Just a pissed off kid

Originally posted by 18XRay
Have you seen the footage of the beheadings? I don't think that they are praying to my god! This is a war against islam and I would like proof that it isn't!

beheading mean nothing. theyve been doing that stuff for decades. its what they do.

a couple years ago i visited turkey. NON, extremist. but common law enforcers will cut your hands off your stealing a candybar.

thats part of there religion. you cant change that. and thats what your dont understand those countries have been doing stuff like that for along time, hell they shouldnt have any people left.

but you cant hears some lies from a friend of a friend, an deside you want to change there whole way of life. an tell them what to do in there own country.

Originally posted by 18XRay
Why do people try to act like they know me! I have planned on joining the military before 9/11 even happened that just secured the fact!

Ok, so to be clear, you're a kid that wishes he was in the 'special forces'. Not a person that is enlisted.

This is a war against islam and I would like proof that it isn't!

If it was a war against islam, we'd be attacking islamic targets, such as random muslims, mecca, etc.

Its a war against the system of internationalist terrorism.

and search google or just take your head out of your ass before you call me a liar,

kid, lets get something clear.

When you say that you've joined into the special forces, you are stating a lie. What you have done is joined the army. Like anyone else in the army, you are permited to try out for the special forces (iow, the green berets). You are also permited to try to become a ranger, or join an airborne unit, if they take you.

But when you enter your initial training, you will not be 'in the special forces', or any closer to it than a draftee.

Come back after a year or so and let us know if you've made it into the berets, airborne, air assualt, rangers, etc.

oh yeah i have a gpa of 3.6 and dont plan on dropping out any time soon!!!!

So, bascially, you're a braggart, claiming to be special forces, but really you haven't even been accepted by the military, let alone started training or finished school.

Rather than coming back in a year to let us know how your prom went, how about you come back in a few years and let us know if you even finished basic.

NON, extremist. but common law enforcers will cut your hands off

Where did you go?

but common law enforcers will cut your hands off your stealing a candybar.

What in the world are you talking about?

A holy war? Holy #!

I would refrain from using that statement around....well, anyone, ever...

You have a lot of studying to do before they will give you more than a haircut kid.

I am going to assume you are another chump from one of those states where cattle outnumber humans. A decent GPA doesn't make you that smart. Not in high school at least.

I apologize for the insult, Mods. I just cannot stand the fact that these are the attitudes that meet our friends and enemies abroad. Way to win some hearts and minds, turd. Unlike a lot of my fellow Americans, doning a set of fatigues and a rifle will not earn my respect. You sound like another ignorant mercinary, only helping to ruin the reputation that the real heroes of our military worked so hard to create.

You should just stay home and read a book. Enlist when you really know what you are fighting for.

"WE" didn't elect him twice.

I had NOTHING to do with this moron getting into office a second time.

Also, keep in mind, GWB did NOT win the election by a landslide. Almost half of America voted against him.

who deleted my slightly harsh post

Originally posted by Communication_Burger

If you go out there, and get killed, it will be for nothing. Save yourself, Kid.

Who said anything about Iraq? I didn't. I think the only one who mentioned Iraq, was you.

Somebody got out of bed on the wrong side this morning, sheesh. Hey, I concur, "going out there and getting killed" could refer to driving for ice cream this evening, however, it does not take a skilled debater to make the case that "out there" would mean the front lines of a conflict, possibly the very conflict 18XRay refers to in his original post I admit my error in coming to that conclusion.

18XRay, I hear you loud and clear, if you want support for your military career, you will find little of it here on ATS. ALSO, give my regards to your uncles at Ft. Bragg. Tell them I am grateful they have the guts, as do you, to fight to preserve the freedoms we hold so dear here in the United States.

Bull and you know it...

I have quite a few friends and family members fighting in Iraq, but it ain't no holy war. I support those in the military who signed up to follow orders without question. Regardless of stance during war, they obey the oath they took. They adhere to the terms the agreed on. THEY DID NOT SIGN UP TO KILL MUSLIMS. This makes you no more honorable than those who kill us for the sole reason that we are Americans.

These are not your orders. This is not what the war is supposed to be about. You should be ashamed to even advocate this. It isn't called courage...its called ignorance, and you appear to be neck-deep.

Originally posted by Communication_Burger

Originally posted by 18XRay
I just volunteered to joined the Army with a Special Forces contract and cant wait to do my part in preserving our freedoms.

Are they sticking 'Army volunteers' straight into the special forces, these days, then?

I was looking for a student job. If no prior experience is required, maybe I can earn something extra on the side as a part time special forces commander?

I didn't read the whole thread but there also a other saying I heared it go like this "I'm not a tool of the goverment or anyone else. Fighting is the only thing I was good at nothing else but at lease I fought for what I belevie." I'm not going to lie but I heared that in a game but what I'm trying to say is Are you fight for what you belevie or what they belevie in. Ask your self that then you can see clearly and move forward just don't be a pawn ok

Be All That You Can Be

Sorry, this is probably terribly inappropriate for me to post, but the first thought I had when I read the OP was:

"Quick, somebody give that kid a gun!"

Well I don't know if your for real or not but I'll tell you this. Your young and you don't know everything but thats ok because we were all young once and I don't think any of us ever knew everything. I personally don't think your thinking straight or joining up for the right reasons but thats just my opinion. I personally hope you'll grow out of what I percieve to be an immature stage and as long your still alive there is still hope that you'll come around. The fact is you may be going to war and even though I may not agree with you idealogically I still wish you luck. We're both Americans and until the dark day this country falls apart we are on the same side. So keep your head on straight and stay safe.

Greetings all,
Interesting thread.

Just been going through it and i would have to say that there seems to be alot of narkiness in here.
Please this is a place where people can come together and talk about things, WITHOUT being flamed or having there opinions thought of in a negative light.
Besides talking civily and with facts works ALOT better then slaying each other over something like this.

Just a thought.
Omega85

Originally posted by 18XRay
...Every time someone says lets pull out of Iraq it is a slap in the face of every member of the military who by the way didn't volunteer to go to Iraq,yet goes because that's what they are called upon to do.

Now don't try to speak for everyone. I have four very close friends that have fought in Iraq. All 4 are with the 3rd Inf. Division based in Ft. Stewart Georgia. Three are in the infantry, one is a cook. Three of them have done two tours in Iraq, and the other had one tour in Afghanistan, and multiple tours in Iraq.

None of them support George Bush, or his war. From what they tell me, open political discussion in the Army is taboo, but their opinions seem to be the general consensus among the soldiers there, including officers.

According to them, the majority of people in the army that are still supporting Bush, and his war, are the pogues/REMF's, which are slang terms for soldiers that A) Don't serve in a combat capacity, and B) Have not been shipped overseas to Iraq, or Afghanistan.

It's easy to be all for Bush's foreign policies when you serve state side. It's easy to be all gung-ho for the "war on terror" when you're an Army pencil-pusher. But my friends have been there, they've seen things, and are privy to information that not too many people are. Their word is good enough for me.

And they've told me they've never forgotten how when the search for WMD's was called off, it suddenly and conveniently became a fight for the Iraqi's freedom. A so-called fight to spread democracy, while democracy here at home dwindled through the "patriot" act, and the NSA's spy program.

Originally posted by 18XRayWE CANT WIN BECAUSE OF THE CHAINS THAT YOU ALL PUT ON OUR TROOPS

What are these "chains" you speak of? "Chains" like due process, and the rule of law? Or laws governing things like common decency?

Originally posted by 18XRayWhy does it matter if any of you support the war that you will never have to fight in????? I just volunteered to joined the Army with a Special Forces contract and cant wait to do my part in preserving our freedoms.

The war on terror has nothing to do with preserving our freedoms, and I honestly hope you don't believe it does. The supposed "war on terror" has been used as an excuse to erode our freedoms and the constitution on an unprecedented level. Supposedly this country was attacked by terrorists on 9/11/01, and by the Bush administration's rationale, 250 million Americans became suspected terrorists.

No matter how bad "the terrorists" wanted to, they could never threaten our freedoms. They can threaten our citizens, and our buildings, but they can never threaten our freedom. I guarantee you the biggest threat to freedom in this country is George Bush and the Republican controlled houses.

If you really want to do your part to preserve freedom, vote the Republicans out of office.

Originally posted by 18XRay"A man that is not willing to die for something is not fit to live"

True, but I don't think you really want to die to further the neo-con/military/industrial complex's agendas? Do you?

Originally posted by 18XRay...all I said is I don't understand why civilians cant just leave the military alone and let them get the job done.

Because civilians make up the military, and the military serves the interest of the civilian population. In a country where 29% of the population still support a bad president and an illegal war, then that 29% is not representative of America. And the cilvilian population that is not against the military, they are against the government.

Originally posted by 18XRayThe US government sees that that's why no matter what you guys say we are going to stay the course.

Yeah, you know Bush, if he says something on Monday, he still believes it on Wednesday....regardless of what happened on Tuesday



[edit on 7/2/2006 by BRCMontana]

Originally posted by 18XRay
I don't think that they are praying to my god! This is a war against islam and I would like proof that it isn't!

that just shows how misinformed you are mate, they pray to exactly the same god as you

they are all part of the same tree, islam aknowledges the existance of jesus but doesn't see him as the son of god just a prophet just like judaism.

instead of immediately attacking 'liberals' for the mess there why dont you either go down to your library and read up on middle eastern history, us interferance and do your own research rather than just believing the lies from the fundamentalist christians who seem to be educating you.

check the motto of this site !

Originally posted by 18XRay
I just volunteered to joined the Army with a Special Forces contract

For some of you, what this means is that he is enlisting in the Army with the intention of taking progressing courses instruction leading to SF.

18XRay, beware that the Army recruiters aren't the best for being straightforward. Otherwise, keep your head down and your powder dry. Stay safe, keep your buddies safe, and best of luck.

For the majority of you other posters, why don't you ditch the superior attitude, just because you've got a zillion posts and someone who is apparently younger or less experienced at posting seems like an easy mark. You can sit behind your monitors and speculate and fume and flame, but in the end, for good or bad, 18XRay is going to be doing while everyone else just sits here posting. You want to bitch about the govt and an unjust war, then do something about it instead of stroking each others' ego about how smart you are and how ignorant someone like 18XRay is. It doesn't sound like anyone has set a genius record on this thread so far.

Not a matter of mark my friend. This response has echoed in person every single time I have ever heard this called a "Holy war."

That is not the stance our military needs. I only hope his basic training entails a bit of geo-political education. Thats all I ask. I seek to educate, and I over-reacted with my insults. Consider this my apology. It was in no way a stab at him for joining the military as I have many friends doing just that with my proud support. I only wish to see people know WHY they are joining.

Fighting Islam is not it.

Originally posted by DaFunk13
I only hope his basic training entails a bit of geo-political education.

Unfortunately this goes against the whole concept of indoctrination. Dehumanization of the enemy is the main way that govts and groups can get an otherwise sensible human being to pull the trigger on another human being who is probably doing the same thing that you are: trying to stay alive.

I think the only answer is "no war" but human nature seems to make it anathema. We're our own worst enemies. All we can do is keep the dialogue open, I think, and pick where to make our stands, metaphorically and physically.

[edit on 3-7-2006 by hogtie]

Originally posted by hogtie
I think the only answer is "no war" but human nature seems to make it anathema. We're our own worst enemies. All we can do is keep the dialogue open, I think, and pick where to make our stands, metaphorically and physically.

Nicely worded and very true. Nice to see that smart people still join ATS.

there is hope

Originally posted by DaFunk13

there is hope

I hope I haven't gone so far as to cause something as dreadful as that!

Thanks.

Originally posted by 18XRayTHE MEDIA IS CRITICAL OF THE WAR and how can you say that we are not at war against Islamic extremists, when was the last time a christian hijacked acouple of planes and flew them into buildings full of completely innocent people. Have you seen the footage of the beheadings? I don't think that they are praying to my god! This is a war against islam and I would like proof that it isn't!

Okey dokey lets get started.

First off i have to agree with something Michael Moore said, i don't agree with this man a lot but one thing he said stood out to me. "Why is it that whenever someone critises the war they have to add 'oh but i support the troops'. Of course they support the troops"

It seems that anyone who doesn't support what is an essentially illegal war they get shot down with this comment and made to look very bad. It's a clever little strategy, the mud slinger always wins.

Now to pick apart the above quote

how can you say that we are not at war against Islamic extremists, when was the last time a christian hijacked acouple of planes and flew them into buildings full of completely innocent people.

Well i don't remember when they last used a plane but christians have commited plenty of horrible crimes including massacres. I mean how far back do you want to go? Should i simply mention the crusades which was a holy war? Should i bring up the fact that many of the people who colinised america were christian and enslaved many black people? You have a go at the islamic holy war and yet you are quite happy to use the term for your own one. Christians have killed many people so don't just make it sound like islam followers are the only ones.

What about the modern time fire bombings of abortion clinics? What about the threats to workers there? What about the fire bombing of homosexual clubs? Many commited by christian extremists adamantly following the teachings of a book which may or may not have been the word of god.

This is a war against islam and I would like proof that it isn't!

Nil desperandum. I have friends who follow the islamic faith. They are extremely nice people who don't support the acts commited by the extremists. They have tried their absolute best to distance themselves from the extremists because they believe that the extremists are not following the religion properly.

Islam is not the problem, it is some peoples interpretation of it. I also belive it is the nature of the people who gravitate towards extremism that is the problem. Obviously some are brain washed, the leaders though seem like naturally cruel people.

So you wanted proof? Would a meek and mild muslim be proof? Someone who never commited a crime, hates the terrorists who have commited horrible acts of violence and supports the arrest and prosecution of such people? If so then please let me introduce you to some of the people i know.

I don't think that they are praying to my god!

That's a classic and truly stupid statement. I don't like insulting people like i just did but it is truly stupid to make such a claim. If your god is so great then why did he let the Koran be written? Why didn't he stop it? Have you ever considered, and lets assume there is a god here, that there is one god who wrote different religions knowing that some people wouldn't like just one? Maybe they would want to choose and lead their lives in a certain way? Surely choice is the one thing a god would have assured us? Choice of belief is a very important choice, maybe one of the most important.

Many people following the islamic faith are peaceful and friendly, going about their daily business as doctors, lawyers, shop owners, bin cleaners and professinal dominatrices. Ok the last one may only be true of very loose followers of the faith. Are you saying that these people are dangerous becuase they follow the islamic faith? How would you feel if i said that christians are dangerous becuase they follow a faith. Afterall as i said above christians have done some horrible things as well.

I wish you luck in the military. I don't want anyone to die for no real reason, even if they are as uninformed as you. If you end up in Iraq or somewhere else then i hope you eventually come home alive and with all your limbs and mental facilties intact.

Deny ignorance, don't accept it as a path to bliss.

[edit on 3-7-2006 by ImaginaryReality1984]