How can people be so brainwashed

Originally posted by PepeLapew

Originally posted by IgnoranceIsntBlisss
SO aren't there already threads that are specificly focused on the phone issue that cover all the bases, and could simply be linked in here to divert this side issue to a focus thread whithout disrupting this one?

SO, aren't there any thread for people like you who really have nothing to say other then criticizing other posters' form and other posters' keeping in line with the subject?

Originally posted by IgnoranceIsntBlisss
WASN'T this thread about brainwashing, which would make some expect to learn / discuss about various aspects of propaganda, psychology, nationalism, sociology, this particular movement and so on?

So who's outta line here?

Originally posted by PepeLapew
and other posters' keeping in line with the subject?

The subject was "brainwashed'.

Anything that absolutely nothing to do with brainwashing is red herring and irrelevevt. Since there's no specific forums category on 'brainwashing' its a damn shame that a good thread about this most critical issue has been hijacked by issues that have absolutely nothing to do with it, and have been wiodely denuked or are irrelevent.



[edit on 25-4-2007 by IgnoranceIsntBlisss]

Originally posted by selfless

The Shadow government fears the red fishes.
Not the way IIB intended to portray the picture but ironically enough the picture serves the purpose of illustrating brainwashing also.

Good call

Originally posted by Speakeasy1981
I just wanted to point out that only two phone calls from Flight 93 were made from cell phones, the rest used airphones.

OK, so let's talk about some of those infamous airphone calls, more specificly Ted Olson's alleged call from his wife Barbara and here's a few quotes from Ted Olson himself:

I'm not surprised that Barbara managed to get collect calls through.

I found out later that she was having, for some reason, to call collect and was having trouble getting through. You know how it is to get through to a government institution when you’re calling collect.

Now, we have to pay particular attention to Olson's stating that she made a collect call. You see, you can pick up a seatback phone and call anyone else on board for free by merely dialing their seat number. But in order to call outside the airplane, you have to use a credit card so that you can first pay the initial 2-3$ fee for using the phone. You simply can not even talk to a ground operator without first inserting a credit card. So let's say she did use a credit card to call her husband, then how do you explain her taking the time to first contact an operator and request a collect call? Why the need to do this if she was already using a credit card?

Ted Olson is obviously a liar and guilty of covering up a crime. However, the interesting thing is that even if the call was fake nobody can charge him with anything because the only statements he ever made about his wife were made while he was outside the country. Therefore he can not be charged for this particular crime inside this country.

[edit on 25-4-2007 by PepeLapew]

Technically IgnoranceIsntBlisss is correct, the thread should try and focus on the original topic, I just think sometimes people are less rigid and restricted when ideas flow freely.

But if it goes to long the original thread descends into a mess of confusion, especially when you try and read the thread from start to finish since more and more pages of an off topic get added on.

I tend to agree with him however human nature at times gets the best of all of us

I don't think the original subject can go on forever: turn on your TV and there is your answer as how people can get so brainwashed. There, question solved ... does anyone disagree with this statement? Does anyone have anything to add to this?
-No? I didn't think so, case closed.

It's simple, people will naturally drift to an other subject. You just can't regulate the free flow of information and the sharing of ideas.

Originally posted by PepeLapew
Now, we have to pay particular attention to Olson's stating that she made a collect call. You see, you can pick up a seatback phone and call anyone else on board for free by merely dialing their seat number. But in order to call outside the airplane, you have to use a credit card so that you can first pay the initial 2-3$ fee for using the phone. You simply can not even talk to a ground operator without first inserting a credit card. So let's say she did use a credit card to call her husband, then how do you explain her taking the time to first contact an operator and request a collect call? Why the need to do this if she was already using a credit card?

Please provide evidence that you are required to use a credit card to contact an operator. I'm sure since you are convinced the government perpetrated 9/11, that you have verified this information.

Here is a quote from the operator who took Todd Beamer's call from Flight 93:

The caller was Todd Beamer... "He told me that he had dialed zero to report his plane was being hijacked...", she said...

www.s-t.com...
It seems plausible to me that Airfones would allow you to connect to an operator for free in case of emergencies. After all, if cell phones have spotty service at cruising altitude and something were to go wrong with the pilots, does Verizon expect customers to pay in order to report something wrong?

Ted Olson is obviously a liar and guilty of covering up a crime. However, the interesting thing is that even if the call was fake nobody can charge him with anything because the only statements he ever made about his wife were made while he was outside the country. Therefore he can not be charged for this particular crime inside this country.

Judge, jury and executioner, I see.

You're making some rather damning statements with, from what I've seen, very little evidence to back it up.

HOW CAN PEOPLE BE SO BRAINWASHED?

Adolf Hitler was the MASTER of manipulating the general public... he explains "THE BIG LIE" (though he claimed to not endorse it) READ THE FOLLOWING CLOSELY and try to see the parallels:

"In this they proceeded on the sound principle that the magnitude of a lie always contains a certain factor of credibility, since the great masses of the people in the very bottom of their hearts tend to be corrupted rather than consciously and purposely evil, and that, therefore, in view of the primitive simplicity of their minds, they more easily fall a victim to a big lie than to a little one, since they themselves lie in little things, but would be ashamed of lies that were too big. Such a falsehood will never enter their heads, and they will not be able to believe in the possibility of such monstrous effrontery and infamous misrepresentation in others; yes, even when enlightened on the subject, they will long doubt and waver, and continue to accept at least one of these causes as true. Therefore, something of even the most insolent lie will always remain and stick..."

Sorry to quote such a douche, but what he states above is a universal truth... ONLY those who ARE or who understand FULLY being "consciously and purposely evil" and can understand that others are EASILY capable of "monstrous effrontery and infamous misrepresentation" will EVER SEE THE LIGHT.

Originally posted by PepeLapew
I don't think the original subject can go on forever: turn on your TV and there is your answer as how people can get so brainwashed. There, question solved ... does anyone disagree with this statement? Does anyone have anything to add to this?
-No? I didn't think so, case closed.

The dynamics of propaganda & psychology & neuroscience & sociology and so on can't go on forever? You've got to be kidding me! So you can say that the TV brainwashed everyone, but HOW? If you cant say how, but you carry on that argument then it's no different than saying the gov did 911, but you dont know how. See if people will listen to you. There are hundreds if not thousands of threads here that talk about how the gov did 911.

It's simple, people will naturally drift to an other subject.

No, actually it's people will intereject with red herrings and soon enough noone will remember what they were even doing. The goals of subversive enemy disinfo agents is to do just that and disrupt progress and understanding, so in effeect when you bite and chew on irrelevent red herrings, which distract and divert from the original concept, you're serving their purpose. I'll tell you: If there are subversive disinfo agents here at ATS, which we have little reason to assume there aren't regardless of what really happened on 911, you can bet they've particiapated in this very thread, and they weren't trying to help. If everyone became enlightened to the "brainwashing" it would destroy their power.

You just can't regulate the free flow of information and the sharing of ideas.

You call debates on played out irrelevent and debunked issues like cell/air phones meaningful and constructive? Here we had a chance for people to really learn about the mind and how everyones been affected here. Instead it's turned into a red herring spectacle (with issues that probably have multiple threads each). The fact that we're having this specific arguement is a testament to that.

[edit on 25-4-2007 by IgnoranceIsntBlisss]
EDIT: Something in here stinks!

[edit on 25-4-2007 by IgnoranceIsntBlisss]

Originally posted by Speakeasy1981

Please provide evidence that you are required to use a credit card to contact an operator. I'm sure since you are convinced the government perpetrated 9/11, that you have verified this information.

I read reports of this on the net so I checked it out myself on my last two airliner flights. On both of those flights I was unable to make a cell phone call and on both of those flights I was not able to use the airfone without a credit card. I did try to contact an operator just to find that out and it can't be done. You need a credit card to do so.
I can't provide you with any proof of this outside my personal experience. But please don't believe me, try it for yourself .....please!

Here is a quote from the operator who took Todd Beamer's call from Flight 93:

The caller was Todd Beamer... "He told me that he had dialed zero to report his plane was being hijacked...", she said...

No offence but my contention is that these calls ere all fake so you can't really use one of the calls to prove that the calls were real. That doesn't make any sense .... do you understand where I am coming from?

You're making some rather damning statements with, from what I've seen, very little evidence to back it up.

Evidence? there is evidence, cell phones don't work in flight at 35,000 ft up and/or at 500 MPH. That is a powerful evidence in itself. You don't have to believe me buddy, you don't have to search the net for it. You don't even have to take an expensive flight seat to figure it out. Take your cell phone and ship it via airmail to a friend across the country and do try to call your cell while it's in flight. Make sure the ringer is turned off because if they hear the ringer in flight they might get peed off a bit.

Now you know what's funny about Olson's calls? The only known evidence of these calls are statements by Olson, the first on September 12th. nobody has produced any call display log, or credit card logs or phone company log to back this up. Nobody!

Originally posted by Pootie
ONLY those who ARE or who understand FULLY being "consciously and purposely evil" and can understand that others are EASILY capable of "monstrous effrontery and infamous misrepresentation" will EVER SEE THE LIGHT.

You speak the truth,

There is a huge difference between someone who's evil by corruption and those who are evil by choice after they are awakened...

The TRUE evil ones are the ones who are conscious of their true existences and are NATURALLY evil beyond this reality.

These are the ones who uses awakening perception as a means to alter this reality in order to trap souls into this realm and forget what they truly are by providing them with wrongful ideological concepts and materialistic motivations. Therefor a person forgets what he really is and where he comes from by being sucked into this world of deceptions and makes the awakening process cycle longer in this reality.

The reason why darkness is over whelming in this world is because the light ones do not fight or else they become the very darkness they are trying to stop. The paradox is, the light will not contribute to the darkness but it will stop it by not taking action, eventually the light casts over the darkness and is achieved in a natural progression therefor a TRUE way to achieve peace and not a forced one that is an illusion.

The N.W.O are the evil ones who are using their awakening perceptions to alter reality for evil purposes, they will not succeed, they never do. The rituals never hold in place, they always collapse under the weight of the outnumber of natural and pure souls.

The nature of existence, it never ends.

Originally posted by Pootie
ONLY those who ARE or who understand FULLY being "consciously and purposely evil" and can understand that others are EASILY capable of "monstrous effrontery and infamous misrepresentation" will EVER SEE THE LIGHT.

True that, but it's even more 'simple' than that... it's all about basic dehumanization. You see this virtually everywhere, it's sadly a basic part of the human experience. Because of this you must use sociology to understand it.

Take any war or individual act of homicidal racism. Look at the histories of slavery, especially in this country. Look at the history of imperialism, especially in this country, and where "we" inherited from: the 13 colonies were Britains imperial colonies.
Look at how the Native Americans were viewed and how they were treated. Then check out "ethnocentrism":
www.google.com...
Another good example:
en.wikipedia.org...

It's all social group A looking down on social group B, and then executing systematic dehumanization to dominate the underlings. We can go back rather far in history for more understanding, for example how the Romans used to justify slaughtering tens of thousands of "lawless" human beings by labeling them barbarians. In truth most of them just weren't willing to be subjects to the "laws" of the imperial rulers, not made habits out of enslaving other peoples so therefore they didn't have enourmous treasures and sophisticated buildings etc.

From our perspective, its basically our establishment looking down on the entire world, and training US to do the same so that we're easily persuaded to go along with imperial policies and agendas. Most people dont look past this truth, let alone look even closer at the establishment elitists and how they in turn view "US". The masses, even in this country, have been viewed and refered to as the "bewildered herd" since around the 1920's, that I know of.

You see it's not just "the government", which has hundreds of thousands of probably good willed people working under it, its the imperial establishment that truly guides the big show while guiding and shaping the views ideas and attitudes of the masses thru the media. Here it's no surprise that only 5 'firms' control all media, and you only have to look on the surface to guess who might control these institutions.
www.corporations.org...

Exactly who are these elite? That cant be ascertained, as its probably not 12 people sitting around a table playing the world like a video game, although it could be ultimately, it mainly comes down to thousands of bigshots who have stocks in various weapons industries, banking, the media and so on.

These people dont care 2 bits about us "sheep", or the rest of the world, or the world itself as proven by the track record of American Imperialism / wars / the depleted uranium the US military uses in its tank munitions in all modern wars / the way our "rights" (privileges actually) keep being taken / what the US and its big corporations are doing to the world (slave labor and environmental destruction happening where all of our disposable products come from) / taxes & inflation that enslave us to paying for all of the above and so on.

This is the science of exploitation & domination; clues to understanding evil's power.



Where does this all fit into this discussion? This is how we understand what drives those who've enslaved the minds of our fellow underling people, while enslaving the bodies and resources of the external underlings that we know as the "third world" etc. Our people are indoctrinated (slow, gradual) our entire lives to be mental subjects to the establishments imperial agendas so that we can be easily persuaded into the next conflict or war they draw up, and acts like 911 serve to brainwash (sudden, massive) US into pipedreams of total worldwide imperial domination.

The indoctrination that has been in effect for numerous generations only made the brainwashing scheme of 911 that much more effective, and without said pre-indoctrination and teh following new level of imperial indoctrination the aftermath of 911 would have been far different: people would ahve said 'hey, our imperial "foreign policy" is what caused the hatred that exists and the croawds who cheered 911'. Instead the systematic dehumanization machine went into overdrive and the pre-indoctrination, 911 brainwashing and then post-indoctrination is still dominate in the American psyche.

Much of that applies to those who actually care abotu things in general. Then for the rest who have been mentioned here who simply don't care about anything, it's important to have a basic understanding of what modern propaganda is:
The science of Persuasion and Diversion.

We've all also been indoctrinated to live out lifestyles and thought patterns of mindlessness. We've been persuaded to only think about what we've been diverted into thinking about: American Idol, Brittney Spears and so on. This part has little to do with "brainwashing". For someone to go from that "reality" into say my view -rapidly- would be defined as brainwashed, even if my view is totally true and realistic.

The best hope of breaking people free from this doesn't rest soley on exposing things like 911, but also in fully understanding these concepts as well. We must take a top down as well as a bottom up approach to ensure success. You can start here:
books.google.com...


[edit on 25-4-2007 by IgnoranceIsntBlisss]

Originally posted by Speakeasy1981
Well, from my own research, the plane's speed during the hand off between towers isn't as much a problem for the person on the air as it is for the people on the ground. A call can hand off between two towers at high speeds successfully, but there's a good chance that the hand off will cut off a call on the ground.

I would like to know how you arrived that this assertion that a plane traveling at altitude would hand-off successfully while a slower traveling vehicle at ground level would not hand-off successfully.
Look at this picture here:

www.thetrainshow.com...
As you can clearly see, the antennas on cell phone towers are pointing toward the horizon. So I ask you, a normal user would be in direct line of sight with these tower antennas while an airplane would not. How do you suppose a plane would have a better chance to connect and hand-off?

You state that this is the result of your own research, please share "your research" with the rest of us.

Hey you who is serving the role of a disinfo agent...

There are basically hundreds of threads about your CELL PHONE issue:
PLEASE, PICK ONE TO MOVE YOUR RED HERRING DISCUSSION INTO!

Even link in the one you want for those following the debate. Just dont destroy the original topic with this completely unrelated topic. Have some respect for the OP.

[edit on 25-4-2007 by IgnoranceIsntBlisss]

Originally posted by IgnoranceIsntBlisss
We've all also been indoctrinated to live out lifestyles and thought patterns of mindlessness. We've been persuaded to only think about what we've been diverted into thinking about: American Idol, Brittney Spears and so on. This part has little to do with "brainwashing". For someone to go from that "reality" into say my view -rapidly- would be defined as brainwashed, even if my view is totally true and realistic.

The diversion part I'm talking about is the biggest threat of all to the movement, and we can observe right in this very thread. Even most who are in the movement have been diverted into issues that are highly debatable and are way overkill in attempts to get a new and proper investigation using joint fMRI + polygraph testing and some indictments. Said issues serve as the bait for the pseudoskeptics and politically biased people who don't want to have to face such a frightening reality and would rather laugh at the endless list of things that people bring up in attempts to prove a conspiracy.

A full out investigation, in addition to joint polygraphs + state of the art fMRI brain scan liie detection is the way to find out once and for all what happened on 911 and then we go from there.
www.google.com...
www.google.com...

As long as the focus is diverted into these controversy issues there wont be solidarity in getting an investigation, or on the other hand peopel will remain "brainwashed" in ignoring 911. If you want a real investigation and a real movement you're going to need the "Skeptics" to get there asap. They simply wont listen to the fringe arguments, and there are plenty of real issues to persuade them with.

[edit on 25-4-2007 by IgnoranceIsntBlisss]

Originally posted by talisman
Technically IgnoranceIsntBlisss is correct, the thread should try and focus on the original topic, I just think sometimes people are less rigid and restricted when ideas flow freely.

But, how can we focus on a subject called "how can people be so brainwashed" without going into more detail? Just wondering.

Originally posted by selfless
The reason why darkness is over whelming in this world is because the light ones do not fight or else they become the very darkness they are trying to stop. The paradox is, the light will not contribute to the darkness but it will stop it by not taking action, eventually the light casts over the darkness and is achieved in a natural progression therefor a TRUE way to achieve peace and not a forced one that is an illusion.

Please U2U me. We have to talk about the things you say here. We have a lot in common.

Originally posted by IgnoranceIsntBlisss
For someone to go from that "reality" into say my view -rapidly- would be defined as brainwashed, even if my view is totally true and realistic.

The best hope of breaking people free from this doesn't rest soley on exposing things like 911, but also in fully understanding these concepts as well. We must take a top down as well as a bottom up approach to ensure success. You can start here:
books.google.com...

Thanks for enlightening us on psychology and propaganda. I enjoy your posts. I guess it's probably because psychology and sociology are far from the realm of my experience in academics. Take care and I hope you enlighten us more.

Edit to add: I do have to say, your avatar freeks me out a little. Reminds me of "conspiracy theory".

[edit on 4/25/2007 by Griff]

[edit on 4/25/2007 by Griff]

Off topic,

Isn't it from a clockwork orange?

Originally posted by selfless
Isn't it from a clockwork orange?

I have never seen that movie. Should I? How sad is it that I'm 34 years old and haven't seen "Clockwork Orange"? Ok...back to topic.

Thanks yo.

Ya that's Clockwork Orange. That's what its like getting 'brainwashed' people to listen/care (about anything really, and especially lastingly), so I feel justified in using it.

I didn't get hardly a peep of psychology or sociology in college either. All electonics engineering. Since I got into all of this, and artificial intelligence, i naturally got sucked into basically every side of the mind/brain world. Sociology was the cherry on top of the icing. I got ahold of this college edition textbook: Sociology: Understanding a Diverse Society
, and it filled in all of the blanks in the aftermath of watching the Century of Self with everythig else i knew:
video.google.com...
Since then, i've gotten and scrubbed thru textbooks on human behavior, persuasion, Media and so on. The "Persuasion, Social Influence & Compliance Gaining" book (i dont think that particular title is in google, but the others cover the same materials) was like the next level after finishing sociology. It details the science of persuasion which exploits psychology, sociology and some of the more distinct overlooked details like "Cognitive Biases", which are all used by our elite masters to control us.
www.google.com...
www.google.com...

My statement "propaganda is the science of persuasion and diversion" is somewhat my catch phrase, but Chomsky helped me understand that for sure:
www.abovetopsecret.com...

If you want to get serious about studying this stuff be sure to add "PDF" to your google searches and try google books!!

I'd like to throw out an easter egg in light of a certain google link i posted above: you can view the entire "limited" _____ if you're clever with the search feature.


[edit on 26-4-2007 by IgnoranceIsntBlisss]