Me and "Them"- Alien Experiences

reply to post by jritzmann


yeah dude me and you need to do some u2u on here i believe its called love the maiden avatar btw! if your gonna die die with your boots on!

Originally posted by cripmeister
Your writing (and your story) is very similar to Striebers and this makes me highly suspicious I'm afraid. I'm not accusing you of plagiarism but the similarity is striking.

I really fail to see how similar it is, other than that neither of us leave out the descriptions of high strangeness that accompany the experience. I SUCK at writing. I am NO writer. I'm a professional artist and I do much better at visuals than I do words.

The descriptive high strangeness is an often left out fact, because no one wants to address that part of it in depth. Not Hopkins, nor Jacobs, or most in between.

This is a VERY large part of the problem. People not in the experience or outside the subject have a skewed notion of scenario of what this experience is like. It's been poisoned with bad research, and poor practices.

If you listen to any one of the Paratopia episodes we've done with people having the experience, or those doing in-depth research that coinsides with experiences (such as Colin Andrews) they do in fact speak at length about the strangeness, and the notion of this being far more complex than your garden variety "alien".

Of course when you are an open book and speak of the experience with 100% honesty...well lets put it this way, the paranormal in general has a battle cry all it's own:

"Make them look like a nut."

To talk about these experiences with open honesty is to be thought a fool. And, that's as big a part of this enigma than any other part. The sooner people understand that the more we all can move forward.

[edit on 14-1-2010 by jritzmann]

reply to post by cripmeister


Yeah that's what I was referring to as the medical condition didn't know what the english term was.

Originally posted by jritzmann

Originally posted by cripmeister
Your writing (and your story) is very similar to Striebers and this makes me highly suspicious I'm afraid. I'm not accusing you of plagiarism but the similarity is striking.

I really fail to see how similar it is, other than that neither of us leave out the descriptions of high strangeness that accompany the experience. I SUCK at writing. I am NO writer. I'm a professional artist and I do much better at visuals than I do words.

Your descriptions of the beings are similar. Many accounts of visitors (or aliens) are but both your accounts stand out. The beings wear hats, yours has a gong (made of metal I suppose) and Striebers (in Communion) wears a metal breast plate. Your hitchhiker experience and Striebers visitor couple in the bookstore are also similar. Both these events were interpreted and not spelled out when they actually happened. The results of the events are the same - the beings seem to exist outside of the mind. Most events though seem to take place in a dream state where we know high strangeness is the norm.

I think your writing is excellent, I read everyone of your posts in the thread.

You've met Strieber and talked to the guy. Are you a fan of his writing?





[edit on 14-1-2010 by cripmeister]

Originally posted by cripmeister
The beings wear hats, yours has a gong (made of metal I suppose) and Striebers (in Communion) wears a metal breast plate.

No, he had no gong his "clap" sounded like a gong (as bizarre as that sounds) His "hat" if that's what it was, yes, seemed to be made of a coppery/brass like material.

Originally posted by cripmeister
Your hitchhiker experience and Striebers visitor couple in the bookstore are also similar.

I don't totally recall his experience of the bookstore, but I don't recall him being relocated in that experience. The notion of these beings looking as they do at times is not unique to me, nor Whitley, nor anyone else for that matter.

Originally posted by cripmeister
The results of the events are the same - the beings seem to exist outside of the mind. Most events though seem to take place in a dream state where we know high strangeness is the norm.

I wouldn't call it dream state, not when I'm totally awake, driving a vehicle, or walking down the hallway, etc. I do agree there's an altered state of consciousness involved. You feel physically different. Your visual perception is sharper, and everything seems to be buzzing around these beings. People I've had shared experiences with have also noted that (wife, friends, and so on) It's not a constant, but it's prevalent in close proximity of the beings.

Originally posted by cripmeister
I think your writing is excellent, I read everyone of your posts in the thread.

Well thats very kind of you and I appreciate it. I've been trying to write all this down in a cohesive way for years now, and I'm never happy with how I write. It always ends up sounding like a high school student wrote it. Maybe I oughtta just say screw it and let it be written the way it is.

Originally posted by cripmeister
You've met Strieber and talked to the guy. Are you a fan of his writing?

Jeremy and I interviewed him on episode one of our podcast, and I'd spoken with him back when I worked for Sightings and Parascope on AOL, then met him in Gulf Breeze and spoke briefly.

Jeremy will probably kill me for saying this, but I'm not a huge fan. I'm also not a big reader of books on this aspect of the subject. I think Strieber was the first to account his experiences in a pictorial way for a reader. In truth for my money, thats the ONLY way to describe it. You MUST put someone in your shoes, or it's just not going to translate.

I think Whitley has been honest about his perceptions, but I also think he's been a bit naive about who he associates his name with and who he endorses. This has not helped him as far as I'm concerned, but thats my opinion.

He also has seemed to become less critical of data the past so many years - which again is a hallmark of paranormal activity - after some time people involved seem to lose their critical thinking. Look at how many researchers start out good, and end up sounding like lunatics. It's all about marginality.

This phenomena has for decades, contradicted and has thrown doubt upon itself. Think about that. Thats a very critical point to all this.





[edit on 14-1-2010 by cripmeister]

[edit on 15-1-2010 by jritzmann]

I like this thread.... here is my own.


I woke up when I was around 5, to consciousness.

I remember that I used to have strange dreams of entrapment, and not being able to escape because of a wall that kept growing.


I remember that I moved to another house, at around 10-13.


I remember being asleep, sort of... looking down at the foot of my bed, and there was this... "Shadow" with piercing red eyes.

I felt trapped.

I tried so say "No", but my mouth wouldn't move... my vocal chords did not respond.

But I FELT the impulse to *SAY* no.


So I tried to say it again.

Still no sound.

But I felt the impulse to "Want" to say no INCREASE.


I kept repeating NO, over and over and over again....


Until I heard my voice begin to register a slight whisper of a "no", and the Dream was over.

I awoke covered in sweat, heart pounding.



I later had another dream.


This time, a silver saucer ripped the roof off of my house, and a yellow beam of light shot in at me.

This, was quite unusual to me... so I got scared and said "No"

Once.


And, I was awake.




Weeks after that event, I was standing in my back yard.


I looked up to the sky, and saw two stars directly overhead.



I had with me, my notebook... scribbles, math, musings, and rantings....


As I was looking up at the stars, I dropped my notebook and I immediately felt myself rising upwards at incredible rates.


I looked back down, and I saw my city, then my state, then my continent... then my planet.


Then Luna. (The Moon)



I got scared... I felt like I was leaving something important behind.


I fell.


I fell so fast...

I saw myself looking up at me looking down at me.... rushing toward me.


as I fell, I saw that my notebook had landed on its edge.


I returned to my body, and was still looking straight up at the stars.


I looked down, and there was my notebook, standing on it's edge.... just like I had seen before....



Things began to get REALLY weird years later... but that is another story.



-Edrick

Reading these types of stories along this line of events... All it leaves me thinking is how it feels to be that turtle.



Be sure to watch the video.

Do the scientists really look like they're showing love towards the turtle?
Is the work involved all that enjoyable for them? (Maybe in the long scheme, but right at the moment with non-ideal conditions?)
Is it necessary work in the scheme of things?
Does the turtle understand what's going on and knows of the importance behind it?
If some method of tranquilizer was used, how does that affect the turtle's perception of such an experience?
Does the turtle like being confined against its will?
Does the turtle appear to enjoy the measures that must be taken to get sample data about it's health and its role in the environment? (Tissue samples, things being stuck in it without permission, possibly taking away its privacy by attaching a tracking beacon.)
Can the turtle tell the scientists about any possible pain or adverse effects from this procedure? Or even mention how (if possible) communicating this experience affects social interaction with other turtles?

Interestingly enough, we humans are actually smart enough to know more than the turtle. Some of us would likely even be able to willingly provide samples or information if we knew the full story and were in the turtle's position. It seems that there'd be benefit of the whole situation being less of a PITA from the contributor's perspective. (As in being no more bothersome than making a blood donation or taking a scheduled physical.) Unfortunately I doubt alien scientists (observing how humans typically do things) would have the ability to trust that samples willingly provided aren't being intentionally corrupted to give false results. So they would still want to go through the process and procedure directly, and take extra measures to make tampering as difficult as possible.

Still I'm curious as to what the answer or potential dialog would be if somebody mentally projected observed footage of a video like this while undergoing an abduction experience. (I feel it's likely the case and should get an honest answer, if they really wanted humans gone at this stage - it's just one simple nudged asteroid away.) Frankly I'd like to get a rough idea of how our planet is doing, how much could be considered our fault, and how we'd be graded when compared to any possible "peers" that may be out there in a similar stage of technology and civilization.

After reading the whole thread, my question is: If they aren't e.t., what are they?

I know you mentioned occult, the symbol on the mirror being angelic (I don't remember the exact term you used), etc. What does that all imply? Something spiritual (I don't mean biblical or religious)? Why would something not e.t. need craft/vehicles as you've mentioned.

I'm just trying to understand where you are saying they come from if you don't think they're e.t.

This reminds me of hornum's thread a little. He basically stated people have these experiences, but they're not e.t.

reply to post by dlifesjrny

If they aren't e.t., what are they?

Well that's the million dollar question. JRitzmann hasn't visited ATS since April let's hope he stops by soon and joins the discussion.

Perhaps the similarities between many religious books can account for what these beings are. Maybe they are the one's considered "fallen" from God's (the ultimate creator) grace by choice. They are the ones that seek to be God through technology and as a result have alienated themselves from him. As a result of this alienation, they can only experience one side of emotions (love and hate). I have heard love and hate described as not the opposites of each other, but one being merely the absence of another. Hate is whats left when you reject love. God is something, the absence of God is nothing. God is everything that is. The tricky part is knowing what "is" and what is the "absence of something." I do it based purely off intuition (leaves room for bias and for me directing the defining in the way i want it to go. Example: You could say God is hate and the absence of him is love. Call it a bias but to most people, if not all, this is counter intuitive. So if the rejection of the Creator is what made these beings what they are then they can no longer experience what is, only the absence. Perhaps they are looking for those who experience emotions that are the lack of something (fear) so they can get to the emotions on the other side of the spectrum (comfort). Think of it like a drug induced high. When the drug wears off, you never go directly to normal, you go from a high to a low then eventually back to the mid-line. The comfort (or what ever feeling they lack and want) is much stronger after a feeling of intense fear. There is such a relief that the event is over that you feel better than you did before the event. The intense fear creates intense comfort. They desire this gives them the comfort they felt in the presence of the Creator. This is how they cope with their decision to pursue god-hood. It makes sense that they can only enter our lives with our permission because they are below the creator and know it (they still haven't obtained what they seek, nor will they ever). I don't think the Lord's Prayer (maybe I'm wrong) is what helped you that one time, but the feeling behind the prayer and who you were calling to. Not calling one specific God (what the Lord's Prayer was intended for through Christianity), but the one true God, Creator of existence, the one who is. If these beings are sensitive to feelings (it seems they are with how they manipulate feelings) then they would have reacted to your prayer in anguish (it reminded them of what they left), not because of the words but because of the feeling behind it and the direction of that feeling.

- A question or two for Jritzmann: 1) Have you ever tried to command these beings? How did they respond? 2) Did you ever get the feeling you were being put through a "good cop, bad cop" routine? (From one of your encounters, this is what I inferred. One was angrily telling you to open your eyes creating the intense fear while the other was trying to comfort you by holding your hand and reassuring you to produce the feeling of comfort). If it comforts you, these beings are under the power of the Creator, just as we are. It is your choice whether you choose to pursue these beings and their quest or to just know that you are going to be fine because the Creator wills it.

-Sorry I ramble, I just have a lot of thoughts and its difficult to structure them because I don't have all the information and can't create a perfectly linear flow.

Mr Ritzmann

Thank you for sharing this amazing unfolding of events. I assume you never wrote the book. I WILL check out your program.

I think the spiritual aspect is quite valid and comes closer to defining the generality of the experience than anything else. It also makes me think that just maybe this is why the governments ridicule the UFO phenomenon.. Maybe, just this once, they are acting in our best interest.

Best of luck to you, sir.

And, PS, this is a totally shameless BUMP!

Sorry, I haven't read all 16 pages of this thread but reading the OP's story, one thing struck me...the mention of the thing in your eye sounds like a very good and detailed description of the start of an aura migraine. As for the rest of it, I have no idea - interesting though.

reply to post by jritzmann


The man who said this:

"I believe ya young man, for one reason alone...you recall every minute detail. Like someone who survives a plane crash. You cant fake that impact."

is very mistaken, you don't remember unless it is given to you to remember, and sometimes that is altered. For some reason it feels like not negatives, thought the long black nails seemed more negative to me. Rather it feels as if there is some purpose to what is happening versus more positive glimpses. I thinks Sleepers thread about Ets Being As Real The Nose on Your Face, brings up the complex way people are challenged with their issues and love/tough love scenarios. Fear is something that alters things especially energetic or soul interactions.

Very interesting account. The saucers had the red light didn't they, as those are we most commonly see. With connection and contact for me, pinging for my son. I see humans. But I've seen a grey in the flesh twice,and a movement that made both my son and I jump rapidly in shock that was grey sized and he's seen one once while awake. Seems more than one species works together.

The saucer covered in the red light was about 30-40 feet, I only thought they could be 2 seaters, or something small, but Sleeper talked about them being larger inside and there is a base like that that is larger inside than it looks on the outside, so we don't know.

Everyone's direct experience with whom they're dealing with seems somewhat different, there are parallels but race and experiences are similar but often different, and that is something that may relate strongly to the person, their perception, beliefs, or tests.

I wish your wife and you well, and peace, healing, being able to integrate your experiences, and be stronger more loving in your choices, for being aware is already a sign of awareness. Its a good thing you to are able to discuss this together and one is not unaware.

Originally posted by dlifesjrny
After reading the whole thread, my question is: If they aren't e.t., what are they?

Imagine my surprise coming by here today...wow. The show is now over a year old, and Jeremy and I have taken a different approach since episode 70: Inviting listeners to do their own interviews with UFO or paranormal luminaries (which we set up and record)...or, they do their own episode on their own angle of the topic and send it to us for airing.

We're still doing shows together on-air as special events (We have Travis Walton on this week) so we're still involved and getting ready to launch a new site.

To answer the above quoted question: I don't know what "they" are. However I feel confident enough to say that it's far greater reaching and of deeper complexity than extraterrestrials. There are definitive connections to other "paranormal" events, and many aspects of this seem to fit into quantum theory.

The question of what is here, wearing the mask of an "alien", but needing marginality and anti-structural frameworks - in no way fits an extraterrestrial hypothesis. It's too early for hypothesis anyway. We need to look at what events surround paranormal occurrences - rather than focus too much on the actual event. Look at the consistencies across the board.

That lends serious clues.

"Why" is not a productive question to ask - you can theorize all you like, but it's not going to get you anywhere...we need to look seriously at what seems like peripheral issues. But, they are ultimately connected to potentials of better questions to ask.

Answers won't come from the UFO field on this. It's a stagnated mess of rehashed sci-fi and pedestrian nonsense. Look outside the field for interesting threads to pull on.

So in short dlifesjrny, I don't know. But I have a good feeling about what it isn't. This phenomena doesn't fit little green men. It's far more complex than that. That's my opinion anyway.

Very intriguing that you logged in tonight. I've been reading most of your replies and I'm almost flabbergasted by your story, and I've regularly disregarded most stories of somewhat similar content as bogus, but this is a real treat. At least for me, considering how rare it is that I trust anyone's story over the internet.

It really is a huge leap of faith taking anyone's word over the internet, but I have to say that I'm on the verge of taking that leap after reading this. Thanks for sharing nonetheless, and I wish you well.

You talked about "high strangeness"... And while I love the term, I do realize you weren't using it in any kind of a fun way.

What this all makes me think of... have you ever read anything by David Icke? There's alotta strangeness going on there. Somewhere (and it's been a few years so please forgive my lack of accurate source) in his writings, he talks about beings from another dimension.... TPTB, he alleges, have made deals with these 'others' to keep their own power....because it's these 'others' who REALLY have the power. (As in your own instance of winding up in Ohio when you were following your dad)
Now, I feel like a total whack job writing that, but it's the thing that resonates for me. Living in deep caves in Asia, maybe the Himalayas. EDIT: Not living, as such, but like the veil is thin there??
But DEFINITELY 'other' and definitely evil.

I hope you make announcements here when you get the book written.

Best to you and yours...................

[edit on 27-7-2010 by ThatDGgirl]

reply to post by jritzmann

The return trip must have taken five hours!!! Wow, you must have really been freaked out. Was the Truck Stop the I-70?

Please continue.

Originally posted by Zarathrusta


By chance, I opened your thread... ... and I'm terrified with what I read.
I mean just to think that what you've written here might really be true. I have no words for it. |:
I read some parts of your stories about two or three times, just to make sure I was reading right, and my whole body chilled with fear each time I read it. I'm not exagerating here.

[edit on 16/7/06 by Zarathrusta]

I read all of it up to about page 14 and i can say i feel the same way, it brings me fear just thinking about it because ever since i was little ive always been scared of the dark and in particular looking outside my window when its dark. Over the past 2 weeks ive been watching Aline/UFO topics in ATS and i do feel alot darker atmosphere around me and i dont like it.
I had to turn this off at page 14 because i felt cries from inside that it was going to go too far if i was to continue.
I will say God Bless to you and i wish you all the best in the future and that Jesus guides you through this evil.
and hats off to you for taking the time to tell us and post your stories, incredible.

[edit on 27-7-2010 by Detrucci]

Ok, now this is just too freakin wierd...

...for what reason would a UFO book be included in the curriculum of a satanic group, and why Ray's book in particular? I emailed Ray and asked him if he had any insight into the situation, but he was as perplexed as I was. And there matters rested for a year or so until additional information came into my hands, information that may indicate - much as John Keel himself believed (Mothman Prophesies) - that occult activity may be an ingredient of the "grey alien" mystery.

From this website... [url=http://www.boudillion.com/lam/lam.htm[/url]

Don't know if you've ever looked into this, but it sure seems pertinent...

Might as well add this too... conspiracyarchive.com...

Oddly, the thread where I just found this info was started around the same time as this thread.

[edit on 28-7-2010 by ThatDGgirl]

[edit on 28-7-2010 by ThatDGgirl]

[edit on 28-7-2010 by ThatDGgirl]

reply to post by ThatDGgirl


Seems somehow fitting. Trickster element in full play there eh? Even more suspect that this thread was moved to another forum by a moderator who's membership isn't as old as this thread is. Yet he'she refuses to answer my simple question as to it's movement - will ALL unverified accounts of weirdness and unverified sighting reports also be moved here??

I have to say I'm really put off. Probably best I stay on my side of the fence at Paratopia.