HAARP video... omg you MUST watch this!

Eastlund's patent can be read in full here:

www.bariumblues.com...

Also a article of interest here:

www.spinspace.com...

Unfortunately, what is lacking, is any evidence that HAARP can or has done any of the things it's supposed by some to be capable of. Indeed, evidence that it's even capable of such things.

After all, I can patent an idea for weather control. I can build a device based on that idea. And I can then claim that my device works and - to prove it refer to numerous severe weather events which I claim I caused. Would you believe me?

The only difference between my hypothetical device and HAARp is that whilst I claim it can control the weather, those who built and operate HAARP claim no such thing...

Originally posted by Essan
Eastlund's patent can be read in full here:
Unfortunately, what is lacking, is any evidence that HAARP can or has done any of the things it's supposed by some to be capable of. Indeed, evidence that it's even capable of such things.

Supposed by some? Do you mean Eastlund?

The answer to your last question is No, I wouldn't believe your claims about a weather control device. UNLESS the US military gets involved in its building, that is. Then I might take it more seriously, reasoning that they might not be too keen on involvement if it didn't.

Look, if HAARP cannot affect the weather, then the WHOLE concept doesn't work. Meaning that electron cyclotron resonant heating is NOT able to heat up large areas of the ionosphere, which in turn would NOT cause large depressions to form extremely rapidly. If this was the case all that money would have been wasted and HAARP would never have been power-upgraded. Twice.

Can I ask, Essan. What do you think HAARP does, then? Merely crate man-made aurorae?

Originally posted by Karilla

Look, if HAARP cannot affect the weather, then the WHOLE concept doesn't work. Meaning that electron cyclotron resonant heating is NOT able to heat up large areas of the ionosphere, which in turn would NOT cause large depressions to form extremely rapidly. If this was the case all that money would have been wasted and HAARP would never have been power-upgraded. Twice.

If that's what it's supposed to do, someone's been wasting a lot of money.

I'm unaware of any research suggesting that any 'heating' of the ionosphere can have any impact of the formation of depressions (though I'll happily be proved wrong ) or, indeed, have any other short term impact on weather systems. Although, interestingly, there is research suggestion that gravity waves produced by tropical cyclones may affect the ionosphere.

www.cosis.net...

Can I ask, Essan. What do you think HAARP does, then? Merely crate man-made aurorae?

My guess it that it's related to the work of Pedersen etal 2003

Altering the direction of radio waves can heat the ionosphere and create effects that can help researchers better understand of the Earth's atmospheric boundary. Pedersen et al. observed a bright spot of "airglow" when a strong radio-wave transmitter's beam was pointed parallel to the Earth's magnetic field. Such a glowing effect results from electrons excited by the interaction between high-powered waves and the planet's ionosphere. The authors found that the bright spot from the parallel signal was at least ten times brighter than transmissions in other directions during their experiment in Alaska. Currently, most high-powered radio beams
are directed vertically, regardless of their orientation relative to the planetary magnetic field. In such cases, the waves generally either bounce off the ionosphere or pass through it without exciting the electrons. The researchers conclude that the energy transfer to the ionosphere can be increased and the power of radio wave
transmitters can be boosted by exploiting the Earth's magnetic field.

www.agu.org...

[edit on 9-5-2007 by Essan]

Originally posted by Karilla

Look, if HAARP cannot affect the weather, then the WHOLE concept doesn't work. Meaning that electron cyclotron resonant heating is NOT able to heat up large areas of the ionosphere, which in turn would NOT cause large depressions to form extremely rapidly. If this was the case all that money would have been wasted and HAARP would never have been power-upgraded. Twice.

Can I ask, Essan. What do you think HAARP does, then? Merely crate man-made aurorae?

It does a lot of things, most of them pure research. Most of it's the research you see on the site.

They've declassified the ELF parts using the electrojet since that's no longer used by subs - no weather mods there - and they also partly declassified the electron precipitation function in 2005, if I recall the date. Mostly because they're moving that to satellites, I expect. That uses electron cyclotron resonance, but not to "heat up large areas of the ionosphere". No weather mods there either.

None of the other undocumented functions I know of are for doing weather modifications. From your first sentence, it seems that you are so focused on HAARP being Dr Evil's weather device that if it is used for other functions, you think it is a failure. It couldn't be farther from the truth. The problem here is that you seem to be overfocused on Eastlund's patents and you're not looking at the rest of the picture. Try thinking of it strictly as a device used to research the attainment of traditional strategic and tactical military goals instead of sci-fi disasters/wormholes/anti-UFO beams and you might get closer.

HAARP was never meant to be anything but a research station. The total power output even after the upgrades isn't anywhere near enough to do most of the effects in Eastlund's patent. In fact, the overall design was built for flexibility but it isn't optimal for some functions. There are, for example, specialized test facilities for forming plasma mirrors for OTH comms and radar that have been testing for some time now. HAARP can't do that to any extent due to various limitations, but some of the experimental data needed to design the other installation was gathered by HAARP.

If it were a tactical or strategic installation, you'd see a lot more security than it has, and you most likely wouldn't be getting guided tours.

You are also focused on the U.of Alaska's site. I beleive you are right about what they are doing. Its public and generally safe. We do not have any information on what if anything the military has done with this technology at thier site.

www.youtube.com...
www.youtube.com...
www.youtube.com...
www.youtube.com...
Nikola Tesla: The Missing Secrets 1-4
even mentions haarp. tesla was cool.

Hi Everyone,

I'm not to sure if this is related however, after searching i was not able to find that many active threads about HAARP and so thought it would make more sense to post it here.

Recently, i have been doing a bit of digging around the company QinetiQ which, obviously has involved me searching their website and other related documents.

Whilst digging around on their website i came across several pages that refer to "CPAR" The Centre for RF Propagation and Atmospheric Research.

I also noticed that it directly refers to one of the applications of this technology as being "Ionospheric Heating", shown on this page.

www.cpar.qinetiq.com...

I also noticed that the page/s refer to ELF and VLF waves, Submarine Communication and what seems to be two small/medium antenna arrays, which if i remember correctly, these terms are also associated with HAARP.

With my entire knowledge of HAARP consisting of only two days reading i dont think that i am ready to start refering to myself as an expert on this, lol. This did make me very curious though.

I was hoping to get feedback from anyone who has knowledge in this area who could advise me if this device/project is similar to HAARP and/or could it serve the same purpose.

Before posting, i did do a quick search on ATS for the term CPAR (just to check if this has already been mentioned) and have not been able to find any references to it so please accept my apologies if this has been discussed on ATS before.

Thank you,

Dal

Originally posted by chroot
Hi Everyone,

I'm not to sure if this is related however, after searching i was not able to find that many active threads about HAARP and so thought it would make more sense to post it here.

Recently, i have been doing a bit of digging around the company QinetiQ which, obviously has involved me searching their website and other related documents.

Whilst digging around on their website i came across several pages that refer to "CPAR" The Centre for RF Propagation and Atmospheric Research.

I also noticed that it directly refers to one of the applications of this technology as being "Ionospheric Heating", shown on this page.

www.cpar.qinetiq.com...

I also noticed that the page/s refer to ELF and VLF waves, Submarine Communication and what seems to be two small/medium antenna arrays, which if i remember correctly, these terms are also associated with HAARP.

With my entire knowledge of HAARP consisting of only two days reading i dont think that i am ready to start refering to myself as an expert on this, lol. This did make me very curious though.

I was hoping to get feedback from anyone who has knowledge in this area who could advise me if this device/project is similar to HAARP and/or could it serve the same purpose.

Before posting, i did do a quick search on ATS for the term CPAR (just to check if this has already been mentioned) and have not been able to find any references to it so please accept my apologies if this has been discussed on ATS before.

Thank you,

Dal

Hi there Dal,


I work for QinetiQ and can help fill in the blanks for you.
please get in touch with me, i am not willing to post info here on a public board , but please feel free to email me privately.
[snip]
thanks

take care

snoopyuk

Consider this amazing video flagged

I'm trying not to be paranoid or anything, but what was someone working for the Centre for RF Propagation doing surfing this web site and looking for anything on CPAR?

Anyway, they appear to be a commercial outgrowth from the original technology the Americans and Russians have been exploring for several decades. What is termed CCC environment.

But I could be wrong. Appearences can be deceiving.

Originally posted by Red_Dog_BOM
I'm trying not to be paranoid or anything, but what was someone working for the Centre for RF Propagation doing surfing this web site and looking for anything on CPAR?

Is that bad? I don't work for QinetiQ - but I do a lot of classified design work for somewhat similar projects as a second tier contractor.

QinetiQ rocks. If I were looking to move back to Europe I'd probably interview.

We're trying to do some design now with direct-digital synthesized acoustic steered-beam arrays with some interesting tricks, it's superficially similar to doing the same thing with HF.

Sort of like a sonar AESA.

Terrible innit - to think that someone connected with an organisation that amongst many other things has a dept looking into ways of improving radio communications should actually read this website!!!!!!

Originally posted by bearindown
Well if what the members are saying here is true, than this may be the scariest revelation in the history of the world regarding defense/attack systems. However, I do agree that if this is that powerful, these scientists are not that dumb, as proven by their development of the technology, and they would know the restraints on the power.

Would they really show restraint? How much restraint has even US scientist ( in a country with so much freedom of speech and all that) go about testing biological weapons on it's own troops when it's not lining them up downwind from atomic explosions? Maybe they will show some restraint when they think there is a 50/50 chance that they might blow up the planet but short of that i have seen good reason to wonder.

I find it hard to believe that people are actually blaming tsunami's and hurricane katrina, which was NOT that strong of a hurricane, on HAARP.

Funny you should say that...

"Q: Let me ask you specifically about last week's scare here in Washington, and what we might have learned from how prepared we are to deal with that (inaudible), at B'nai Brith.

A: Well, it points out the nature of the threat. It turned out to be a false threat under the circumstances. But as we've learned in the intelligence community, we had something called -- and we have James Woolsey here to perhaps even address this question about phantom moles. The mere fear that there is a mole within an agency can set off a chain reaction and a hunt for that particular mole which can paralyze the agency for weeks and months and years even, in a search. The same thing is true about just the false scare of a threat of using some kind of a chemical weapon or a biological one. There are some reports, for example, that some countries have been trying to construct something like an Ebola Virus, and that would be a very dangerous phenomenon, to say the least. Alvin Toeffler has written about this in terms of some scientists in their laboratories trying to devise certain types of pathogens that would be ethnic specific so that they could just eliminate certain ethnic groups and races; and others are designing some sort of engineering, some sort of insects that can destroy specific crops. Others are engaging even in an eco- type of terrorism whereby they can alter the climate, set off earthquakes, volcanoes remotely through the use of electromagnetic waves."

So there are plenty of ingenious minds out there that are at work finding ways in which they can wreak terror upon other nations. It's real, and that's the reason why we have to intensify our efforts, and that's why this is so important.

DoD News Briefing
Secretary of Defense William S. Cohen

Again, my attitude is, if it's not going exactly right, we're going to make it go exactly right. If there's problems, we're going to address the problems. And that's what I've come down to assure people of. And again, I want to thank everybody.

And I'm not looking forward to this trip. I got a feel for it when I flew over before. It -- for those who have not -- trying to conceive what we're talking about, it's as if the entire Gulf Coast were obliterated by a -- the worst kind of weapon you can imagine. And now we're going to go try to comfort people in that part of the world.

Thank you. (Applause.)

END 10:39 A.M. CDT

www.whitehouse.gov...

So did he just say something 'stupid' or did he simply tell us more than he intended to OR , god forbid, was he being honest in his own almost presidential type of way?

Listen, New Orleans was going to be nailed by a hurricane of that strength eventually.

Actually they had to reduce the federal budget for the levies by massive amounts to ensure their failure, they had to shut down the pumping stations to extract water and at best sabotaged the repair effort during the storm. Then there are obviously those reports of exploding earthworks...

So maybe NO never had a chance in the long run but i wonder why they had to involve themselves to such a degree ( i'm after all typing up these things from main stream sources) that we would find out.

We, the citizens, and the government, knew of the restrictions on the levies strength and played the role of the typical procrastinating individual.

That's true but once again the levies held up in the past and there never has been such a severe cut back in funds for it's maintenance.

Tsunami's do occur as well. My guess is that in the history of the world those were not the strongest tsunami's ever to hit those particular islands.

That may be true but underwater earthquakes do not cause massive Tsunami's and especially not in the way they said it did. I am not sure how much HAARP was involved ( it's easier with nuclear or similar weapons) but the fact that the US got so many ships and troops there so quickly tells me a whole lot. Why the commander of the task force ( marine assault vessel just happen to manned and ready 'waiting' so near to Chrismas with many more marines than is standard ) were also in charge of the capture of Baghdad is any one's guess and why a certain Sgt said they had been preparing all year for a 'humanitarian mission' is even stranger. Why the Indonesians measured the quake intensity at between 6 and 7 while CNN and BBC got it at 9 or more is odd. Why there were no aftershocks or damage to the structures in Indonesia before the tsunami's hit ( amateur video) is a open question. Why there has never been registered Tsunami's in the bay of Bengal is a indication of even more strangeness.

I could go on....

Now, may HAARP have played into the hands of global warming, perhaps, I'm not a scientist so I, admittedly, do not know. Did global warming possibly help create these tsunami's, or hurricanes, possibly.

No they did not and you can ask just about any of those so called experts; even they have some credibility to maintain after all.

But the relation can be no more than a friend at a bar buying you a drink, then you drive home and kill someone on your home because you got drunk; as HAARP is not soley responsible for global warming.

I don't believe ( and it's basically a question of faith as far as i can tell from comparing the data from different scientist and groups) in global warming and if it turns out that we are in fact having some if i have seen plenty of facts showing us that it's not a bad idea to have some. With HAARP and similar technologies we are now probably able to affect global weather patterns in deterministic ways and can certainly do so on continental scales.

To say so is actually irresponsible, as we have to admit our own mistakes, and fix our own mistakes before we can look at someone else to correct theirs.

There is always time to do introspection later but for now i can assure you that you are not the problem and that we should all be looking at those who are pretending to act in our interest in the positions we have given them in good faith. Whatever your crimes or failures you could go a long way in redeeming yourself by exposing and acting against those who commit such crimes on continental scales.

Stellar

Originally posted by Tom Bedlam
Once you discover that "Dr" Nick Begich is a "doctor" of homeopathy (you'll notice they never bring THAT up) you will get an idea of just how far you can believe him.

So now you get to decide what sciences are in fact sciences? Why do you think one should not be able to get a doctorate in traditional medicine? Do you think tha the 'dr' part makes him instantly believable and if so why do you hold such stupid views? Are you scared that the people who normally believes governmeny propaganda might be distracted by other 'dr's saying what they wish?

That book of his is a travesty.

It's a travesty that so much truth can be so easily documented by even a guy without a 'proper' PHD. At some stage one must ask what the so called intelligence people with proper degrees are doing or for that matter NOT doing.

I got fed up with it one day and wrote one of my trademark long spews on RINF, they banned me and deleted it, but I've still got it.

It's way too long to post here, though.

Long post's rarely put me off so go ahead and stun us with your brilliant insights into what HAARP can not do.

Originally posted by Tom Bedlam
The whole "HAARP causes earthquakes" thing is wrong. You might as well expect your local TV station to cause earthquakes, some of them have more total output and/or higher ERP than the Gakona array.

Which one's have a higher ERP than HAARP does? As i understand federal regulations do not allow them to get anywhere close? These FM stations can also not focus their energy the way HAARP can. Are you familiar with wireless energy transmission and the fact that such energy can and will build up in any given area when focus can be maintained?

Be as specific as you can as i think i will be a spending some time on this thread.

Stellar

[edit on 25-5-2007 by StellarX]

This is a cool story and video. But something about it seems to be fake (Not that Haarp is fake, but that the video seems fake).

If you had a very controversial, potentially scary experiment going on would you have those 2 "scientists" acting as your spokesmen?

When they responded to the statement made by the woman (Biophysicist), where she said humans are made of energy, or contain energy those Haarp "scientists" responded in a weird way. Almost dismissing what the Biophysicist said as non-science. Could they really not be aware that all mass contains energy, anything that has mass contains energy, including the molecules and atoms that humans are made of. E=MC2 ?

If it's real, we're in big trouble... Not because I beleive that Haarp is automatically evil, but because they have some very questionable people working on it.

I would think that if the government, or CIA really wanted ease our concerns they would have much smoother, attractive, smart people acting as the spokesmen on a video production.

Also, I believe that if they had the capability to do these weird things to the earth they would have already done it.

If they're using it in ways that Tesla intended maybe good things will come from it. It was scary thinking about what Tesla was about to do before they stopped him at Wardenclyffe, but his intentions were good.

Originally posted by Electro38
If you had a very controversial, potentially scary experiment going on would you have those 2 "scientists" acting as your spokesmen?

When they responded to the statement made by the woman (Biophysicist), where she said humans are made of energy, or contain energy those Haarp "scientists" responded in a weird way. Almost dismissing what the Biophysicist said as non-science. Could they really not be aware that all mass contains energy, anything that has mass contains energy, including the molecules and atoms that humans are made of. E=MC2 ?

You have to look at what they said from a physicist/engineering point of view.

I sort of remember that exchange, it was a little tough because the copy I watched had the sound and video about 30 seconds off from each other and I just gave up about halfway through.

But as I recall, the "biophysicist" said something fairly nonsensical and new-agey about some energy pervading all living things (it was nonsense) and the guy said "I don't even know what that means".

The issue was that what she said made no sense, the way she said it. She was using scientific terms but not in a way that actually applied. That's not uncommon among these guys, they take terms that sound neat and all science-y but then mish-mosh them all together in ways that don't fit. You see a lot of it in that video.

Originally posted by Red_Dog_BOM
I'm trying not to be paranoid or anything, but what was someone working for the Centre for RF Propagation doing surfing this web site and looking for anything on CPAR?

Anyway, they appear to be a commercial outgrowth from the original technology the Americans and Russians have been exploring for several decades. What is termed CCC environment.

But I could be wrong. Appearences can be deceiving.

Why do you think that its only the US and Russia that has been exploring these things?. Dont underestimate us sunshine!

Originally posted by StellarX
So now you get to decide what sciences are in fact sciences? Why do you think one should not be able to get a doctorate in traditional medicine? Do you think tha the 'dr' part makes him instantly believable and if so why do you hold such stupid views?

Because he's trying to pawn himself off as having a doctorate in a relevant field. And, no, I don't consider homeopathy to be science. I'm also pretty much not into Atlantis, fairies in the garden, orgone or the blue crystals giving you good luck.

Are you scared that the people who normally believes governmeny propaganda might be distracted by other 'dr's saying what they wish?

No, what's "scary", if you can call it that, is that people are credulous enough to buy into the "HAARP lore" without question.

It's a travesty that so much truth can be so easily documented by even a guy without a 'proper' PHD. At some stage one must ask what the so called intelligence people with proper degrees are doing or for that matter NOT doing.

There's not much in the way of truth in the book. Even if you're not techically savvy, a bit of critical reading would lead you to many of the same conclusions.

Long post's rarely put me off so go ahead and stun us with your brilliant insights into what HAARP can not do.

No, it's really long. Probably 4 maximum posts. If you really want it, I'll u2u it to you after I get back from vacation. Hint - go look up some of his "experts", I especially like his use of "Dr" Daniel Winter.

Which one's have a higher ERP than HAARP does? As i understand federal regulations do not allow them to get anywhere close? These FM stations can also not focus their energy the way HAARP can.

Nope, sorry, there are lots of TV stations with way more ERP than HAARP. Looking in the FCC database, WSRE has about a 3GW ERP.

They do "focus" their output, that is, they use a directional antenna array, although not of the same type as HAARP. Otherwise their ERP would be equivalent to their total output. When you see transmission towers in a group, that's a directional array.

Are you familiar with wireless energy transmission and the fact that such energy can and will build up in any given area when focus can be maintained?

Pfft. No, it doesn't. Does the output of your local TV station "build up" in the downfield antenna footprint? Does your flashlight "build up" light in its "focus" the longer you hold it still?

HAARP is a dirt-plain HF phased array. At least it is from the power amplifiers out to the antenna field. You could buy the same stuff off the shelf and make one, if you had the money. The trick, if such you could call it, is in the exciter and the techniques of using the system.

And, yes, I know you're a "Bearden-phile", so no doubt we'll be treated to a huge cut-and-paste session about scalar crap.


[edit on 31-5-2007 by Tom Bedlam]

Tom, I'm a newbie here, but I completely agree with all of your statements. After reading the stats and official HAARP website, I think it is a relatively harmless device. And yes, the video in question is DEFINITELY presenting information in a misleading manner.

My field is Biomedical Engineering (yes, we make implants and can control people! ), and I will say, without a shadow of a doubt, that the HAARP array as presented CANNOT alter mammalian behavior. If indeed it has the potential to slightly change the magnetic field of the earth, then it can potentially alter BIRD behavior, since it is speculated that birds navigate migratory patterns through the earth's magnetic field. But even then, that's just putting them a few kilos off of their typical summer nesting grounds, right? No real harm done.

Beyond that, any thought that it could mind control is just ridiculous. EMR is no different than visible light (they are one and the same). In a sense, I guess, if it's intense enough it could cause a change in neurotransmitter balance in the brain. That, of course, is the effect that people who never go outside get more depressed than people with regular exposure to sunlight.

NO MIND CONTROL
NO GEOFORMATION
limited, at best, weather control

Originally posted by pondrthis

EMR is no different than visible light (they are one and the same). In a sense, I guess, if it's intense enough it could cause a change in neurotransmitter balance in the brain.

Can you guess why it might have that effect on neurotransmitter balance?
How and why?