Poll of ATS Members' Political Ideology

F - Neither Liberal nor Conservative - Do Not Support the Bush Administration

I voted for Kerry because the other evil is more evil.

Hell, way back when.... I voted for Ross Perot. I even printed 100,000 of his yard signs.

I support the civilian-lead disarming and deconstruction of our current government. Leading to the rebuilding of our government according to the U.S. Constitution. By the people and for the people. I know, hell will probably freeze over first but I can hope, can't I?

An odd mixture of B and F.
Cheers Xpert11.

26 have now voted

A 8
B 2

C 0
D 2

E 0
F 14


And while it's clear that most conservative-leaning people support Bush and most liberal-leaning people do not, the purpose of this question was to see if there was any crossover (conservatives who don't support this administration, for example) and it seems to be the case. It's the minority for sure, but my point is that just because someone is conservative, it doesn't necessarily follow that they support this administration (B). And just because they don't support this administration, doesn't mean they're liberal (F).

I must say that I'm personally thrilled that many people are not associating themselves with the political 'right' or 'left', but choosing to associate with both or neither. Not that there's anything wrong with 'right' and 'left'. Some of my best friends are 'right' and 'left'.

I'm just heartened by the variety. Thank you all for responding and I hope to hear more responses.

Those respondents not tallied:
dr_strangecraft
wecomeinpeace
Majic (was there an answer in there?)
xpert11 (B or F?)

Updated Vote Tally at 11 AM EDT Wednesday 6/21/2006

30 have now voted


A Yes 8 -26.7%
B No 2 ½ -8.3%

C Yes 0
D No 2 -6.7%

E Yes ½ -1.7%
F No 16 -53.3%

G No 1 -3.3%


Bush Yes, 26.7%
Bush No, 73.3%

Cons, 33.5%
Libs, 6.7%
Other, 56.7% -


On Scorekeepers prerogative (But Subject to timely revision)
Foot Note: 1. Gallopinghordes: You fall “outside” but I made it an F
Foot Note: 2. Majic was allotted to F


[edit on 6/21/2006 by donwhite]

F

There are a few things I agree with Bush on, but for the most part I disagree with him.

A

Although I don't strictly follow the party line.

F

I do not subscribe to any political party. I support lesser Federal government, leading to lesser government spending; equal power in the three branches of government; gun ownership; personal, privacy and property rights; stricter border control.

F for me.

I am a one party person.

I think I will receive an F on this test...

F - Neither Liberal nor Conservative - Do Not Support the Bush Administration

D....without a doubt....self described old hippy liberal and proud of it dag nabbit!

D - Normally, I consider myself a moderate who leans left. But as of late, I consider myself more as a liberal.

F

That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, — That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness. Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shewn that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security.

-Thomas Jefferson

39 Have Voted as of 11 PM Thursday, 6/22/06

A - 10, 25.6%
B - 2 1/2, 6.4%
C - 0
D - 4, 10.3%
E - 1/2, 1.3%
F - 21, 53.8%
G - 1, 2.6%





[edit on 6/22/2006 by donwhite]

Good question yer' Benevolence,

F:neither liberal nor conservative- Do Not support the Bush Administration.

1. Church/State separation is, I believe, fundamental to the broadest protection of inherent human rights.

2. Fiscal Responsibility: a necessary attribute to everyone, from individuals/families/business/ and especially...GOVERNMENT. It doesn't mean things might not be a struggle at times, it means using whatever you do have WISELY.

3. Gun Ownership: and with the harshest of penalties for those who commit crimes involving violence, especially with guns.

4. Compassionate Governance: As far as possible, a government should have a compassionate social policy for those who are truly in need of assistance.

I believe that it is only when we can demonstrate an ability to have a fully functioning society based on human rights, compassion and justice, that we will have anything of real value (other than Democracy) to "spread" around the globe.
The "People's Purse" should be used at home first.

5. Strong Military: Cut the pork and give the Nation a well armed, supplied, supported, and highly trained military. Use it only as a last resort, and mercilessly defend the Nation with it in case of real threat. If you have to ask those folks to destroy lives then give them the overwhelming force, supply and commitment necessary to settle the matter as quickly as possible.

6. The Constitution: The value of the fundamental ideals underlying this document, when adhered to, cannot be overstated. And, I believe the spirit of the document is towards the continuing expansion of Liberty and Equal Rights under the law.

7. PUBLIC PARTICIPATION: It's great that we can freely express our beliefs in America, but it has to get beyond griping about things and on to informing ourselves on the issues and vote, write, e-mail, generally harrass our representatives to honestly represent as many of us as possible.


If I could, I would also force The Media to generally grow a spine, give a damn about the real issues, and do some "as-truly-as-possible impartial" investigative journalism.
Enough of the freakin' dog-and-pony show that passes for information which is truly in the Public Interest.

Bleh, I say.

OK, apocalypticon, help me. I can identify the 9th Division shoulder patch and the Field Artillery collar insignia for officers, but I cannot identify the third patch. What is it?

From www.diggerhistory.info/00-pages-top-level/master-index.htm#all-sites

posted by apocalypticon

Good question yer' Benevolence,

2. Fiscal Responsibility: a necessary attribute especially . . GOVERNMENT . . It means using what you have WISELY.
4. Compassionate Governance: As far as possible, a government should have a compassionate social policy for those who are truly in need of assistance. The "People's Purse" should be used at home first.
5. Strong Military: give the Nation a well armed, supplied, supported, and highly trained military. Use it only as a last resort, and mercilessly defend the Nation with it in case of real threat.
The Media grow a spine and do some "as-truly-as-possible impartial" investigative journalism. Enough of the freakin' dog-and-pony show that passes for information. [Edited by Don W]

Durn, Ap-con, this is one heck of a post. I forgot the topic. I’ll look-see at what you have said. I’ve picked a couple topics that interest me. Item 2. Fiscal. Etc. We need to have enough taxes to equal our outlay. That does not mean raise war funds and cut social funds. If we want more war, raise taxes and earmark it for “war for the duration” as I asked for in 2001, a 75 cents a gallon “war tax” for the duration. Makes everybody think he’s part of the effort. Plus, encourages conservation. What we call a “win-win” move.

Item 4. Starts off great but you’ve got a couple “qualifiers” in there. Maybe intentional, maybe not. I’m looking at “as far as possible” which is rather loose when you’re hungry. Help for people who are “truly in need” is another potential escape clause. We hear too much of this kind of "wanna help but" talk from the R&Fs. Hardly ever hear it from the dispossessed. Hmm? I hope you meant to do more than to pray for us? As in an ac cooled mega-church, pray for the homeless?

Item 5. Well, after 1991, it is hard to find an enemy worthy of our weaponry. If we can’t find an enemy in 15 years, maybe it is time to ratchet down our weaponry? Surely we could use the money to better advantage? Andy Rooney said last Sunday we had 8,000 Abrams tanks. Hmm? Are we planning to fight the Second Battle of Kursk? I doubt the Ruskies could get 800 tanks to run. It’s my estimate fewer than 100 M1A1s could counter all the low riders in Los Angeles! Viva Mexico!

Item Media. As for the media, I believe the media has always been “mis-used” in the eyes of many, including me. History tells us T Jefferson started it with slander on G Washington and J Adams. And they reciprocated! Back in the more recent good old days, I read the Manchester (England) Guardian air edition. Alistair Cooke was their US reporter and I got better news coverage albeit a week late than in most US papers.

The Dow Jones Company published the National Observer, a weekly that arrived on Monday morning, which was regarded as the best weekly in the US, until the Dow Jones Company cancelled it because of complaints from Wall Street Journal advertisers it was too much left wing and getting on their case. And etc. We just can’t rely on one or even two sources. Plus, we need to read some hard bound books. By worthy authors. And etc. Good post, Ap-Con.

Best military insignia website I've seen.
See www.diggerhistory.info...



[edit on 6/23/2006 by donwhite]

I wish there were more options, but..

F - Neither Liberal nor Conservative - Do Not Support the Bush Administration

F - I voted Libertarian in the last election.

Hey Don W,

Sorry about the length of the post--I got rather a bit overzealous with the spirit of the thing

As for #4: as to the qualifiers; I mean "as far as possible" only in the sense that there are some things which require not only external support systems but also as much personal effort as the individual is able to contribute. This will vary depending upon the person and situation; however, Government, in it's capacity of "providing for the common good", should develop support systems designed to ameliorate the degree to which individuals are unable to help themselves (imho).

This would involve a whole raft of things; from adequate support for mental health/rehab programs, to adequate support for the infirm and elderly, to programs which actually make it possible for the highest percentage of individuals possible to achieve the education required to build a truly vibrant, functional society.

One which has a real interest in assisting people in becoming productive, independant citizens--which is what I believe the overwhelming majority of people want for themselves.

A society, in other words, which doesn't look the other way as people die under bridges or on park benches, or suffer the indignities of dehumanizing treatment in shoddy retirement centers (or worse) to name only a couple of things.

Am I a "Bleeding Heart"? Probably. (you didn't ask the question, or assume it...but others will).

As for the "mega-church" thing...I am not a fan of the current mega-church phenomenon but that's beside the point. To inadequately paraphrase The Man Himself:
What good does it do to tell the poor or those in need "Have a good day" or "I wish you well" without actually seeing to it that those in need receive real, tangible help. You know, the food, shelter, clothing type of stuff. Prayer is a good thing but it can also be an excuse for inaction/uninvolvement. Bleh on that, I say...

I do believe in reading books...all kinds...it's one of the few ways to get in depth, nuanced info. I have a library that covers a whole wall of my home, floor-to-ceiling...and most of it is pretty good stuff. I was a History major in university, so I like to read...a lot

Alright, this is turning into another full-blown article so I better stop.

BTW: The other unit patch is for the 3/2 ACR (3rd Squadron, 2nd Armored Cavalry Regiment). I was deployed with this unit's Howitzer Battery (M109 A1's) as a Forward Observer.

And to anybody out there who knows that unit: Toujours Pret!!!

Whew! Man that was long...still awake?



[edit on 21o06e305406e 54 by apocalypticon]

Another Edit The thing about the military was primarily aimed at cutting out the waste and Pork. My god, man, look at the cash they can't account for simply from what was doled out of the backs of trucks to contractors in Iraq.

Millions, or even billions, might not seem like much in the face of our national indebtedness, but it could do one heck of a lot for any well run assistance program.

[edit on 53o06e301006e 10 by apocalypticon]