Project Serpo: Postings by "Anonymous" -- Breaking news?

Originally posted by Zep Tepi

Originally posted by Crakeur
He might even have a friend or contact on the email list who will verify that chapman was this that or the other thing and we all need to be really carefull with this.

I have already stated that Bill has said he has no knowledge of who chapman is and he suspected him after his (chapman) third post.

This post

where does bill say such a thing?

or do you mean, that is what bill is saying now...

I have been in touch with Victor an updated him on these new twists. I gave him a direct link to this thread. He has answered my first message with questions concerning these developments. I am awaiting his next reply to the question of Chapman. Maybe he will post it here.

Doty was and is considred a long standing member of the "infamous Birdies" as well as Robert Collions. Christopher "Kit" Green. Strieber's name has been added to that list in the past decade. As well as Howe who is considered an associate member.

So

You have Doty & Ryan on coast to coast breaking news of SERPO.

Striber comes out of the 'wood work' with his account of SERPICO SERPO encounter at a UFO conference decades back. In essence Striber sprays gas on the fire until the SERPO story ember now becomes a raging fire.

Howe then spreads that fire across the entire media outlets.

Bingo, Presto!

SEPRO becomes the talk and only talk of the Ufo Community. Disinformation Mission Complete?? By the infamous "Bride operatives.


Nightshade 09

Originally posted by onlyinmydreams


Wait... I walk away for one hour and everything goes bananas???

If this was just four guys playing a game in London.... how did Strieber, Doty, and the others get together for that C2C interview? I know that they may not be telling the truth... but that seems like a pretty huge, and pretty risky, game.

Also... as I have for a few days... I suspect that 'Chapman' may be trying to discredit the story. I never took his posts seriously and was always suspicious of the way he latched onto all of this.

The bottom line is that we need to hear from Bill.

Originally posted by gingerladHi Crakeur,

I can't blame Victor for staying up there in the rafters, if he joined the fray he'd just be put through the wringer like Bill.

I think Bill has to be applauded for coming back time after time to keep us in the loop. He doesn't have to, but I'm grateful as I know many others are that he does.

I agree that it would be tough for Victor to come here and not get bombarded with questions but I would do it if it were me and I were being honest and truthfull. I'd post to establish that this is real.

I also agree that Bill has continued to come back time after time to keep us in the loop but the point of this hoax might be to come back time after time. There is the possibility that he is coming here not as a favor to us but with other motives. Is that the case? I don't know. the evidence is pointing in a bad direction for Bill and he's going to come here and start discrediting chapman, which he really cannot do as he supposedly knows nothing about him other than what he posts here. So, all he can say is chapman's a liar. No kidding. I pegged him for that right at post 2 by chapman.

I would love for Bill to come here and clear this all up with an explanation that makes sense and makes me believe he is innocent regarding the accusations but, to be honest, I have been saying it from the beginning, if it's a hoax (and I thought it was) he's got to be in on it. I hope I'm wrong. I hope it isn't a hoax. I hope Bill is not out to fool us all.

the way I see this, we're all still being played. the hoax is now to keep the hoax going. chapman, serpiansurfer and a few others have been playing this thread from the moment they joined. It has, at times, seemed as if they were talking behind the scenes and then posting. so, I'm still tagging along, I'm waiting for Bill's response and I'm enjoying every minute of what has been a rather good piece of interactive theater.

No one, in their right mind, knowing that they would be discredited for life when found out, would go on a nationally syndicated radio talk show like Coast to Coast AM among others and open himself up like he did if he was not telling the truth. He would have known it would not last forever and he would eventually be found out.

Bill Ryan in my opinion has done nothing to warrant judgement of hoaxer. He can be affiliated with whatever spirtual group he wants as far as I am concerned and has absolutely no obligation to tell us.

As for Chapman/Serpiansurfer/whatever else he may or may not be....there will always be those out there that will stir the pot. Why let him bring down what has been mostly up til now...intelligent discussion.

And until we have absolute proof one way or the other, lets try to keep open minds.

Well, according to the stats on the ATS forum main page, Mr. Ryan happens to be on right now--pending update, or....?

wow.

I thought with all this activity there had to be pictures or something!

Things are nuts here.

Pages back I saw someone defending "both" sides of the fence in a single sentence. quite an accomplishment of thought!

This thing with Chapman, a guy who has no proof of anything he says, and people jump off the fence, and run around the fence squawking trying to figure out which way is up, and which side of the fence they should be on! It's crazy people!
You don't need to scream "hoax" everytime something minor appears.
Especially for a reason without logic.

The body of evidence already shows a hoax.
The weight of proving this, is in the hands of Anonymous, and always has been.
Extraordinary claims require Extrordinary proof! And the proof we have so far is ....NONE!
Right now there is no reason TO beleive it.

Nothing short of pictures will make me budge from my Skeptic Polar end. And then, maybe only budge me enough to examine the pictures.
That doesn't mean I don't like reading the Anonymous postings, because I do.

Just let the story come out and make your own determination.
Take the Anonymous entries for what they are. FUN TO READ


Lets just take a deep breath.....
Tap your heels together, and repeat after me:
there's no place like home, there's no place like home....

Wake me up when the pictures are out...


[edit on 30-1-2006 by KDX175DUEX]

Hi, All -

I had a call from Zep Tepi earlier this evening saying that ATS had gone mad and I should really get back online quickly. I've just arrived in Switzerland (late evening here) and can see what he meant.

1) Re Chapman's second message on p.143 (disregarding his grandson's): I'd prepared something to post anyway, pointing out his unprofessional spelling errors (“apoligise”, “signitory”, “pernecious”, “opticions”, “usefull”)... and the highly unlikely sign-off with a happy smily, a significant give-away considering that this gentlemen professed to be elderly and not at all internet-savvy.

So now we know why. If chelseafan1 was banned for deception, then the chapman and serpiansurfer logins certainly should be also. If I was a moderator, this is not the kind of reputation I'd want to have sticking to ATS. The thing to remember, in my personal opinion, is that if members are allowed to get away with that posting strategy, it only encourages others to their own deception. This is not how debate should be conducted and is not helpful or constructive.


2) To state what I hope should be obvious, I do not know who chapman / serpiansurfer is and have no connection with him.


3) The rumor “SERPO may be a Scientology Plot!” first surfaced two or three weeks ago – first promoted, I believe, by Jack Sarfatti. Here again is my response at the time, which I also circulated on Victor's list.

From: Bill Ryan
Date: Sat, 14 Jan 2006 11:52:21 +0000
To: John Lundberg
Cc: Jack Sarfatti, Caryn Anscomb, Dan Smith
Subject: Re: SERPO may be a Scientology Plot!

Hi, John -

Thanks for this and your other. I know quite a lot about Scientology and this seems a far-fetched theory to me... I didn't see any connections in the report that Jack posted below. I believe Victor Martinez is rabidly against the Church of Scientology, and my own claim to fame is that I'm on the infamous Church of Scientology's “Enemies” list:

www.xenu.net... .

I also know personally the head of the International Freezone Association (IFA) - his name is Michael Moore, in Australia (not THE Michael Moore!), and also the head of the independent “Ron's Orgs”, whose name is Max Hauri, based in Switzerland. They're both fine people of the highest integrity. No way would they be involved in Serpo. They don't engage in scams or dirty tricks (if this should eventually turn out to be one). But I have no contacts within the Church of Scientology and would have no means to check anything out if they're up to no good.

It's hard to imagine why the Church of Scientology would want to set up anything like this... although they have immense resources and a sizeable “spook” department with which they fight both the Powers that Be and also inconvenient individuals (Werner Erhard was ruined by a Church of Scientology sting, for instance). With a significant stretch of the imagination it could conceivably be a mechanism to embarrass Victor Martinez (Anonymous started his postings before I arrived on the list) but if so, what a huge hammer to crack a tiny nut! Their standard mode is to dream up dirt on people, or set people up with stings. Victor would probably be far more vulnerable in other ways.

[Hi, Jack - my regards to all there in SF. I may be over there after 24 Jan for a couple of weeks and maybe we can catch up then.]

Best wishes, Bill

From: John Lundberg
Date: Sat, 14 Jan 2006 11:04:16 +0000
To: Bill Ryan
Subject: SERPO may be a Scientology Plot!

Hi Bill,

Sarfatti thinks there's a link between serpo and
scientology, do you have any further information
about this?

All the best,
John


4) Serpo is not a hoax. A hoax means it's 100% deception. I'm personally certain this is not. In my opinion, if I may say so, this is a less than fully responsible word for the moderators to use – it's emotionally loaded, may be a premature conclusion, tends to lead and influence members' and visitors' thinking, and may put filters and fixed ideas in place.

ATS has a responsibility as an internet opinion leader. If it were up to me, I would relabel this thread, with rather more intellectual rigor:

Serpo: now is the time to re-examine all the evidence to date.

I presume that there's no intention to close the debate. But judging the account as a hoax and promoting the label prominently may be seen by some as a attempt to end the thread. This is premature. See the questions drafted below.


5) As per my last post, I suggest that a profitable way to focus the debate is to consider that if this is disinformation, then:

a) Which parts are true?

b) What might be the purpose?


6) I close by releasing this significant snippet of information, which came to light just last Friday. I received this message below on the contact form on 20 December. The e-mail address supplied was an LANL (Los Alamos National Laboratories) address, but every version of it (including possible typos) bounced when I attempted to reply. It said simply:

From: [lanl.us.gov formatted address]
Date: 20 Dec 2005 02:37:08 -0000
To: "Serpo.org"
Subject: Contact

About 80% of this info is fact, the remaining 20% is fiction. The US Gov is in the process of releasing info on Alien contact. This is the first step.

(Bold emphasis mine.)

The IP address seems to be the same as Anonymous's.

I'm not going to release any other details at this stage. I want to see what happens next, and intend to keep that powder dry for the moment. Others are helping me look at this issue, but we already know that the IP address question can be fraught with pitfalls and possible incorrect conclusions unless handled with significant expertise. It's really not for inexpert speculation, which I think we've all learned.

If was sent from the same computer (which, as I understand it, an identical IP address does not necessarily imply) I have no idea what to make of this apart from assuming the possibility that he was offering a heavy hint... possibly without his superiors being aware.

80/20 could be about right. As I said in an earlier post, one doesn't have to fiddle with too many parts of a smooth-running engine to make it misfire badly and make one feel like junking the whole thing.

If so, as per my (5a) above, which parts are the 80% and which are the 20%?

Best to all, Bill

How'd did Bill know about chapman's third post?

Thank you Bill, for your fast reply!! Lets get Chapman behind us and on with the disclosure!!!

Bill,

How did you know about chapman's third post?

Originally posted by Valhall
How'd did Bill know about chapman's third post?

I don't know what you mean to imply with that question. I suppose he read it like the rest of us. Am I missing something here??

Originally posted by Bill Ryan
Serpo: now is the time to re-examine all the evidence to date.

I presume that there's no intention to close the debate. But judging the account as a hoax and promoting the label prominently may be seen by some as a attempt to end the thread. This is premature. See the questions drafted below.

Bill,

Thanks for your comments. I think that people are having a hard time reconciling those last posts from Anon and the "rush to judgment" seems to be an easy way out. I agree that refocusing on the evidence at hand is the best way to proceed.

Of course, ATS being a conspiracy-oriented website, the members here are always going to be eager to explore conspiracies wherever they may be found... and wherever they're not (just to make sure we've looked everywhere!) But let this serve as another reminder when analyzing evidence -- don't make more out of it than it appears on the surface, until you've turned it over and looked at it from a few angles.

More importantly -- any idea how frequently anon might be releasing informtion now? Or do you only learn that when it appears in your mailbox?

Yeah, you're missing that the question is now directed to Bill. Not being crabby, just trying to get an answer.

Bill,

How did you know about chapman's third post?

Val I think Zeptepi must have informed Mr Ryan of all the detail when he called him...?

Thank you...but I really want Bill to answer this one.

I would really really like to know how he knew about chapman's third post?

AND when?

A PS to my last: as I mentioned before I left the US yesterday, I now have a very slow dial-up connection where I'm staying in Switzerland (a farmhouse B+B) and have not read every new page. I was given a summary by Zep Tepi on the phone and have essentially responded to that.

If anyone has specific questions which are still unanswered, I'd be grateful if you could repost them, so I don't have to hunt and find them all! I'm also aware I have 11 unanswered U2Us which I promise to get round to, but that won't be tonight. My apologies to all who have been waiting patiently there.

It's also gone midnight here, and I've been traveling for 24 hours, so I'm not going to stay up very long... tomorrow I should have a bit more time.

Best to all, Bill

And this is such an astronomically simple and quick question to answer, that I'm seriously confused about why it's taking so long?

So are you saying you learned of chapman's third post from Zep Tepi?

If so, when? Give it in a time zone please so that it can make sense to us.

Welcome back Bill,

FYI an IP address can be used by hundreds/Thousands of people behind a NAT device.