"I Helped The U.S. Army Plan The 9/11 Attacks" (HOAX?)

Originally posted by they see ALL


i just want to point out that, i think, there is a strassburg in germany (and in france too):

They sound alike but the spelling is different. Not that it matters but in Germany it is spelled Strassburg (uses funny letter on google map so might be only one S sp?) in France it is spelled Strasbourg

[edit on 5/23/2007 by shots]

This thread is was a riot to read!

Originally posted by xpert11
As you can see I visited McNiven ATS profile.
I want to know why his last visit is listed as being in 1969 ?
For readability here is the original image .

Now that's interesting...



I'm surprised that noone spotted that ID sooner, what a terrible job he did with his graphics program

Here you can see it blown up 300% with the same photo enlargement software that HLS uses:


That's some shotty work.


After having to dig to actually see what his story "was" in his operation GRILLFIRE, I kept finding it interesting that he was like the PERFECT guy to just so happen to sign onto the project, as it seemed that everyone of his lifes experiences leading up to that point was divinely guided so that he would later be able to answer every scenario.

The Bill Clinton prophecy he made in 1976 was where I couldn't follow it anymore.


Then there's how his clearance is labeled "GRILLFIRE", as if his 1976 planning project is not only some special official clearance code, but it was even still in effect in in December '04?!?!?

Look here, "GRILLFIRE":

I wonder if all the people who actually felt the necessary time to not only agree with this story -- But make proclomations such as --
"Finally!"
Or, "I knew our government was full of it!"

Ever comes back to these threads and realize what twits they are.
The fact is that the fundamental truth is being covered by lies.
But almost always.
It's not the government lying.
And it's not the government's truth you're believing.
'Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar'.


Edit for clarity: I mean the few people who immediately jumped on the bangwagon, taking this as the God-sent truth.

[edit on 23-5-2007 by Iblis]

Now that the hoax kooks are even applying their shams to the 9/11 atrocities, perhaps people might begin to understand where all of the UFO / Alien claims come from.

Not many people fell for this thread.

This thread was doubted from the very start by everyone.

I personally didn't even believe any of it from the thread tittle it self.

But Iblis, i fail to see your point....

This hoax doesn't mean that the government didn't do 911. It only means that a person has a lot of time to waste.

I still waiting for people to claim that this was a Government plant to dis-credit the 'real' truth.

My first post (page 1) was a one liner because if the original submitter or posters ACTUALLY reivewed the site they would/should of realized it was BS.

Originally posted by ferretman2
I still waiting for people to claim that this was a Government plant to dis-credit the 'real' truth.

It would actually be to divert away from the real truth, while providing a straw man, if that were the case.

Assuming he's just some lone joe trying to get attention, he's unwittingly served as a tool of any would-be disinfo agents / agendas.

Originally posted by ferretman2
I still waiting for people to claim that this was a Government plant to dis-credit the 'real' truth.

I'm no longer waiting to see a troll say the exact same thing you just did.

Originally posted by selfless
This hoax doesn't mean that the government didn't do 911. It only means that a person has a lot of time to waste.

Good point, still even when the person that started this thread is not Mr. McNiven I still will like to know if the real Mr. McNiven will come to a side like ATS and debate his story or have it debated.

It will be interesting to know if his story is nothing more than a fiction of an over worked mind or made look like it is to discredit him from something that he may know.

WILL THE REAL MCNIVEN PLEASE STAND UP

I've received a reply.

First, here's my email...

Email from Skeptic to Mr. McNiven...

Hello Tim...

Our members are rightfully concerned about this:
www.codenamegrillfire.com...

Can you help explain what that is?

Thanks.

His response is lengthy, and I'm reluctant to provide any more platform for a hoaxer, but I think it's important for our members to see his full response.

Email Response from Mr. McNiven...

It is the photo copy of what I was given by Donald Rumsfeld in 2004 when I went through the process of obtaining a new ID Card. In Feb. 2004 after taking part in the Mariani Lawsuit I decided to try and get my Federal Resources reinstated. In 1997 I had a Massive Heart Attack and laid in a Coma in my apartment for two weeks. Following this I quit doing work for the DoD until on September 11,2001 my Non-Rescindable Call Back Orders were activated.

On the morning of 9-11-01 about 30 minutes after I watched the second plane hit the second tower it dawned on me that I had just watched what we had discussed in the Study. I became hysterical yelling "You Basturds, You Did It" and I wasn't refering to the yet to be said 19 Arabs but to the US Congress / US Government. At that time I knew who was behind the Attacks (Donald Rumsfeld was Secretary of Defense when the Study was conducted) and didnot think I could get any assistence from him in having my Federal Resources reinstated which is why I didnot try at that time but instead went ahead with my Non-Rescindable Orders to get the information about the Study to the American People by contacting media outlets.

In Feb. 2004 I began contacting Lawyers to help me get my Federal Resources reinstated and got a reply from Mr.Gerry Spence that I had a case but he didnot have the time to take it and to find another Lawyer.
www.codenamegrillfire.com...

I also began contacting DoD Personnel Offices and received a few replies to include this apology from the Ombudsman Cheryl Wong-Ng. I would like to point out that Obudsman Wong-Ng had the ability to verify that I was the DoD Agent I stated I was before she apologized to me.
www.codenamegrillfire.com...

I contacted the Tacoma,Wa DoD Field Office by phone and they told me all they did was Boeing Employee background checks and I would have to go back East since there were no DoD Personnel Offices on the West Coast. Before the Seattle Office of the CIA had been closed down I could get administrative help there like I did in the 1980's.

In August 2004 I traveled to Washington,DC and on friday August 6,2004 I gained access to the inner grounds of the Pentagon through the Gate without having to show an ID Card, I had informed them that I was on my way (not everyone at the Pentagon hates me only the Democrats and Republicans). I was Politely shown to the DoD Employees' Only Bus Stop where I was to catch the #3 Bus to the Personnel Office in the Polk Building.

I stood there with the Lieutenants, Captains, Majors, Colonels and other DoD Civilian Employees for about 30 minutes until the #3 Bus arrived and the Driver told me that I had to get an escort from the Personnel Office to ride the Bus since I didnot have an ID Card. I went and called the Personnel Office and spoke to a Mr.Pitman who told me that you cannot come to the Personnel Office to be Identified anymore (post 9-11-01) but you had to go to the FBI who would Physically Identify you first. So, off to the J. Edger Hoover Building I go.

When I get there they tell me that I have to call and make an appointment to have my fingerprints taken and gave me the DC FBI Field Office's phone number. I call and the woman I talked to told me that I needed to go to Virginia to have my fingerprints taken. I lamented that I had just traveled 3,000 miles from Bellingham,Wa and wasn't there someplace closer? She said she would check and put me on hold. After the better part of an hour she picked up the receiver to see if I was still on the line and then hung up on me. I looked at my watch and it was 4:30pm Office closing time. I had to wait until the next week to try again.

This time the woman I talked to said I had to go to the J. Edger Hoover Building because this is where they keep the fingerprint files. I told her that they had sent me to her. She then said that the FBI "Doesnot" take fingerprints anymore it had been outsourced to Local Police Departments. I asked her if the DC Police Department was good enough and she said; yes. (This is the fourth thing the FBI told me about getting my fingerprints taken by the FBI for my DoD Identification, does it sound like a Political Party runaround?)

I went to the DC Police Station on Indiana Street and they told me that they didnot do Federal fingerprinting a Federal Services did and gave me sheet of paper with their information on it. I went and got my fingerprints taken. With fingerprints in hand I call the FBI back to see where I needed to drop them off. They told me that I had to send them to the Personnel Office who would then forward them to the FBI. When I was told this I knew that Rumsfeld wasnot going to give me a new ID Card even though I had traveled 3,000 miles to the Pentagon itself. (Why is having DoD Agents' Physical Identification outsourced from the DoD and FBI to "for profit" street corner Business' who "Donot" have to follow any DoD Security Regulations an Improvement in our National Security? Shades of Valerie Plame! If you look closely you will see that Federal Services is a street corner Passport Photo Business.)
www.codenamegrillfire.com...
www.codenamegrillfire.com...
www.codenamegrillfire.com...

I returned to Bellingham and mailed my fingerprints along with this letter to the Personnel Office. I would like to draw your attention to the P.S. section on page 3 where I give the Pentagon Gate Guard a Critique. How was I able to send this through the US Postal Service to the DoD Personnel Office in post 9-11-01 America and not get Arrested for it, unless I work there? No one I have asked to explain this, after they have told me they donot believe me has ever contacted me with an answer to my question, why?
www.codenamegrillfire.com...

By November I hadnot received a reply so on November 4,2004 I hand delivered a written request to Federal Judge Coughenour at the Seattle Federal Court to help expedite my paperwork. Six weeks later I got the ID Card that I made the photo copy from which you have the link to.

During the ten month period it took to get the new ID Card the only people I had contacted in concerns to it were, Lawyers and DoD Personnel Office Workers; no civilians or anyone else. When the ID Card showed up in the mail I questioned whether or not it was real and contacted Judge Coughenour to have an FBI investigation done into whether or not it was real. I received no reply from the Judge or the FBI. But I continued to look for a Lawyer to help me with the issue.

I contacted Mr.Jeff Trueman who I had worked with on the Mariani Lawsuit and he refered me to a Karen Parker in California who then refered me to a Indria Ra Choudhury in Bellingham, the name sounded familiar like I had contacted her before for help but she didnot reply but because Karen Parker refered her I contacted her. It took her three weeks to reply to set up an appointment. At this appointment that lasted for two hours she never let me explain what Legal Services I needed; she would constantly interupt what I was saying with questions like; Did I like the Food in Basic Training? (What does this have to do with the Legal situation?)

She then set up another appointment a couple of weeks later so as she said she could have time to go over my paperwork. When I arrived for the appointment her Office was locked, I waited outside for her to show up. Finally, she showed up 45 minutes late and then made the statement to me that; "The WTC Twin Towers hadnot even been built until the late 1980's" and then said to call her for a new appointment. She never returned my communications or ever set up another appointment with me. I found out that she was a Democrat who had lost a recent Election and understood then why she had subjected me to the treatment she did.
www.codenamegrillfire.com...

Not having Judge Coughenour or the FBI contact me that their investigation into whether or not the ID Card I was sent was not real I assumed that these Federal Authorities had confirmed it was real and had came from the DoD under Donald Rumsfeld. So when I received notice from the Whatcom County Court that I was to report for Jury Duty, I sent a photo copy of the ID Card along with an explaination to the Court that I had been called back to Active Duty and couldnot show up for Jury Duty.

In 1995-96 I had worked with the North West Drug Task Force out of the Whatcom County Sheriff's Office on the Sayce - Oyen Drug and Weapons Smuggling case. I told the Court to check this out since the Sheriff's Office was just across the street from the Court House. They did and called me to inform me that I had been Excused from Jury Duty. Here is a link to the notice.
www.codenamegrillfire.com...

So, here is Physical Evidence that I used the ID Card that was sent by Donald Rumsfeld to me to be Excused from Jury Duty by the Whatcom County Court. After the FBI confiscated this ID Card and had it in their posession one Agent made a mocking statement to me about; Did I use the ID Card to buy something at the PX? I replied to him that I had used it to be Excused from Jury Duty by the Whatcom County Court and that they should check this out since the Court House was only two blocks away. The FBI Agent didnot like the reply I gave him.

It has been almost two years since the FBI confiscated this ID Card; why hasn't the FBI Arrested me for Impersonating a Federal Agent when I used this ID Card to be Excused from Whatcom County Court Jury Duty? Isn't that a Federal Felony? Why hasn't the FBI Arrested me for having in my posession this ID Card if it is not the one that Donald Rumsfeld sent to me? In post 9-11-01 America do you think that if you had this ID Card that you would be Arrested for it if it wasnot real? Then, why haven't I been? Please explain.

While reading some of the comments one person said that the way they obtained the link was through researching my email account(?) I did send out emails with this link in the past when I was discussing the issue with someone but I also sent out this link with it too. It is the ID Card with the letter it came with in Dec. 2004. I wonder why they didnot include this link?
www.codenamegrillfire.com...

I am still waiting for the people who say that the ID Card didnot come from Donald Rumsfeld and the DoD to explain why I havenot been Arrested for having it in the past two years? Why wouldn't the FBI Arrest someone in post 9-11-01 America if they were in the posession of a phony US Government ID Card that they used to be Excused from Jury Duty with?

There was also an email I sent out about the Bellingham Police Physically searching me in a predetermined Police Interogation spot across the street from the Federal Building during an anti-war rally in front of the Fedreal Building and not even asking me my name. They knew who I was and since the Bellingham City Council is Democrat dominated, having them subject me to this Harassment was politically motivated. Would you if you were a Police Officer who was interogating a potential Bombing Suspect; which is what I was told I was; wouldn't you ask that person their name and ask for ID? Then why didn't the Bellingham Police do that instead of just Physically searching me and then let me go unless it was a act of Political Harassment?

A few years ago a person told me that their buddy had figured out how to hack into the Microsoft's main Computer that they run their MSN TV Internet Service out of. I contaced Microsoft with this information but received not reply from Microsoft. This wasnot unusual since most questions I have sent to Microsoft havenot been answered. I am not a computer wizz so I don't know how they were able to access my emails for this information. I don't really care, I have more information that I havenot put online yet or even had the time to discuss with other people. But you should ask who it is that posted my email information and how they obtained it for your own information; are they also reading your emails?

While reading through some of the replies there was the usual mix of people who would like to get more information (investigtors by nature) people who condemmed it without investigating anything, people who were confused by it but wanted more information and those who equate typos (the use of Capitol letters) as proof that the information cannot possibly be true.

In the past when people have said that what I have said is not true I have challenged them to meet me in Washington,DC then, we would both go to the Pentagon and I would watch while they walked through the Gate at the Pentagon like I did on August 6,2004 to prove that they are willing to Physically back up what they have said with their Person. Not one person has ever met my challenge; neither has anyone who has said that I wasnot telling the Truth has agreed to meet me in person and say it to my face. So, the people who are condemming my information are doing the same thing the Democrats have been doing for over 5 years and that is making Political Party Propaganda statements attacking my information with Cliches but will never back it up in person. I am sure you are familiar with this Political Propaganda tactic; bury the single posting of the Truth with dozens of condeming undocumented Cliches, nothing new here so like always I will just dismiss them as being Political Party Propagandists who cannot back up anything they say since it is just Propaganda.

So, I issue the same challenges to those on ATS who say that my information is not true to meet me in person and tell it to me straight to my face not to hide behind electronic blips on a computer screen and to meet me in Washington,DC to go to the Pentagon so they can show me how they are able to walk through the Gate to gain access to the innergrounds of the Pentagon like I did on August 6,2004 if what they say is true. They still havenot explained to me why US Attorney General John Ashcroft didnot Arrest me for Impersonating a Federal Agent after they called John Ashcroft a Totalitarian Prosecutor who rounded up innocent people to be held in Secret Prisons around the World that we donot even know about yet.

In answering the questions that some people have sent in should I do it one question at a time or should I answer them together in one statement? Some people who commented were sincere in finding out more information and to have some of the information clarified which I will gladly respond to. To the others I issue my challenges to.

I understand that some people are frustrated by the way our Elected Officials treat us and can be forgiving towards their expressions of frustration but these arenot the Political Party attackers who are out to discredit the information that connects the Democratic Political Party to involvement in the 9-11-01 Attacks and the War for Money that resulted from them.

Any more questions will be gladly answered.
Tim McNiven

My reply...

Hi Tim...

Our members (and I) are certain that the ID badge is fabricated, which places the credibility of your entire story on exceptionally shaky ground.

Originally posted by ferretman2
I still waiting for people to claim that this was a Government plant to dis-credit the 'real' truth.

Wait no longer! It very well could be that. If you cry wolf enough times people will start to disregard everything, even the truth.

On a side note, doesn't McNiven sort of look like Rip Taylor?

Peace

Thank you, Skeptic Overlord. I think it's safe to now assert that this man is a hoax -- whether Rumsfeld gave him that card or not. Would you agree?

Originally posted by SkepticOverlord
His response is lengthy, and I'm reluctant to provide any more platform for a hoaxer, but I think it's important for our members to see his full response.

No way, keep in contact with him. let this guy bury himself with his own words and actions.

Originally posted by zerotime
No way, keep in contact with him. let this guy bury himself with his own words and actions.

He has already done that. The Administration of this forum should want nothing further to do with the Man.

That was one of the most bizzare, convoluted, painful things I've read in a long time. He makes no sense whatsoever in it.

Didn't this guy include his Social Security number in his documents listed on that website. Couldn't anyone use his name and SS number to conduct their own background check? Considering of course that the number is real.


[edit on 23-5-2007 by zerotime]

In 1997 I had a Massive Heart Attack and laid in a Coma in my apartment for two weeks.

Rip Van Winkle sleeps for two weeks in his apartment after a "massive" heart attack. OMG...this dude is PRICELESS!!!!

Great thread BTW ~!

Is any way to verified that the FBI confiscated his ID like he claims?

I found this on another site,

Regarding the FBI visit to McNiven’s home on July 6, a spokesperson from the Bellingham, WA., office confirmed agent Lance Boyer and three others confiscated McNiven’s DOD card outside his apartment on the date mentioned, but refused to comment further about the nature, legality or purpose for taking his personal property.

culhavoc.blogsome.com...

Is anyway that this can be proven?

Originally posted by marg6043
Is any way to verified that the FBI confiscated his ID like he claims?

I think it's logical to assume it was confiscated.

Think about it... if you're an FBI agent, and encounter some guy with an obvious ID forgery, you're going to take it. I think the fact that it looked so much unlike a read badge is the reason he wasn't arrested.

Mc Nivin walking into the Secratary of Defense's Office


Receptionist: "May I help you?"

Mc Nivin: "I am here for my DOD I.D. badge"

Receptionist: "OH! yes sir Mister Mc Nivin sir! I will Notify Mr. Rumsfeld immediately!"

Mc Nivin: " Make it snappy, I am an important man you know!"

Donald Rumsfeld: " Mr. Mc Nivin with the power vested in me I now bestoweth you with this most honorable I.D. badge --- May no one dispute your credibility EVER again"

Mc Nivin: "Muahahahaa"

Rumsfeld: "Muahahaha"

All three characters in unison: "Muaha-ha-ha!"

Rumsfeild: "Um next time just pick it up at the human resources counter..K?"