Atheism is the Worst Sin

Originally posted by ShadowedRedemption
by doing that tech would prove that christianity has just become a tool for people to expand their egos and control others through a sort of brainwashing "you can only be happy if you believe in god"

become? i'm pretty sure that's what at the root of all religions.. insecurity and fear.

--sorry I decided long ago not allow a fictionous idea to control me.

no need to apologize for freeing yourself.

To me christianity always looked like a cult, only it wasn't as short lived as say Charles Manson's cult.

a religion is just a cult with more members.

madness I fully agree with you.

You do know that as far as mithra and Christianity are concerned mithra might have actually gotten most of its stuff from Christianity.

Because of one little thing, Christianity got everything it believes from the Old testament which began around 2000 B.C and completed around 400 B.C meaning that mithraism would have or, could have taken some things from Christianity.

God Bless

Originally posted by followerofchrist
You do know that as far as mithra and Christianity are concerned mithra might have actually gotten most of its stuff from Christianity.

you mean how the mithrans (or whatever they were called) went into the FUTURE and got their stuff from christianity. mithra's following started around 300 BCE.

Because of one little thing, Christianity got everything it believes from the Old testament which began around 2000 B.C and completed around 400 B.C meaning that mithraism would have or, could have taken some things from Christianity.

that would be assuming that christianity came first.... which it didn't.

Originally posted by followerofchrist
You do know that as far as mithra and Christianity are concerned mithra might have actually gotten most of its stuff from Christianity.

Because of one little thing, Christianity got everything it believes from the Old testament which began around 2000 B.C and completed around 400 B.C meaning that mithraism would have or, could have taken some things from Christianity.

Sorry but paganism predates christianity. And paganism itself is predated by cro-magnons. Cro-magnons in turn evolved from apes and were not suddenly created by a diety.

In actuality, it is believed that Jesus studied Mithraism during is hiatus from the Bible, and that is where HE got his ideas.

Christianity borrows heavily from old religions, not the other way around. It's how they got the pagans and the old god worshippers to convert (other than threats of burning at the stake, rapine, pillage, etc.). they took the old pagan holidays and god-aspects and converted them to make the Christian god easier for the pagans to understand.

Christmas for example. I've seen some stuff that suggests that Jesus was actually born in July. But they moved his "birthday celebration" to the time of the winter solstice to cover Yule, Saturnalia and other more ancient holidays.

Same with Easter. Easter used to be the holy time for the goddess Eostre, she of the bird-turned-rabbit (which is why the Easter Bunny lays eggs). That holiday was subsumed by the resurrection holiday.

There is also good reason to believe that the Virgin Mary and the infant Jesus are remade from the images of Isis and Horus.

Christianity is NOT the origin, it is the plagiarist.

So let's not go there, shall we? I could go on for days and days and days ...

Originally posted by MajorMalfunction
In actuality, it is believed that Jesus studied Mithraism during is hiatus from the Bible, and that is where HE got his ideas.

or that christianity ended up as jews following a mythic figure based around mithra.

Christianity is NOT the origin, it is the plagiarist.

damn straight!

So let's not go there, shall we? I could go on for days and days and days ...

that would make a fun thread.

Indeed, there are too many examples of christanity's plagerism to count (even santa claus is one). Maybe a new thread for discussion of those? I think it would be a good idea.

Why not it might be interesting, being that we have already got off topic.

God Bless

Originally posted by followerofchrist
Why not it might be interesting, being that we have already got off topic.

it wasn't that nice of a topic to begin with... the ol' "atheists are worse than murderers, rapists, crusaders, inquisitors, serial-killers, and nazis" line is a bit.... BIGOTED.

So let me get this straight. You get horrible injured (truely sorry that happened to you) then because you recovered from the injuries with time, you say it must have been because of a diety? What about all those people who get horrible injured are not thiests and heal like any normal animal would when injured. people get over adversity including great injuries through sheer will, no miricles needed. The human body is an amazing thing.

next. Denying ones belief in the existance of an omnipotent being does not murder the omnipotent being, which in the act of murdering would proove that the entity is in fact not omnipotent or a god at all. So, I deny the belief in jesus. Did I just murder jesus. not logically.

Why would an omni potent being even care about athiests. I'm sure hes/she/ it is not that insecure and wouldn't even care. do we care because ants don't believe in humans. and because they don't believe in us humans did ants just murder the whole human population.

To me the biggest sin is to do onto others that which you would not do onto yourself without just cause. ie. killing for ones own protection. OK. killing for the sake of it=really bad sin.

Also, this could be a question for marduk. But I think it's wierd that the term for something dispicable and horrible is the word "Sin" in the judeo/christian religions. But Sin was a god to the babylonians/and assyrians, and hittites it think. Funny that somebody named the worst thing one could do in their own religion the very same thing as the name of the god of their adversaries religion. Food for thought.

Bassplyr you nailed the argument exactly.

Originally posted by ShadowedRedemption
Sorry but paganism predates christianity. And paganism itself is predated by cro-magnons. Cro-magnons in turn evolved from apes and were not suddenly created by a diety.

Hahahahahahah... Wow. I have nothing against evolution, but I find it hilarious how atheists try to use it as an argument against God, and theists try to disprove it as an argument for God, all the while, none of them seemed to have studied it in any great detail. What happened to the oh-so-honourable concept of scientific thought? Observe, hypothesise, and then try to prove your hypothesis. The only reason that evolution is such a hot topic is because it's proof would negate current christian ideas about the origin of man. Most people wouldn't even care about it otherwise. Why isn't there a humongous debate among the public about the existence of dark matter?

Originally posted by BASSPLYR
Why would an omni potent being even care about athiests. I'm sure hes/she/ it is not that insecure and wouldn't even care. do we care because ants don't believe in humans. and because they don't believe in us humans did ants just murder the whole human population.

About omnipotent beings not caring...well, I wouldn't think that the human-ant analogy is correct. Human's aren't omnipotent, not even relative to ants. The concept of omnipotence would mean that forget about not caring, an omnipotent being would care about every single atom in the universe, and still have enough care left over if it was decided to pop another universe into existence.

[edit on 30-5-2007 by babloyi]

Originally posted by babloyi
Why isn't there a humongous debate among the public about the existence of dark matter?

because it seems people will only take even the slightest intrest in science when it contradicts what they believe.

About omnipotent beings not caring...well, I wouldn't think that the human-ant analogy is correct. Human's aren't omnipotent, not even relative to ants. The concept of omnipotence would mean that forget about not caring, an omnipotent being would care about every single atom in the universe, and still have enough care left over if it was decided to pop another universe into existence.

i would disagree. just because you're all powerful doesn't mean you're all caring. the ability to do anything you want doesn't impart any responsibility on it at all.

Babloyi.

you know your counter agrument to my comments on omipotnet entities actually furthered my point. your premis actually amplifies the logicalness of my argument. you just took it to an even thurough level of my origional explanation. you just check mated yourself there. re-read what you wrote in response to what I wrote. think about it.

ps sorry about my awful spelling.

Originally posted by GreatTech
A human murdering another human is a horrific act and by far the worst human-to-human act. What is worse? Atheism. You have murdered the Divine Being that created you.

How can man murder God? God was not born and cannot die.

There are ALWAYS consequences.

Very true. But remember - cause and effect are not the same as crime and punishment.

All sins have been forgiven to all men, remember? Except blaspheming the holy spirit which means rejecting truth.

And while I truly believe there is literally ONE actual truth which is the foundation of all things...I do not believe, at all, that all souls are going to perceive it in exactly the same way - when they finally get down that far!

But each of us are journeying toward that - and my perspective or view is certainly my own and unique - but that doesn't make it any less 'truth' than yours or anyone else's. Truth is only compromised by deceit...and while we are prone, by default, to self-deceit as human beings and many of us, by extension, end up living in a world of our own fiction...we all eventually get over that and start in earnest to find truth. But we do not have the capacity, incarnate, to see the whole view as God can see it - and not being able to see the whole view and having an incomplete understanding (an opinion) is a whole other thing as opposed to lying or being deceitful about spiritual issues.

AND for most atheists...atheism IS their TRUTH...if God has not revealed Himself to a soul, then atheism or agnostism is actually the only honest declaration by that soul!

Hypocrisy is something Jesus speaks of as very deplorable in God's eyes - this is the same as blaspheming the holy spirit - and it is a far better state of affairs to be an honest atheist than a hypocritical religious person.

The hypocrisy in religion misleads both those within and those on the outside looking in. There are also atheists, that I have encountered, that are very bitter toward God and religion...they used to believe and tried to believe but when they listened to those that claimed to know God and did what they did but got no response at all...they blame God.

It is not God's fault - it is because the hypocrites live a lie and then promote it as the absolute truth.

We must not measure ourselves against one another or any other material standard...we must not judge ourselves or others like that and above all..we must be honest with ourselves.

God is a Great God and loves appreciation for what He has done for your life.

This is no doubt your true understanding...but my understanding is that God doesn't seek our praise...he desires, above all, for us to love one another as He loves us. That is the ultimate thanks we can give for His presence in our life....manifesting His love toward others. Modestly and without self-aggrandizement. God has no ego...man is the ego-driven animal.

I love atheists as much as theists; I just believe that atheists are misguided as I was for 6 years. But there is hope.

Theists are just as misguided as anyone else - many claim to be theists but believing is not the same as giving over the control to God. When we attempt to guide with our own two eyes rather than God's...we misguide ourselves! Myself included. That is how I know there is no justification in judging these things...we are all in the same boat, ultimately!

Just love...judge not. Period.

God can work amazing wonders in your life. When God is in your life, nothing becomes impossible.

God IS life...it is up to us to believe. If we don't - then why fake it? God has set no time limit!

Even though some of this sounds like preaching, I am only trying to help. I do not want anybody to experience what I went through.

Why not? Did it not eventual lead you to God and, in the process, transform you through the 'bad' times and perhaps the difficulties which seemed unbearable then but now seem more like blessings?

There is a reason for everything that happens to us...the same reason. But it is not for us to try to do God's job for Him. We are merely witnesses...He is the GUIDE because He CAN see what we cannot.

I know that I will be criticized as I have discovered that many atheists do not mince words. God Bless anyways.

God bless you, my friend! I do hope you don't feel as if I am criticizing you - if it is, it is intended to edify (construct) any one that reads this and also you and me, as well. I don't mince words, either - but I always am driven by a single motivation which is the hope that we all continue to find more and more truth in our lives...by following the two greatest commandments...

That is all that matters. Athiests love their neighbors, too - it is not something that requires religion. God comes to those who love others - no matter what a person believes, love rewards love.

I love you!!

Originally posted by queenannie38

The hypocrisy in religion misleads both those within and those on the outside looking in. There are also atheists, that I have encountered, that are very bitter toward God and religion...they used to believe and tried to believe but when they listened to those that claimed to know God and did what they did but got no response at all...they blame God.

queenannie38,

To blame a 'god' for anything, or to be angry at a 'god', first one must acknowledge that a 'god' exists. An atheist does not make such an acknowledgement - ie:- we do not believe that a 'god' or 'gods' exist. Therefore it is obviously impossible for an athiest to blame or be angry at a 'god' - that would be to blame something that you know does not exist!

It may well be true that some athiests are angry at the behaviour of certain churches or religious organisations, such as those that have harboured paedophiles while hampering investigation and justice, but that is not the same as being angry at a 'god', for only a fool would blame a 'god' for the criminal acts of humans in trusted positions within society, merely because the organisation professes to worship, or represent that 'god'. No doubt a view shared by many of the faithful.

So if you have come across people who are angry at 'god' then those people are not athiests, they are denying (while still acknowledging the existance of..) the particular 'god' rather than having an atheistic view. The two views could not be more different! Unfortunately, it appears that the two have been combined in some people's minds.

queenannie38, while you might wish to defend GreatTech and the individual quotes that he has made, please put them in the context of the title of this thread, which he started, and ask yourself if he came here to 'help' anyone. In fact, if you read the whole thread you will discover that GT has apologised for the whole thread and his attacks upon the integrity of athiests, and retired from the thread.

If you think he did start this thread to help athiests, just consider how calling someone worse than a murderer, etc, is likely to help anyone! The fact of the matter is that GT started this, and previous threads, as a premeditated attack upon athiests (and anyone else who doesn't believe in his particular 'faith'), and he has admitted as much, before leaving this thread and all but leaving ATS completely!

The Winged Wombat

[edit on 31/5/07 by The Winged Wombat]

[edit on 31/5/07 by The Winged Wombat]

Originally posted by BASSPLYR
Babloyi.

you know your counter agrument to my comments on omipotnet entities actually furthered my point. your premis actually amplifies the logicalness of my argument. you just took it to an even thurough level of my origional explanation. you just check mated yourself there. re-read what you wrote in response to what I wrote. think about it.

Nope, don't see it. If you are trying to say that because an omnipotent being has to care for every single atom in the universe, it has no time for specific singular atheists, then you missed my point. I'd think that for an omnipotent being, if there is an ultimate amount of care that something could have, the infinity amount of care, that would be how much the omnipotent being would care for each and every single person individually, as well as everything collectively.

nope that wasn't the part I was talking about. I understand what you're saying. but, read the first half of the post I was commenting on. really re read it and compare it to what I wrote and you'll understand why and how you just amplified streangth of my argument. even if accidently. I know you were talking about the whole god loves every single thing hypothesis, but you said some other stuff around that part that doesn't help your argument.

Not sure what you're getting at. You said something about an omnipotent being, which I didn't think matched the concept of an omnipotent being. I'm not engaged in any sort of "logic" competition, and you are not going to get "points" for "checkmating" me. I wasn't taking about anything you mentioned previously in your post, and I'm not engaged in any debate involving any of those points. While this whole branch may be slightly off-topic, I still felt that I could interject my opinion on that matter.

* Babloyi sidesteps BASSPLYR's lunge, and returns with a backhand tri-prong attack, with a multi-element psi-ball *

Did I win now?

[edit on 31-5-2007 by babloyi]