Why i think the TR-3B Astra Locust does not exist and never did

Don't forget that the majority of "triangular craft" reported these days are just three innocuous lights floating around that eventually fall into a delta formation. It boggles my mind that even though they are seen and reported as three separate entities, and despite the fact when in this delta formation you can still see the sky between them, that the are still called a singular "craft".
The hell does that make any sense?

Originally posted by Mondogiwa
Paul,

Do you just jump to the conclusion that alieans are involved when you can't understand the technology?? It seems you just restate the same point over and over again. You can't really explain how a cell phone does what it does but you don't think aliens made them...or do you?

By stating that since the technology is just obviously too far advanced for us to have made you are making the same mistake as you claim others make by saying they are ours. The point is that you have no, and I mean no proof whatsoever other than your thoughts and ideas that make sense to YOU! This is the same thing that everybody does, no matter what their stance is on the subject. There's no way to know for sure...it just has to be a logical deductive approach based on your personal experience and/or knowledge base. For me, it's all based on governement military projects with the U.S. Navy that I get my thoughts and ideas and information from. I have seen with my very own eyes some technologies under study that are mind blowing and I still am not sure that I really understand them so it's just beyond me....but, I totally and completely believe that we have the capability and knowledge to create otherwordly technologies. That is not to say that they are all our own but I am convinced beyond any shadow of a doubt that what most people have seen is our own technologies. It does not have to fit into your box or mine!

Peace to you sir, end of posts on subject for me.

No matter advanced the technology, it still needs to comply with the laws of physic. The technology that powers the TR-3A/3B certainly does Not(obey the laws of physics). Reactionless propulsion was experimentally tested in the 1950s and early 1960s and the results were the same: ABJECT FAILURE.

People are coming up with all kinds of preposterous theories about top secret military aircraft that use technology which are either impossible, or impractical.

Originally posted by banditfllu
reply to post by Paul the seeker

 

Kinda narrow minded to say its not real.. This Freaking thing flew by.. Instantly stopped and Lit up like a star and freaking took off. Made no sound.. Didn't even cause a sonic boom.. If I wasn't so poor.. I would have recorded it.. IT was Amazing.. So what are you saying? I saw a Ufo? LOL! Yeah sure.. w/e.. I hope to see a Ufo some day.. But this thing.. I'm sure was made by Usaf.. If the Gov says its not real? Id just laugh. Because in 2006 Nasa posted that their tests of the antimatter engine produced too much Gamma radiation.. (2010 Antimatter captured for the FIRST time!) LOL..

What you say was indeed a UFO. Keep in mind that UFO is an acronym for (an) Unidentified Flying Object. If a UFO turned out to be an extraterrestrial vehicle, then it is no longer unidentified. Antimatter can only be produced currently in extremely small quantities that are far too small to be of any practical use in propulsion. And believe me, if and when such technology becomes feasible it will NEVER be used on atmospheric vehicles because the amount of radiation released would be much greater than a hydrogen bomb and the vehicle would be propelled to speed unsurvivable in the Earths atmosphere. I.E., it would be vaporized within seconds.

IDC what the government says or does not say! If you make a claim that such a military aircraft does exist, the burden of proof rests upon YOU to produce the evidence. If you cannot do so, then by virtue of Occams razor it is safe and logically consistent to assume that such a thing does not exist and is likely to be a hoax.

if they can get the stealth Bomber to fly they can get a brick to fly.....So why not a perfect triangle...

reply to post by Paul the seeker

What interests me, i have never heard of a triangle being built at A51

The F117 Stealth fighter was tested at Groom lake,

that could be considered a triangle craft

reply to post by Paul the seeker

I see it from the realistic side, which concludes it is more likely being related to alien technology.

How in the world is that realistic?

Real based on your belief that extra terrestrials exist?

I've read incidents about triangles enough to know their flight behavour, flight location ..

How have you verified what you read to be true?

reply to post by InhaleExhale


But it wasn't BUILT there. Probably because nothing has been built there, ever. They've assembled aircraft there, but Groom doesn't have any kind of facilities to build anything there.

reply to post by Paul the seeker

simply not any government would let their experimental crafts or stealth crafts cruise where triangles are reported.

Is this a fact you can back up or just your opinion?

I would like to hear why they wouldn't?

The fact there was never reported anything officially about any technology like this the chance for this to be atleast military or top secret if it's not controlled by aliens raises up to 90%

that 10% that's left over what would that represent if its not alien or military top secret?

Triangle reports go back to the 80s and earlier, now don't tell me they had nuclear powered gravityless and unrealisitc seeming manouvarible triangles at that time. well not unless foreigners were involved.

You do know the splitting of the atom happened back in 1917, that was then developed into atomic and nuclear weapons by the 50s.

I am still confused whether you saying this craft doesn't and never did exist or that its alien in origin.

reply to post by Paul the seeker

How much have you deepened to UFO reports? they're facts, you're just speculating.

The reports might be a fact as in the reports are real, whats being reported could be misinterpretations or hoaxes.

They wouldn't be UFO reports if they were identifiable.

Originally posted by Zaphod58
reply to post by InhaleExhale

 

But it wasn't BUILT there. Probably because nothing has been built there, ever. They've assembled aircraft there, but Groom doesn't have any kind of facilities to build anything there.

Exactly,

Which brings to point out how much the OP is speculating but throwing words like fact around.

I am not sure whether OP believes the craft to exist or doesn't, hoping for some clarification.

Originally posted by InhaleExhale

Originally posted by Zaphod58
reply to post by InhaleExhale

 

But it wasn't BUILT there. Probably because nothing has been built there, ever. They've assembled aircraft there, but Groom doesn't have any kind of facilities to build anything there.

Exactly,

Which brings to point out how much the OP is speculating but throwing words like fact around.

I am not sure whether OP believes the craft to exist or doesn't, hoping for some clarification.

The burden of proof is always on the one making the claim!

Yeah yeah, I know that "absence of evidence does equate with evidence of absence", but you cannot prove a negative. So in this case, unless you can present evidence that the TR-3B actually exists, then I call malarkey.
Thus far, the proposed propulsion mechanisms violate proven laws of physics so there it's reasonable to be cynical here.

Sorry, but I've seen a flying triangle, and I don't know whether it's the Astra, or what you want to call it, but it was a military plane. It was a perfect triangle, running lights, and three large lights just like in the OP's image link. Of course, no one is going to believe me, and I really don't care. But, it made no sound, and it fascinated me. I was thoroughly convinced it was a black project, and not a true UFO. True, I still don't know what it was, but I guess I am trying to say not extraterrestrial.

Originally posted by Catacomb
Sorry, but I've seen a flying triangle, and I don't know whether it's the Astra, or what you want to call it, but it was a military plane. It was a perfect triangle, running lights, and three large lights just like in the OP's image link. Of course, no one is going to believe me, and I really don't care. But, it made no sound, and it fascinated me. I was thoroughly convinced it was a black project, and not a true UFO. True, I still don't know what it was, but I guess I am trying to say not extraterrestrial.

I am not doubting that you saw a flying triangle, but how was it flying? Was it maneuvering like a normal airplane?

Originally posted by Mondogiwa
Paul,



Next, the possibility of the TR3B's existence is up in the air, but the technology that is suggested makes it possible (at least in theory). There are technologies that exist today that render airflow and airflow disturbance obsolete, in effect they make air disturbance not a factor.

I have been privy to some suggested technologies (none are ever said to exist on paper and application), and they take what we commonly know as airfows and turn them on their ears.

I worked for the U.S. Navy as part of the F18 program and have also talked with emmbers of other branches that will completely agree with me that these technologies are possible and probable. Some of these friends of mine are even here on ATS and cruise the aircraft forums as I do.

Electromagnetic anti-gravity is not possible with modern technology nor our experimentally verified understanding of physics. An electromagnetic field has no effect on mass and it has been shown that at least on the classical level that gravitational and inertial mass are equal to one another. Magnetic levitation requires 2 magnets pushing against each other balanced by the force of gravity. The Earth's magnetic field is far too weak for any artificially produced magnetic field to generate lift for any sort of aircraft.

Furthermore, the speculated propulsion mechanism, using a tokamak chamber containing mercury plasma that is accelerated by electromagnets would definitely create a strong magnetic field, but that alone would not enable this thing to get off the ground.

There are those that claim this aircraft uses ionic propulsion and even nuclear plasma thrusters. But if such where the case the plasma exhaust would be thousands of degrees and would glow white hot making this aircraft highly visible and vulnerable to heat seeking missiles.

And finally, a magnetic field of that strength would be lethal. So this machine would have to be unmanned.

reply to post by YogSohoth

The burden of proof is always on the one making the claim! Yeah yeah, I know that "absence of evidence does equate with evidence of absence", but you cannot prove a negative. So in this case, unless you can present evidence that the TR-3B actually exists, then I call malarkey.

Sorry can you remind me where I said or claimed anything is real/not real in this thread,

I am trying to understand where the OP stands as quoted below from one post of a few asking

I am still confused whether you saying this craft doesn't and never did exist or that its alien in origin.

Originally posted by YogSohoth

Originally posted by Catacomb
Sorry, but I've seen a flying triangle, and I don't know whether it's the Astra, or what you want to call it, but it was a military plane. It was a perfect triangle, running lights, and three large lights just like in the OP's image link. Of course, no one is going to believe me, and I really don't care. But, it made no sound, and it fascinated me. I was thoroughly convinced it was a black project, and not a true UFO. True, I still don't know what it was, but I guess I am trying to say not extraterrestrial.

I am not doubting that you saw a flying triangle, but how was it flying? Was it maneuvering like a normal airplane?

Yes, I followed it in my vehicle for as long as I could. It was silent, and flying along. I could easily see it, as it was a cloudy morning (before dawn), and it's lights, and shape, were easily seen. It was moving at a pretty fast clip, but nothing mind boggling. A normal military jet airspeed.

Originally posted by Catacomb

Originally posted by YogSohoth

Originally posted by Catacomb
Sorry, but I've seen a flying triangle, and I don't know whether it's the Astra, or what you want to call it, but it was a military plane. It was a perfect triangle, running lights, and three large lights just like in the OP's image link. Of course, no one is going to believe me, and I really don't care. But, it made no sound, and it fascinated me. I was thoroughly convinced it was a black project, and not a true UFO. True, I still don't know what it was, but I guess I am trying to say not extraterrestrial.

I am not doubting that you saw a flying triangle, but how was it flying? Was it maneuvering like a normal airplane?

Yes, I followed it in my vehicle for as long as I could. It was silent, and flying along. I could easily see it, as it was a cloudy morning (before dawn), and it's lights, and shape, were easily seen. It was moving at a pretty fast clip, but nothing mind boggling. A normal military jet airspeed.

Was it an equilateral triangle? Or more of an isosceles? Too bad you have no pics of vids of it. Can you describe it more detail perhaps? I am honestly curious.

Originally posted by YogSohoth

Originally posted by Catacomb

Originally posted by YogSohoth

Originally posted by Catacomb
Sorry, but I've seen a flying triangle, and I don't know whether it's the Astra, or what you want to call it, but it was a military plane. It was a perfect triangle, running lights, and three large lights just like in the OP's image link. Of course, no one is going to believe me, and I really don't care. But, it made no sound, and it fascinated me. I was thoroughly convinced it was a black project, and not a true UFO. True, I still don't know what it was, but I guess I am trying to say not extraterrestrial.

I am not doubting that you saw a flying triangle, but how was it flying? Was it maneuvering like a normal airplane?

Yes, I followed it in my vehicle for as long as I could. It was silent, and flying along. I could easily see it, as it was a cloudy morning (before dawn), and it's lights, and shape, were easily seen. It was moving at a pretty fast clip, but nothing mind boggling. A normal military jet airspeed.

Was it an equilateral triangle? Or more of an isosceles? Too bad you have no pics of vids of it. Can you describe it more detail perhaps? I am honestly curious.

Equilateral, most definitely. Not really much to tell, more than what I've said. A triangle shape, all black, except for blinking running lights at the three points. It made no sound. And no, I have no pictures or videos. I saw it on the way to work, and I go to work early in the am, before dawn. It's been about 10 years ago now. I still remember seeing it vividly. I often look up, no matter where I am at, so I've seen a few odd things. If I recall correctly, it was heading East, or slightly SE. Not much more I can say than that.

One of the highlights of my skywatching. #2, in fact.

originally posted by: YogSohothNo matter advanced the technology, it still needs to comply with the laws of physic. The technology that powers the TR-3A/3B certainly does Not(obey the laws of physics). Reactionless propulsion was experimentally tested in the 1950s and early 1960s and the results were the same: ABJECT FAILURE.

People are coming up with all kinds of preposterous theories about top secret military aircraft that use technology which are either impossible, or impractical.

This statement is true....provided that the technologies, knowledge or capabilities haven't changed since the '50's/'60's, which we know isn't the case. Not only that, but it's such an arrogant, anthropocentric viewpoint that it immediately loses any validity to me. What humans don't know about physics and the universe could fill petabytes.

In just 50 years from the end of WWI, when most people in the world were still using a horse and buggy as their main source of transportation, we landed men on the moon and successfully returned them to Earth. That fact makes me wonder how much more we know now since the 'ABJECT FAILURE' of 'reactionless propulsion' testing in the 1950's. My educated guess would be; quite a lot.

Technological progress comes from doing things differently in an unpredictable way, and that is exactly what has been done.

Sorry to zombie this thread, but I just had to say something.

originally posted by: YogSohoth
Electromagnetic anti-gravity is not possible with modern technology nor our experimentally verified understanding of physics. An electromagnetic field has no effect on mass and it has been shown that at least on the classical level that gravitational and inertial mass are equal to one another. Magnetic levitation requires 2 magnets pushing against each other balanced by the force of gravity. The Earth's magnetic field is far too weak for any artificially produced magnetic field to generate lift for any sort of aircraft.

Are you new to this whole subject? You really don't seem to know what you're talking about. Pioneers like Brown, Biefield, and Hutchison debunked your statements above many decades ago.

The Newtonian principled propulsion systems are a thing of the past for the black budget world. This is new physiscs; there are gate keepers to this knowledge that stop further research by independent scientists through ridicule, marginalization and disaccreditation. Their tactics seem to have worked on you.