After 6 years what has the Disclosure Project disclosed?

Thanks for the quick reply. I limit my assistance in fund-raising to local organizations as time allows.

You can not blame anyone for being skeptical where these types of organizations are concerned. It has been my experience that the worth of an organization or project is proved by the publics willingness to sit down and write a check. The organization must prove its worth before that can happen. Then and only then will the cash start to flow.

Supporting a project like this would indeed be very expensive. I would think it would be important to include, at no charge, people who could be beneficial to the organization in the activities to build credibility. Especially with an organization who's primary expenses are administrative in nature.

If these sightings are happening in these sessions, it is most unwise to not document them on film or at least to allow the participants to testify as to their authenticity.

[edit on 3/26/2007 by Blaine91555]

Originally posted by tock

He has a G7 country behind him, should be good to see what happens with this.

I warned you guys... I am glad he is ignoring me so he can't see my posts - it only gets worse from here - just wait until all of the New Age rationalism floods forth - and it will. I mean, he IS quoting Greer when Tock mentions G7 - even though reality states that it is actually G8

G8 Countries:
Canada, France, Germany, Italy, Japan, Russia, the United Kingdom and the United States.
en.wikipedia.org...
This should clue you in on who you are dealing with: since I corrected him in another thread - he still goes back to saying G7 countries, a misquote from Greer's DP video... where Greer in his infinite wisdom says "A major G-7 Country will have alien contact soon."

Originally posted by millerman
Oh yay, yet another Greer-bashing thread.....

Hi Millerman

How are you doing? Don't blame meee for this one... I am just on the sidelines making MIC commentary and taking notes on the play by play action!

Originally posted by Blaine91555
Thanks for the quick reply. I limit my assistance in fund-raising to local organizations as time allows.

You can not blame anyone for being skeptical where these types of organizations are concerned. It has been my experience that the worth of an organization or project is proved by the publics willingness to sit down and write a check. The organization must prove its worth before that can happen. Then and only then will the cash start to flow.

Supporting a project like this would indeed be very expensive. I would think it would be important to include, at no charge, people who could be beneficial to the organization in the activities to build credibility. Especially with an organization who's primary expenses are administrative in nature.

If these sightings are happening in these sessions, it is most unwise to not document them on film or at least to allow the participants to testify as to their authenticity.

[edit on 3/26/2007 by Blaine91555]

Yeah, documentation would rock, I don't think they can afford the gear and the personnel to film all expeditions. But, if a volunteer would step up to do it, that would rock.

With your experience, could you send your recommendations to Debbie Foch? Would be greatly appreciated.

The CSETI Non-Disclosure Agreement

The issue has been raised as to why CSETI does not allow people to take photographs/films and makes them sign an NDA.

I can't speak for Greer or CSETI here, I can only speculate. But I would imagine that it actually started as a way for him to PROTECT people - because people running around with too much UFO/ET proof had a tendency to "suddenly commit suicide under mysterious circumstances".

But I must admit, I have wondered about this myself, about why CSETI doesn't have footage of CE-5 experiences that they could put on Google or YouTube. Are you able to get a definitive answer from CSETI about this tock?

From my understanding, they are very careful about what they show.
They don't have any cameramen doing the work, and certainly don't have the money to do it.

They seem protective of their footage, because they don't want it to be abused. They might have got "scammed in the past", but that's just speculation.

I think Steven is pass the point where he cares about footage, that's my opinion.

My question is, would you get more support showing pictures of glowing balls of light, or you would just give more opportunities for the people to complain on the quality of such footage...

ANother important point is that, material gets damaged under these huge electro-magnetic fields, created by the crafts. Sometimes, the brand new batteries go "Dead". I remember, one of the media corp. had between 40000-70000$ worth of damage on their equipment during one event.

As soon as I'm done with my current project, I'll see if I can get a good video and picture packaged together, into another slideshow like the mars anomaly research presentation I made not long ago. That should satisfy some of you.

[edit on 26-3-2007 by tock]

Originally posted by tock
From my understanding, they are very careful about what they show.
They don't have any cameramen doing the work, and certainly don't have the money to do it.

They seem protective of their footage, because they don't want it to be abused. They might have got "scammed in the past", but that's just speculation.

Anyone seeing the trend yet? Always curving the answers - always having the answers that just make no sense. You would figure, lets say 20 people are on this 'UFO Outing' that Greer is having - $800 x 20 = $16,000... and yet, they can't afford a camera, or anyone to operate it? LOL what a JOKE.

I think Steven is pass the point where he cares about footage, that's my opinion.

Yeah, he is past the point of caring about footage, and disclosure - and more about how much his next venture will bring in.

My question is, would you get more support showing pictures of glowing balls of light, or you would just give more opportunities for the people to complain on the quality of such footage...

Oh nothing really, we would gain nothing from it (what a mentality) - all but the bits and pieces that started this phenomena in the first place. Face it - the UFO phenomena would be nonexistent without footage and photos.
Even though Tock has me on ignore - I feel compelled to show how flawed his argumentation is to the rest of the community.

ANother important point is that, material gets damaged under these huge electro-magnetic fields, created by the crafts. Sometimes, the brand new batteries go "Dead". I remember, one of the media corp. had between 40000-70000$ worth of damage on their equipment during one event.

I thought he said no reporters were bothering with Greer, and that Greer wasn't interested in filming them - or that they didn't have a camera man, or even the funds for the cameras...... what then do we make out of $40,000-$70,000 worth of damage to equipment???

As soon as I'm done with my current project, I'll see if I can get a good video and picture packaged together, into another slideshow like the mars anomaly research presentation I made not long ago. That should satisfy some of you.

CANT WAIT!

What Greer is selling you at his convention is called intellectual property, and there are laws against theft of intellectual property. Tock has to sign a non-disclosure agreement because if Tock were to take this knowledge and spread it himself, this would take away from Greer, who created it, discovered it, whatever you want to say. It makes sense for a company and a con-man, but it doesn't make sense for a non-profit organization. You only have a non-disclosure agreement to protect something you created, and Greer created a nice little set of stories. Those christian guys on the television on Sunday mornings are the same thing, and politicians are definitely not too far behind.

If Greer actually had something that can't be explained away with ease, he would only have to release ONE video to youtube, google, anywhere on the internet. The rest would happen naturally, and quite fast. But, if he hasn't got anything of substance, he'll continue to sell his personality as the biggest part of his product.

On the same token, Tock has the right to believe what he wants. But i don't think anyone is arguing with that.

CidCauldensfey said:
"Greer screwed up the Disclosure project by making it a spirtual thing. Obviously it must be because mysticism is easier to believe and more factual than actual scientific evidence."

No, Cid, you just don't get the importance of "mysticism"... that is, the spiritual part of all this.

A more evolved level of being is required. You don't seem to be there yet... judging from your cynical statement and your 'glory of war' avatar.

"The truth shall set you free(Cid).... but it's gonna make you madder than hell first."

By the way, Greer is playing chicken with the Power Holders... and it's gonna take a while. Read HIDDEN TRUTH, FORBIDDEN KNOWLEDGE, his last book. He's quite smart how he walks right into the enemy camp and says 'let's talk.' He's gained many allies by this open and transparent approach. REAL guts ball! And, he know he might not survive. But THEY know that should that happen, they will be immediately exposed and some of them possibly lynched. It's the top of the 11th inning, bases loaded, score tied, three balls and two strikes... the sweat's poring. Now it's all in s l o w m o t i o n. But, something's gonna happen, sooner or later. We must be patient.
B.

Tock,

I have no interest in that. My plate is full. Probably for the rest of my working life.

As for any advice I would give to kick loose funding? You will not like it. The same full disclosure that is being demanded of the government would be a good start. We lead by example. It would seem this gentleman is following the governments example of secrecy. If the evidence is there it should be released. Otherwise don't expect much in the way of support. People capable of giving support are not going to accept anecdotal accounts as a reason to participate financially. If there is no evidence other than the word of a few individuals who paid for the experience, don't expect people to come running to join in.

Technology has changed dramatically in the last few years. Anyone can now shoot footage in High Definition with a camera that costs under $10,000.00. Since digital cameras are not prone to damage from magnetic devices in the same way as old film cameras I find it odd that they would receive any damage from a magnetic field. The vehicles you use to get to the site would be far more prone to damage from that. Unless you have to walk out every time? I'm hesitant to buy the camera damage story.

Originally posted by The Cyfre
What Greer is selling you at his convention is called intellectual property, and there are laws against theft of intellectual property. Tock has to sign a non-disclosure agreement because if Tock were to take this knowledge and spread it himself, this would take away from Greer, who created it, discovered it, whatever you want to say. It makes sense for a company and a con-man, but it doesn't make sense for a non-profit organization. You only have a non-disclosure agreement to protect something you created, and Greer created a nice little set of stories. Those christian guys on the television on Sunday mornings are the same thing, and politicians are definitely not too far behind.

If Greer actually had something that can't be explained away with ease, he would only have to release ONE video to youtube, google, anywhere on the internet. The rest would happen naturally, and quite fast. But, if he hasn't got anything of substance, he'll continue to sell his personality as the biggest part of his product.

On the same token, Tock has the right to believe what he wants. But i don't think anyone is arguing with that.

Thank you sir. I might not understand the nuances of this political battle, but I trust my feelings regarding him.
The reason I was not satisfied only reading what i Found on ATS and on the NET in general, brought me to make the trip to Mt Shasta. I had to kick myself hard to do it too... Now, I'm happy, cause I have the answers I was looking for. I can't walk the path for the rest of the people on this forum.
You gotta live it for yourself.

Originally posted by kroms33

Originally posted by tock

He has a G7 country behind him, should be good to see what happens with this.

I warned you guys... I am glad he is ignoring me so he can't see my posts - it only gets worse from here - just wait until all of the New Age rationalism floods forth - and it will. I mean, he IS quoting Greer when Tock mentions G7 - even though reality states that it is actually G8

G8 Countries:
Canada, France, Germany, Italy, Japan, Russia, the United Kingdom and the United States.
en.wikipedia.org...
This should clue you in on who you are dealing with: since I corrected him in another thread - he still goes back to saying G7 countries, a misquote from Greer's DP video... where Greer in his infinite wisdom says "A major G-7 Country will have alien contact soon."

I've noticed in other posts that Tock has a habit of ignoring the questions he cannot answer. Indeed, he doesn't seem to be able to answer any question other than quote Greer or Sereda's pseudo science waffle that he's picked up from their videos. G7, indeed!

I think Greer is going the same way L Ron Hubbard went. The only difference here is that he is calling his organisation a 'non profit' set up whereas Hubbard tried to call Scientology a religion so as to evade taxes. All you have to do is at the end of the financial year pay all the excess cash out as bonuses and expenses and hey presto - no profit left! Either way the goal isn't education or enlightenment it's to dupe the gullible into handing over their cash.

I was amazed to learn in this thread that Greer has his accolites sign a non disclosure agreement before he takes their money. Absolute hypocrisy - Greer should be sent to the UFO Hall of Shame.

ATS people, isn't the 'ignore' option on this site a form of censorship and doesn't it go against the philosophy of the site? Just a thought!

Originally posted by millerman
The CSETI Non-Disclosure Agreement

The issue has been raised as to why CSETI does not allow people to take photographs/films and makes them sign an NDA.

I can't speak for Greer or CSETI here, I can only speculate. But I would imagine that it actually started as a way for him to PROTECT people - because people running around with too much UFO/ET proof had a tendency to "suddenly commit suicide under mysterious circumstances".

Nope you speculate incorrectly, Greer has no fear of members of the public being murdered. Quoted here:

Originally said by Dr Steven Greer

But here’s the deal, when we did this none of us were threatened, none of the military guys, none of the corporate people, none of the intelligence officers, not myself—none of us, not a single one of us got a phone call saying, "Shut up, don't do this"—nothing. So we feel that we have kind of cleared a path for disclosure to happen.

My source: www.ufoevidence.org...

I think The Cyfre has actually expressed my views on this much more eloquently than I possibly could. Not often I completely agree with someone.

Originally posted by timb3r

Originally posted by millerman

I can't speak for Greer or CSETI here, I can only speculate. But I would imagine that it actually started as a way for him to PROTECT people - because people running around with too much UFO/ET proof had a tendency to "suddenly commit suicide under mysterious circumstances".

Nope you speculate incorrectly, Greer has no fear of members of the public being murdered. Quoted here:

Originally said by Dr Steven Greer

But here’s the deal, when we did this none of us were threatened, none of the military guys, none of the corporate people, none of the intelligence officers, not myself—none of us, not a single one of us got a phone call saying, "Shut up, don't do this"—nothing. So we feel that we have kind of cleared a path for disclosure to happen.

Yes that is so now, especially after the 2001 Disclosure conference.

But CSETI started in the early nineties, around 1991 I think, and at that time "Murder Inc." was still actively harassing and silencing people. In "Hidden Truth" he talks about his team being quite seriously threatened and even targeted with directed energy weapons and things like that. So I can see him putting some protective measures in place for CSETI members, like the NDA and "no cameras" rule.

But as to why that would still be the case today, I don't know....

Hold on.

Tock states that 70,000k worth of camera equipment was destroyed and also says that he will take some footage - though I assume he means personal, outside of the watchful eye of the organised CSETI group.

And yet you state no camera's are allowed ?

Which is it?

[edit on 27-3-2007 by timb3r]

Originally posted by timb3r
Hold on.

Tock states that 70,000k worth of camera equipment was destroyed and also says that he will take some footage - though I assume he means personal, outside of the watchful eye of the organised CSETI group.

And yet you state no camera's are allowed ?

Which is it?

[edit on 27-3-2007 by timb3r]

Well I am not involved with CSETI so I don't know, but someone else posted something about people not being permitted to bring cameras along.

But if it is true that the ET crafts emit very strong EM fields that can damage equipment like that, and 70K of equipment was ruined one time.... that would explain the "no cameras" rule wouldn't it? ;-)

I believe it, because some of the DP witnesses who were airline pilots and came in very close proximity to the crafts have testified that all their equipment started malfunctioning....

Originally posted by millerman

But if it is true that the ET crafts emit very strong EM fields that can damage equipment like that, and 70K of equipment was ruined one time.... that would explain the "no cameras" rule wouldn't it? ;-)

Considering that Greer is taking $800 dollars from each participant I doubt very much that he is concerned about them suffering a further financial loss due to a potentially damaged camera.

I believe that the no-camera rule applies because there is simply nothing to film. That way the organisers can claim anything happened - space craft landed, for example - and the poor unfortunates who laid out the cash can't prove that nothing actually occured - no photographic evidence and a signed non-disclosure document that keeps them silent.

Originally posted by millerman

Originally posted by timb3r
Hold on.

Tock states that 70,000k worth of camera equipment was destroyed and also says that he will take some footage - though I assume he means personal, outside of the watchful eye of the organised CSETI group.

And yet you state no camera's are allowed ?

Which is it?

[edit on 27-3-2007 by timb3r]

Well I am not involved with CSETI so I don't know, but someone else posted something about people not being permitted to bring cameras along.

But if it is true that the ET crafts emit very strong EM fields that can damage equipment like that, and 70K of equipment was ruined one time.... that would explain the "no cameras" rule wouldn't it? ;-)

I believe it, because some of the DP witnesses who were airline pilots and came in very close proximity to the crafts have testified that all their equipment started malfunctioning....

You can record video, take pictures and record sound on those trainings.
If you screw up your gear, just too bad.

You cannot use the footage recorded before having been accepted by CSETI.

There was an invited Media, at some point, that got their camera damaged, I believe it was in england.

You are right about malfunctioning. These craft generates billions of volts to create an gravity nullifying effect and to propulse themselves.
It's probably similar to an EMP shockwave when you come close. So You bet our very sensible CHIPS would get wiped, even worts if your gear contains EPROMs.

Originally posted by Blaine91555
Tock,

I have no interest in that. My plate is full. Probably for the rest of my working life.

As for any advice I would give to kick loose funding? You will not like it. The same full disclosure that is being demanded of the government would be a good start. We lead by example. It would seem this gentleman is following the governments example of secrecy. If the evidence is there it should be released. Otherwise don't expect much in the way of support. People capable of giving support are not going to accept anecdotal accounts as a reason to participate financially. If there is no evidence other than the word of a few individuals who paid for the experience, don't expect people to come running to join in.

Technology has changed dramatically in the last few years. Anyone can now shoot footage in High Definition with a camera that costs under $10,000.00. Since digital cameras are not prone to damage from magnetic devices in the same way as old film cameras I find it odd that they would receive any damage from a magnetic field. The vehicles you use to get to the site would be far more prone to damage from that. Unless you have to walk out every time? I'm hesitant to buy the camera damage story.

Darn, 10000$ is a load of money man.
Digital camera are affected by high powered electromagnetic fields and so are batteries.
Thanks for the advices. I'll pass this along.