US Military Funds Geneticist Searching for DNA "So Dangerous It Does Not Exist"

Originally posted by soficrow
Back to the original question:

Why "look" for DNA dangerous to life unless the intent is to sequence it for military use?

Anyone here have any answers? Speculations?

This is what makes a few of us scratch our heads The military has it's sights set for this for a real nasty reason I'm sure. This has that Scifi movie " SS Doom trooper" all over it. I don't want to sound to out there but I swear the back story on Resident evil sounds just like this. When you start altering DNA code you are tampering with nature. I'm all for DNA research and finding ways to "help" man kind not splice in death codes that will do who only knows what?

[edit on 6-1-2007 by tsloan]

Why "look" for DNA dangerous to life unless the intent is to sequence it for military use?

They say "dangerous to life", but, what if it is the opposite. What if it is the cure for what they have done. If they could analyze the DNA of Jesus they surely would. They are looking for what some call "the God gene" in order to eradicate any chance people have of circumventing their ill deeds.

Originally posted by GT100FV
You do realize that folks at USAMRID do all sorts of research on harmful viruses/diseases, so that they can then work on countermeasures in the event they are used against us. Of course that's not nearly as interesting as military bashing.

The only problem with that theory is that the "disease" they are looking for doesn't exist in nature or in any foreign arsenal.

They straight out admitted that one of the potential uses was to create a "suicide gene" that could be used to destroy genetically modified creatures if they proved dangerous.

It's an extremely small and extremely logical step to apply that admitted mechanism in other possible contexts, especially since we're presently nowhere near having the technology to custom make our own creatures.

It is a fact that this technology could easily be used to put a "kill switch" in any living thing you had designed it for as easily as spreading a viral vector.


Edit to add: Let's consider the non-genocide options though, if it makes people happy. They're still fairly bad.

You could make a plague that you could shut off on a whim I suppose breed millions of a harmful insect such as locusts, termites, africanized bees, or whatever suits your purposes, unleash them on a given area for political reasons, then kill off the swarm when it was no longer needed.

Great way to start wars really- there's nothing like a plague of locusts going hog wild on crops to highten tensions between neighboring tribes who never liked eachother anyway- could be very useful in Africa, don't you think?

Then of course there's an idea I had some time ago- fairly elementary really, just far ahead of the state of genetic technology at present- you could create an organizism to metabolize rubbers, which are afterall organic compounds and disperse it over enemy troops as a non-lethal bioweapon- every bushing and hose in their vehicles and fuel depots becomes useless, their NBC gear rots, which should scare the hell out of them, etc.... only problem is that without a suicide gene such an organism would destroy modern life.

[edit on 6-1-2007 by The Vagabond]

A-You are assuming that we are the only one's doing DNA research, and on infectious agents.

B-you wouldn't need to develop genetic materials to degrade rubber, that would "destroy" life on Earth. There are plenty of chemical compounds that break down rubber.

C-The USA no longer has chemical/biological weapons, nor would it use them. The policy would be a nuclear response if we had to retaliate against a WMD attack from another nation.

D-You're assuming that the research is for an evil purpose, without exploring any other possibilities.

Thing is, genes mutate.

Some scientists think that's one of the biggest problem we face - accelerated rates of mutation.

What if - the military creates a bioweapon to kill off all the Arab Muslims, or Chinese, but it mutates into forms that kill other races too?

What if - the military creates a killer gene targeted to malaria-bearing mosquitoes, carried on a common virus - but the "suicide gene" doesn't work - and the bug somehow mutates and hybridizes into a super-malaria-hemorraghic fever disease?

Schtuff happens.

The potentials here are astounding. And astoundingly scary.

The military isn't developing, nor would it use bioweapons. If we just wanted to wipe out Arabs, a few ICBMs are more than up to that task.
We didn't use them in WW2, Korea, Vietnam, and we took a lot more casualties there, so why are you so sure that the motives are genocide?

Originally posted by GT100FV

... why are you so sure that the motives are genocide?

Pardon me?

I hardly think anything I said could be construed as anything other than speculation - and both statements referred to earlier comments.

Aside from that:

The US Military has a long history of not only developing bioweapons, but manufacturing them AND using them to experiment on uninformed American civilians, as well as uninformed military personnel - without consent.

But BTW - I do know that US Military scientists and doctors have made some GREAT contributions to modern medicine - and that the bioweapons division is a completely different department.

I also know that political oversight directs the Military. ...If you want a thread dedicated to defending the US Military in all its capacities - feel free to start one.

This thread is about the search for "DNA that is incompatible with life" - and invites speculation on how such material might be used.


.


sp

[edit on 6-1-2007 by soficrow]

This is my take at it, the whole idea for the research is base in that Greag Hampikian is going to compare all sort of DNA sequences to in the DNA database to find if any of them do not exist in nature.

Now that seems harmless enough, but when you get the US department of Defense interested enough to award 1 million dollar grant them it sounds like it could be some hidden interest and that can open the door to any type of research if the Genetics gurus actually find something.

Now we know that radiation damage DNA and can make DNA mutate into becoming incompatible to the point to kill plants and human life.

I mean itsn’t too much damage (or mutations) to the DNA can be incompatible with life and cause death.

Will this be what they are looking for it?

How can DNA mutate into been dangerous to life, in case of a radiation poisoning?

Marg - The researchers are specifically looking for the sequences that destroy life:

"There must be some DNA or protein sequences that are not compatible with life, perhaps because they bind some essential cellular component, for example, and have therefore been selected out of circulation. There may also be some that are lethal in some species, but not others. We're looking for those sequences."

My questions:

What can they possibly do with these sequences, besides create bioweapons?

So actually the interest here is to separate whatever they find into sequences and once that is done is easier to do anything with them.

Be for the good of mankind of just for biological weapons.

scary

In my opinion, several scenarios exisit. Who will govern the endless possible results, which could mean extracting good for self serving reasons, or, extracting aggression to make one more civil, manipulation to stroke ones ego and what about mixing alien (no DNA) with DNA, then there could be trading DNA and humanity slips into a non-returning, unrecoverable, no going back to downward descent.

Maybe it didn't stop with Hitler.

The DNA Bomb
Modified Crops are In the Crosshairs Now. You May Be Next.
by Erik Baard

May 16 - 22, 2001

This is the doomsday scenario: Assassins seek to take down a world leader, but they won't need to risk using bullets or bombs. Instead, they stand on a receiving line and shake the leader's hand, coming away with a genetic sample—a fleck of skin, a stray hair—that reveals his secret vulnerabilities. Then they engineer a pathogen that will attack only the dignitary. The next time he addresses a crowd, one terrorist simply coughs, releasing the pathogen-loaded virus into the air. It circulates silently, a contagion harmless to all but its target. Within hours, the leader is dead.

www.villagevoice.com...

Dr Dean Hamer, the director of the Gene Structure and Regulation Unit at the National Cancer Institute in America, asked volunteers 226 questions in order to determine how spiritually connected they felt to the universe. The higher their score, the greater a person's ability to believe in a greater spiritual force and, Dr Hamer found, the more likely they were to share the gene, VMAT2

www.telegraph.co.uk... /

Altering DNA.....Good or Bad...Right or Wrong!
If we alter ourselves we can never go back.
Is this right?
what could we build?
How clever can we make our brain?
How big an organism can we build?
will this end humanity as we know it?
Can we build an organism to travel through space and tell us what it is like?
How big can an inteligent mind be?
Good or bad...Right or wrong?
What are we capeable of?

setiathome.berkeley.edu...

Specifically, Louis has isolated strange, thick-walled, red-tinted cell-like structures about 10 microns in size. Stranger still, dozens of his experiments suggest that the particles may lack DNA yet still reproduce plentifully, even in water superheated to nearly 600˚F. (The known upper limit for life in water is about 250˚F.)

www.popsci.com...

Mod Edit: Link Truncation, BB Code.


[edit on 7/1/2007 by Mirthful Me]

You're obviously not paying attention GT, but I'm gonna try this one more time just incase I'm talking over your head.

Originally posted by GT100FV
A-You are assuming that we are the only one's doing DNA research, and on infectious agents.

What will we get from creating such DNA which is quite possibly different from one our enemies might develop? Studies in the defense against a genetic weapon would more appropriately center on defeating the vector. You need anthrax to study defeating antrax, etc because we're talking about a living organism different from others. DNA on the other hand is essentially the same in structure and weakness, therefore you wouldn't need the "dangerous" DNA to study how to combat it.

B-you wouldn't need to develop genetic materials to degrade rubber, that would "destroy" life on Earth. There are plenty of chemical compounds that break down rubber.

Not the DNA. They suggested using a suicide gene in dangerous synthetic organisms. We happen to know that there are organisms on this planet that can digest all kinds of strange things. Therefore, I am suggesting that it might be militarily useful to genetically engineer a microbe that metabolizes rubber or other essential materials without the nasty side effects of a caustic chemical. The only drawback to this is that the organism would be a threat if it continued to reproduce, hence the utility of a suicide gene in such an engineered organism.

C-The USA no longer has chemical/biological weapons, nor would it use them.

Are you currently the CG at Dugway, or are you taking their word for it?

D-You're assuming that the research is for an evil purpose, without exploring any other possibilities.

Hmm, the positive side of genetic research being carried out by an organization which is charged with the swift and efficient destruction of any human beings who become our enemies... I'll have to get back to you on that one... well, besides the obvious one- that it's presumably intended for our enemies rather than us, although I don't trust them to get it right.

Some other possibilities(some of which have been alluded to)
fighting diseases-if you can figure out the DNA sequence to kill infectious diseases, that might be worthwhile as a NBC countermeasure eh? Or even just for the benefit of mankind, in treating illnesses.

The military's mission is to be able to protect the country and win wars. If we were merely interested in mass casualties, we could do a lot better than we have been doing. Why send in ground troops at all, when we could just carpet bomb every inhabited area in Iraq(and with nukes we could get the body counts much higher than with bio or chem.)
Apparently no research can be done that doesn't have some evil ulterior motive, and everything is just lies and disinformation. Perhaps folks who do serve have some insight, that neophytes don't have, and get rankled when they hear pretty unflattering speculation.

Give it 10 years and this stuff will be showing up as a white powder in envelopes addressed to Democrats in the senate.

I'm not just trying to be contrary- our army has a track record when it comes to this stuff. Even when they try to help, they usually kill somebody. Gulf war syndrome ring any bells, you know Nerve Agent Pyridostigmine Prevention System?

I've had all sorts of vaccinations, and never developed in medical conditions, nor have I worked with anyone in the last 14 years who has either. I think the jury may still be out on the exact cause of the Gulf War illnesses. Don't think I'm not interested though, as I want to make sure I avoid whatever the source was.

Originally posted by The Vagabond
Give it 10 years and this stuff will be showing up as a white powder in envelopes addressed to Democrats in the senate.

So this is a Republican program, to wipe out Democrats?

Originally posted by The Vagabond

The only problem with that theory is that the "disease" they are looking for doesn't exist in nature or in any foreign arsenal.

They straight out admitted that one of the potential uses was to create a "suicide gene" that could be used to destroy genetically modified creatures if they proved dangerous.

nifty idea, in theory, the reality is very different, though, that's why i don't take these overly optimistic predictions and roadmaps very seriously anymore.

consider This Case

GMOs have a life of their own and most people just don't want to know it so they simply don't look. testing is usually very limited and does not test the entire inserted sequence (let alone the entire genome) while proteins, lipids and sugars (the final product, the DNA is after all just the blueprint) remain ignored.

no doubt it's going to be a dangerous affair, but mainly due to unpredictable side effects and mutations. so far, the promises of commercial GMOs haven't materialized, what makes you think this new&hyped 'product' will be any different?

enough to inflict a great deal of harm, that's for sure, but you don't need fancy germs to do that, as the 20th century has shown so clearly .

Very worrying indeed and not unlike much research in this area for many years... just think eugenics and hitler...

another ats thread on this topic :

ATS DNA Thread

regards

Elf

Thanks for your contributions everyone.

Seems we can think of many nefarious applications for this technology - but no specific positive applications.



Or did I miss something?

Originally posted by MischeviousElf
Very worrying indeed and not unlike much research in this area for many years... just think eugenics and hitler...

another ats thread on this topic :

ATS DNA Thread

Thanks Elf. ...I did include the link to a1ex' thread in the opening article. ...I got an email in RL about this topic, but held up my submission for a1ex, who posted on it first.