Israeli Soldiers Were Captured INSIDE Lebanon

I want to know how Olmert has the audacity to claim that Hezbollah's actions were an "act of war" when the Israeli soldiers were captured INSIDE Lebanon at Aita al-Shaab.

Correct me if I am wrong my fellow ATS'ers but isnt sending troops into a sovereign nation itself and "act of war"? So wouldnt it be reasonable to assume that it was infact Israel that declared war on Lebanon before the Israeli troops were captured?

The sources said the Israeli soldiers had been seized at around 9 a.m. (0600 GMT) across the border from Aita al-Shaab, some 15 km (nine miles) from the Mediterranean coast.

news.yahoo.com

Kind of changes the whole situation dont you think? Israel declared war on Lebanon by sending troops across their border. Hezbollah capturing some and killing others is completely justified since Israel invaded them.

>Fixed link

[edit on 13/7/06 by subz]

First I heard of this, however I was under the assumption this also happend at a checkpoint, which are not in Isreal. Maybe the soldiers chased them across the border? If it was Isreal being agressive then yes it would hurt Isreal.

The BBC reports that the two Humvees that were involved in the ambush are still sitting were they were destroyed, blood and all still there. Israel has apparently had trouble claiming the bodies apparently. Now, it isn't clear on were exactly the Humvess are in relation to the border....

The point where two vehicles carrying Israeli soldiers were ambushed on Wednesday morning is particularly exposed, a military road running right next to the border fence.

The burned-out remains of the two Humvees, low armoured cars in which they were travelling, are still there.

There is blood on the tarmac and some of the soldiers' belongings - a green flak jacket and knapsacks.

Unconfirmed reports suggest that there may have been efforts to retrieve the bodies of four Israeli soldiers killed when their tank was blown up on Wednesday.

Source

As you can see Aita al-Shaab is well within the Lebanese border. As soon as Israeli soldiers crossed into Lebanon that was an act of war on the part of Israel against Lebanon. For Olmert to spin the situation into claiming Hezbollah's capture of Israeli soldiers inside Lebanon as an act of war against Israel by Lebanon is a bold face lie.



Well within Lebanese territory.

[edit on 13/7/06 by subz]

Are you shure it doesnt mean inside the Israeli border? That city sits pretty much smack dab on the border. Depending on which way you read it I guess.

Also the Israeli soldier that was captured by Hamas was also outside of Israel in Gaza. So that too is a legitimate action carried out by a militia against an occupying force. It wasnt a kidnapping but it was a taking of a POW.

Definitions and semantics at a time like this may seem pedantic but it seriously undermines Israel's stance and retaliatory action when put into perspective. These soldiers are POWs and in the case of Lebanon, Israel declared war on Lebanon not the other way round. Therefore Israel's continued attacks on Lebanese infrastructure and territory is an act of aggression not self defence. That would make Israel liable for repairations in any international court.

Originally posted by ludaChris
Are you shure it doesnt mean inside the Israeli border? That city sits pretty much smack dab on the border. Depending on which way you read it I guess.

The IDF soldiers were inside Lebanese territory when they were captured. The practice of Israeli incursions into Lebanon is not an isolated incident.

I would also reiterate the portion quoted by Stu, that Israel has not yet recovered the dead IDF soldiers. This would be because they are within Lebanon. If they were killed inside Israel it would not be a problem to recover their bodies.

Another point I would like to reiterate is Israel's incursion of Syrian airspace last week. That is also an act of war carried out by Israel against Syria. Israel cannot plead self defence if it is then attacked when it is Israel who is carrying out acts of war.

[edit on 13/7/06 by subz]

Subz your being too biased on this issue. The Israel soldiers that were captured were at an Israel base. Was that base on the border of Lebanon? Yes. Was it in Lebanon? No. So there you have it, they were not in Lebanon but they were on the border. So who did infact start this war? Obviously the Hezbollah. The time for action is now. May the U.S. and Israel be the victors over the theocratical Muslim nations.

Originally posted by Techsnow
Subz your being too biased on this issue.

Originally posted by Techsnow
The time for action is now. May the U.S. and Israel be the victors over the theocratical Muslim nations.

OK...

Originally posted by Techsnow
The Israel soldiers that were captured were at an Israel base. Was that base on the border of Lebanon? Yes. Was it in Lebanon? No. So there you have it, they were not in Lebanon but they were on the border. So who did infact start this war? Obviously the Hezbollah.

Do you have any evidence that suggests they were captured at an Israeli base inside Israel? If you do I would like to see it. Every mention of the location of the capture has put it inside Lebanon at Aita al-Shaab.

err yeah, the tunnle they blew up that went under the Isreali border to get behind the guards. Now.. maybe your line of thought is off from mine, but why go through the trouble of a tunnle when they are on your side of the border? no they obviously were not. You also site just one source that may have been a typo, if all news stations carried the same message it would be different, and even your source never said they were in the city, they were on a military road on their side of the border. Whether or not they were on what ever border anyways it is the blatent fact they were targeted for no reason. That is an act of war, not walking or standing or driving like the Isrealis. I think you are straining to take the "It's all the jews fault" both sides commit atrocities but this new wave of agression was started by the terrorist. Now whether or not Isreal should have attacked so heavy handed you can argue, but not that Isreal started it.

No, they were taken from Israelie territory. It isnt that hard to figure out. Really.

Subz
The history has already been written. Even if it were true its not going to be admitted to. I dunno who to believe anymore to be honest. If in fact it were true...what would happen? Another resolution to be vetoed by Bolton yet again anyway.


Pie

posted by Subz
I would also reiterate the portion quoted by Stu, that Israel has not yet recovered the dead IDF soldiers. This would be because they are within Lebanon. If they were killed inside Israel it would not be a problem to recover their bodies.

Israel attempted to cross the border but came under heavy fire from Hezbollah, hence the fact they are now concentrating on air and artillery attacks.

Israel knows that Hezbollah can dish out a fair amount of damge and are far more potent than the Palestinian fighters. They have anti-tank missiles, mines, night-vision, body armour..the whole shebang. These guys are tough cookies and will fight the IDF tooth and nail. Remember, they are the reason for the 2000 pullout by Israel.

Also hence why they cannot retrieve the bodies, as they lie within Lebanese territory and Hezbollah will engage any troops that cross the border.

Originally posted by Rockpuck
err yeah, the tunnle they blew up that went under the Isreali border to get behind the guards. Now.. maybe your line of thought is off from mine, but why go through the trouble of a tunnle when they are on your side of the border?

That wasnt in Lebanon.

Many sources, outside the u.s.a. are reporting that they were captured INSIDE LEBANON. It's not a type-o.

It all started on July 12 when Israel troops were ambushed on Lebanon's side of the border with Israel. Hezbollah, which commands the Lebanese south, immediately seized on their crossing. They arrested two Israeli soldiers, killed eight Israelis and wounded over 20 in attacks inside Israeli territory.

Source

-e

Originally posted by subz
Do you have any evidence that suggests they were captured at an Israeli base inside Israel? If you do I would like to see it. Every mention of the location of the capture has put it inside Lebanon at Aita al-Shaab.

Come to think of it, what evidence was cited by the Israeli's? Did they just say 'Hezbollah crossed our border and attacked us?'

Originally posted by Communication_Burger
Did they just say 'Hezbollah crossed our border and attacked us?'

Yes, the Israelis are simply taken on their word that it was a "cross-border raid" by Hezbollah. Thats good enough for most corporate mainstream news outlets. They all get their international stories from a handful of sources AP, Reuters etc.

Its not as if this is a first for Israel either. They have very publically violated Lebanese airspace and territory for decades. So its not as if its completely inconceivable that Israel done so on this occasion. If there was no precedent for Israeli breaches of sovereign territory I would take this story with a pinch of salt, but as it stands Israel is a habitual airspace/territory violator. So I believe it when its reported the IDF soldiers were captured inside Lebanon.

very interesting, good find subz, WATS for you. It seems that israel crossing the border and the hexbollah immediately attacking fits the puzzle pretty well. I didnt even think to figure this little bit out, but look at that, it makes all the difference in the world. Shouldnt have taken their word for it.

Subz,

This is thread is bogus. And you got a WATS for it?
Geez people do some research.
Your article clearly states:

The sources said the Israeli soldiers had been seized at around 9 a.m. (0600 GMT) across the border from Aita al-Shaab, some 15 km (nine miles) from the Mediterranean coast.

The Israeli army confirmed that two soldiers were captured and eight killed on the Lebanese frontier.

Hizbollah supporters set off fire crackers and distributed sweets in the streets of Beirut in celebration.

Nasrallah said Hizbollah had repelled an Israeli force that tried to go into Lebanon to hunt for the missing soldiers, destroying a tank and killing four crew members.

Footage on Hizbollah's al-Manar television showed a smoldering Israeli jeep, with a soldier's kit lying beside it. It showed smoke rising from an Israeli border post.

Explain that to me. Your own source claims that not only was the attack over the border, but Hizbollah’s al-Manar channel showed footage of smoke rising from a Israeli border post. Opps ya missed that one.
Your Google image is nice too. I really like how you zoomed in on Aita al-Shabb but neglected to show where Zar'it is in relation to the border. Could your lapse be due to the fact that Zar’it is due west, across the Israeli border…well within their own territory? Gee I wonder?

And what? You forgot to mention the diversionary rocket and mortar attacks, in Shlomi that preceded the cross-border raid. Please your bias is showing.


DENYi

Originally posted by Imperium Americana

The sources said the Israeli soldiers had been seized at around 9 a.m. (0600 The Israeli army confirmed that two soldiers were captured and eight killed on the Lebanese frontier.

Explain that to me. Your own source claims that not only was the attack over the border, but Hizbollah’s al-Manar channel showed footage of smoke rising from a Israeli border post. Opps ya missed that one.

You are most likeley right but why does it say 8 killed on the LEBANESE frontier? Thats a little confusing. It does make it sound like its on Lebanese territory.


Pie