HIV conspiracy

Do you believe the HIV was created as a population control? or just as some experiment?
Some people claim the medicine against HIV just makes the virus worse and spread and that the government has a medicine anti-hiv but does not give it to the public because of the income $$ that anti-hiv drugs generate.

What is your opinion?

You don't actually believe any of what you said do you? Is this nonsense the opinion of someone you know or read somewhere or did you figure that we didn't learn anything after we created the bubonic plague.

I think the sharp angle is clever if not desperate in your attempt to get support for this crazy Idea. Instead of just asking us to speak extemporaneously, you ask a question giving two choices where no matter which of them we pick, we are looking as silly as you are for entertaining either one of those choices.

Allow me to offer several others that may appeal to some of the other aunt sally fans.

Do you believe the HIV was created as a population control? As some experiment? God's punishment to the Homosexual? One huge lie that the whole AIDS thing is a hoax and that nobody really died of it and Rock Hudson is still alive living two houses away from Elvis. Was something to disprove intelligent design but went terribly wrong and evolved into a diabolical virus?

Is, just what Doctors say it is.

variant strains of HIV has been discovered in the bodies found entombed in sarcophagus's in Egypt. That would indicate that it has been here for a LONG time. So that pretty much cancels out the postulate that our Governments evil scientist made it or that we found it searching Joseph Mengele's bunker. It makes for a lousy conspiracy theory for population control OR money. Invariably what happens with a disease like AIDS is those who had contracted it, MOST being Gay, had to wait a decade before any anti viral cocktails were even on the market. The Government dragged there feet not giving money to research one. So far I see no dollar signs. Since Gay men don't pop babies out there butts, I doubt there was much worry about population control with them.

The virus is best transmitted via Injection by drug users with dirty needles or Flesh injection right into the hemorrhoidal arteries from dirty dick users.

This is why we saw gays and intravenous drug users coming down with it first. Now as for the Government making money on it? When was the last time you ever seen a drug being sold by American Pharmaceuticals Company? If anyone makes money from drugs for HIV it would be Pfizer Searle ,, you know big corporations etc. Cases of Aids that went from bad to worse are usually those that fought so hard to have congress for ego FDA approval which would have taken years. These people didn't have years, they were gonna die and they knew it. Being a guinea pig for HIV drug trials was a better shot at survival where doing nothing guaranteed only one prognosis.

A lonely, slow agonizing death.

The stigma it has made it very unpopular for political funding or subsidy to offset the extreme price the typical Nigerian could afford.
Our Government allocated 10 billion for AIDS medications to Africa where in some countries 7 of ten have HIV. That makes for one hell of a parent-less generation of children. Those children are easy recruits to fight in wars at minimum wage.

As for the Government having some kind of antidote? Don't you think it shows better business acumen using the cure to keep taxpayers alive selling a expensive drug that maintains they be more physically fit keeping the Government fiscally fit? Of course it does so that theory is just bunk. I don't believe the Government has any such thing but I know someone who does.

His name is Earvin "Magic" Johnson

If the government was so concerned about our population I can see them adding a huge tax on childbirth operations. Adding all kinds of Government regulations to Child Care which would raise prices to offset the increased costs for such an establishments government compliance.

Then they could take the tax revenue generated there to subsidize free abortions which would make new child births even less.

They could think of a lot of ways to do it even emulate China's government rules for having children is better.

I dont believe and I dont disbelieve

What you say makes sense and maybe is true but we all know that we cant trust the government or whatever entity that deals with the public.

Thats why I was asking the forum users their opinion.

evidence points to HIV as a virus whose origin traces back to animal cancer retrovirus experimentation in the "pre-AIDS" yers of the late 1960s and 70s; linking to vaccine experiments performed on blacks and gays, however the popular theory due to politics is that HIV originated in chimps from the African rain forest, which "jumped species" in the 1930s.

In 1974, veterinarians created an AIDS-like virus called "bovine type-C virus" which acted exactly like AIDS when they fed it to monkeys in infected cow's milk, instead of their mother's milk. Within a year, the infected chimps died due to pneumocystis pneumonia, which is the leading cause of death for AIDS patients.

A similar AIDS-like virus was also created for cats in the 1970s, created by Myron (Max) Essex.

The AIDS virus actually came into the public in 1979, starting with the gay and black populations.

search google for the "SCVP - Special Cancer Virus Program." It happened in the 2 decades preceding the AIDS outbreak of the late 70s and 80s. All AIDS research today, both for vaccines and it's origin are all heavily funded and connected to the government, and many of the original scientists who conducted the "species-jumping" experiments that are most likely the cause in the first place.

The only subjective part of AIDS/HIV is the opinion people have of it, and how they think it originated. There are a few schools of thought. There's the racist/ignoramus that claims it's from people fornicating with monkeys (ridiculous, imo) - there's the invented in a lab nutcase crowd (of which I tend to be a part of) - there's the other crowd that figures it's just the next step in evolution, just another virus that's harmful to us (and we could be considered another virus to the planet). The last crowd is for the most part undecided. I'm actually part of the last 3 crowds, although the least surprising origin for me, would involve scientific experiments, not a freak quantum leap in nature.

It's just too much of a coincidence that we were creating the EXACT virus for other species at the same exact time a virus spontaneously mutated into the same thing, only for humans - and it only affected a specific group of minorities, although anyone is clearly susceptible to it equally.

No, sorry your wrong and had you read the only intelligent post on that hip hop forum you might have seen the errors. HipHopThinkTankwhere you copy pasted some whack jobs post to substantiate yours

You might want to plagiarize someone in CDC next time rather then,, well,, what ever that guy is.

Originally posted by Soulshock


I dont believe and I dont disbelieve

Enough with the circumlocution, ya stand for something or fall for anything, or in your case,, SPIN!!

What you say makes sense

Of course it does,,especially when you have statements like this

I dont believe and I dont disbelieve

to compare it to

Thats why I was asking the forum users their opinion.

Of course you were,, it's obvious you have none either way




[edit on 6-9-2007 by Conspiriology]

im not here to talk back to anyone.

just to discuss topics. and I am not a skeptic, so theres lots of issues that I dont believe and I dont disbelieve.

Originally posted by Conspiriology
No, sorry your wrong and had you read the only intelligent post on that hip hop forum you might have seen the errors. HipHopThinkTankwhere you copy pasted some whack jobs post to substantiate yours

You might want to plagiarize someone in CDC next time rather then,, well,, what ever that guy is.

LOL

did you consider for a second, that I may be that same wackjob? Sorry, next time I'll just retype it out - I didn't realize I needed to handcraft each post to make you feel special.

I'm glad you at least took the time to copy and paste part of my comments into google. Here's the original post:

forums.undergroundhiphop.com...

Wouldn't your response be considered flaming? Perhaps next time, send a PM.

edit:

How about some "wackjob" sources

Growth (vols 45 + 46), 1980-81: A bacteriologic investigation and histologic observations of variably acid-fast bacteria

Journal of Dermatologic Surgery and Oncology (vol7) (1981)

Cutis (vol 32), 1983

AIDS: the Mystery and the Solution (1984)

AIDS: an Inquiry into the Origin of the Aids Epidemic (1988)

The Cancer microbe (1990)

Queer Blood (1993)

New Dawn (Melbourne, vol Sept 1998)

Faden RR (Chair): "The Human Radiation Experiments: Final Report of the President's Advisory Committee" (1996)

Virus Hunting (1991)

The River (1999)

Emerging Viruses (1996)

I could list a few more, but throw those into google, and it should keep you busy enough to come back with some insight next time.

[edit on 6-9-2007 by scientist]

[edit on 6-9-2007 by scientist]

Well, as someone who's been living with HIV for nearly 20 years, I can say that I probably have a better than average knowledge of the hows, whys and wherefores.

HIV is a retrovirus found in chimpanzee and monkey populations in Africa. I have heard that it was put in the human population by accident as a side effect of polio vaccine research in the 50's, which I used to believe, but more recent research tends to suggest that it entered the human population due to hunting and eating of chimpanzees by native populations. It could have been in the human gene pool for a very long time, but only in small, isolated areas. it took a long time to spread to pandemic proportions.

Is it a conspiracy? Why would it be? Population controls such as this would not be controllable themselves. There would be no way of knowing who it would destroy and who would live -- just like now.

It was an accident either in the lab, or in the jungle.

I've been alive all these years, and have not had one opportunistic infection. Why? Because I take my meds and have done since the day I was diagnosed. Yes, the meds are expensive. Yes, the pharmaceutical industry cleans up on the patents. But do the drugs cause HIV? no. That sort of thing would be impossible to cover up, there is so much research going on in independent bodies all over the world.

I wouldn't put it past some of the pharmaceutical megacorps to sit on a vaccine or cure if they had one, for a little while, but to release the disease into the world deliberately? I think not.

yes, that is a bit extreme, but would you consider it a reasonable possibility that someone inadvertently created it?

Maybe not for malicious purposes... but then again the first person to create a rope wasn't thinking about strangling someone either.

Originally posted by Conspiriology
You don't actually believe any of what you said do you? Is this nonsense the opinion of someone you know or read somewhere or did you figure that we didn't learn anything after we created the bubonic plague.

I think the sharp angle is clever if not desperate in your attempt to get support for this crazy Idea. Instead of just asking us to speak extemporaneously, you ask a question giving two choices where no matter which of them we pick, we are looking as silly as you are for entertaining either one of those choices.

Allow me to offer several others that may appeal to some of the other aunt sally fans.

Do you believe the HIV was created as a population control? As some experiment? God's punishment to the Homosexual? One huge lie that the whole AIDS thing is a hoax and that nobody really died of it and Rock Hudson is still alive living two houses away from Elvis. Was something to disprove intelligent design but went terribly wrong and evolved into a diabolical virus?

Is, just what Doctors say it is.

variant strains of HIV has been discovered in the bodies found entombed in sarcophagus's in Egypt. That would indicate that it has been here for a LONG time. So that pretty much cancels out the postulate that our Governments evil scientist made it or that we found it searching Joseph Mengele's bunker. It makes for a lousy conspiracy theory for population control OR money. Invariably what happens with a disease like AIDS is those who had contracted it, MOST being Gay, had to wait a decade before any anti viral cocktails were even on the market. The Government dragged there feet not giving money to research one. So far I see no dollar signs. Since Gay men don't pop babies out there butts, I doubt there was much worry about population control with them.

The virus is best transmitted via Injection by drug users with dirty needles or Flesh injection right into the hemorrhoidal arteries from dirty dick users.

This is why we saw gays and intravenous drug users coming down with it first. Now as for the Government making money on it? When was the last time you ever seen a drug being sold by American Pharmaceuticals Company? If anyone makes money from drugs for HIV it would be Pfizer Searle ,, you know big corporations etc. Cases of Aids that went from bad to worse are usually those that fought so hard to have congress for ego FDA approval which would have taken years. These people didn't have years, they were gonna die and they knew it. Being a guinea pig for HIV drug trials was a better shot at survival where doing nothing guaranteed only one prognosis.

A lonely, slow agonizing death.

The stigma it has made it very unpopular for political funding or subsidy to offset the extreme price the typical Nigerian could afford.
Our Government allocated 10 billion for AIDS medications to Africa where in some countries 7 of ten have HIV. That makes for one hell of a parent-less generation of children. Those children are easy recruits to fight in wars at minimum wage.

As for the Government having some kind of antidote? Don't you think it shows better business acumen using the cure to keep taxpayers alive selling a expensive drug that maintains they be more physically fit keeping the Government fiscally fit? Of course it does so that theory is just bunk. I don't believe the Government has any such thing but I know someone who does.

His name is Earvin "Magic" Johnson

If the government was so concerned about our population I can see them adding a huge tax on childbirth operations. Adding all kinds of Government regulations to Child Care which would raise prices to offset the increased costs for such an establishments government compliance.

Then they could take the tax revenue generated there to subsidize free abortions which would make new child births even less.

They could think of a lot of ways to do it even emulate China's government rules for having children is better.

were is the proof of this,i would like to see the article that states that hiv was found in egypt.

Also i think there is a conspiracy to some parts of the health industry...i have been researching blood electrification (bob beck), and some of royal rifles stuff and honestly i see there is great potential in all of that...blood electrification has proven to be better than penicillin on most occasions and has even helped me with a major disease...Also penicillin was discovered decades before by a person in Brazil...but that went unnoticed.

in a world were great and corruption rule, we may never know the truth...MajorMalfunction i just wanna say, well i dont really no what to say except your a trooper and just great man keep it going.


[edit on 6-9-2007 by ATSGUY]

I've heard a ton of different conspiracies with HIV. The one I hear most is the polio vaccine. The population control one sounds really bogus to me unless it was for a small group and it broke out. I think we got it from chimpanzees though.

Hooper makes a pretty convincing case in The River that it was inadvertently, if negligently, introduced from Chimpanzees through a polio vaccine, but the mainstream establishment never accepted his theories. He could never locate the right batch of vaccine to test I don't believe.

Really interesting book, nonetheless.

In such a PC world, I'm thinking twice about posting a reply to this. But this is after all my OWN OPINION and under freedom of speech and freedom as thinking human, I will share my personal OPINION.

I am not a religious fanatic, until I see HIV epidemic. It's so widespread amongst homosexuals and we still have no cure, not even a vaccine, it's God's way of signalling His disapproval of this behaviour. It's a punishment of the deviation of what human supposed to do.

leaking by an accident would be a good explanation.

its difficult to believe something nowadays.

reply to post by chickeneater


Oh, dear, now I must deny ignorance.

The rate of new HIV infection is dropping in the gay community because they're using safer sex methods (forbidden by religions for the most part) and because of education.

The fastest growing segment of the American population with new HIV infections are African American women. No, it's not a judgment on them either, for "multiple sex partners" (someone else I discussed this with went there last time, so I'm just doing a preemptive strike on this). There are many factors as to why HIV is spreading so quickly, MOST OF THEM having NOTHING to do with gay sex.

I am a woman. Straight. With two children. And I'm HIV+. Never had sex with a gay man.

I certainly hope that I don't hear any more of this damaging sort of nonsense, because I have a lot more to say on the matter, and I'm sure it will probably not do any good because people who believe HIV is a judgment from god do not usually seem capable of understanding the truth of this disease but prefer to stick to the superstition and blame placed in their heads by the evangelical cults in this country.

Statements like that one make me both sick and angry. It's because of that mentality that millions of people in Africa lose the support of their families, and some women who come down HIV+ are even killed by their families because of "dishonor," when it was their husbands who gave it to them in the first place.

It's because of that mentality that people stay in denial about the fact that they could have HIV, don't get tested for it, and end up spreading it unknowingly because they were afraid to find out. They didn't want to be stigmatized by this sort of poisonous slander.

it's because of this mentality that many women in my support group here in this country haven't told their families, because this is the sort of thing their families believe (because of religion) and rather than lose the support of the family, they keep their secret and say nothing when this sort of ignorance starts up at home.

Even if there were a god -- which I do not for one moment believe -- the Christian god is supposed to be one of love for everyone and everything. Jesus was of love, not hate. I find it impossible to believe that someone who loved you so much he "died for your sins," and loves everyone else on the planet equally as much, would send a disease to earth to punish one segment of humanity for being as they were created to be. Furthermore, if god is infallible, and omniscient, then he would have known that HIV would affect the entire spectrum of humanity, including children born with it to mothers who have no access to medicines, a god that knowingly would kill "innocent" people off indiscriminately with the homosexuals. That's not the act of a merciful god. Nor a sane one.

And people wonder why I say religion is a poison. This sort of statement is just the tip of the iceberg.

For the love of your god, educate yourself.

wishing people dead of a terrible disease is not a Christian virtue. Even I know this and I'm a hard-core atheist.

reply to post by MajorMalfunction


1st of all, I am sorry for your condition and I apologize for my own opinion. That being said, being ignorant (if I am indeed so) is not illegal isn't it? I know scientifically what HIV is, a disease passed through semen or blood, regardless if you are straight, gay or bi, etc.

Just last year I had an HIV scare, after waiting 3 solid months with cold sweat every night due to fear, and re-testing again later, luckily, it turns out to be just that, a scare. That gave me a new appreciation of life, and a new perspective.

I am posting pertaining to the ORIGIN of the disease, and it's just a theory. And God I believe is full of love, but he can frown and disagrees with what we do, and send a nudge our ways to point us to the right directions. It's a sign, I believe. Now that it has spread to the straight community, it has become universal curse. The moral is, don't have sex with anyone you don't really know. (if you know me, you'd laugh because I sound like a hypocrite)

Lastly, I truly am sorry for you not believing in God, I can see why.

Spare me the condescension. i don't believe in god because there is no evidence for one. And I don't need one to live my life. I also don't believe in god because of statements like yours -- even if I were inclined to believe in a deity, I would not choose the christian god because so many of his followers make hateful ignorant statements like the one you made that I jumped all over. The world is wonderful enough without a judgmental sky fairy distributing diseases willy-nilly as punishment. Diseases know no morals, they know no religion, they are just microbes that make people sick.

It is not against the law to be ignorant, no, but what you said was skirting close to hate speech which is offensive.

There are more ways people get HIV than just sex and needles. Which is why I told you to educate yourself. People in third world nations, for example, go to the doctor's clinic, which only has a few needles that are not sterilized and used over and over and over again, and it's passed along this way to innocent people.

This is an exact mirror of another conversation I had with another christian, who is using the fact that people have a disease to make a moral judgment against them. Does it make you feel better to say things about people who have a disease through no fault of their own? Why not say cancer is a judgment from god, then? That's caused many times by people not taking care of them selves, or indulging in risky behavior.

Why HIV only? In my opinion, it's an excuse for churches to preach hate and judge others. What does your bible say, judge not, lest ye be judged?

Keep morality out of microbiology and we'll get along much better in the future.

And for the record, don't make assumptions about people's reasons for not believing in fairy tales. Some of us have grown up and don't need a Santa Claus to distribute answers to prayers when we're good and diseases and disasters when we're bad.

id like to add that a close friend of mine contracted HIV from a blood transfusion. I don't see why that would have pissed god(s) off.

reply to post by scientist


If god is the god of the Christian Scientists or the Jehovah's Witnesses, it would have.

Another reason not to believe in god -- no two churches (or people) can agree on what god is, and is not.