757/767 remote control flight...terrorists didnt do it

Originally posted by discomfit
It's not exactly a secret that large jets can be remotely controlled.

I once saw a very good video of it done in the 90s I think. Here is the only info I could dig up for now: NASA : Controlled Impact Demonstration.

In 1984 NASA Dryden Flight Research Center and the Federal Aviation Administration (FAA) teamed-up in a unique flight experiment called the Controlled Impact Demonstration (CID), to test the impact of a Boeing 720 aircraft using standard fuel with an additive designed to suppress fire.
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On the morning of December 1, 1984, a remotely controlled Boeing 720 transport took off from Edwards Air Force Base (Edwards, California), made a left-hand departure and climbed to an altitude of 2300 feet.
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During the 14 flights, there were 16 hours and 22 minutes of remotely piloted vehicle control, including 10 remotely piloted takeoffs, 69 remotely piloted vehicle controlled approaches, and 13 remotely piloted vehicle landings on abort runway.

So ya... this was in 1984. I'm pretty sure they can do the same and better today.

Riddle me this

Why didn't any of the planes transmit their hijack code ? All these trained pilots and no one sent out the signal ? OR PERHAPS they were taken over electronically and it didn't matter what button they pressed.

Do you have any idea how the ATC control panel works? Let me educate you. Just ot let you know there is no button on the pilots yoke or on the glareshield that once pressed will transmit the hijack code.

There are two dials that are used in selecting an ATC code. On each of those dials sits another dial. That makes a total of four dials, ATC codes are four didgit numbers remember. On Boeing aircraft like the 757 and 767 the ATC control panel is on the center pedestal between the pilots and behind the throttles. In order to select a code the pilot has to turn and reach to the side and then make four seperate motions. Now imagine trying to do this when someone is in the process of cutting your throat. Trust me by the time it registered to the pilots what was going on it was already to late to do anything.

As for your little fantasy about remote takeover it is just that, a fantasy.

Originally posted by Boone 870

originally posted by ULTIMA1
If you will acknowledge there is no evidence of the hijackers getting acess to the keys.

I admit that there is no evidence of the hijackers using keys. Also, I admit that there is no evidence of the hijackers kicking the doors in.

Just as there is no evidence of a remote takeover.

Originally posted by AMTMAN
In order to select a code the pilot has to turn and reach to the side and then make four seperate motions.

So your stating that none of the 8 pilots had about 4 seconds to set the codes?

It takes less then 4 seconds to set the code. Are you saying it took the hijackers less the 4 seconds to get in to the cockpit? Do you have evidence of this?

Also it only takes 1 second to key the mike and call for help.

[edit on 25-11-2007 by ULTIMA1]

reply to post by ULTIMA1


As I have said before, there is no way to know if the hijackers used keys to unlock the cockpit doors.

What I have said is, that there are keys in the passenger cabin that the hijackers could have used.

Originally posted by Boone 870
What I have said is, that there are keys in the passenger cabin that the hijackers could have used.

So would you say that the 8 pilots had more or less then 4 seconds to get off a call or signal before the hijackers were in the cockpits?

reply to post by ULTIMA1


So, ULTIMA1,

You lied when you said the following?

Originally posted by ULTIMA1

Originally posted by Boone 870
Will you acknowledge the fact that there were cockpit door keys on the aircraft?

If you will acknowledge there is no evidence of the hijackers getting acess to the keys.

You said you acknowledge the fact that there were cockpit door keys on the aircraft. Boone held up his end...and you backed down and will not acknowledge?

How can someone debate you on this if you cannot hold up your end?

Originally posted by Disclosed
You said you acknowledge the fact that there were cockpit door keys on the aircraft.

Ok, so their were keys on the aircraft. BUT no evidence they were used.

Now, can you prove to me that the hijackers got in to the cockpits in less then 4 seconds to stop the 8 pilots from getting off a call or signal?

Becasue in less the hijackers got into the cockpits in under 4 seconds the 8 pilots would have time to get off a call or signal.







[edit on 25-11-2007 by ULTIMA1]

originally posted by ULTIMA1
So would you say that the 8 pilots had more or less then 4 seconds to get off a call or signal before the hijackers were in the cockpits?

Before they got in the cockpit? I would say they had all the time in the world.

After they got into the cockpits? I would say less than two seconds.

How much do you know about commerical aircraft? Reading your inane rants I'm guessing not much. The original OP is a bunch of garbage, pure and simple. If you knew anything about commercial aricraft you would know the whole idea of a remote takeover of a 757 or 767 is nothing more than a parnoid fantasy.

its one thing to dismiss someones statements with the support of facts and quite another to do so without any explanation...

Originally posted by Boone 870
After they got into the cockpits? I would say less than two seconds.

So how long would you say it took them to get into the cockpit, i mean if they did not have a key. And remember how long it took the passengers of flight 93 to get int to the cockpit with a cart.

Tell me, are the pilots going to sit and do nothing while the cockpit door is being forced or are they going to be making calls?

Originally posted by Animal
If you knew anything about commercial aricraft you would know the whole idea of a remote takeover of a 757 or 767 is nothing more than a parnoid fantasy.

So you do know the autopilot on a 757 or 767 can be preprogrammed?

Do you also know there are sytems that can remote control a plane?

So you do know that you can disconnect the autopilot by simply pushing a button, or pulling a circuit breaker don't you? Or that you can reprogram it in flight, don't you?

Originally posted by Zaphod58
So you do know that you can disconnect the autopilot by simply pushing a button, or pulling a circuit breaker don't you?

Yes, but did the hijackers know that?

Well let's see, they had their commercial ratings, so they did some basic work with autopilots, so that's a yes. They had their commercial rating, so they had to know some basic information about circuit breakers, so that's a yes. Circuit breaker panels are labeled with what each breaker does, so that's a yes.

Here's a picture of what an aircraft circuit breaker panel looks like. What's that one say? Right under Flight Systems? First one on the left?



Sure looks like that says "Auto Pilot" to me. Boy THAT was hard to find.

originally posted by ULTIMA1
So how long would you say it took them to get into the cockpit, i mean if they did not have a key. And remember how long it took the passengers of flight 93 to get int to the cockpit with a cart.

However long it would take them to give the door one good kick.

originally posted by ULTIMA1
Tell me, are the pilots going to sit and do nothing while the cockpit door is being forced or are they going to be making calls?

Not if the hijackers were fast.

This person is talking about the new reinforced doors.

Based on the design specifications for the strength of these doors, while they may well be bulletproof, they are probably not person-proof.A moderately heavy man could run up to the cockpit door, throw himself against it, and burst it open

Source

They didn't all have commercial ratings...wromg. Mosyt could not rent a Cessna so please..Ultima! makes a salient point: Even IF ALL FOUR sets of highjackers had keys allegedly kept by certain crew members, they would SURELY have had time to push the button on the yoke that activates the mike. Forget the transponder and 4 seconds..try less than a second to press the button and alert the ATC that something was wromng. But no.

No calls from any plane: Some possibility that a mike was keyed on ONE flight only and that could well have been a part of the plan also. But we should have FOUR sets of tapes of pilots yelling their heads off as ' attackers ' slashed and fought and supposedly with 100% sucess in all FOUR cases but all there is, is silence. When you listen to the tape of Flt. 93 talking to Cleveland tower, there are only a few seconds at most between the last transmission and total dead air. No mike keyed and a yell..nothing.

Remote taking is the ONLY rational way to explain that.

originally posted by eyewitness 86

They didn't all have commercial ratings...wromg. Mosyt could not rent a Cessna so please..

You're right, Ziad Jarrah did not have a commercial license. However, he did have simulator time.

Most could not rent a Cessna? You're absolutely wrong about that. Hani Hanjour was refused one time. The person that refused to rent him the aircraft said later,“There’s no doubt in my mind that once [Flight 77] got going, he could have pointed that plane at a building and hit it.”

Originally posted by Boone 870
This person is talking about the new reinforced doors.

But why then did it take the passengers of Flight 93 a cart to try break down the cockpit door?

So again your stating it took the hijackers less the 4 seconds to get into the cockpit and subdue the pilots on all 4 aircraft?

reply to post by eyewitness86


Care to put money on that? Hani Hanjour, the pilot that they said couldn't even fly a Cessna was a certified commercial pilot. He lost his license after six months when he failed to show up for an FAA mandated physical.

In the middle of their training, in late September, Atta and Alshehhi enroll at another flight school, in nearby Sarasota. However, they are soon asked to leave it, and return to Huffman in October (see Late September-Early October 2000). While Atta and Alshehhi attend Huffman Aviation, another of the alleged hijackers, Ziad Jarrah, is taking lessons at a flight school just down the road from them (see (June 28-December 2000)). Yet no reports describe the three ever meeting up while they are all in Venice. According to official accounts, Atta and Alshehhi complete their schooling at Huffman on December 19, 2000, when they take their commercial pilot license tests. Rudi Dekkers says that after returning to the school to settle their bills, they leave and are never seen there again.

www.cooperativeresearch.org...

There are three right there.

Hani Hanjour, the Saudi pilot who flew American Airlines flight 77 into the Pentagon, "had lived in the United States off and on throughout the 1990s, mostly in Arizona, intermittently taking flying lessons at several different flying schools." He was, in the view of one of his flight instructors, "intelligent, friendly, and 'very courteous, very formal,' a nice enough fellow but a terrible pilot." He finally got a commercial license from the FAA but was unable to find work here or in the Middle East.

www.washingtonpost.com...

And there's four. Atta started out with a private pilot license and continued training to get his commercial rating. The other three all got both through several flight schools.

Jarrah DID have his commercial rating. They won't say where he got it, but the FTTC instructor said in many interviews that he was supposed to return to the school and complete his commercial rating, but he when he didn't return, the instructor found out that he had already gotten his rating.

[edit on 11/25/2007 by Zaphod58]