Why does everyone pussyfoot around Islam?

To say this thread isn't racist is like saying the Nazis weren't racist as they killed Polish, German and Russian Jews.

I dont think this thread is racist ,( the part about deporting them probably is) but i think the point being tried to make is that the muslims have got to integrate with people of their host countries and respect and abide by the laws of that country, not just come out with the jargon that they are goverened by islamic law. Also they have to respect and try to adopt the cultures and way of life of that country otherwise both sides will never get on.

the reason why people pussyfoot with them are , like we have seen lately they all ways blow stuff out of proportion,even if you criticize them they call for your beheading.they act before thinking and its mostly the imams fault because they brain wash these people in you there warp view of Islam and prey on the un educated

Now your new argument is why we Muslims don’t protest against these terrorists as violently as we do against the cartoons??

I am a Muslim and the problem is I don’t know who the real terrorists are? Who are they if you can please tell me clearly?

Are the Chechens terrorists because they are fighting for independence against Russians?
Are the Chechens terrorists because they are retaliating after the results of Russian helicopters firing anti-tank missile at children playing on play grounds?
Are the Chechens terrorists because because most of their men are dead and now the woman’s are blowing themselves up because they have nothing to live for! Their children dead, husband’s dead, brothers dead.
Your media doesn’t show their side, they only show Russians suffering e.g. school and theatre siege. Visit Chechnya and you will know who the real terrorists are.

Are the Palestinians terrorists because they are fighting for their land against Israel?
Are the Palestinians terrorists because they have nothing to live for except blowing themselves up under Israeli occupation?
Are the Palestinians terrorist because they retaliate to the on going Israeli assassinations and killings taking place everyday?
You don’t know what life is like when there are checkpoints after every 1 mile and the city surrounded with walls with the sounds of tanks, bulldozers and firings and explosions taking place on daily bases. Women getting sexually harassed when being searched by IDF at checkpoints.

Were the Bosnians terrorists because they retaliated after their mass massacres took place in Srebrenica and daily killings of women and children and getting raped by the Serb forces?
Your Western countries watched for 5 years while this was all happening in Europe, than you took action when most of the Muslims were slaughtered.

Are the Afghans terrorists because you left them for civil war for 15 years after they crippled soviets?
Is Osama Bin Laden and his group terrorists because the US helped them to cripple soviets and now that they have turned towards them because they have waged the same war against them?

Are the Iraqis terrorists because they didn’t give you free access to their oil?
Are the Iraqis terrorists because they are retaliating for a war based on nothing and has claimed more than 150,000 lives?
You have totally destroyed that country and now you say Iraqis are free and real democracy will take place.

Is this what you call free world, free of dictatorships, a world full of peace and democracy?
Why don’t you just admit it that you want to wipe out Muslims 1by 1 so that it makes things clear of what your real intentions are.

You know when I hear all this happening to Muslims; I start to wonder what does the word terrorist means and who are the actual terrorists.

Could'nt agree with you more Holedigger, when you live in any particular country you must abide with their laws and legislation.
Could you imagine if you were a Christian rioting in Iran or Syria for your beliefs, ain't happening man! or if you did I think you would conveniently disappear.
Yeah sure you can protest in a free country but you don't go around inciting terrorism in the country you are living in( you've seen the banners)
If you want to live in a democratic state that's exactly what it is, you can't change it, and if you don't like it go and live in a Dictatorial Islamic state.

iman

I cant beleve the amout of ignorance that there is in the Western world in regards to Islam. As you can see the people are ignorant of these things and thus are one sided. No one telsl this side of the story in the Western media. Because if people understood why many muslems called for jihad, the governments and business responsible for this would be gone. We are both being played by our government witch are ran by business.

After reading what Iman said, why cant people see this?

Originally posted by Alien DNA
If you want to live in a democratic state that's exactly what it is, you can't change it, and if you don't like it go and live in a Dictatorial Islamic state.

So you think then that citizens should have no say in law makeing of democratic countries?

Makes me almost glad that I'll be a sea for long stretches of time, atleast at sea the law doesnt change much.

So you think then that citizens should have no say in law makeing of democratic countries?

I think what he was trying to say is that if you live in a democratic and free state then yes you do have a say in the laws and regulations of that state. You have a say as long as those laws are within the bounds of the fundamental principles of democracy. However if for example you’re in the US and you’re lobbying for a law outlawing the fist amendment then that law will never get passed because it violates one of our basic principles. Now, if you don't like that, well, no one is forcing you to stay in the US, or any free country for that matter.

The problem IMO is that thanks to constant tinkering in the Middle East, there is a hatred for the West. It's not surprising. If someone stormed into your land and told you to do things this way or that, or face death. Wouldn't you be a little bit miffed? Iman correctly points out mass atrocities that have happened to Muslims. Not to mention the lack of publicity those causes got. That was until they decided to kidnap folk, explode and do all sorts of nasty things. It's a shame. Not all Muslims are terroists. Contray to whatever the Sun may say. Some folk have agendas.

Originally posted by supercheetah

Originally posted by Alien DNA


PS I'm going to take it one further than you: Religion is a pox upon the world.

[edit on 2/5/2006 by supercheetah]

i agree with you on this. i know this isnt a religious topic, but religion is the great whore mentioned in the well known book of revelations. people give it money and they make you feel good. physically and mentally very satisfying but very deadly spiritually. what a deception. perfect. and while the deception grows thru the centuries, the plan for the different religions to destroy each other works like clockwork. all the while, just outside the chaos there is truth.

Okay listen there is hundreds of protests around the world, just because this one takes a further approach to it doesnt mean you deport them all out of your country. The "west" started the problem so they should solve it.

Are we allowed to protest about not allowing people to be saved in the name of Christ when a Billion Muslims are being held hostage in their religion? Can we protest the fact Christians go to jail in Iran for preaching?

To be honest we have protested and Bush has done his protest by invading Iraq, but then again if we let them do as they do we could have been sitting ducks to terrorism. Terrorism was not invented in 9/11 and protests over Islamic rights have been seen before.

But how did Islam even get off the ground? It invaded people, 'assimilate or die' and that is the basic foundation today it has no middle ground it did not spread through faith but through fear. It could not compete with Christianity because that too had a seal on it until Christ returns. it could not compete with Judaism because you have to be a bloodline Jew to be a prophet they kept records and history of who they were in the 4000 year absence of Islam. The word never existed whole civilisations did any change the language and historical records to cover up Islam. It never existed in Islamic form.

The satanic verses protest, the school protests of the 1960s of Muslim girls going swimming. The headscarf?

Today the media is much larger and information goes on a quick global scale and people can now all stand up and protest together and we did not have the mdia we have today.

'Many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall increase." Daniel (12:4)

I still think Christianity is the victim here atheist and other religions are shutting the door on Christ and anti-Semitism is on the rise.

I do become Islamaphobic when I get on a plain I always think is this the plain or is this the train in which i will die.


Who ever wins we lose. If the Muslims win their argument then I want Christians to start banning films like 'The life of Brian.' or 'the Exorcist' when a cross is used for sex. But that wont happen, they will start banning basic rights, people will go to court to rub the European justice system or the governments will set more restrictions on us for freedom of speech. We have liberated Iraq but imprisoned our selves.

If we win then nothing changes the freedom will only rub the Muslim noses in it to cause more terrorist attacks and employ the ID scheme as an excuse. Its beyond our control the system at hand is superior to mankind’s mind evil does not sleep and never gets tired. We will be lead to a point where we all agree after we destroy our selves in the mean time. Action problem solution, how ever it gets there does not matter. The devil wants the Jews dead and mankind by his nature alone or satanic influences have repeated history many times over these people. Even Jesus died he was a Jew but he beat the system of evil for the covenants of the history of mans original Adamite bloodline. Today is no different and tomorrow mankind will join forces with Satan to destroy these promised people and history will go full circle. Will we have a new Hitler yes he was just a puppy wait until it grows up.


[edit on 9-2-2006 by The time lord]

Who ever wins we lose. If the Muslims win their argument then I want Christians to start banning films like 'The life of Brian.' or 'the Exorcist' when a cross is used for sex. But that wont happen, they will start banning basic rights, people will go to court to rub the European justice system or the governments will set more restrictions on us for freedom of speech. We have liberated Iraq but imprisoned our selves.

If we win then nothing changes the freedom will only rub the Muslim noses in it to cause more terrorist attacks and employ the ID scheme as an excuse. Its beyond our control the system at hand is superior to mankind’s mind evil does not sleep and never gets tired. We will be lead to a point where we all agree after we destroy our selves in the mean time. Action problem solution, how ever it gets there does not matter. The devil wants the Jews dead and mankind by his nature alone or satanic influences have repeated history many times over these people. Even Jesus died he was a Jew but he beat the system of evil for the covenants of the history of mans original Adamite bloodline. Today is no different and tomorrow mankind will join forces with Satan to destroy these promised people and history will go full circle. Will we have a new Hitler yes he was just a puppy wait untill it grows up.


[edit on 9-2-2006 by The time lord]

[edit on 9-2-2006 by The time lord]

Originally posted by Alien DNA
we live in a FREE society...
Come on FREE people post your vote of confidence...

Just read the sig...

just reading through the thread, just afew points:

99% of terrorist are muslims? what about the IRA,ETA,UDA,UVF, Ayran Army,KKK, Zionist groups, Christian extremists...i could go on..

deporting all muslims is a stupid idea, America and other countries were built on immigration.

getting rid of all muslims cause of 7/7 is like removing all the catholics from the UK due to the numerous IRA bombings.

not going off topic, but the part about the IRA are "no longer activie" you might want to read the report that states they are still funding themselves and kept arms.

over a 100 years ago, we had Zionists doing what muslims are doing now. There is no real big difference. Zionists commited one of the worst terrorist attack against the British Empire via bombing the King David hotel. 92 were killed. Thats more than 7/7...but we didnt go around hating Jews, did we?



[edit on 18-2-2006 by infinite]

Anyone that says the Muslim religion is represented badly in America is a moron. The A.C.L.U. and other "fringe" groups treat the Christian faith like a week old dog turd. That is plastered all over the place. The only place you see bad things said about Islam is from nutbags like Pat Robertson and Jerry Falwell along with white supremist groups as well.
I am 100 percent Atheist, I live my pitiful life of drudgery. I try not to step on too many toes,,, anymore. I don't mind people being able to worship whatever way it may be. I don't care if "In God We Trust" is in or on anything. I want to be left alone. I don't like somebody telling me that their religion is all encompassing, that it loves all walks of life, when it isn't. Don't p*ss on my leg and call it a shower. For having so many people that are willing to blow themselves up for their beliefs, the Islamic world is the biggest bunch of whiners when it comes to it's own shortfalls. If there is so many Muslims that disagree with suicide attacks then stand up and do something about it? I wouldn't want Christians doing it and I wouldn't sit back and let it continue. Is it western culture's fault that so many of middle eastern descent follow the teachings of a "poor man's" Judeism?
Here is how you stop terrorism, it is actually quite easy... Say there is a suicide bomber, blows up a street side bistro, deaths and crippling injuries ensue, some group takes responsibility. Through information gathering you find out where this person or persons families live. Are you all still following me? O.K. You know where their family is and you drop by for a visit. Then you proceed to mutilate them by poking out their eyes with pokers, hack off digits and then move on up to whole limbs. Burn the skin off their bones. Take from them parts of the body that were taken from the victims. The same can be done for beheadings, except for every one that is beheaded you in turn behead 10 or maybe 20. I mean isn't it the fault of the parent that the child is an ingrate? Then there would be a reason for the violence perpetrated against the western world.
People are probably going to hate me, but oh well.

I want to say some things about the word "appeasement," which has been tossed around on this thread, usually followed by "doesn't work," or the mere unstated implication that appeasement is a bad thing.

The negative connotations this word has gained since 1939 are yet another of the nasty little gifts bequeathed to us by Adolf Hitler, along with nuclear weapons, the Cold War, and the Israeli-Palestinian conflict, none of which would have existed without the Nazi regime, or at least not in the form we have them today.

Appeasing Hitler was, as it turns out, a bad idea. But in general, there is nothing wrong with appeasement. Appeasement is the cornerstone of diplomacy. One partner to the negotiations has demands; the other partner meets those demands as far as practicable -- i.e., appeases the negotiating partner -- in exchange for concessions in return. Without appeasement, there is no recourse except for war. And only when one is dealing with a Hitler is war inevitable.

When dealing with the anger of the world Muslim community, including but FAR from limited to its terrorist expression at the extremes, there are some ways we can and should appease that anger, and other ways we should not. The Muslim community has legitimate grievances and demands, and also ones that, in my judgment, are not legitimate. It is legitimate to demand that the West stop supporting tyrants in Muslim countries, stop exploiting these countries' cheap labor and ripping off their natural resources, stop encouraging genocidal acts either between Muslims or towards Muslims by non-Muslims. And it is completely legitimate to demand the evacuation of Western occupation forces from Muslim countries.

It is not, in my belief, legitimate to demand that Western newspapers and other media censor themselves of all ciriticism of Islam, the Prophet, or God. But it is also my belief, very sincerely held, that if we were to meet the legitimate demands of Muslims, the illegitimate demands would cease to matter. Media criticism or ridicule of Islam strikes nerves because it seems to express the contempt for Muslims that our actions in the Middle East demonstrate. Without those actions, it would be shrugged off.

Appeasing Hitler by giving him the Rheinland (which was part of Germany after all), and approving the Anschluss with Austria (which was accomplished bloodlessly and with approval of most Austrians), was only wrong because he was a nutcase bent on launching a horrible war, and the added territory and population only made him stronger. They were perfectly legitimate demands in and of themselves, and we know it was a mistake only in hindsight. Islam in general is not like Hitler; although a few Muslims may be like him, they lack Hitler's dictatorial power and so we may safely appease the legitimate demands of Muslims, thus lowering the appeal of the extremists. And that is what we should do.

Deporting all Muslims who simply exercise their rights of free speech and petition of the government for redress of grievances will only enflame the situation. Foreigners, regardless of religion, who commit crimes, yes, those should be deported (if not imprisoned). But not people who merely engage in a peaceful protest. That is not only wrong and against who we are as a culture, it is also ultimately self-defeating.

[edit on 20-3-2006 by Two Steps Forward]

Originally posted by Alien DNA
We must somehow send a strong message to Islam that Freedom alway's wins and most people want to be free even in the Middle East.
It's just the controlling way of Islam I don't like, their women are covered up and not allowed to come out of the house without the husband's permission, it's just soooo last millenia don't you think?

freedom and islam aren't mutually exclusive..

christianity and islam aren't so different, it's just the places where they have majority control are. islam is strongest in the poorer parts of the world, christianity has control in the richest parts of the world. the reason islam is represive and violent is because it can be exploited by unscrupulous persons. remember medieval europe? that wasn't exactly a christian utopia, but during the same period the muslim world was much more egalitarian, informed, and overall more civilized.

should we be allowed to deport christians that think we shouldn't have public displays of the virgin mary being sodomized by satan while performing oral sex on jesus? well, that's how bad depicting the prophet mohammed is to muslims, so please, be tolerant.

peace

deport all the PEOPLE of Islam,first off are you a total nit wit?do you have any clue how many off them there are?Dont you know that there is good and bad in every race, creed,or religion of man,moron?you cant just ship a whole religion out the door,or a whole race for that matter.how can you point your finger at every Muslim living in the free world,it is free right?like as free to protest!!!or are you taking that away to?seems to me freedom isnt free at all in your ALIEN DNAwad world....

what kind of prophet would say such a thing>>>>>>


Tabari IX:69 “Killing disbelievers is a small matter to us.”