Super-Hacker Gary McKinnon Will Be Extradited To United States

Originally posted by Rasobasi420
I think the key here is for the government to prove the extent of the damage.

What does it matter if the damage was $700K, or $1? The fact is, he broke the law. And that's all they need to bust him.

One aggrivating point is that if this is the direction the trial is going, we may never get to see any evidence of UFOs or antigrav, or any of that cool stuff.

Evidence of what? You're dreaming, sir. As if he was going to validate your dreams...

I have heard people swear up and down that there network is not even connected to the net in anyway, only to find out later that there were numerious connections on the inside... mini networks to share printers or modem pools etc. Getting ANY access is the foot in the door you need to get ALL access. The expense of the computers probably reflects compliance with useless and stupid codes like the orange book and others that they need to meet to be connected to certain gov networks.

Originally posted by jsobecky
hat does it matter if the damage was $700K, or $1? The fact is, he broke the law. And that's all they need to bust him.

Well, it matters because there is a minimum damage cost required to extradite. THat' why I posed the question in the first place. So yes, they needed more than a dollar to bust him. I believe the damage needed to be in excess of $5000 but I'm not sure, could someone clarify.

Evidence of what? You're dreaming, sir. As if he was going to validate your dreams...

I never though he would validate my dreams. I know that Aliens exist, and I am 100% convinced the government is covering up some part of it. I was only hoping that this would be an opportunity to get these topics back on the front page, rather than in the Weekly World News.

Originally posted by Rasobasi420
I believe the damage needed to be in excess of $5000 but I'm not sure, could someone clarify.

If that number is correct, it's a very low threshhold and easy to meet.

I never though he would validate my dreams. I know that Aliens exist, and I am 100% convinced the government is covering up some part of it. I was only hoping that this would be an opportunity to get these topics back on the front page, rather than in the Weekly World News.

I understand your quest for knowledge and verification. I hope you get some sort of validation of your beliefs. But don't count on the US gov't to co-operate; they never will.

some one should send him a copy of Prisonbreak Season 1a & 1b

Originally posted by EvilBat
I'll put a Free Gary right next to my Free Kevin

Mitnick is still in jail? I thought he was freed in 2005...

[edit on 8-7-2006 by Telos]

I take it mots everyone here likes the idea of One World Government, as a Police State?

Else why support the idea of extraditing this guy to the USA instead of charging him in Britain?

The real damage caused by Gary was the exposure of pathetic security measures used by our
highly overpaid MS certified IT professionals 4 years after 9/11.

Last week the House Appropriations Committee blasted the VA Secretary for allowing
employees to take home laptops without any security measures to encrypt critical
personal data.

The fleecing of U.S. taxpayers to improve "national security" is an illusion.

Gary is a Brit who allegedly committed a crime in Britain - but somehow the law allows him to be extradited to the USA and processed through the US Justice System?

Exactly when did we establish a One World Government Police State?

...and why wasn't I informed?

I think it will be rather difficult to prove the damages. How can they show that any damage was done by Gary. I honestly believe that he was not there to do any damage, and, unless he was deleting files willy nilly, he probably didn't do any actual damage. Definately not $700,000 worth, and most likely not even $5000 worth.

My perspective:

1) Cause he exposed "outdated" loop holes he will be tried, Had he found a NEW way in he would be hired by the gov

2) The people who left the network open should be tried, kinda like in some states if someone hacks from an "unprotected" wireless network the owner of the network will be charge. However if the network had ANY protection, the hacker would get charged. Hence i believe he should get no jail time, but the people in the gov should at least get a slap on the wrist....

3) Being an IT prefessional i see no damage done that equates to physical hardware or software. I think the outragous dollar amount is so they can pay their IT dept to fix the holes they were paid to fix a LONG time ago.

4) If the gov would stop lying in the first place, people would not hack into their databases.....but we the people "can't handle the truth"

[edit on 8-7-2006 by scoobdude]

Originally posted by scoobdude
My perspective:

1) Cause he exposed "outdated" loop holes he will be tried, Had he found a NEW way in he would be hired by the gov...

...

4) If the gov would stop lying in the first place...

"The gov," huh? Like, you take it for granted there is only one government.

This is getting very scary.

Does no one realize that the UK and the USA are two different countries? Or that Gary is not accountable to the USA in the USA because he is a citizen of the UK living in the UK?

Did I just fall through a wormhole here?

It's basically accepted that the US and UK are one entity at the top levels. I wonder though, If I were to hack into NKs computer system, and find out theyir missile status, would I be extradited, I bet not.

I don't see a petition helping this guy out that much. I mean he DID break the law, and he should know by now the U.S. government isn't very friendly to its enemies. I've also read that he is in U.S. Army brochures as a "perfect example of a terrorist". Just seems like our government has already turned him into some type of super-villain. I feel sorry for the man. I honestly hope that at least he found what he was looking for.

There is no reason to help him, hes a bumbling idiot whos going to get exactly what he deserves. If only it was this way with all script kiddies the world would be a better place. People assume the price of damages is padded, but has anyone sat down to think about what happened. So youve got a penetrated network, first you have to find where the penetration occured. Then track down the extend of the comromise. After that determine what needs to be done to patch the holes and fix the problem. Then you have to go over every box on that network and check for integrity to ensure there isint some little call-home program left dormant for later use. All that translates into man-hours of time not only for those who are working on fixing the problems but for thos who cannot work because their network is down due to some !@#$ing retard who thought he was hot crap using canned exploits and misconfigurations. McKinnon should consider himself lucky hes not looking at an even higher ammount of damages.

As for the extradition argument that he should be tried in the UK, bollocks to that as a friend would say. He violated the security of US systems, therefore our laws should be brought to bear aginast him. Simple reason: if not then people the world over are going to figure out they can sit in a country with 0 laws against hacking and start going hog wild while making faces across the border to agents waiting to bust them.

No way the cost is $700,000 thoug. He told everyone what exploits he used, and where the security flaws that he used are. As for going over Every System with a fine toothed comb, all that would need to be secured are the machines that he accessed, which could be found using the same scanning software he used. Maybe the damage was in excess of $5000 come to think of it, but no where near $700,000

Extradition should only take place when the perpetrator was physically in the jurisdiction of the prosecuting party. Telepresence shouldn't count. If I prank call the Vatican repeatedly, should I be extradited to Italy to face harassment charges? I think not. Italy takes it up with my government, and my government punishes me as is appropriate.

Gary may not have been creative enough to code his own vulnerability exploits, but half of a hack is exploiting known weaknesses in software, hardware, and humans. He got the job done, didnt he? He is far from an idiot. He did what every person does: made a stupid mistake. And it got him busted. He should be punished for his crimes by his own governing authority. We have no jurisdiction.

Originally posted by Helig
There is no reason to help him, hes a bumbling idiot whos going to get exactly what he deserves.

When did you start working for the goverment.?!? The punishment does not fit the crime, he hacked a network that was so easy the goverment did not even think to fix it in the first place. He did not corupt or destroy and thing on their network. What he did was find evidence of a massive conspiracy for which this forum was [MADE for unless you people have forgotten. This guy is being made an example of so that anyone in the future will think twice before trying to uncover any classified conspiracies. If people tried to actually read his story with out passing any preconceived notions about him and remember who we are dealing with i.e (big goverment). We then would be able to correctly talk about his dire situation.

[edit on 8-7-2006 by Revelmonk]

He may have committed a crime from Britain, but the physical crime was carried out in the states. Those computers were in US territorial waters/land.

How about an American go ahead and hack into ay European nations military database, while having to chance upon a large chunk of vital information? I am sure you would be crying to leave him be and reward him for such actions.

Would you be praising a criminal for breaking into your house, taking some cash and luxuries and giving it to a homeless peson. Obviously the deed was ok, and it probably did not set you back that much, but he did compromise your privacy as well as physically steal something from you.

That is what happened. This man compromised the privacy of a national defense agency, and physically stole information. That is an illegal act, and illegal acts deserve to be punished.

Originally posted by rich23
In order to justify the extradition, the US government is continuing its tradition of flat-out lying.

Proof? Ah, I though so. That also goes for the rest of your "implausible" scenarios.

Originally posted by rich23
As for those people spouting the tired cliche "if you can't do the time"... I'm sure they're always happy under authoritarian regimes like the US. Personally I prefer the kind of freedom we have in Europe.

Yeah, because we all know that there are no jails and crimes in Europe. And we all know that punishing people when they break a law is only something that authoritarian regimes do right?

Originally posted by Rasobasi420
One aggrivating point is that if this is the direction the trial is going, we may never get to see any evidence of UFOs or antigrav, or any of that cool stuff.

Because there might be no evidence of "that cool stuff", he has no proof to back up what he’s claim he "saw".

Originally posted by Rasobasi420
No way the cost is $700,000 thoug. He told everyone what exploits he used, and where the security flaws that he used are.

Ok, I’m getting tired of this, what allows you to make such a statement, where are your sources that state he could not have caused 700K worth of damage? Do you even know the ins and outs of this case? No you don't.

Originally posed by soficrow
Does no one realize that the UK and the USA are two different countries? Or that Gary is not accountable to the USA in the USA because he is a citizen of the UK living in the UK?

He is if he commits a crime against the US, which he did, then he can be held accountable. The way some people are talking about this you would have though this was the first extradition in history. :shk: