The FED is a serious scam. When is something going to be done about it?

This is all very interesting...

but what does it all matter, if the fed isn't privately owned?
or if they dont really make much money...

from this source, over 95% of the income of the federal reserve, goes back to the treasury, because it is against the law for the Fed to actually MAKE money... it has to give profit back...
I dont know, but it seems logical to the way the things have changed since the kennedy years...

Fed Doesn't make profit?
I still have to check this data also, because there are quite a few contradictory ones online.

Hi Laz ,
INE but I don't know that the FED itself making money is the problem. I think the conspiracy, if you will, is that the people running the FED can manipulate the system and gain evermore wealth at the cost of the average person.

According to Saussy (and others I assume) inflation is due soley to fiat money, a system pushed through by the people behind the FED. Every year we are asked to give up more and more, to conserve, cut back, work harder & longer, just to make ends meet.. to hold on to our standard of living. Is it any wonder why so many families have to have dual incomes? How will that ultimately affect our childeren and future generations.

A side note regarding Laz's link...

The Fed is also paid fees for services it provides such as funds transfers (Fedwire), check processing, and automated clearinghouse (ACH) operations. (ACH options are electronic alternatives to the paper-based check system. Examples include automatic payroll deposits and electronic bill paying.)

Can someone explain why we have to pay fees for something that is done electronically? We are making their job easier and have to pay more for it. Never understood that one.


[edit on 17-8-2006 by mecheng]

I wonder why the Anti Deformation League feels it necessary to defend the FED and paper money? Then people wonder why "all Jews" get blamed for the system we're under. And how dare they call these "idiot" legal arguements. According to the ADL if you feel the FED and paper money is a scam, you're an idiot!

BattleofBartoche said it just fine, but I have to comment also. And I'm sorry..but I have to laugh. Mecheng you are great and I'm glad you joined the debate here. I'm not pointing this out because I'm a spelling Nazi...I'm pointing it out because it is funny. It's the Anti-Defamation League. I don't think a league against deformed people will ever fly. Although, Hitler would have liked something like that. He was all for getting rid of the "un-perfect."

But back on track.....The Anti-Defamation league is probably receiving funds directly or indirectly from the Illuminati that run the FED. So of course they will defend them. Money talks.

Sounds like the ADL is in the FED's pocket.......

[edit on 17-8-2006 by Excitable_Boy]

Damn spell checker!

[edit on 17-8-2006 by mecheng]

Originally posted by mecheng

Originally posted by Peyres
2. Assumptions. Cleverly worded to not directly implicate jews, but racist none the less.

Speaking of the Jews, and I'm not an anti-semite, just a JARG

, but I found this on the Anti Deformation League's website under their "Militia Watchdog" page. It appears they don't appreciate anyone complaining about the paper money system or the FED and have set up a whole page of what they call "Idiot Legal Arguements" defending the FED and paper money.

Idiot Legal Arguments: A Casebook for Dealing with Extremist Legal Arguments

I wonder why the Anti Deformation League feels it necessary to defend the FED and paper money? Then people wonder why "all Jews" get blamed for the system we're under.

And how dare they call these "idiot" legal arguements. According to the ADL if you feel the FED and paper money is a scam, you're an idiot!

I'm not calling you lot racist, you have been clear enough to differentiate the average jew to the banking cabal But that particular article on Wiki is well..

Originally posted by Astyanax1/ What exactly is the scam being perpetrated here?

It's a scam, because the Fed (international bankers) are parasites. They create nothing. While labor from a carpenter builds houses, a programmer sits in front a computer writing software, a teacher educates children, a firefighter puts out fire, these bankers do little then put entries of debt on a ledger.

They control the money supply. In an inflation (issue money), it cost nothing to record debts. In a contraction (limit money, loans), the wealth of hard working people is transfer to the bankers.

The Great Depression is a wealth transfer. The bankers got the working people's wealth. When Enron went bankrupt, the employees saw their pensions vaporized, but their wealth was not destroy, it was transfer.

Imagine, you buy a share of Google at $500. You got a piece paper stating you own a share. Sergery Brin owned that share and sold it to you. Let's say Google dissolves, out of business. You have nothing but that piece of paper. Where is that $500? In Sergery's hand. Wealth transfer. In this case, Sergery put in work on Google. Imagine those bankers, they do jack.

2/ Who is perpetrating it?

International bankers. The dynastic families, Rothschild, Warburgs, Shieff, Rockefeller, Morgan, et al.

3/ Why is it worse to buy and sell money than it is to sell books or chickens?

Money is just a medium of exchange. It could be anything. I have money in the form of a record on a database, $10,000. How much do you want to buy that? Does it make sense. Money is infinite. It's an idea, an illusion, limitless, nothing.


[edit on 29-8-2006 by tazadar]

[edit on 29-8-2006 by tazadar]

Welcome to ATS tazadar! And an awsome first post I might add

Lets not forget the bankers produce money out of thin air and charge us interest upon it. They call it fiat currency and fractional reserve lending. I perfer the term The Lenders Multiplier:

The lenders’ multiplier

When you deposit £100 in your bank account, the bank, or banks, will effectively lend that money out to approximately 8 to 12 other people dependent upon the deposit ratio, naturally charging each of them interest, often upwards of 20% interest, as in the case of credit card debt, for example. They will of course pay you some minuscule level of interest for the privilege of ‘looking after’ your money. They will also attempt to charge you under any spurious excuse they can dream up, such as giving you a statement of the amount in your account or writing you some form letter.

So, let's say you open an account and your first deposit is $1,000.
- They then lend that money out to 10 other people.
- In other words they lend out $10,000 even though they only have $1,000 (your money) in hand.
- They then charge those people 15% on the $10,000 in loans which comes to $1,500 a year.
- They give you %3 interest on your $1,000 which comes to $30 (WOW) and keep $1470 in profit... for doing what? NOTHING!

Oh, I forgot... you also get to pick out a nice new toaster for opening the account.

“None are so hopelessly enslaved as those who falsely believe themselves to be free.”
- Johann Wolfgang von Goethe

You and I are slaves in this system. It is indeed like the Matrix, where the Machine controlling us from birth to death. People think they are free, but in reality are enslaved by the Machine.

We work for others without pay. When we get a paycheck, it is not "money." It is Debt. How true is the saying, "I work like a dog."

mecheng, when it comes to loans. Example like a mortgage (mort = death, gage = pledge), it's a death pledge.

Principal: $1,000,000
Year Terms:: 30
Annual interest rate: 7%

Monthly Payment: $6,653.02

Total Interest Paid: $1,395,087.20
Total Repaid: $2,395,087.20

Interest as percentage of Principal: 140%

When you borrow, $1,000,000. The bank issue (coin, create) the amount through fractional reserve banking. However, there is a flaw in the scam. The new money - $1M - created by the bank is put into circulation. The money to pay the interest - $1,395,087.20 - IS NOT created, thus not in circulation.

How to extinguish (repaid) the interest? New loans from the $1M in circulation must be created. Thus, an endless cycle of debt. Debt can never be repaid. The US national debt is approaching $9 trillion. American people can never pay this off. Debt can never be extinguished in this system.

Now that you have taken the red pill, what must we do?

We must inform and educate others. Wake them up.

The Federal Reserve Act is unconstitutional. It must be repealed. The Federal Reserve System must be dismantled.

"The Congress shall have Power ... To coin Money, regulate the Value thereof" - United States Constitution, Article I, Section 8. The Constitution does not give Congress the power to coin money away to a private corporation.

Create a Central Bank that functions in creation, regulation of money and a government agency under the powers of Congress. Have the US Treasury print United States Notes to replace Federal Reserve Notes. There are $800 billion of FRN in circulation. The issuance of United States Notes are debt-free.

Dae, thanks for the welcome.

[edit on 29-8-2006 by tazadar]

Originally posted by tazadar
Debt can never be repaid. The US national debt is approaching $9 trillion. American people can never pay this off. Debt can never be extinguished in this system.

First off... Welcome to ATS!
Next (and I want to do some research but right now too busy/lazy), how was the debt turned into a surplus during the Clinton administration?

Edit: Sorry. Showing my ignorance on the subject (I told you I hate this stuff). During the Clinton years we only had budgetary surpluses in which he was able to pay down the debt somewhat but not come close to eliminating it. Here's an interesting link which shows the spending of Reagan, Bush I and Bush II vs. prior presidents and Clinton administrations...An Analysis of the Presidents Who Are Responsible For Excessive Spending

[edit on 29-8-2006 by mecheng]

Originally posted by mechenghow was the debt turned into a surplus during the Clinton administration?

I do not understand your question. Debt is not a value (it's a negative). Surplus means a positive. By definition debt cannot be a suplus. You probably mean under Clinton, the government took in more tax revenue than what was borrowed.

This debt-based monetary system is in all over the world. They have worked over the centuries to implant this system in every industrialized country. There ultimate goal is a single world currency. That's when they have absolute power on the entire Earth. They will establish a world government to do it.

Every major wars in recent history, behind the scenes, they conspired to cause chaos and destruction. World War I, the creation of League of Nations. The Europeans fought against it. The League didn't survive long. The international bankers funded Hitler's Nazi. World War II, the creation of the United Nations.

In Christianity and Judaism, usary or interest is forbidden in money-lending, but the believers of these faith lost that teaching. Islam is the only religion written in the Quran forbidding usary. That is why the international bankers have declared war on Islam. They want to destroy the Islamic faith - by consent or conquest, conquest in forcing the Muslims to accept it by forming puppet governments.

As you can guess, these international bankers are powerful and wealthy beyond imagination. The Rothschild wealth is suspected to be $100-300 trillion worth.

They have influences and control in our media establishment, academia, books, etc. They have put out propaganda and disinformation to blind us from the Truth. DO NOT buy this thing of "higher authority", such as what do you know from economist from Harvard? That economist has been bought, sold-out.

Look into your instinct, your gut feeling, your common sense. Believe in yourself.

Originally posted by tazadar
I do not understand your question. Debt is not a value (it's a negative). Surplus means a positive.

I edited my previous post.

In Christianity and Judaism, usary or interest is forbidden in money-lending, but the believers of these faith lost that teaching. Islam is the only religion written in the Quran forbidding usary. That is why the international bankers have declared war on Islam. They want to destroy the Islamic faith - by consent or conquest, conquest in forcing the Muslims to accept it by forming puppet governments.

I don't know about this one. You mean to tell me there are no Islamic banks or lenders that charge intrest???

Look into your instinct, your gut feeling, your common sense. Believe in yourself.

I do.

Originally posted by mechengI don't know about this one. You mean to tell me there are no Islamic banks or lenders that charge intrest???

There are, such as, banks in Kuwait which was conquered by the US during the Gulf War. I don't know that much about UAE. I'm pretty sure with Malaysia and Indonesia. The 1997 Asian financial crisis was a classic case of inflating and contracting the money supply. The bankers are slowly and silently destroying Islam. They will put out propaganda and disinformation to brainwash the people.

With Leo Wanta case, it's the first time I hear of it. The story is probably true. I don't doubt the work of the Bush crime family. Bill Clinton and Hilary are as evil as the Bushes. Bill Clinton is a Rhodes scholar. The Rhodes Scholarship to Oxford University was founded by Cecil Rhodes, the founded of De Beers. Rhodes exploited the natural resources of Africa. I don't know if you know about De Beers control artificial scarity of diamonds and the evils they that do in African countries.

The Illuminti, these master criminals will use these organizations, fronts, occults to recruit evil people to serve them.

The United States Constitution is the most wonderful document ever written. I worry for this Land of the Free, Home of the Brave. Americans are hypnotize to popular media. They waste their time on what color shoes Paris Hilton is wearing today. America is brain-dead. That's what these criminals are looking for and the reason they are getting away with it. We need to wake people up.



[edit on 29-8-2006 by tazadar]

There is one major flaw to this debt system that screws the bankers more than us. All debt for people is removed & property is to be returned every 7 years. That is why you get your credit rating back after seven years. For nations it is 70 years, all property must be returned as well. 1933 plus 70 equals 2003 that debt was suppossed to be wiped out, the bankers have broken their own laws. This is why Canada & the U.S. stated having surplus again. Now we need more war to put us back in debt.
It's also why you have mandatory parole hearings when paying your debt tov society. They have to trick you to contract back into the system.
There is such a wealth of knowledge in a book called "black's law dictionary".
Once you understand what words really mean, then go back a re-read your Acts of Paliament/Congress.

Originally posted by forestlady
Nax, did you read the link at the beginning of the thread that told how the first Rothschild made his money? He basically created the banking system as we know it today. When you read about his ruthlessness and his ambition, why would you believe that he created an honest system? He found a way to create money by doing nothing but lending money he didn't have. That is creating money out of thin air.

Mayer Amschel Rothschild certainly was greedy conniving con-artist. Paper money and fractional reserve banking was first used in China around 900 AD. The population size and economic volume was smaller, so these house cards scheme lasted only a few decades.

Further, if our money was backed by a gold standard, then we would have actual wealth. But we don't, our dollar is backed by nothing but thin air. I guess somebody figured at some time that since we're a superpower, we don't need no stinkin' gold, our word is good enough.

When the con-artist bankers got the Federal Reserve Act passed in 1913, they went to their next plan - steal the gold.

They started to inflate the money supply -simply debt entries on a ledger, out of nothing. The medium of money allowed for economic activities. Leading into the Roaring 20s.

1929, time for harvest. JP Morgan being the arrogant bastard that he was invited Churchill to the viewing floor of the New York Stock Exchange to demonstrate his power over the people. Morgan stopped 'call money' (loans) to the stock traders and brokers. A contracting of the money supply put stock trading on a stand-still.

The US economy could still go on in spite of the stock market crash, but since the bankers control the Federal Reserve, contraction on the money supply is repeated. Loans not issued. Due to fractional reserve banking, no new loans mean borrowers of existing loans could not make payment. The economy headed into a depression.

1933, Congress and FDR passed a law to collect the gold and silver from the American people. Fort Knox is looted.

But here's the kicker: our monetary system is a house of cards. And now, with many other countries considering going off the dollar as the standard payment for oil, well that will greatly devalue our dollar, making it more worthless. Many, many economists are predicting a great crash soon in the U.S.

Since, 1933 the dollar is not worth 100 cents. Today, the dollar is like 9 cent of 1933 value. There is a population and economic volume limit. The banks won't be able to find any more people to make loans to, thus this house of cards will fall. The collapse is coming, probably 2015.


[edit on 29-8-2006 by tazadar]

Americans are hypnotize to popular media. They waste their time on what color shoes Paris Hilton is wearing today. America is brain-dead. That's what these criminals are looking for and the reason they are getting away with it. We need to wake people up.

Right on Tazadar...and great contributions to the thread.

Bartoche.....one correction. The 7 year thing doesn't really work anymore for individuals. If they don't pay off their debts...say to a credit card company...that will NEVER come off their report...even if it gets written off. Nothing will come off a credit report unless it is paid in full or an agreement is made to pay something to clear the debt. Without clearing the debt..it will stay forever on a person's credit report. Once paid off....and if a person is completely debt free or current with everything...they can end up with a good credit score as soon as 6 months later....

Now back to the scum bag Illuminati.....honestly, who has the power to fight against the most powerful people in the world??? JFK tried....didn't have much luck. If our president can't do it (or won't in most cases since the Illuminati owns them all...except they didn't own JFK).....who can??

Originally posted by Excitable_Boy

Americans are hypnotize to popular media. They waste their time on what color shoes Paris Hilton is wearing today. America is brain-dead. That's what these criminals are looking for and the reason they are getting away with it. We need to wake people up.

Right on Tazadar...and great contributions to the thread.

Bartoche.....one correction. The 7 year thing doesn't really work anymore for individuals. If they don't pay off their debts...say to a credit card company...that will NEVER come off their report...even if it gets written off. Nothing will come off a credit report unless it is paid in full or an agreement is made to pay something to clear the debt. Without clearing the debt..it will stay forever on a person's credit report. Once paid off....and if a person is completely debt free or current with everything...they can end up with a good credit score as soon as 6 months later....

Now back to the scum bag Illuminati.....honestly, who has the power to fight against the most powerful people in the world??? JFK tried....didn't have much luck. If our president can't do it (or won't in most cases since the Illuminati owns them all...except they didn't own JFK).....who can??

Actually federal reserve notes are simply promissary notes, a promise to pay when lawful money is restored. You can go to any stationary store, pick up some bond paper and write you own promissary note and mail it in to your creit card company. Sounds crazy I know but in a court of law a promissary note is a promissary note. The credit card company used your own signature to to create the funds to lend to you. They never actually lent you anything but your own credit.
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Originally posted by mecheng
I don't know about this one. You mean to tell me there are no Islamic banks or lenders that charge intrest???

Indeed, it is against Islamic law. They tend to charge a fixed fee for services and are allowed to purchase stock for customers and what have you. They have alot of rules for banks, some I agree with, some I dont.

Source
For a business loan:

Loans made by a bank to a permissible venture are not subject to fixed repayments. Justice and fair play prevail in all contracts, and rates of profit and loss cannot be determined beforehand. So long as the business continues to function, the risks as well as the profits are shared by the Bank.

Personal loan:

In the case of private loans, normally to needy people with no savings at all to fall back on, only the loan needs to be repaid. This service may carry a once-and-for-all charge, but no continuing interest payment. Such loans are rarely made, however.

However, I have found at this site an interesting snippet:

Riba (interest, usury) is primarily an economic issue in view of the fact that all religions and mythologies have prohibited, restricted, discouraged, disliked, or degraded Riba in one way or the other since the inception of human interaction. All three major revealed (Ilhami) religions i.e., Islam, Christianity, and Judaism have strongly condemned and prohibited Riba in its original versions. Later, the clerics of Jews and Christian Church abandoned the prohibition of Riba (interest, usury) that led the mankind into the economic anarchy of the present era.

Islam - the most modern revealed religion is still upholding the righteous prohibition of Riba although not in practice in any of the Islamic country at governmental level but there is immense enthusiasm for Riba-Free financial system in Muslims.

Interesting huh, seems like Islamic banking doesnt cut it at the governmental level.

If the FRB fails, or the US federal reserve note is severely deflated, what will Americans use for currency? All other countries can fall back on other currencies, but we in the US must still use only these FRNs. Gold is nice, but if America somehow switches away from paper money, how fast will that happen? Also, where will the gold come from? Will we drop our deflated dollars and go dig in the hills? There really is no plan for a shift away from the Fed, so you should probably plan for it to be catastrophic if paper money fails altogether.

The Fed runs very well and makes a nice profit. One independant researcher put that profit at 6x all the taxes collected in the entire US annually. What if the problem isn't the Fed, but the private ownership of it? Aren't the people of America the only ones who have the ability and right to nationalized the Fed? Why not make it a public institution? Americans would never have to pay taxes again, so robust is the US economic engine.

There really is no way to get off the FRB ship without massive disruption of food supply (starvation). But just because a ship has a hole in it and is taking on water (debt) doesn't mean you jump out of the ship. That's why ships have bilge pumps. The Fed could remain very useful if it were in the right hands. How much loss of life would it take to seize it? Probably far less than anyone realizes... Except the people who now own it that is.


[edit on 29-8-2006 by smallpeeps]

the problem is that the status quo is mantained by too many people, I´d say at least 25% of the people of the western countries, and these people have too much to loose so they, and they are the ones who have the money and the political and corporate power will never risk loosing thier lifes even for what they might think to be the correct path.

When I was 20 I was for the revolution, now I´m for the subversion and I think this might be the way, the trick here is to subvert the system so it colapses naturaly.

honestly, there is not much we can do about it, just look around an you´ll see the incompence of our politicians doing the job for us.

When the system doesn´t work anymore we´ll have our chance to create a new one, so that´s the message. Think about an alternative for the next 15 years.

you can start by answering this question:

Where is the democracy when on a country of 300 mill people only 150 mill are registered to vote and from those only 50% do really vote, from those ~49,9% vote on one man who is elected by 35 mill people and that will try everything he can and know to do everything he wants or he doesn´t even know he wants...

who is this guy who rules a country of 300 mill and was elected by only 35 mill wich is a litle more than 10% of the total population, is this the form of democracy we want for us ?

...and when I say "us" I could be saying U.S.

for me this system is the real nest of the incompetence, you see, marketeers will elect mickey mouse or even the austrian

...and when I say austrian I can be thinking about california or germany


fred