Looming Transit Strike Could Cripple New York City

strikes over folks. moose out front should have told you.


the strike is over. workers will begin reporting when the next shift begins and service should be back up to normal incapacity in about 12 hours.

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Thank God the strike is over...I think I would have had a heart attack if I had to bike to work another day. With any luck, the 2/3 train will be back up by the time I leave work today and can ride it back home with my bike.

I really think the union caved, not only because of threats of jail time, but also the rank and file members were skeptical about it anyway and it was blatently obvious that they got hardly any sympathy nor support from anyone -- even including most other types of union members. The coverage in both the New York Post and Daily News was absolutely scathing!

Marg, you're right, for the most part it was inconveniences... but there was also a lot of other problems and potential problems.

For me it was waking up early, for others it was sleeping at work, still for others it was cancel the doctor appointment and wait it out.

Meanwhile, it should take about a day to turn the trains back on. The busses we'll see running this evening (but almost definitely not at rush hour).

I usually like to support organized labor, but as a NYC resident, I have to say that the timing could not have been worse for this strike, and I agree that it was selfish.... basically they want to make their point on the backs of everyone in NYC who depends on public trnnsport, but the people hurt most are the people who can't afford to miss 3 days of work (right before Christmas, too), or the people who can't afford to spend money on cabs. I don't see the transit workers as having any right, as they claim, to the billion dollar MTA surplus- that money was not made because the transit workers worked any harder this year- it was made because high gas prices mean more people are using the MTA (which has what amounts to a monopoly on subways and most buses).

Perhaps if the strike would have been in the summer it would have been worst taking in consideration the heat.

I imagine that is limitations as to the damage that can be done to a city like NY and I also imagine that it would not be more than 2 or 3 days the max, that will be enough to do enough to prove a point.

Is to much money involve when things like this happen specially in this time of the year. But already many businesses has lost money specially Hotels that had many cancellations for the holidays because of the strike.



[edit on 22-12-2005 by marg6043]

The one in 1980 lasted 11 days I believe.

Yeah, Hotels are hurting badly. A lot of people cancelled their trips when they realized they wouldn't be able to get around.

Also shopping suffered badly. Malls will survive, but the mom and pop stores are going to suffer the most. The week before Christmas is huge for them, and they lost, in some case, up to 90% of their pre-holiday business. That really hurts.

so selfish.

what got me wasn't the traffic and the walk to work. it wasn't the noise from all the cars blasting their horns out of frustration over their inability to get over the 59th st. bridge (a few blocks from my apt.).

it was things like having to stay home and take care of the kids because the baby sitter couldn't get to work. (not a huge issue for me but my wife did it one day and her client was not thrilled).

being told by my daughter's doctor that walk in's were not going to get much in the way of attention due to short staffing (my daughter has been puking since 2 this morning).

my family is lucky in that these inconveniences were just that. However, for many, having to stay home from work because you didn't have someone watching the kids meant a loss of pay. store owners were short staffed and many shoppers were staying away.

toussaint and his henchmen should be held responsible for all lost money over the last three days.

Originally posted by defcon5
Why should these guys get raises that put them above the level of almost all other government workers?

?

Why shouldnt' they? If they can extort it out of the MTA, then more power to them.

That is all this is about again folks, the union wants their cut of the profits…

The workers want to get more money. They are the ones that voted for the strike. I am sure that the union administrators also want to have more money in the system and skim from it too. But the workers are the reason why there is a strike, because they are willing to strike for more money.

I would rather see the surplus of money go to improving the system.

Thats really irrelevant. Thats not happening with this money. Its either going to the people that run the MTA, or some of it is going to go to the workers.

I think that all these jokers that went on strike and broke the law should get to do community service.

That is not the penalty. There is no legal basis for arresting them. The punishment is fines, not jailtime.

Hell if I was the mayor I would use the 1 Billion to automate the whole thing

The mayor has not control over the system, its run by the MTA.

fire anyone that went on strike, criminally prosecute the ring leaders, and never have to worry about this kind of problem again…

Then, instead of a strike that lasts a few days or weeks, you'd effectively have a strike that lasted months as you tried to 'automate' the entire transit system. And then the guys that are working to automate it and put in the new system......might strike too.

Also, its entirely possible that the 'ringleaders' at the MTA will be the ones going to jail, since the legal process requires that they negotiate in good faith and don't provoke a strike. They, apparently, lied about how much they were raking in, to their own employees and the city. If the union calls for it, then the law (and I beleive that its the same Taylor Law too) requires an investigation. If they are at fault, then the union and workers don't pay any fines.

I'd LOVE an 18% raise like they're demanding. It ain't happening. Such is life.

But it can happen (or rather the union can get close to the high demand it is making, which i think is 8-9$% no?), if they strike and make things uncomfortable for the MTA, the city administration, and the people of the city.

Again this is all about the union leadership and $$,

Of course its about money. Thats what they are striking for. The union wants more money, and the employees want more money. They'd better get it while they can, 'cause its pretty obvious that the MTA doesn't have their interests at 'heart'. The very idea is laughable. They have to watch out for themselves and get as much money for themselves as they can. If they get disabled, if they loose their job, if the MTA bulls an enron, no one is ever going to take care of them. Ever.

djarums
My problem is that people are taking this as a "us vs. the evil corporations or government". It's not.

Indeed. The MTA isn't particularly 'evil' or sinister. Its just another company (that tends to lie about its profit margin, but whatever). This strike is about one thing and one thing onyl, the strikers want more money. Good for them, get it while you can.

Yes, the workers wanted more money. I respect that. I think we all have the right to dream and to hope and to want more money for working.

No gripes there.

And I think what should have happened is that Toussaint should have gone to the MTA leaders and stated that his union demands that the new contract be under certain conditions.

At that point, no citizen of New York would have a complaint, because as you said, they want more money, that's fine!

But walking out on a system that carries all of us and keeps our lives running was wrong. Honestly, I feel bad for the workers, but I feel worse for the rest of us, because this was yet another example of how ambitious and greedy individuals hungry for fame and recognition can devastate all of our lives.

rookie transit worker makes more than a veteran police officer.

transit workers retire with full benefits at 55. Toussaint was asking for the age to be dropped to 50.

the workers didn't vote to strike, the executive committee headed by toussaint voted to strike. the president of the twu international told toussaint he was against a strike and shortly thereafter (around 3 AM) toussaint walked outside and told the press they were striking.

toussaint spoke about the mayor as if he was born with a silver spoon in his mouth, which is completely untrue. Toussaint acted as if the city would back his union and we didn't. He miscalculated big time.

If I was in his shoes, I'd have went with a massive slow down. 10% normal speed. No law broken.

Originally posted by Crakeur
the workers didn't vote to strike, the executive committee headed by toussaint voted to strike. the president of the twu international told toussaint he was against a strike and shortly thereafter (around 3 AM) toussaint walked outside and told the press they were striking.

I really think this is the worse part. Too bad we don't have more input from the actual members of the union to comment on how they really feel about all this, but I believe they can't while something like this is going on. I would bet the majority of them would prefer the reasonable terms being offerred as oppossed to the finainacial repercussions to them and their fellow NYers that this is causing.

I've seen this happen before on a smaller scale, where it came out in the end that the union rep was not presenting what the membership wanted, and I find it hard to believe that the majority of members are really supporting this mess.


[edit on 12/22/2005 by Relentless]

my kids' babysitter has a brother and a brother in law who are both bus drivers. her brother in law was taking a vacation this week and wasn't forced to make a choice and her brother was off Tues. and Wed and he went back to work today. She said he was a first year employee and all the first year employees go to work because there are literally thousands of applicants waiting in line for an opening.

He would have had to make a tough decision because he didn't believe the strike was right but he knows that breaking the line leaves you an outsider when all is resolved.

Originally posted by Crakeur
If I was in his shoes, I'd have went with a massive slow down. 10% normal speed. No law broken.

Not needed. Most institutions are overburded with rules and regulations. So many that if you comply with them as they are written, nothing will get done till the policies are changed. As a nurse we have done this on numerous occasions. Sometimes it takes a while, but nothing like a 500,000 $ spike in overtime to get the attention of management

Originally posted by Djarums
But walking out on a system that carries all of us and keeps our lives running was wrong.

Not giving people who apparently run the entire city the 8 point difference would be just as wrong, no?

can devastate all of our lives.

Not for nothing, but you said you had to get up two hours earlier, and other people I know had to sit on the trains into penn station for a little while longer, and walk a distance.

Thats not devastation. Some countries don't even have mass transit systems in their cities. People had to walk in chilly weather. Its not a big deal. I'd be ticked too, but, seriously, who suffered the most during this strike and had the most risk on the line? The workers. The city lost two days of normal commerce, not all commerce, just the normal high rates. These guys lost 6 days of pay in total. Their union, supported by their dues, lost, what, 2 million dollars? And those guys that run the MTA, anyone think that they were even inconvienced for a moment?

Who's more greedy, the schlubs that drag their butts to work inside the subway system, or the jerks who run the business from their offices and are already far richer than any of their employees? Who has a harder time 'making ends meet', and who's kids are less likely to get good health care and go to college?

Its perfectly understandable that they'd strike, especially when the MTA is lying during the negotiations, and if the people of the city had to walk 20 blocks to work for two days *shrugs*, what should they care?

Hell, the NYC mass transit system sucks anyway. The people of the city should've placed the blame of the strike on the MTA, and done away with those incompentent scoundrels.

Originally posted by NygdanNot giving people who apparently run the entire city the 8 point difference would be just as wrong, no?

the strike's inability to completely shut down the city proved they don't run the city, they just make the people move faster.

from what I have read, and heard, the workers, for the most part, weren't to keen on the strike to begin with. It remains to be seen if the strike did anything for the contract. The one thing we new yorkers did learn from it all is that our little mayor is a pit bull when provoked. until now, he has always come across as a bit of a wuss with regards to public debates over union labor disputes.

the one thing Toussaint failed to consider is that we, as a city, have seen a hell of a lot of bad times in the past few years. We got thru 9/11 as a single unit and we got thru the blackout as a single unit. the disrupted service, while annoying, costly and disruptive didn't garner a single tear of sympathy from the locals.

If I would have found this Thread early enough, I would have contributed my Willingness to go to Iraq as a Contractor to make $60,000 dollars a year. I would have been a Company Driver for a Contracting company, picking people up from various bases in Iraq, mostly around Bagdad. Occasionally, about once a week, I would have travelled the road to Abu Graihb Prison to drop off, and pick up Company workers. I was so Eager to do this! I was amazed. Thinking to myself, "Shnikeys! 60,000 Smackers for driving around a bunch of Pot-holes, and swerving around Firecrackers! I do that in San Antonio!"

I'm only 18, and was planning on this in the spring of 2004. So I was seventeen. If I would have known I could drive around New York City for just under Five G's less, I probably would have wanted alot more for the Iraq Job.

Unfortunately, The company that was going to hire me lost the Contract in the Rebidding for 2005.

actually Kokasion, it would have been quite a bit more than 5gs difference....anything you earn in iraq as a civilian contractor is generally tax free.

Damn, I forgot about Taxes... Seeing as I'm a Military Brat, I don't usually hear much complaining from Mom and Dad. I guess I better get used to saying, "Damn you, Taxes!"