HIV conspiracy

Originally posted by Soulshock
Do you believe the HIV was created as a population control? or just as some experiment?
Some people claim the medicine against HIV just makes the virus worse and spread and that the government has a medicine anti-hiv but does not give it to the public because of the income $$ that anti-hiv drugs generate.

What is your opinion?

They invented the common cold too. Ever notice that a virus is not natural. They still do not know if it is animal, mineral or vegetable. These viruses are so alien that they can only be manmade.

How else do the pharmaceutical companies rake in the profits? The cost of one year supply of HIV meds is more than $1000 per month and since they killed off a bunch of people for the hype they now release meds that doesn’t cure it, but just contains it for your life time. Let’s see.. a million dollars spent for these drugs over the ones life time is a very nice renewable income source, and something along the lines of a flu shots (another renewable income source for something they made, but do not want to cure) that could have a delayed HIV reaction to hit about the time a person is sexually active…YES blame it on the sex!

The good news is they will make sure you live 100 plus years for you are a very valuable income sourse for them and they wouldn’t want that to stop anytime soon.



[edit on 7-9-2007 by Xtrozero]

''God'' is just a investion to control the people, just like religion.

Not this again, seriously, how many times do I need to debunk HIV conspiracy theories? Just take a look through the ATS records, as I'm sure this topic has been covered numerous times. If that doesn't appease everyone then I would be more than willing to answer any specific scientific questions about the origins of the virus. I am a Virologist working in HIV Prevention currently, so I can add anything that MajorMalfunction has not already covered.

Here are a few threads that might help answer some questions:

HIV Conspiracy
www.abovetopsecret.com...

Why HIV Causes AIDS (see my posts on pages 2 & 3 for information)
www.abovetopsecret.com...

Give me some time and I will give everyone a thorough answer as to why the virus is not a conspiracy against certain humans, and a little background on HIV.

[edit on 7-9-2007 by Jazzerman]

Originally posted by chickeneater
That being said, being ignorant (if I am indeed so) is not illegal isn't it?


I am posting pertaining to the ORIGIN of the disease, and it's just a theory. And God I believe is full of love, but he can frown and disagrees with what we do, and send a nudge our ways to point us to the right directions. It's a sign, I believe.

to the first part, no, it's not illegal....just god damn dumb

the rest of what you're saying is about the same.....god had to send down a friggin pandemic to give us a 'nudge' back in the right direction.....

the more i hear about this 'god' character, the more i want him to take a big bite outta my arse[/spits]

that is MY opinion of which is not against the law....right? right

major, i say religion is a plague.....thats my word of choice.....least the one i can use on the boards here.

reply to post by Boondock78


Religion is a plague, God is created to instill fear and control over humans, right? I used to be an atheist, but then again, I really hate being a pragmatist.
Religion is only as good as the people who worship it. Many commit suicides and believe they would be received in heaven by 72 virgins, some think their prayers help them win superbowl/ war, absurd I know.

But denying the existence of God simply because you haven't been "benefitted" from Him is just short-sighted and down right bitter.

Feel sorry for ya!

Originally posted by scientist
id like to add that a close friend of mine contracted HIV from a blood transfusion. I don't see why that would have pissed god(s) off.

That's just one of the many totally asinine theories that are out there is that GOD made it to punish the homosexual. I guess that idea comes from the biblical account where he destroys the city of Sodom amd Gomorrah. I would ask the little homophobic twit why GOD just doesn't take out San Francisco too then?

To who ever it was asking for a link to the research finding the HIV in mummy's Ill suggest this one Do your own,, I DO I have had ten friends die of AIDS and I don't think any of them were the unfortunate victims of GODS wrath or man's dabbling into secret weapons to control population. To me, that is the kind of garbage that got the truthers credibility in the toilet. Just too many ways it can be debunked. I dislike debunkers as much as any truther and I am a creationist also. I DO find many of the methods used for debunking garbage talk very useful however and the most easily used technique being common sense is all thats needed for this topic.

You want a link for the mummy post? Try the Glendale public library in AZ. That's where my mummy info was obtained. I really could give a rats arse whether you believe it or not. It sure is a hell of a lot more credible then what Ive seen from some of the posts here.

By the way scientist I wasn't flaming you and if I was you'd seen much more creative liscense being taken in the use of expletives. I merely thought you taking that post from a hip hop forum was kind of funny as the post below that one on the same forum ripped it to shreds. Other then that your post was much like my own in that regard. I mean if any post at all were to be flamed,, they would have to be the kind that keep saying " I don't believe and I don't disbelieve" . That has GOT to be the most banal of them all. My first thought was "what an idiot"

lol

I remember when the BBC was doing some research as to how King TUT died at such a young age news.bbc.co.uk... Ever since then I had an interest as many in the medical fields did to see how far back some of the known virus's can be traced. The fact that HIV mutation rate is so fast makes it difficult to pin down a cure.

They have found in the tissues of some since that first came out. When you have a long justation period as AIDS has (as much as a decade) you can reasonably assume that yeah,, of course it had been around in the 70's before it was wide spread and a household name in the 80's. My point was that it was around LONG before that.

[edit on 7-9-2007 by Conspiriology]

Originally posted by Jazzerman
Give me some time and I will give everyone a thorough answer as to why the virus is not a conspiracy against certain humans, and a little background on HIV.

[edit on 7-9-2007 by Jazzerman]

I always enjoy reading your input. I don't believe HIV is a conspiracy targeting anyone, but was fascinated by The River. It you have time or are so inclined, when you make your next post could you include a couple brief comments regarding how those that work in the field view Hooper's theory?

I've been to his website and know he continues to push the idea that a polio vaccine is responsible, but I don't believe there are many who support him.

Thanks.

I always enjoy reading your input. I don't believe HIV is a conspiracy targeting anyone, but was fascinated by The River. It you have time or are so inclined, when you make your next post could you include a couple brief comments regarding how those that work in the field view Hooper's theory?

Ahh I see a man with common sence nothing more refreshing then that. I was begining to think I was all alone in my pragmatism.

I noticed a few inaccuracies in some of the comments here.

First let it be noted that HIV was NOT found in chimpanzees, ever. Since its HUMAN Immunodeficiency Virus. The chimpanzees carry SIV, or Simian Immunodeficiency Virus. It should be noted that SIV is non-transferable between species. They're isolated solely to each individual species. Infact, the mutations of SIV to HIV is just a commonly accepted hypothesis with no real evidence in it's favor. There never has been a case of HIV being FOUND in a monkey in order to proove that the virus did infact mutate.

So where did this virus come from? From 1962 to 1978 the Department of Defense funded a Special Viruses Program. A program designed to develop new biological and viral weaponry to use against various soviet targets.
In 1971 the SVP began research, with congressional approval, of a viral weapon that would discriminate against specific people (that they apply it to) and affects those whom are infected by destroying theyre immune system. The lead researcher of this program was Dr. Robet C Gallo. Those whom know the name, know that he is the first person to "discover" HIV. Ironic, just by coincidence, the man that FOUND the HIV virus, in 1985, was in charge of the project to design a virus that did the very same thing in 1971? How curious... Infact, Gallo actually has a PATENT on the HIV/AIDs virus, filed in 1987. US Patent number 4647773: " Method of continuous production of retroviruses (HTLV-III) from patients with AIDS and pre-AIDS."

"A method for continuous production of HTLV-III virus which comprises infecting in cell culture highly susceptible, permissive cells consisting of a neoplastic aneuploid HT-cell line with said virus, said cells preserve the capacity for permanent growth after the infection with said virus, growing said cells under conditions suitable for cell growth and recovering said virus produced by said cells. "

He patented a method to successfully CREATE more of the virus.

So, lets just take a look about that in abstract.

You have a variation of a virus, isolated only in Simians, mysteriously appear in a rare, mutated form, and discovered by a man who was working hand in hand with the US government to make a virus years before, with the EXACT same conditions that this said virus does, and this very same man has a patent on this said viruses creation.

...

As having lived through watching one of my close relatives go through the horrible things that the HIV/Aids epidemic until his demise. I do agree that it may have been some laboratory created (or re-created) virus that was released into the general "gay/drug" populations under the guise of "free immunizations" to a select groups of individuals in largly populated gay communities (yes, my uncle was gay and living in Philadelphia, PA). He was also a very caring and nuturing person who spent his life working to help others as a therapist for various State Hosptials.

From our strict catholic upbringing, it was "hidden" and was a very taboo subject. He went from being a very healthy young man who took his job very seriously, and must have been diagnosed early on. After that diagnosis, we (close family) noticed changes in his behavior, like doing things that were out of charater and travelling quite extensively. I do miss him dearly yet. He finally sucomed to his illness back in 1991.

Back to the religous issues at hand with this, most of the family did not know of the real reason for his death. They were "spared -- as my grandmother called it" and were told that he had died of cancer. He had actually died of phnemonia from precipitated from the lack of an immune system.

I have tried to gather information on the HIV/AIDS epidemic over the years along with all the conspiracies surrounding this devistating virus. I haven't found much to ease my thoughts on the whole issue, but I'm glad you have brought this to the forefront.

With everything else going on in the world and specifically the US, you can't put anything past the governments and pharmacutical industries to capitalize on the innocent citizens to further their own agendas.

Ok, I think I'm done with my ranting now, but I am trying enjoying this thread, thank you all.

A_L

I'd just like to read a thread on here once where religion is mentioned and a dozen people don't respond by calling Christianity a "fairy tale" and equating Jesus Christ to Santa Claus. Just because one moron says that HIV is a punishment from God to the gay community does not mean that all Christians believe that. It doesn't even mean that any measureable number of Christians, at least in this country, believe it. You shouldn't lump the radicle fringe elements of Christianity in with the rest of us, just as one shouldn't condemn all of Islam over the actions of terrorists.

I don't think there is a single person in my church, or even a single person that I know, who believes HIV is a punishment from God for those who engage in homosexual behavior. It's completely absurd and completely ignorant. And the fact that there is disagreement among Christians and its particular sects does not mean that God does not exist or that Jesus Christ wasn't his son. That's like saying that aliens don't exist because there's a thousand different threads on ATS with a thousand conflicting theories about the sources of UFO's.

Furthmore, you can state your beliefs without insulting hundreds of millions of people on here. You'll never find me bashing athiests or non-Christians on here, even if one of them says something that I find stupid. And I certainly have the sense not to condemn all athiests or all other members of that moron's religion based on his comments/beliefs.

I believe in God and Jesus Christ. I have as much a right to do so as anyone on here has the right to believe in Bigfoot or Aliens or even the Flying Spaghetti Monster. I think its foolish to say that there is no evidence of God, or even that absense of evidence is evidence of absense. Faith is believing in that which you cannot see. But personally, I see the existence of God all around me. I see it in the beauty and diversity of life and in the many miracles I've read about and witnessed. And with all that said, that does not mean that I subscribe to every single word of the Bible or every word uttered by my Pastor. Being a Christian, despite what a few self-righteous guys in funny hats halfway around the world might say, does not require one to adhere to every single letter of every single word. I have plenty more to say, but I don't want to hijack this thread anymore than I already have. I just wish that there was a lot less Christian-bashing going on here at ATS. Just because you don't believe in something does not mean that you need to bash it or equate it to fairy tales or act as though all of its believers are radicals and/or morons. Having a Christian bash you on here or say something stupid does not give you a free pass to speak ignorantly and offensively of the entire religion.

On behalf of us normal Christians, let me apologize to MajorMalfunction for the ignorant comments made towards her. I have deep sympathy for you and I hope that despite your infection you live a very long and healthy life. I respect you and I respect your personal beliefs, and you are completely entitled to them. I just feel the need to let you know that when you bash one idiot for believing in God, you bash all of us kind and normal folks who also do. And this is coming from someone who isn't a radical or even a deeply-religious individual. I'm just someone who happens to believe in God and is dragged to Church by his girlfriend from time to time. But I am as offended by your comments about Christianity as you are offended by chickeneater's comments about the origins of HIV. You passed up an opportunity to put him in his place with a reasonable and factual argument, but instead chose to lower yourself to his level by insulting a group of otherwise good people and their personal beliefs. That's just my opinion and I felt the need to let you know.

As for the origins of HIV, my mind isn't entirely made up. Obviously I don't believe that it is the work of God in an attempt to punish homosexuals. But I also don't think that it is an attempt at population control. There's plenty more effective ways to do that. If it was created as a means of population control then it must have been done independently by a small group of well-educated morons who didn't have the sense to fully think through what it was they were doing or the effect it would have on the world.

Originally posted by Conspiriology

I always enjoy reading your input. I don't believe HIV is a conspiracy targeting anyone, but was fascinated by The River. It you have time or are so inclined, when you make your next post could you include a couple brief comments regarding how those that work in the field view Hooper's theory?

Ahh I see a man with common sence nothing more refreshing then that. I was begining to think I was all alone in my pragmatism.

I mentioned the river as well (first even), but I guess I don't get kudos because I'm still crazy

Originally posted by MajorMalfunction


Is it a conspiracy? Why would it be? Population controls such as this would not be controllable themselves. There would be no way of knowing who it would destroy and who would live -- just like now.

It was an accident either in the lab, or in the jungle.

If the people who want this virus out have a cure for it, they don't really care who gets it as long as they themselves don't.

Originally posted by Xtrozero

Originally posted by Soulshock
Do you believe the HIV was created as a population control? or just as some experiment?

They invented the common cold too. Ever notice that a virus is not natural.

Xtrozero: Everything is natural....steel, plastic, condoms, its all natural. I'd like to think that makes enough sense to not really need explaining.

Soulshock: I believe that the "someone got it on with a monkey" theory...its stupid...but its the best we've got. The idea of population control is a crock though, because if you start limiting your population....you've got less people to flood your malls, buying things they don't need, and ingesting high fat foods, driving those business criminals bank accounts up.

yes, good one.

gotta check what sleeper and the gang say about that and diseases.

Originally posted by Xtrozero
They invented the common cold too. Ever notice that a virus is not natural. They still do not know if it is animal, mineral or vegetable. These viruses are so alien that they can only be manmade.

Are you suggesting that humans genetically engineered all viruses?

You think we genetically engineered small pox? A virus that killed people as far back as the 1700's?! That we GENETICALLY ENGINEERED something back then?!?!

We didn't even have cars back then!

[edit on 9/7/2007 by Kacen]

Originally posted by ringo_shells
Xtrozero: Everything is natural....steel, plastic, condoms, its all natural. I'd like to think that makes enough sense to not really need explaining.

.

You are going to read my outrageous post and just comment on my use of the word manmade or natural hehe.

I understand your point but to differentiate between something that man had no influence in making can simply be called natural and something that man in a natural way created can be called manmade. The fact that man is natural and so everything he does is natural was really not the focus of my crazy post.

Originally posted by WolfofWar
It should be noted that SIV is non-transferable between species. They're isolated solely to each individual species. Infact, the mutations of SIV to HIV is just a commonly accepted hypothesis with no real evidence in it's favor.

Not entirely true there; SIV can be transmitted between species. Case in point, the viral envelopes in cases of SIV in Asian Rhesus Macaques are almost completely similar to those found in Sooty Mangabey monkeys. There has been some research done to determine if cross-species infections were possible and we now know that it is. To save my breath, here is a good study called "Detection of Simian Immunodeficiency Virus in Diverse Species and of Human Immunodeficiency Virus Type 2 by Using Consensus Primers within the pol Region":

Journal of Microbiology

Here is another article dealing with this issue:

euplotes.biology.uiowa.edu...

[edit on 7-9-2007 by Jazzerman]

Originally posted by WolfofWar
I noticed a few inaccuracies in some of the comments here.

First let it be noted that HIV was NOT found in chimpanzees, ever. Since its HUMAN Immunodeficiency Virus. The chimpanzees carry SIV, or Simian Immunodeficiency Virus. It should be noted that SIV is non-transferable between species. They're isolated solely to each individual species. Infact, the mutations of SIV to HIV is just a commonly accepted hypothesis with no real evidence in it's favor. There never has been a case of HIV being FOUND in a monkey in order to proove that the virus did infact mutate.

I notice a few inaccuracies in your comments...

Over 120 diseases are shared between human and animals and resent ones that have mutated to have jumped from animals to humans are measles, influenza A, Ebola, SARS, dengue, and HIV.

Yes in Chimps it is SIV but the jump needs a mutated form and HIV has mutated very well, and continues to. The fact that Chimps got their SIV from two other breeds of monkeys shows how well this virus can evolve to other species. Here is an article on HIV being at least 75 years old in humans.

www.pbs.org...

Originally posted by leafer

Originally posted by MajorMalfunction


Is it a conspiracy? Why would it be? Population controls such as this would not be controllable themselves. There would be no way of knowing who it would destroy and who would live -- just like now.

It was an accident either in the lab, or in the jungle.

If the people who want this virus out have a cure for it, they don't really care who gets it as long as they themselves don't.

Is this something "the people" told you? They they made it and they don't really care who gets it? I would assume the part saying as long as they and the superfluous addition "themselves" not getting it is the only part of that post that makes any sense. People do have a tendency to become quite sympathetic about this once it hits close to home. Nelson Mandela was against any support for AIDS until his son got it.

The post with the information about Gallo is interesting but am to think that there is more to the two distinctions being made between the genus type? SIV HIV? besides the genus simian and human, the virus does pretty much the same thing does it not? I'm just wondering if their isn't another reason for adding that distinction for instance, if we used crabs to test on would be the only reason to make the distinction CIV or crustacean immuno virus etc?

You seem to be making a statement that one could clearly point a finger at a evil scientist or Gallo?

At least that is the impression I got.

I don't mean to be flip but your post IS factual regarding Gallo and I remember the law suits that were going on for patents where his name was involved.