You People Have All Been Taken For A Ride

I think there's a lot of projection going on here in this forum concerning Greer.
It's my guess that those who are the most vocally caustic in their statements on what they feel about Greer's personal religious/philosophical belief system are also those who get the most grief from friends, family and colleagues about their own interest and belief in UFOs and ETs.

Consequently, they take this grief out on someone who's not here to fight back, in this case, Greer -- it's all about venting but nothing about Greer's actual work in the UFO community itself which has nothing to do with religion and everything to do with Disclosure.

Why people are negatively judging a man because he has a different esoteric/religious belief system than what they believe in where they also in turn are negatively judging his accomplishments and ongoing effort for Disclosure because of this instead of separating the two -- which is what they should be doing -- is beyond me and I think it's not only very wrong... but also very STRANGE.

There's a term for this type of reaction/behaviour and it's called PREJUDICE. In this case, religious/philosophical prejudice and if you think that such a thing does not exist, then how do you explain the loss of over 6 million Jews during the Holocaust?

At any rate, unless someone else comes along who has got the same kind of ambition, drive, intelligence and organizational skills as what Greer has clearly demonstrated to rally hundreds of the most credible UFO witnesses in the world to make their voice be heard to work toward full disclosure -- Greer, like it or not, is the only person out there we have now doing this.

I personally don't give a hoot what his religion is. All I want to find out is what our gov't has been up to and what's being manufactured by funds from the black budget. If they have the technology to build these marvelous UFOs that so many of us have seen up there, I along with many, many others here in this forum would love to find out. So far, Greer's been the only ufologist out there to take up this very, very challenging mantle.

He should be respected for this and not made fun of and mocked just because he himself has had a few of his own extraordinary experiences which, by the way, he's finally revealed to the public. I think that that was a very brave thing for him to do -- and very commendable.
I personally have a lot of respect and admiration for this person and so do many other members here in this forum.








[edit on 29-4-2007 by Palasheea]

Originally posted by Palasheea
I think there's a lot of projection going on here in this forum concerning Greer. It's my guess that those who are the most vocally caustic in their statements on what they feel about Greer's personal religious/philosophical belief system are also those who get the most grief from friends, family and colleagues about their own interest and belief in UFOs and ETs.

Consequently, they take this grief out on someone who's not here to fight back, in this case, Greer -- it's all about venting but nothing about Greer's actual work in the UFO community itself which has nothing to do with religion and everything to do with Disclosure.

You guessed 100% wrong, a theory with no evidence.

Why people are negatively judging a man because he has a different esoteric/religious belief system than what they believe in where they also in turn are negatively judging his accomplishments and ongoing effort for Disclosure because of this instead of separating the two -- which is what they should be doing -- is beyond me and I think it's not only very wrong... but also very STRANGE.

There's a term for this type of reaction/behaviour and it's called PREJUDICE. In this case, religious/philosophical prejudice and if you think that such a thing does not exist, then how do you explain the loss of over 6 million Jews during the Holocaust?

An incredible leap of logic. You got from Greer to the Holocaust in two easy paragraphs. Congratulations.

At any rate, unless someone else comes along who has got the same kind of ambition, drive, intelligence and organizational skills as what Greer has clearly demonstrated to rally hundreds of the most credible UFO witnesses in the world to make their voice be heard to work toward full disclosure -- Greer, like it or not, is the only person out there we have now doing this.

The ONLY one? Wow, you just threw out several hundred researchers in one blow. Friedman, for example, would be quite amazed you would say that. Not to mention Timothy Good.

He should be respected for this and not made fun of and mocked just because he himself has had a few of his own extraordinary experiences which, by the way, he's finally revealed to the public.

You miss the point of what the criticism of Greer is about. It's not about his 'religion' at all.

1. He exaggerates. For example, he mis-characterized a dinner conversation as a "briefing the CIA Director." So much so that the Dirctor sent him a cease and desist letter.

2. He claimed ownership and authorship of the "Best Evidence" project. The real authors sued him over this mis-characterization

3. He claimed SETI received signals, which they hotly deny. he has "sources" in SETI but won't name them. It's all a conspiracy, of course.

4. He accepted and repeated a wild tale about nerve gassing aliens that even his handlers found over the top.

5. He posted "pictures of UFOs" including an angelic MOTH!

6. He now says he can "vector in" UFOs by using meditation He claims the US is shooting down UFOs with "particle beam weapons."

These are just a few issues. I'm not documenting them because that has been done here before in exquisite detail. Rather than repeat, do a search. In terms of mocking him, the only thing I would really mock him about are the photos of a moth, which are truly ridiculous. Other than that the real issue is his own credibility.

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Can he have any religion he wants and say anything he wants? Surely he can, without question. But the issue is that he has set himself up as the Disclosure Guru. He initially did this in a straightforward and professional manner. The famous 2001 press briefing, for example, was a masterful presentation managed by a very articulate person. The idea here (which I cannot stress enough) was to convince a neutral party that the issue is serious and warrants serious investigation. The "neutral party" we're talking about is Congress. We need to convince Congress that this is not about some weird fringe group, but is about normal people who have serious evidence of a cover-up.

Get this? It's not about preaching to a convinced, credulous fan-boy UFO club. It is trying to get away from that reputation altogether.

However, what has happened is that Greer has gone off the deep end and lost tons of supporters. He has gone from an earnest, dare-I-say conservative interested party to another conspiracy theorist who will believe just about anything he's told. He's not even talking about Disclosure any more. Where are these 500 witnesses? What are their names? It's not there. That's not the focus. Instead it's pictures of moths and zero point energy devices.

Look at it this way. Greer has gone from,

"Senator, this is a serious issue. We have 500 people: bureaucrats, military people, normal patriotic citizens who have an incredible story to tell. This is way beyond fringe groups. You've been lied to; we've been lied to. We need to get to the bottom of this for the sake of our country."

=to=

"I can meditate and vector in UFOs (by the way, I talk to them all the time) and to prove it I'm releasing this picture of a UFO. Though it looks suspiciously like a terrestial MOTH, it is actually an angelic ET come to grace us with her presence."

NOT what we need!

If I could say one thing to Greer it would be: "FOCUS, Greer, FOCUS! Disclosure is the issue, not vectoring in UFOs, not meeting ET."

THAT is why Greer is criticized. He has self-destructed. He has self-destructed so badly that people are beginning to think he's a plant who did this on purpose. (I do not think that is true, by the way.) And with that destruction has gone the hopes of many people who originally thought Greer was an articulate spokesman for Disclosure devoid of the typical New Age nonsense that turns off the vast majority of the population.

And that is also why Greer now has an unenviable position in the UFO Hall of Shame. And THAT is a shame.

(Frankly, I don't expect the OP to really understand these issues. Sorry. It's kind of like p**ing in the wind.)

I wouldn't say taken for a ride.

In the beginning Greer was genuine and seemed real, and I still think a lost of the people that he had behind him and their testimonies were credible.

But if you want to put it that way, then yes, I was taken for a ride.

I believed Greer and those behind him and I am not afraid to admit it. A lot of it is still very credible, I just believe Greer him self is starting to lose his mind and sense of rationale

[edit on 29-4-2007 by LastOutfiniteVoiceEternal]

the photo of greer in the " pub " with some young ladies should
give alot of us an answer to the dierection he is going in .

Originally posted by crijack
He was the perfect representative for anything related to UFO disclosure because he was willing to do the logic and evidence aspect for UFOs.

He was A representitive for disclosure, he wasn't THE PERFECT representitive for it. He gathered witnesses to testify... and...???

Many can even argue that he was UFOlogy's last hope for disclosure. I thought if someone can push for disclosure, it would be him when mixed in with all of the other UFO outcasts who try to make money off the profession or just seek attention. (By the way UFOlogy is NOT a profession).

No, many would argue that he is not the last hope for disclosure. Why should Greer have been elevated to pop-star status above other serious researchers? Now all that Greer does is try to make money off the profession or just seek attention.

...new age ideas, the last book he wrote, extraordinary claims of SETI, all the way to his recent faulty UFO pictures, he is hurting his own credibility and the credibility of the disclosure project.

True that. But who cares? We don't. Cast him aside and move on.

So now you have to ask yourself, who will rally the troops now? Who will be the savior for disclosure?

Dude, it's not like disclosure has died with Greer releasing his moth pictures. It's shattered his reputation, but it hasn't hurt any attempts at disclosure.

Serious researchers need to keep researching. Those of us in the general public just keep spreading the word slowly to other people until the tide turns.

I haven't been taken for a ride just because Greer has thrown away his credibility.

[edit on 29-4-2007 by tezzajw]

Originally posted by IronManWith all the stuff here about Mars, Galaxy and The Milky Way,
It's quite obvious that aliens are among us, this site proves it.
FACT.
Snickers.

Mars, Galaxy, Milky Way and Snickers are all chocolate bars here in the UK.

Anyways back on topic.

As others have suggested its a little prosumptious to assume everyone fell for Greer.
Ive seen his photos (mostly on here) and every one of them i laugh at.
HOWEVER, the point you made about him being a shill to get everyones attention only to dump on everything at the end is believable and most likely very true.
If that isnt the case and he isnt a shill then talk about quit while your ahead.

Oh and as for the moth pic, if it isnt sarcasm then that is a moth and if you notice the camera angle is perfect for the angle of the moth, the camera isnt perfectly pointing up.
Shine a huge bright torch near a tree point a camera into the beam of light and of course a moth will come flying into view.
Again i suspect you was just being sarcastic.

I sincerely doubt we've "All" been taken for a ride. Greer is one man. A man who has never been held in the best light to begin with.

Had someone like Stanton Friedman done what Greer had done there would be more outcry and more reason to feel betrayed, but since its Steven Greer, its not that big a deal.

schuyler,

Well, it sounds like you do have some really serious issues (or some axe to grind?) with Greer and from your list of reasons on why you no longer support him, it also sounds like you yourself are willing to believe just about every negative thing that's out there circulating about him and this causes me concern because apparently there are some other members here who are that way also.

My question is: Why are ufologists bad-mouthing each other all the time? Could it be that they are each competing with each other for attention and book sales? Common sense tells me that there must be some truth to this yet it boggles my mind that they still all show up to lecture at the same conferences or show up in the same film documentaries even though they all hate each other... lol.

At any rate, I'm only interested in Disclosure so nothing else about Greer, rumor or otherwise outside of the Disclosure topic interests me -- it's totally irrelevant to what's really important and that is to get our gov't to release information about what they know about UFOs and ET's. Who gives a cr#p if someone said that Greer said something where some big shot no longer wants to talk to him and so on... who cares??

Too bad all of those well known ufologists can't put aside their personal jealousy's and ego's to all team up and help Greer with his Disclosure Project but lol, hell would freeze over before that would ever happen.

And I'm sure if somebody else were to take off where Greer left off, that person too would end up being a main target for vicious rumors and lies so as to undermine his effort for full disclosure also.

So what does this all mean? Could be that there are other not so unknown forces out there that are working hard on a full time basis to prevent full disclosure?

This to me is obvious because when we look at how Greer has been targeted, it's very clear that something very sinister is going on here. So this leads me to believe even moreso, than ever before, that there are covert agencies out there who will do everything humanly possible to prevent full disclosure -- even if it resorts to murder.

For this reason, I would not be surprised to find us reading in the paper sometime in the near future or so that Greer somehow dies accidentally where his name will join a long list of researchers who have met the same end and I find this extremely disturbing.










[edit on 30-4-2007 by Palasheea]

I must admit that early on he had me. Greer appeared to be the shot in the arm the UFO community needed to gravitate towards some credbility. He had what seemed to be the ear of some in congress and the intelligence community which was impressive IMO.

He had the witnesses necessary to possibly convince these people he was talking with to show beyond a shadow of a doubt that in order for there not to be anything happening or for all of these people to be crackpotsor liars, the institutions which hired and placed faith in these people (from pilots both mil. and comm. to missile silo operators) had to have been insane as well for trusting such people in the positions they had held.

He almost acts like someone who has had a psychotic break of some kind. I mean what causes a person to make such a 180 deg. turn in behavior? Fear? Drugs? Intimidation? Whatever it may be it would need to be powerful, IMO.

Personally, because of his behavior of the last 3-4 years, I am going to let Greer slip away into the night, but I do think that every single one of us should put our full support behind those incredibly credible witnesses he had collected together. Greers behavior should in no way have any influence on what his witnesses have had to say over the years.


[edit on 30-4-2007 by Lost_Mind]

Right Lost Mind,
For those few members here who are spending a vast amount of time and energy posting negative messages about Greer, if they would re-direct that anger into doing something more constructive instead like begin to initiate a new Disclosure Project to take off where Greer left off then I would support them 100%.

Springer said last night that he's got something cooking along these lines so let's hope that everyone will support him to get things off and running!

Originally posted by Springer
VERY FEW of our members lend Greer any credibility at all. If you actually read the thread on his ridiculous images you'll understand this to be true.

Naturally there are the "True Believer" types who for whatever reason seem to almost need this sort of stuff to be true who will believe anything anyone they perceive as "authoritative" has to say and they are more than welcome to do so.

From what I see on these boards the vast majority of our membership have cast Greer aside since he went "off the deep end" as it were.

Springer...

I agree fully Springer. When I first started researching Greer and his endeavors I actually liked what was being done. However, after seeing what he has been doing over the past 6 years I am completely opposed to what this man stands for. Not the concept of trying to force disclosure but the idea that someone so 'spiritual' and such would take advantage of people so blindly (like has been done for the entire existence of society unfortunately). If it truly was about spirituality there would be no massive fees to 'discourage' the lowly from attending his sessions. That is the words of someone who is a true believer/Greer fanatic. All souls would be precious to the true spiritual leader. Greer is not this.

People just want so badly for there to be something more to their lives than what they perceive. Sure, it can be tough at times people or for some, all of the time. However, if you're reading this you're not dead yet so do yourself a favor. Think for yourself. Search for yourself. Just don't SWALLOW every fantasy thrown your way.

I have my beliefs but if I want to be honest it is all 'speculation'. Why? Because I simply don't know for sure. However, I hold to my faiths and beliefs because I have 'thought' for myself. That's what I implore everyone else to do. Don't create a new religion or cult out of this guy. If he really needs the funds to continue his work then let him do it legitimately.

Originally posted by Springer
VERY FEW of our members lend Greer any credibility at all. If you actually read the thread on his ridiculous images you'll understand this to be true.

Naturally there are the "True Believer" types who for whatever reason seem to almost need this sort of stuff to be true who will believe anything anyone they perceive as "authoritative" has to say and they are more than welcome to do so.

From what I see on these boards the vast majority of our membership have cast Greer aside since he went "off the deep end" as it were.

Springer...

You know, this is the most condascending post I've ever read, and by a moderator no less, now at least I know why people like Tock, Tok, Toc or RL etc would be banned for being rude when Greer detractors, being just as rude would not get a peep. This explains a lot.

The reason why you don't have anymore Greer supporters is because you either ban them or they give up trying to deal with the status quo, the majority, as you say.

The threads in the Greer posts have gone off track many times and I have done everything I can to be civil and to encourage civil behavior, even among people who agree with me, millerman for one. The majority have not been this way.

I know 2 people who have gone to a CSETI event, one was Toc and the other is a friend of mine. They got 'taken for a ride', one of them went this past week, and they had an incredible experience. I hope to go for such a ride myself soon.

Greer is doing a lot more than what he is posting on his website, and when the current stuff he is doing breaks loose, you can have the egg on your face hard boiled, scrambled or fried, doesn't matter, just so long as you enjoy as best you can, moderator or not.

c3hamby

whether we belive in psychic ability, crystal energy,alien abduction,talking to the dead or christianity we are rightly or wrongly buying into a very powerfull belief system.

Now I'm not here to attack anyones beliefs but i think as intelligent human beings we should be prepared to question our beliefs AND the poeple who encourage us to "donate" or make life decisions based on the information they are providing.

do you ever question your own beliefs or those people like greer & sereda?

Originally posted by yeti101
c3hamby

whether we belive in psychic ability, crystal energy,alien abduction,talking to the dead or christianity we are rightly or wrongly buying into a very powerfull belief system.

Now I'm not here to attack anyones beliefs but i think as intelligent human beings we should be prepared to question our beliefs AND the poeple who encourage us to "donate" or make life decisions based on the information they are providing.

do you ever question your own beliefs or those people like greer & sereda?

Life decisions?

I have to be at work at 8 am. I work until 5. I get a lunch break at 11:45, and I eat a chili potato and run down to my car and meditate, which usually turns into a nap.

At 5 I go home, I drive through a beautiful neighborhood and take another nap, or at least meditate. In the evening, being a musician, I practice, meet with friends, journal and go to bed.

On the weekends I play piano in a jazz band, and also am getting my own band together, where I play jazz organ. The C3 in my name does not refer to extraterrestrial contact, but a model of Hammond Organ that I play.

I like to sleep late on Saturdays, sometimes I play at a black gospel church on Sundays, a real blessing.

I just finished a book called 'The Field'. It's about the electromagnetic field.

What's my point?

I'm not sure.

But I will tell you that I will do these things whether any of this is true or not.

Yes, I do believe it. The one thing that I'm suspect of is when Dr Greer said the Gr Britain landing was someone from the future...that's out there.

But...it did not generate income for him to say that. In fact if he was out for the money, he would not want to say that. That is NOT believable.

And these pictures. If your motiviation is money, at least throw a garbage can in the air and snap a shot. Anybody can look at these pictures and debunk them.

These pictures have to be looked at from a different perspective.

I understand that many people are turned off by Greer's spiritual aspect.

Spiritual growth and awareness and development is the future. I didn't say religion, I personally seperate the two.

We (you and I) will not see advanced technology until we become more advanced spiritually.

Are we advanced spiritually as a society?

Forget about the government. Forget about black projects.

No we are not.

It's easy to look at the government and say it's their fault, with their nuclear bombs, with their war-mongering world domination attitude.

But you don't have to look beyond this board to see the state of our spiritual state.

We don't discuss these things. We shout our opinions to each other, all the more louder if no one agrees. We're quick to anger. (me included, obviously).

We have road rage, we flip the finger, we yell and curse the most at the people we love.

The emotion behind the finger on the MAD button is the same emotion behind the finger on your QWERTY keyboard, fear.

Sereda, I'm not sure about him.

BTW, in sharing this with you, i feel like I just wasted a bunch of keystrokes.

Let the majority mob unfurl their flag upon me.

[edit on 30-4-2007 by c3hamby]

c3hamby, thanks for the reply very interesting.

p.s i meant religion/mediums/psychics for life decisions not so much greer.

why arn't you sure about sereda?


[edit on 30-4-2007 by yeti101]

you do bring up a good point i have wondered also, how does a doctor get into his position, where he is talking to geezers in the pentagon, and he is just a doctor.

thats one question that i have always had about him.

Originally posted by andy1033
how does a doctor get into his position, where he is talking to geezers in the pentagon, and he is just a doctor.

There are several 'doctors' in this field - Dr Frank Stranges and Dr George King are two prime examples. The real question is, are they real doctors! 'Dr' George King was a taxi driver who created the Aetherius Society - a group, still in existance today, that contacts space beings by meditation (sound familiar?).

According to David Clarke and Andy Roberts in their latest book Flying Saucerers - A Social History of Ufology King, tired of taxiing, posed the question 'How can I make a million pounds?' Someone jokingly answered 'Start a religion that involves ufos!' King went full steam ahead on the idea and history is history...

Originally posted by Palasheea
schuyler,

Well, it sounds like you do have some really serious issues (or some axe to grind?) with Greer and from your list of reasons on why you no longer support him, it also sounds like you yourself are willing to believe just about every negative thing that's out there circulating about him and this causes me concern because apparently there are some other members here who are that way also.

PROVE what I said isn't true. Actually, unlike many posts here, including yours, there is evidence to support my points. Your personal assertions here are just plain silly. Please DO try to refrain from asserting sinister motivations to me or anyone and concentrate on what the posts SAY.

My question is: Why are ufologists bad-mouthing each other all the time? Could it be that they are each competing with each other for attention and book sales? Common sense tells me that there must be some truth to this

I think there is a certain amount of truth to that, but when you look at who is bad mouthing whom, a different picture emerges. Essentially what we have here are Claimants and Ufologists. Greer has gone from the latter to the former. Other examples of Claimants are Burisch, Lear, and Lazar. None of them are Ufologists; they are claiming to the world that they have had certain experiences. Ufologists attempt to verify those experiences and often come across negative information. Ufologists DO 'bad mouth' Claimants, often with good and documented reasons. But Ufologists don't, as a rule, bad mouth each other all that much. Can you come up with a negative statement about Friedman? Good? I'd like to see it.

At any rate, I'm only interested in Disclosure so nothing else about Greer, rumor or otherwise outside of the Disclosure topic interests me -- it's totally irrelevant to what's really important and that is to get our gov't to release information about what they know about UFOs and ET's. Who gives a cr#p if someone said that Greer said something where some big shot no longer wants to talk to him and so on... who cares??

BIG CHANGE of attitude then! My goodness, in your original post you were lamenting that poor Dr. Greer was picked on by all these nasty people because of his religion and that was so not fair! Now you don't care.

And I'm sure if somebody else were to take off where Greer left off, that person too would end up being a main target for vicious rumors and lies so as to undermine his effort for full disclosure also.

If they post pictures of vectored in moths as UFOs, then, yes, I would think that would happen. Anyone can self-destruct because of their own pitiful actions. Greer brought it on himself. Nobody 'did it' to him.

This to me is obvious because when we look at how Greer has been targeted, it's very clear that something very sinister is going on here. So this leads me to believe even moreso, than ever before, that there are covert agencies out there who will do everything humanly possible to prevent full disclosure -- even if it resorts to murder.

For this reason, I would not be surprised to find us reading in the paper sometime in the near future or so that Greer somehow dies accidentally

Total, complete, abject, wild-eyed speculation. If you are incapable of using facts to back your theories, invent a conspiracy. Works every time.

I don't think you folks realize how much that 2001 DP Press Club Conference with those witness cost them. Over $150,000 total. It's not like they can have those every month without a ton of funds. They are non-profit. Everything they make from book sales, video sales, and the few contributions that come in isn't as much as you might think. And with the media not taking the UFO subject seriously most of the time, it's hard for Greer to appear on Larry King Live or stuff like that.

I think you guys are a bit too hard on Greer and expecting a bit too much perhaps. How much do you do? Do you do "ANYTHING" to help aid in UFO disclosure? Ask yourself that.