in today's society if that was the case. all we need to do is pray hard and the so-called Evil (Viruses) would have been easily defeated by the almighty Hand of God. think about it, how many of you are actually alive today because of the advancement of human understanding of the world around them (science, technology and education) and not resortment to some fancy shamanism and/or mythology? but then, of course, if you prayed hard enough and in good faith, the high hopes and optimism in the praying process might actually aid your body's own self-repairing mechanism into healing 'some' sicknesses. this is known as the placebo effect..none of it has to do with holy water or exorcism. God should be sued.

2. If we are His beloved children, and He loved us (or Himself) so much so that He has to create us in His own image, is He willing to punish us in eternal suffering just by not calling Him Father? we are all orphans in a sense. would you kill your own child for stealing? how imperfect! the bible said the earth is only 6000 year's old.? every religion in the world would claim that their god is the true God, and those non-believers would go to hell, and only the faithful will go to heaven. the classic carrot-and-stick doctrines; these are suited for the general people's standard or freedom of thought thousands of years ago, as widely used as a measure of 'crowd control' and also shows the political influence of a given empire at that time. or maybe simply a lack of understanding of the world? what happened to the people who roamed this earth 20 000 years ago, i wonder? where would their souls go? also, what kind of heaven would Muslims go? and what about those mainstream Buddhist monks whose religion doesn't revolve around a supernatural being but instead is simply a teaching of 'the way of life'? i strongly believe that we have created God in our own image, and not the other way round. the ability to imagine things marked the major step of humankind out of the bush in Afrika...and the 'soul' everyone talks about is merely a 'mind', which is unique to human brain. a mentally retarded person won't care to spend so much time worrying about where his 'soul' would end up when he dies, because a 'soul' is meaningless to him.

3. Why must we behave humanely to other beings only in the hopes of going to heaven and out of fear of going to hell? what has our civilisation become? through thousands of years of modern evolution of the mind and thought, this is the best we arrived at? it certainly is ashtonishing to believe such is the case...

4. After the mortal sin, Adam and Eve were punished to come down to Earth from Garden of Eden. here, they would be stoned by people because they opposed God by eating a deliciously poisoned apple. (if i remembered correctly from my Sunday school) but who were these 'people' who were going to stone them? Also, they had 2 sons, Cain and Abel. Cain killed Abel (or the other way round). so, how did they reproduce? p/s: excuse me for my lack of bible knowledge, i learned nothing from my Sunday school...only contradictions and ironies. you are free to correct me if i'm wrong.

5. I think the Bible is one of those attempts by humankind to establish a statutory law system during ancient times of chaos and political unrests. it's by all means a very very clever way to govern the peoples' behaviour.

I'm not advocating for anti-Christ or anti-religion, just that my logic doesn't rhyme with it. as i study the cosmos now i oftentimes find it easy & convenient to put God in the equation whenever i can't grasp a deep understanding of things. if so why bother to research further then? everything will 'just be'!

Originally posted by RedDragon

Originally posted by WraothAscendant
Yackity yack yack yack.
I find I don't have the wish to argue with you Red Dragon. It serves no good purpose, I would just end up repeating myself over and over and over and over and over and over and over again..

By all means believe what egotistical foolishness you want. But. science has not disproven (nor the other side proven) the possiblity of the spiritual no matter how you people (and those people) mince words and twist things to mean what you want them to mean.

By all means conitnue preaching your truth is the only truth that can be and your ego masterbation. Just excuse me if I cease in paying attention.

Oh, and there is actually tons of evidence against spiritual stuff existing. Check this thread out:

www.belowtopsecret.com...

We've been able to prove that all spiritual experiences are the result of chemical inbalances in the brain and are actually delusions and hallucinations, and like most mental diseases, it is a largely genetic occurance.

Bullcrap. You people have no proof of anything but the obvious disproving of alot of religious falsehoods (of course women wasn't made from a rib).

And then the bending of information to suit your own egotistical needs ensues. Funny thing is most your camp sounds like your enemies, different format and BS. The subject is still in the air yet you want SOO BADLY to be right you can taste it.
You state all these chemical imbalances and insanity bs, yet science has said repeatedly it doesn't completely understand how the mind works.
Hmm can we say inconsistant?

Thats all I shall say. You will no proceed the attempts to dodge and/or make me look silly. Why not use some more delightful food parodies? Seeing how that seems to be a favored theme.

And P.s. If you did not say that then I apologise squirrel.

[edit on 23-9-2007 by WraothAscendant]

[edit on 23-9-2007 by WraothAscendant]

Now QS don't make me click you straight off of my friends list!

And not because I disagree with you - the Bible may well be just a collection of beautiful parables and moral tales relative to a time long past, or not!

But you are a very excellent and intelligent debater and you, of all people, should know you can't argue about religion. People are going to believe what they want to believe, especially since faith is a belief in something unseen or despite all evidence to the contrary.

However, it was a well thought-out post and I have been fascinated and entertained. Flag!

reply to post by RedDragon

Anyways, you were wrong about the Jesus part. The Roman historian you mention that talked about Jesus a decade later, the works of his that mention Jesus have been proven to be forgeries. The first mentionings of Jesus aren't until 200 years after his death. There are no mentionings of any of the apostles during their lifetimes either. Censored parts of the Bible even show that Jesus, like Muhammed, was a pedophile.

Forgeries? Where did you get that? Censored parts of the Bible show what??? You should be ashamed of yourself for posting anything of that sort. Do you think you can just make up anything you wish and others will believe it?

There are errors in the Bible even on the first page in Genesis. Events about the creation of Earth and the Universe are mentioned out of order in ways they never could have happened.

There are no errors. You are not reading with undersanding.

Anyone who seriously believes anything in the Bible because it's in the Bible does not deserve to be reasoned with.

Oh really? And just where did you obtain all this wisdom, so much wisdom that we should listen to you, one who tells unsubstantiated whoppers instead of wisdom from a Book that was inspired by God. Is that reasonable to you?

You blind, blind, brainwashed religious people. Please read the following:

"It is an act of virtue to deceive and lie, when by such means the interest of the church might be promoted."
Bishop Eusebius (260-339)

"How well we know what a profitable superstition this fable of Christ has been for us."
Pope Leo X (1513-`521)

My keyboard is the bible and the internet is the new god. when we die, we shall all return to become signals and bits of information. when ash and dust becomes too archaic...
the end is nigh

I have never understood if you dont believe in God why try to discredit it? It only works for good, peace and love. Now true there are radicals in any religion and any non religious group that will always try for hate and hurt but true Christians just want peace and love. You shouldn't attack a organization with good intentions because others do bad in its name. If there were no religion the same bad people would do the same bad things but give a different reason.

Originally posted by SoFunkyMe
reply to post by jedimiller

 

show me proof that all that is tru u have proof that there is god were? we need proof for everything well thats how i live

You are asking for proof that nobody can provide. Can you prove that we dont live in a petri dish from another civilization? Nope you cant. Can you prove that we even exist? Nope you cant. Everything you "know to be true" is just a chemical reaction in your brain that tells you what something is or isnt. You cant prove anything at all? I could put you on drugs to effect your brain and prove to you that the sky is really green and when you urinate small lizards come out, or at least that is what you would see and believe. My point is humans know nothing, for us to think anything at all if "fact" is ridiculous. Almost every "fact" man has known in the past has been proven wrong or misguided with the passage of time. In 1000 years what we hold as physics and truth now will probably be laughable. Proof is nothing more than you being coerced into believing something. Truth to you may be that the sky is blue but to someone else it may be grey or non existent at all. Have you ever witnessed 99% of anything you hold to be "truth" for yourself? Probably not and even if you had, again, its all just a chemical reaction in your brain. If you ask me, any human that believes they know the absolute "truth" about anything is nothing short of misguided and ignorant. Its all perception my friend and nothing more. Just about everything you know was told to you by someone else with very little other than mass acceptance to be used as proof for their correctness.

There's a great line in the movie Contact that always comes to mind when people start arguing about 'proof'.


Can't remember the characters names, but it's a scene between Matthew McConaughey and Jodie Foster, so I'll just use their names. He's a preacher and she's a scientist.

It goes something like this:

Matthew: Did you love your father?
Jodie: Yes
Matthew: Prove it.

reply to post by Quantum_Squirrel


I have a few questions for you.

I. Does what you say exclude:

1) the forces of darkness,
2) Belzubub (Lord of the flies)
3) Creatures, celestial, terrestrial
4) In the body, out of the body

II. And what is your remedy for:
1) little fiery darts,
2) scorpions and their stings,
3) the furrow on the forehead (snake tied with the bands of satans people),
4) leeches who pilfer the earth and humans
5) the dust heaped by the wicked
6) the woes of living

III. Do you believe there is a spiritual realm? If yes, what exists there?

IV. Do you believe death is the end of life or a transition to a new one?

V. Have you ever been in a position when:
1) you could not save yourself
2) could not heal yourself
3) needed a higher power for whatever reason







[edit on 23-9-2007 by Siren]

reply to post by Ingolstadt

reply to post by shug7272


EXACTLY!!!!!!!! Thank you gentlemen (or ladies, or gentleman and lady or lady and gentleman) for saying better than I could what I was trying to say for a while now.

Originally posted by Siren
reply to post by Quantum_Squirrel


I have a few questions for you.

I. Does what you say exclude:

1) the forces of darkness,
2) Belzubub (Lord of the flies)
3) Creatures, celestial, terrestrial
4) In the body, out of the body

No i am not alking about these 4 books i'm talking about the Bible, we can do a seperate book review later 1 at a time if u like ..

II. And what is your remedy for:
1) little fiery darts,
Sun cream

2) scorpions and their stings,
Sting Cream

3) the furrow on the forehead (snake tied with the bands of satans people),
Face Cream

Finally a serious question.

4) leeches who pilfer the earth and humans
exploitation is never a good thing

5) the dust heaped by the wicked
see attached video

6) the woes of living
there is always soemone worse of than you out there, it's not all bad smile

III. Do you believe there is a spiritual realm?
there is a possibilty of other 'realms' out there , a place doesn't have to be spiritual to be another place it could be another dimension.

If yes, what exists there?
The possibilites are endless


IV. Do you believe death is the end of life or a transition to a new one?
Energy can't be destroyed only transferred so both scenarios are possible.


V. Have you ever been in a position when:
1) you could not save yourself
yes

2) could not heal yourself
Yes , and i went to the doctor to get fixed

3) needed a higher power for whatever reason
No, i dont talk to air









[edit on 23/9/07 by Quantum_Squirrel]