Pilots for 911 Truth Airphone Claim - debunked

And as I said in an earlier post, the reason they are testing new equipment to allow cell phones on planes is because prior to this a cell phone at high altitude would hit ALL the towers within range instead of just one. When they did that there was a risk of the entire network being overloaded. This new equipment they're testing limits the signal to just ONE tower at a time.

Current rules of both the FCC and the Federal Aviation Administration ban in-flight cellular calling. The primary FCC concern has been possible disruption of cell phone communication on the ground. The FAA's worry is how cell phones might interfere with a plane's navigation and electrical systems.

At Wednesday's meeting, FCC officials proposed allowing passengers to use "off the shelf" wireless handsets and other devices so long as they operate at their lowest power setting and do not broadcast unwanted radio frequency emissions that could interfere with cellular networks on the ground. The FCC will now seek public comment on these issues. It will also work with the FAA to ensure that FCC rules and policies complement the FAA's efforts.

Engineers at NASA noted at least three years ago that cell phones were being built so well that they emitted remarkably fewer interference-causing spurious radio signals. A NASA engineer said in a 2000 interview that the airplane cell phone ban would be lifted once earlier generations of cell phones wore down and were tossed out or recycled.

www.news.com...

That's an incredibly useful insight Zaphod. Hmmm. So it's not even so much a matter of their working from altitude as working too well, in a sense.

In that case, is so many calls from Flight 93 not so weird then? But why not the others?

Partly psychological? Unlike the first two flights (and maybe 77) they knew what was going on by 9:30-ish- other planes had been hijacked and crashed. School's out, the ban is off - gather intel and send out messages and then act.

That's one explanation.

Gotta go check out the Pilots site and then go barbecue some ribs in my spiffy new apron.

Originally posted by johndoex
CaptObvious,

Further, anytime you want to address the fact that John Hotard, PR Rep from American Airlines says the deactivation order was issued prior to 9/11/2001 (and puts his name on that statement), which contradicts your paperwork above obtained from an anonymous source through the internet... let us know. However, i think you already have made up your mind and will find anything to back up your preconceived notions, even if from an anonymous internet source which contradicts John Hotard himself. You will go further to mislead your readers that we have not commented on the blog entry at SLC when in fact anyone who reads the comment section will clearly see we have commented more than once.

You bias is extreme. Your deception is clear.

Actually it does not contradict the documentation in question. What Rob B fails to realize is that the date the boys in the ivory tower decided to discontinue air phones and when it was actually carried out are two different things. Like any large corporation, especailly an airline, there is a decision making process involved.

First you have to figure out when how much is this going to cost. Then you have to determine what stations are going to accomplish it and the manpower involved. Since the system technically belonged to and was maintained by another company you have to work out the contractual issues. Then an engineer has to write the necessary ECO's. Once this all happens it has to be signed off on by the appropriate management people in M&E. Then it will makes it's way onto the shop floor.

Originally posted by CaptainObvious
reply to post by johndoex

 

Rob ~

You are not making sence. Throw all these names around from SLC and JREF... I don't care. Post your replys to "Pat" and the others over there. Just answer me one question.....

HAVE YOU SENT A COPY OF THE WORK ORDER TO YOUR CONTACT AT THE AIRLINES?

Answer the question. If not... why?

If this comes up as a fraud, I will be the first to apologize to you and the others at your fantasy website.

Oh.. one more thing...do you agree with Dr. Griffin that the phones cals that were made were due to "voice morphing?" I doubt I will get a response to the question either.

Thanks,

CO

Your not going to get an answer. Myself and others have been asking him repeatedly for more documentation to support his claim. So far he has not done so, that should tell you something.

There's something else Rob B failed to mention when he posted that AA maintenance manual page earlier this summer. Did you notice the letters in the left hand column next to the first sentence saying the air phone system was being deactivated? The letters TR mean Temporary Revision, this particualr TR was added April 2007.

< img131.imageshack.us... >

Originally posted by JimmyBlonde

Originally posted by CaptainObvious

As you see, these undoctored documents (besides personal information) show that the airphones were not deactivated until March of 2002.


[edit on 15-9-2007 by CaptainObvious]

Hi, Captain obvious.

I have no real interest in the documents or what they imply but I would like to point out that what you have posted is a scan of a document and not a real document. Scanning a document and posting it on the internets does not constitute proof or even a convincing argument.

Thanks.

Using that logic you can say the same thing about Rob B scanned document. After all, is it not scanned and posted on the internet?

reply to post by AMTMAN


AMTMAN ~

thanks for your input and all the information you gathered. Not sure where Rob will go from here. I doubt we will see him remove that article at his site.

reply to post by johndoex


Seems to me you are wasting your time on CaptainO. If you can back up your claims with names of people in the industry and he cant why continue to argue with a wall? He believes the official story and thats fine. If the average person looks at the two forms of info, one signed and verified and the other "anonymous", it doesnt take a genius to figure out which is more credible. Not to mention you and your partners have real knowledge and experience in the field and your arguing with "some internet guy". I wouldnt validate him with a response. You can look at the star ratings of you and CaptainOs posts on the first page and understand that nobody is buying his garbage. Wouldnt even buy it if it were on sale.

[edit on 19-9-2007 by shug7272]

reply to post by shug7272


Shug ... Do you see me looking for donations? No.

do you see me selling coffee mugs??

NO! Do you see me selling aprons? NO!

Have I made death threats. (threatening to put a "bullet" in someones head?) NO!

Have I made threatening phone calls to others that don't believe what I post? NO!

Shug, I suggest if you are in fact searching for the truth, do a little research on the people you trust.

If you would like, I will post the threats he has made and I will post a link to the phone call he made.

The man is VERY upset because his fantasy is getting undone. He does not want his reputation to die with his theory......he will LOOSE MONEY!!!

I will bet my house that he made the clone name of mine just to try to make me look bad.
I dont care about starts or flags either.Most of my posts offer things that most Cters don't want to deal with... facts. So trust me when I say.... i dont loose any sleep over not having starts on my OP.

Originally posted by shug7272
reply to post by johndoex

 

Seems to me you are wasting your time on CaptainO. If you can back up your claims with names of people in the industry and he cant why continue to argue with a wall? He believes the official story and thats fine. If the average person looks at the two forms of info, one signed and verified and the other "anonymous", it doesnt take a genius to figure out which is more credible. Not to mention you and your partners have real knowledge and experience in the field and your arguing with "some internet guy". I wouldnt validate him with a response. You can look at the star ratings of you and CaptainOs posts on the first page and understand that nobody is buying his garbage. Wouldnt even buy it if it were on sale.

[edit on 19-9-2007 by shug7272]

Rob B's source on the subject of this post is also anonymous. Rob says he knows the name of his source; we have to take his word that he does.

Could you show me who "signed off" on Rob's side of the story? While you are at it why don't you explain to me what a pilot who has never worked on an aircraft in his life or flown for AA knows about AA M&E?

Truthers like to say they just want answers. From what I have seen that's really not true. What they want is their version of the truth. If you give them information that suggests otherwise they will attack you, talk about everything but the subject at hand or pretend you don't exist. Guess what, you and Rob will prove me right.

If you really just want answers and are at the least bit intellectually honest here's what you have to do. You have to ask Rob to explain the TR that was posted along with all the other information. Since he has a "source" at AA he should be able to do so. He will not give you a direct answer to your questions. Rob will rant about how I'm just another anonymous poster, that HE knows his source, HE’S right and I'm wrong etc, etc. However in the end he will not answer your question. That's assuming of course you even ask it.

I find it hard to believe that PM and the History Channel were even brought into this equation.
Nobody I know gives ANY credibilty to Popular Mechanics.
I've done some props for the History Channel in the past and I can tell you that they don't care about accuracy, it's about budget.
I have an interest in history and I've found them to be wrong so many times I stopped watching the channel.

I haven't read any articles that say or prove that cell phones work on aircraft at flying altitude......ever.
The title of this thread is misleading.

[edit on 19-9-2007 by citizen truth]

reply to post by citizen truth


Citizen Truth...

the topic is not mileading, Pilots For Truth claimed that there were not any operational seat back phones posting a form they believed proved this. The form was legit, but did not contain the information they claimed it did. (please see posts from AMTMAN above)

In addition to there false claims, there was a form received that showed the dates as to when they were removed.

Originally posted by CaptainObvious


I will bet my house that he made the clone name of mine just to try to make me look bad.

I'll take that bet.

Mods, please look up IP's and inform CaptOvious to start packing his bags.

CO, send your deed to this address...along with a contract stating you will be paying the remainder of the mortgage...

click

Also, your frivilous claims at attempts to discredit in order to derail your own thread because you are relying on an anonymous source on the net are very unbecoming, text book disinfo and predictable...

I have been through numerous FAA background checks, criminal background checks, PRIA checks, and random drugs tests required by the FAA. They arent worried about some spat on the net and they wont be in the future. Give it a rest and stop your whining.

Im also not surprised you would attack our support structure. We are up against multi-billion dollar propaganda machines such as Fox News. But i suppose you feel Fox is truth and you dont mind if they raise funding to inform the public. Do you attack this forum as well for raising funds in order to operate?

shug, no worries my friend. CO is not really worth much of my time. He will take any information as gospel obtained from any source, no matter the accuracy, as long as it supports the govt story. A critical thinker he is not (i see he hasnt found our update as well, not surprised). However, i couldnt pass him up on his bet. Observe the backpeddling and excuses that will now pour from CaptObvious. He'll probably even try to spout some Conspiracy Theory that i had a friend do it..lol

Cap, you arent that important. You cannot debate facts. You derail your own thread and you have been proven to eat your foot many times in the past.

I'll be looking forward to your deed and contract in the mail Cap.


fixed link

[edit on 20-9-2007 by johndoex]

Originally posted by johndoex

Originally posted by CaptainObvious


I will bet my house that he made the clone name of mine just to try to make me look bad.

I'll take that bet.

Mods, please look up IP's and inform CaptOvious to start packing his bags.

CO, send your deed to this address...along with a contract stating you will be paying the remainder of the mortgage...

click

Also, your frivilous claims at attempts to discredit in order to derail your own thread because you are relying on an anonymous source on the net are very unbecoming, text book disinfo and predictable...

I have been through numerous FAA background checks, criminal background checks, PRIA checks, and random drugs tests required by the FAA. They arent worried about some spat on the net and they wont be in the future. Give it a rest and stop your whining.

Im also not surprised you would attack our support structure. We are up against multi-billion dollar propaganda machines such as Fox News. But i suppose you feel Fox is truth and you dont mind if they raise funding to inform the public. Do you attack this forum as well for raising funds in order to operate?

shug, no worries my friend. CO is not really worth much of my time. He will take any information as gospel obtained from any source, no matter the accuracy, as long as it supports the govt story. A critical thinker he is not (i see he hasnt found our update as well, not surprised). However, i couldnt pass him up on his bet. Observe the backpeddling and excuses that will now pour from CaptObvious. He'll probably even try to spout some Conspiracy Theory that i had a friend do it..lol

Cap, you arent that important. You cannot debate facts. You derail your own thread and you have been proven to eat your foot many times in the past.

I'll be looking forward to your deed and contract in the mail Cap.

fixed link

[edit on 20-9-2007 by johndoex]

Thank you for proving me right Rob.

reply to post by johndoex



John,

It will be kind of tough for the mods here to figure out what library your posting from! (jk)

John, I notice that you are careful with your posts and do not come out and deny the allegations that I have presented. Let me ask you these questions:

1. Do you make a profit from the: cups, aprons, tshirts, tote bags, and DVD's you sell on your website?

2. Do you ask for donations for your website?

3. Did you say (post) this to Mr. Mark Roberts?:

"I would actually like to get in an official ring with Mark Roberts to break his jaw "

or this?:

"Mark Roberts does deserve to die a traitors death....
I will not apologize for it this time. I will be there for his death should America fall into Civil War. That is not a threat. that is a promise.
...If he gets in my way of defending our Constitution.. it will be my pleasure to put a bullet in his head...He is a disgrace to America."

Also John did you make a threat Russell Pickering "We're going to get you?"

I dunno... is this your voice???

www.pentagonresearch.com...



John, i deal with facts here. You can spin your fantasy on your website all you want. It appears you are not getting the revenue you had hoped for with your Tote Bag sales and Donations.

Mods, I apologize in for derailing this thread somewhat, but this is the man that started the lie and continues to make money off the DEATHS of thousands of Americans that were killed on 911. No matter who you think killed our people on 911, John is attempting to make money off of it and its pure disgust!






[edit on 20-9-2007 by CaptainObvious]

CO, you cannot debate facts, you cannot authenticate your source, so elect to derail your own thread through cherrypicking BS internet exchanges that were typed out at a Super Bowl party in attempts to discredit, you misquote complete audio tracks you post which were a call for a debate.

You cry and whine like the best of em...

Let us know when you find the update on our site. You too AMTMAN...

By the way, Craig Ranke and Aldo also know our source. They have tossed back beers with him. Have you done the same with AMTMAN? Know his name? Can you stick to topic?

Feel free to email if you would like to have a recorded debate. However, i have a feeling you would rather cower behind your screen derailing your own thread with frivilous BS due to the fact you cannot authenticate your source.

Hope your foot tastes good after that bet...

Have a great night... i can be reached via email or snail mail... address is above. I dont cower behind my screen.

reply to post by johndoex


Thanks for the answers John!

Once again you are proving yourself.

You have offered a debate over at JREF in 2-3 months. But refused a written debate. I wonder why??

John... are you or are you NOT making money off of what happened on 09/11/2001???

You can say whatever you want. I don't have to debate with you...you cant answer simple questions. You make money off of the murder of thousands of Americans on 911 and that is SICK. I tell you what... I will debate whats left of you after Mark Roberts puts you completly out of business.

But hey...keep on accepting those donations and selling your coffee cups to support your lies.

You can post your address on line... that does not give you credibility, it makes..... (SNIP) I would never give out my personal information to a man that wants to put bullets in peoples heads. I dont care how drunk you were when you said it. You made threats to him more than once and thats a fact. A fact you do not deny!

reply to post by CaptainObvious


CaptainObvious, you have just lost ALL creditability.

You first start a thread with unverified data, and claim it to be "undoctored" and imply it is real. Then, because you have found that your data is invalid, and not an acceptable form of evidence, you attack someones personal life.

CaptainObvious, since you know nothing about creating a revolutionary movement, I will tell you the basics.

1: Time and Research and Passion - Dedication that isn't free.
2: Money - Not Free
3: A Website - Websites aren't free.
4: Advertisment - Clothing/hats/cups/bags anything that will get your name spread out into the world - its not free.

Now, since you Obviously missed that aspect of "the bigger picture", I can only suspect that you don't see that "bigger picture" of 9/11 as well. That would explain your need to truly believe data that only looks real, but which is not really REAL. Like, NIST/ASCE/FEMA, and the 9/11 Commission Report, and various other lost souls as well. You tend to only believe that which gives you the belief and feeling of real.

Someday, one of the most important things in the universe will appear real to you when in reality it is just an illusion. You will believe it only because it felt real, and not that because it truly was or wasn't. This will lead to your entrapment. This will be The Great Deception.

You will be surprised to find out you are debating against the good prophets, the ones that will stop at nothing to help the deceived. Until then, the forces will play the tug of war.

reply to post by 0ne0ne


John...
Another attempt at trying to make me look bad? This name was created yesterday. Funny how their first post is to discredit me. How many does that make on this thread alone.

Do you think these people in here are going to buy it?

You make money off the deaths of thousands of people ! You sell Barbeque Aprons with your logo on it!!! You seek donations to sell your lies!!!

You get drunk and say you want to kill someone that does not agree with your lies!!!

You can call me what you want... you sir are not honest.

Sleep tight, and see what other names you can make up tomorrow.

awww... look at the govt shill crying in his wheaties. You dont have much faith in the law do you CaptObvious...

Yeah... i got a bit carried away with that wording... but the fact and context of the quote is that i will defend the Constitution. It is clear you will not and instead you elect to protect War Criminals dismantling our Constitution based on a govt known for lies and corruption. I dont blame you for wanting to remain anonymous. Just like your source.

I know you still believe in the boogieman CaptObvious.. but dont worry.. no one is coming after you...lol

Next time try to quote the full statement. As i have said before, your cherry picking is very unbecoming and predictable. Then again, you defend war criminals.. and derail your own thread since you cannot authenticate your source... typical shill.


ok.. enough fun with the shill for tonight... enjoy your night behind your screen...
typo

[edit on 20-9-2007 by johndoex]

reply to post by CaptainObvious



You want to see the REAL people making money off of 9/11 CaptainObvious?!?!?!?!?!

Check out Halliburton, check out the Carlyle Group, look at what Silverstien made, you would be shocked to find out that they are making MILLIONS upon MILLIONS of dollars off of 9/11.

en.wikipedia.org...
en.wikipedia.org...

These are REAL companies, making REAL money, because of 9/11.

WHY DO YOU NOT PERSONALLY ATTACK THEM?!

I know already, you are one of the deceived, or possibly the deceiver.




gut check-

[edit on 20-9-2007 by 0ne0ne]