air in space i just seen a bbc newsround report

Not quite sure what you mean TechSnow, but I will take it as your acceptance of my statements about air in space.

Due to the lack of responses from my overwhelming case for air in space, I will also assume that we are all finally in agreement on the issue.

The ongoing projects within NASA, the scientific data regarding the ISS, and common sense tells us all that there is indeed air in space and anyone who tells you otherwise is trying to sell you something.

Though I accept your approval of my previous statements, thoughts, pictures, data, links and otherwise, I still would be more than welcome to debate the issue further with anyone who, despite the overwhelming evidence, feels and or thinks otherwise.

Your Pal,
backtoreality

Originally posted by backtoreality
Due to the lack of responses from my overwhelming case for air in space, I will also assume that we are all finally in agreement on the issue.

I do not agree with you about the existence of air in space, maybe that is the reason why you have ignored me 4 times and not show the formula used to calculate the Luminosity of the stars.

The ongoing projects within NASA, the scientific data regarding the ISS, and common sense tells us all that there is indeed air in space and anyone who tells you otherwise is trying to sell you something.

Maybe my sense is not that common, but to me it says that there is no air in space.

Though I accept your approval of my previous statements, thoughts, pictures, data, links and otherwise, I still would be more than welcome to debate the issue further with anyone who, despite the overwhelming evidence, feels and or thinks otherwise.

I did not approve anything of what you said about the existence of air in space, maybe my English is not good enough to make other people understand what I am trying to say, but I will try it once again:

I do not believe that there is air in space.

I also would like to, once again ask you to show us the formula used to calculate the Luminosity of the stars.

If you want to post, I would be grateful, but if you do not want to post that formula and instead you want to ignore my search of knowledge for the fifth time, at least say it, do not just ignore my posts.

Unless you have already put me on "ignore", if that is the case then I guess my question will remain unanswered...

I can agree with you that there is H20 in space but I'm not going as far to say that you can breath it. You could try of course.. but you wouldn't live very long... and you wont die for the same reason as the supposed dogs that were sent into space. Poor pups, had to deal with that awful smell just before they passed out and died.

For those that don't know newsround, it is a 10-minute news show shown during kids TV and aimed at the target age of 11 years old. I just thought it may clarify some thoughts about the OP.

Originally posted by Techsnow
I can agree with you that there is H20 in space but I'm not going as far to say that you can breath it. You could try of course.. but you wouldn't live very long... and you wont die for the same reason as the supposed dogs that were sent into space. Poor pups, had to deal with that awful smell just before they passed out and died.

The problem, of course, with H2O in space is that it is not filtered. You wouldn't want to breath it, but you definitely would not want to taste it. Think about all the junk in space contaminating it and diluting the purity. There also would be no plastic bottle pictures of beautiful mountain scenery with clean water rushing down the side.

Yes, those poor pups died an awful death. I supposed the ones that faired the greatest (=longest) chance of survival would be the dogs that didn't drink too much before the flight so that their bladders were relatively empty; or the ones that had a preexisting bladder problem--much like we see on tv commercials these days. Otherwise, it was the "last meal" that ended up clogging their sinuses and causing a horrible--and very stinky--death. RIP pups.

OK backtoreality, apparently you have me digitally ignored or psychologically ignored.

If that is because of my request for that formula to calculate the Luminosity of the stars that takes into account "the breathable air in space and the effect it has on light from distance stars" and that you "can recite by memory", then I guess that I will need to find somebody else with a little more patience to teach me, some people do not like to teach others.

So, seeing that my question is still unanswered after 42 days, I will make another, maybe someone can enlighten me about this supposed existence of air in space.

If there is air in space, does that air reach all the way to other astronomical bodies, like the Sun?

Originally posted by ArMaP
OK backtoreality, apparently you have me digitally ignored or psychologically ignored.

If that is because of my request for that formula to calculate the Luminosity of the stars that takes into account "the breathable air in space and the effect it has on light from distance stars" and that you "can recite by memory", then I guess that I will need to find somebody else with a little more patience to teach me, some people do not like to teach others.

So, seeing that my question is still unanswered after 42 days, I will make another, maybe someone can enlighten me about this supposed existence of air in space.

If there is air in space, does that air reach all the way to other astronomical bodies, like the Sun?

In the event of an ignore, consider that a bypass.

But I'm quite certain at this point... their presence here is to perpetuate a hoax. In my humble opinion they should get the boot for violating the TOS by knowingly posting false statements.

Originally posted by backtoreality

Originally posted by cmdrkeenkid
Without an O2 supply, you will soon begin to feel the effects of Hypoxia. Why do you think mountain climbers take bottles of O2 with them? If the air was fine up there, would they even need them?

Interesting question. Why don't you ask football players, track stars, basketball players, soccer players, marathon runners, etc, etc, etc.

This is altitude training,were the air is thinner making the lungs adapt to the conditions of lower oxygen,when they return to normal altitude their lungs are stronger and are capable of of greater capacity,making them stronger to combat fatigue.

Sorry if this has been covered already,i read up to page 3 and it was`nt,this debate is one of the most absurd i`ve read here on ATS "more air in space"

Originally posted by evo1981
I truly wonder what John Lear thinka of this thread!

Has anyone asked him yet? Because im sure that one of the most accomplished pilots in the world, not to mention his interest in con's, will have good input into this thread!

John Lear is, going by his posts, a smart guy with a keen sense of humour. I would have thought he'd LOVE this thread, and might even consider helping out Backtoreality, who is now my favourite poster of ANY on this board.

Never has one poster kept so many people so wound up for so long.

And I have to say I'm utterly, utterly shocked at some of the names on this thread who so plainly didn't get it, and who came back, again and again, merely giving Backtoreality more and more opportunity to display his finesse.

BTR, I particularly liked that you mentioned that NASA know how to design windows so there's a through-draught. Their knowledge is awesome!

Edit: thanks to the mods for letting this one run and run!

[edit on 24-9-2006 by rich23]

backtoreality is my hero!!

The funniest thread in ats. I wish he had a paypal account i want to buy him a beer.

Originally posted by gps777
This is altitude training,were the air is thinner making the lungs adapt to the conditions of lower oxygen,when they return to normal altitude their lungs are stronger and are capable of of greater capacity,making them stronger to combat fatigue.

You sure it doesn't have more to do with physically climbing a MOUNTAIN?

Sorry if this has been covered already,i read up to page 3 and it was`nt,this debate is one of the most absurd i`ve read here on ATS "more air in space"

You are sorely mistaken my friend. The title of this tread is actually air in space i just seen a bbc newsround report. The difference is, quite simply, huge. Absolutely, incomprehendably unimaginable. With such a concise, eloquent display of English grammar I am, quite frankly, shaken to the core that you did not quote this masterpiece correctly. Please update your records accordingly.

Originally posted by rich23
BTR, I particularly liked that you mentioned that NASA know how to design windows so there's a through-draught. Their knowledge is awesome!

Thank you for your thoughtful reply rich23.

The following is something that I do not have the expressed written consent of NASA to discuss, though due to your interest I will give you a brief summary leaving out the more top secret items. NASA space shuttle engineers were so incredibly successful with their design of "latching windows" in order to let the cool breeze in that in the early-to-mid 90s they set out to try to take advatage of their engineering marvel. There was a strong debate about what could be done, but after 2.5 years of windtunnel research they decided on "project llimdniw". Starting in the late 90s, flip-down 3ft windmills were added on the crew side of the latching windows, ironically, powering small fans located in the shuttle cockpit. For anyone with basic knowledge of the space shuttle, you will remember that this is directly above where the intense plasma builds up during re-entry (thus the carbon-carbon cone of the shuttle). Intense scrutiny of crew return flight data indicated a 0.8% decrease in perspiration; though the decrease has also been attributed to a change in anti-perspirant/deodorant by some NASA scientists. To this day, the debate rages on, though many astronauts after the design change have been quoted as saying "that's some cool breeze".

Originally posted by leejones
about astranorts doing odd jobs on the space staion, and in the report thay showed the part off the space staion it was blowing around like a ballon ? not by the engines.

This is because of the Solar Wind, not air in space!

Solar wind

A solar wind is a stream of charged particles (i.e., a plasma) which are ejected from the upper atmosphere of a star. When originating from stars other than the Earth's Sun, it is sometimes called a stellar wind.

It consists mostly of high-energy electrons and protons (about 1 keV) that are able to escape the star's gravity in part because of the high temperature of the corona and the high kinetic energy particles gain through a process that is not well understood at this time. Many phenomena are directly related to the solar wind, including: geomagnetic storms that can knock out power grids on Earth, auroras, why the tail of a comet always points away from the Sun, and the formation of distant stars.

While early models of the solar wind used primarily thermal energy to accelerate the material, by the 1960s it was clear that thermal acceleration alone cannot account for the high speed solar wind. Some additional acceleration mechanism is required, but is not currently known, but most likely relates to magnetic fields in the solar atmosphere.

The solar wind blows a "bubble" in the interstellar medium (the rarefied hydrogen and helium gas that permeates the galaxy).

Originally posted by Keyhole

Originally posted by leejones
about astranorts doing odd jobs on the space staion, and in the report thay showed the part off the space staion it was blowing around like a ballon ? not by the engines.

This is because of the Solar Wind, not air in space!

Keyhole: nice google search!

Would you mind explaining the above question in laymen's terms?








p.s. what search keywords did you use?

Originally posted by backtoreality
"project llimdniw"

llimdniw - windmill verry funny.
I still don't know if backtoreality is joking or not.....
Anyways, someone here posted this equation pV = nRT and BTR said that if the temperature decreases, than also the volume decreases. But this equation says nothing of that kind. This equations says that when temperature decreases, the product of the pressure and the volume decreases. Moving up in the atmosphere, the volume of a section of the atmosphere increases so the pressure decreases even more.
Question: if there is air in space...where does the air form Earth ends and where the air from, lets say, Mars starts? And it is an abrupt transition from the earth's air to that of mars or not?

Originally posted by Apass
Question: if there is air in space...where does the air form Earth ends and where the air from, lets say, Mars starts? And it is an abrupt transition from the earth's air to that of mars or not?

Earths air doesnt finish and Mars's start. A planets air is held together and contained within the atmosphere of the planet. Space is whats in between.

Space, we are told, is a vacuum with no air, a temperature of absolute zero and serious radiation from the solar wind and various other cosmic radiations.

If there is air in space, why is there an atmosphere. If the air in space was dense enough, wouldn't the atmosphere of a planet just drift off???

Sorry...but the question was for BTR
I know what atmosphere is and why earth's air doesn't interact with mars' air...

Backtoreality... I hope this question doesn't drag this fascinating thread too much off-topic, but I was wondering if you had any inside knowledge on that well-known occasion when an Apollo 8 astronaut gave the game away to children of all ages when, emerging from the dark side of the moon, he gave the cryptic comment, "Please be informed that there is a Santa Claus."

Now there are dull souls out there who take the view that this is merely a coded attempt to imply an alien base on the far side of the moon. Do you have any inside skinny on this fascinating, yet elusive topic?

I feel sure that the real, unvarnished truth behind the years of speculation is much simpler.

[edit on 27-9-2006 by rich23]

Originally posted by Apass
Anyways, someone here posted this equation pV = nRT and BTR said that if the temperature decreases, than also the volume decreases. But this equation says nothing of that kind. This equations says that when temperature decreases, the product of the pressure and the volume decreases.

Actually, the intellectual who originally quoted the Ideal Gas Law (pV=nRT) stated that as T[temperature] decreases, so does P[pressure]. To this reversal of our basic knowledge of mathematical calculations, I in turn replied that the same could be said with respect to an increase in Pressure and a decrease in Temperature. Since this calculation is simply an equality of the product of variables and constants, the variables could be altered to form equality in any way imaginable. The point being, the Ideal Gas Law does not prove--unless we accept this new form of mathematics--that as temperature decreases pressure will decrease with a direct relationship.

Moving up in the atmosphere, the volume of a section of the atmosphere increases so the pressure decreases even more.

...as to your claim, I again must refer you to my reply above.

Question: if there is air in space...where does the air form Earth ends and where the air from, lets say, Mars starts? And it is an abrupt transition from the earth's air to that of mars or not?

You are a worthy foe, Mpass. Frankly, I am surprised this question has not come up long before now. There is no easy explanation to your question, but I will do my best to answer in a concise, but complete way.

Quite simply, there is no formal designation of the "end" of the Earth's atmosphere and the "beginning" of the Martian atmosphere. Geographically speaking, lines of distinction are drawn to very precisely mark one territory from another. However, go closer and see if the designation is as clear as it seems. Stand on the border of two areas and try to draw the actually line with a pencil. Then, try and decide which grains of sand are part of each territory. How about the molecules? Sub-atomic particles? And how to account for those pesky semi-existing Quantum particles?

The same is true with regards to the atmosphere of the Earth. Where to draw the line? As humanoids, I believe that these lines of distinction only serve to segregate and separate us from our Martian cousins. Sure, they may have existed billions of years ago; and they might have only been microscopic, single cell organisms; and this is still a hot-button issue among scientists in the field, but nonetheless, we must open our arms wide in acceptance of our planetary neighbors--even if some say hugging a single-cell organism is "not possible". Remember, you can't hug your Martian friends with nuclear arms.

Originally posted by Prote
Earths air doesnt finish and Mars's start. A planets air is held together and contained within the atmosphere of the planet. Space is whats in between.

Prote, welcome to the conversation.
If this is so, what can be said of the common saying, "give me some space"?

Space, we are told, is a vacuum with no air, a temperature of absolute zero and serious radiation from the solar wind and various other cosmic radiations.

Who are we told by? I would go tell them that they are completely wrong. As was discussed before, space does not have a temperature of absolute zero. The temperature varies GREATLY depending on wether or not an obect is in direct sunlight or not, and the lowest actual temperature is still a few degrees K above that (3K, I believe).

Also, please let this person know that absolute zero is, by definition, impossible. It is unattainable. A mirage we can see, but cannot touch.

If there is air in space, why is there an atmosphere. If the air in space was dense enough, wouldn't the atmosphere of a planet just drift off???

???????

You will have to help me on this one. "Dense" objects would be more prone to falling back towards the center of gravity from which they are attracted to.

Please clarify. Was this also told from that same person?