NEWS: Explosion Kills One at University of Oklahoma

Indeed they are, if there is no proof of something than in fact you can't say it as though there is proof.

He could be a Muslim, Jew, Christian, Hindu, list can go on and on all days.

However what is more important is what drove him to the point of killing himself, of wanting to take his own life. If it is because of the U.S. and its War on Terror you need to look at why the kid felt he needed to go to such an extreme. If the problems are not dealt with they will get worse and worse however assuming things do not solve the problem in anyway guys.

Ok, you info hounds... this info not released yet...AND NOT CONFIRMED...
but dont let that stop you from developing theories...
the unofficial story from an OU student doing research (remain anon) take it for what it is...

situation looks columbine"ish"...

This is all SUPPOSITION... NOT FACT YET...(this is supposidly becoming knowledge among the campus students... so could easily be rumor...)
SUPPOSIDLY:
7 detonators found... in his car...
7 devices found along ASP street...
it appears he was not going to kill himself... but others...
I don't feel comfortable throwing anything else out yet...

Oh, except the haircut thing... the "bushy" photo was taken while he was in denver... NOT AT OU just 6 blocks up from an islamic center... that photo was the student ID. that has short hair...

so why would he change his hair style AWAY from that dictated by Islam...when he was "exposed to it" at the campus?
like I said... typical unkept youth look...

If you will notice... I am using rumor (a true rumor going around right now)
as a source, and saying very plainly... "it is rumor"

when you quote World NUT daily... be kind... do the same...



[edit on 4-10-2005 by LazarusTheLong]

LINK

This is quote from his father...

His father, Joel Hinrichs Jr. of Colorado Springs, Colo., said his son did not intend to hurt anyone and should not be associated with suicide bombers who try to frighten or harm people. He committed suicide in an open area of campus because he knew it would be a violent explosion, Hinrichs said.

"He wanted there to be no question. He didn't want to live through it, so he used as much as he could carry." Hinrichs said. "He took pains so nobody would be frightened and nobody would be harmed because he didn't have any ill will in his heart; he just ran out of optimism."

Then later in the article, it states that the father had some contact via phone in e-mail about a month prior, with no concerns for his son. If he didn't want anybody to be hurt, or frightened, why do it outside a OU football game just before halftime? That statement seems out of place to me.


THis is an interesting case.....






[edit on 4-10-2005 by asala]

The Golden Spike

Originally posted by LazarusTheLong
you can speculate all you want to...
but you are wrong... All we have been hearing for the last 3 days in Oklahoma is about the bombing... no such "spiking" as you are trying to claim...

I am claiming that this story is being spiked at the national level. If I'm wrong, kindly give some examples. I am citing all my sources.

Show me where I'm wrong.

I am not assuming anything about this case. I am observing the shocking disparity between the nature of this story and the national coverage and expressing my significant concern about what I'm observing.

I invite you to find this story on CNN.com, MSNBC.com, FoxNews.com or ABCnews.com today. Note the extent of the coverage. Note what stories are being carried instead of this one.

Note the conspicuous absence of investigative reporting as we head into the fourth day after what the “authorities” are officially calling a “suicide bombing”. In Oklahoma!

Note the pushing of an “official” story which is not supported by the facts presented so far.

The angle is clearly to “prove” that our unfortunate three-named suspect intended suicide, despite the fact that there was no suicide note (according to them) and the proximity of tens of thousands of people to the blast site.

I am highly suspicious of the motives for doing this.

The Frustrating Quest For Answers

Meanwhile, I have been stomaching the commercial bombardment of my local news radio station -- which is normally all over stories like this one -- and so far, I haven't heard ONE WORD about this story.

I'm referring to KKOH. Go see for yourself. Not ONE WORD. And this silence coming from a station that runs the entire right-wing line-up -- including Michael Savage -- and so far I haven't heard anything about this story from them.

I haven't been listening 24/7 -- I can't handle that much of this stuff -- but if anyone else has heard anything on this story from these people, please let me know, because I can't find this story there.

That's what bothers me: the rumors coming from all sources in lieu of facts, and the deafening silence surrounding a suicide bombing on U.S. soil.

I am at least as skeptical of some of the so-called sources for this story as anyone else is.

So let's please not spread the false rumor that I have abandoned skepticism.

I have reasonable concerns which are justified by the way this story is being handled by the media. I ask simply that my concerns be addressed. I am NOT trying to push this story in a particular direction.

I just want some facts, and facts are not only scarce, but the spin being promoted in place of them is highly suspect.

Why is this story being handled this way?

That's what I want to know.

The Most Unreliable Source

Originally posted by LazarusTheLong
Majic, I don't want you to leave this story alone... I just want you to get it right... please no more assumptions of islamic connection... at this point, with no evidence, (world nut daily excluded) that is just insulting... and ignorant...and scaremongering... no need to go there until the littlest evidence can point there...

I suggest you follow your own advice and not make assumptions.

In particular, I recommend not making assumptions about me. This story is not about me, so please stay on topic and stop talking about me, okay?

If you have evidence I have made a false assumption, kindly post a quote MADE BY ME and your evidence showing I'm wrong. If you have such evidence, I would greatly appreciate that, because it will help me to correct whatever errors I have made so far in this case.

Specifically, I urge you to kindly withdraw so much as the suggestion that I am making any sort of Islamic connection to this case, because that is demonstrably false. I have seen others make that claim, but I have seen no credible evidence to support it, which is why I claim not to know if there is such a connection.

Check this thread. I have not even so much as used the word in this thread until now -- and only in response to your slanderous claim. Please don't try to confuse things more than they already are by making misleading statements like that.

I don't mind being proven wrong, but I seriously mind people making false statements about me or my position on things. Please don't put words in my mouth. I have more than enough of my own to share, as I am sure my fellow members can agree.

I'm interested in the facts of this case, not false speculation about me or what I believe. If you want to quote me, quote me accurately and use a quote block.

Let's leave the expression of my opinions to me, okay?

Assessing The Coverage

Let's take a look at my claims so far, which specifically do NOT include speculation about the motives of the bomber, with the possible exception of a sarcastic jab that he might have been a “Mennonite” (I really don't know what his religion, if any, was).

I am claiming that this story is being spiked at the national level, and that “mainstream media” coverage of this incident is conspicuously absent to an absurd degree.

Is anyone seeing coverage of this that I'm not seeing?

At the national level, there is a virtual blackout on this story. What information I am seeing comes from the local student newspaper and information from people who claim to live in Norman or were at the game that night.

This story is being carried almost exclusively by the “blogosphere”. Am I the only person who finds that disturbing? Am I to understand that the story of a suicide bomber on U.S. soil -- whatever the details may be -- doesn't merit national attention?

What I'm not seeing is any evidence that this story is being investigated by the “big boys”. Usually they at least send a reporter and have them check in, but I've seen nothing like that so far.

Am I wrong about the dearth of national coverage? If so, please show me some links so I can get educated about this.

That's all I ask: I just want to know what's going on here.

Other Sources

Here's what I mean by spiking, courtesy of Wikipedia.

By definition, this story is being spiked by the major news organizations. I want to know why.

If you peruse the various articles about this matter in The Oklahoma Daily student newspaper -- so far the most credible news organization covering this story in any depth -- you will find dozens of comments expressing concern over the lack of national news coverage of this incident.

I'm not the only American who shares those concerns.

Regarding other reports, especially those alleging Muslim ties, I am extremely skeptical of them, because they are originating from sources with a demonstrated pattern of bias and deception.

There are plenty of lies circulating about this case. I'm not interested in seeing more of them.

I want truth, and while I am trying my best to be patient in waiting for the facts, I am very impatient with the lies and obvious deceit I am seeing on the part of "authorities" who should know better than to publicly speculate about things they demonstrably cannot know.

I am also extremely suspicious of the national media blackout on this story. It stinks utterly.

Mark my words. This is a cover-up.

Majic,
thank you for your response...

Actually the islamic comments were made towards Sheperd, and only incidentally towards you... I just didn't want to see a respected member start to jump on the "terrorist bandwagon"
you haven't and I apologize for jumping too soon there... I see that you are maintaining a good grasp on facts at this point and not joining the march...

I was mainly wanting to address the comment by you that national media had been "spiked". IMO that it is premature to say that... there is nothing yet to report...
at this point... it has just dropped off the news charts, because it is what it is... a local interest story...
a common suicide using a very uncommon means....

Gaylord owns the daily oklahoman... and you probably know about Gaylord (the suicide bomber blew up in front of the "Gaylord" stadium...) If there was an order to "stop the news" then it would be done... it hasn't...
the link I gave earlier is from his television station.

Now, that said...
let me point out... it is going to be news again (see rumor above)...and if we don't hear about it, then I will personally make sure the country knows it is a coverup... but by that time, the whole campus will know the truth... so a coverup would be all but impossible...

I can only hope that the rumor is unfounded...

also... just throwing this into the mix...
radio blanket (RF disturbance method of blocking remote bomb signals...) might have set off a radio controlled bomb when it gets a certain distance from the stadium...


[edit on 4-10-2005 by LazarusTheLong]

Interest Grows

Hey Laz, I may have misread your statements. All those ellipses and such...

Just saying that it's important not to misquote folks in a climate such as this.

I don't buy the "not of national interest" notion. Just look at what's being carried instead of this story.

A suicide bombing on U.S. soil IS of national interest. Claims to the contrary are absurd.

If nothing else, I don't live in Oklahoma and I am extremely interested in this story. According to the comments at oudaily.com, I'm hardly unique in that regard.

Related PODthread

Additional (optional) comments on this story in podcast form are here:

Spike: The Oklahoma Suicide Bomber

I'm claiming this story is being spiked. I would love to be proven wrong.

So let's see the proof.

Again...
the original video news report link is from the Daily oklahoman... a newspaper and television group owned by gaylord (aka. government voice box)
they published more info yesterday, and I am sure to see an update tonight on the news also...

most of the continuing info is from a human interest perspective...
"so and so knew him when" this is typical media response.
present facts
present drama angle
present human side...
we are almost full circle... but I have a strong feeling that new info is coming, that will put this in the national media again. And all the local news stations that HAVE continued to report will look a little foolish if they have taken one angle, and then find out this was another columbine...

so while I respect your opinion to think it is being spiked...
the Gaylord media reporting continues... and they are as "governmental" as you can get... and one of the biggest nationally... but the only Gaylord outlets that are carrying anything are the local ones...
so You can probably see why I dont see the same "absence" of info...
it is surrounding me via local news night and day... and becoming more and more hyped everytime...
Oklahoman news still has it...

I realize that this is the same old stuff... but it is still being reported on...
just not nationally... and if it is a suicide...then it is local interest... it is not a "suicide bombing" in the sense of the word...
more of a twisted dramatic suicide... if that is all it is (*we will see) then the national news side is done...

With total respect Majic... I also want to see the truth... let us hope it isn't anything more than a suicide...
Thank you again for your insightful comments...

[edit on 4-10-2005 by LazarusTheLong]

Some CNN coverage of what the guy's dad has to say about the situation:

Dad: Oklahoma student bomber wasn't politically motivated

NORMAN, Oklahoma (AP) -- The father of a University of Oklahoma student who committed suicide outside a packed football stadium using explosives said Monday his son didn't intend to harm anyone else or push a political agenda.

Source:
edition.cnn.com...

The only thing is... how does the dad know for sure? If you were planning to launch a terrorist attack, I think it's the sort of thing you might keep from your folks. Besides that, the story doesn't make sense and is contridictory. The dad says that there was no suicide note, but then goes on to say that he knows for sure it was a suicide. I'm gonna have to agree with Majic on this one.

I'd like to know why every single bomber has a beard though.

He didn't have a beard. I thought that had been covered.

When Students Outshine Professionals

In light of the pathetic and inadequate response to this story by the "mainstream media", what seems to be the only credible news source for this story is the student newspaper at the University of Oklahoma.

Here are some articles on the story which may add some much-needed depth to the coverage.

The first is an open letter from OU President David Boren regarding the coverage and decisions he had to make:

Open letter from the OU president

While I appreciate his position and perspective on this incident, he has failed so far to explain how he immediately knew this was an “individual suicide”. How did he know, and how did he know without an investigation? These questions remain unanswered.

One of the student editors shares his anecdote from the night of the bombing:

Covering it

This establishes that people inside the stadium knew something was up. The explosion wasn't unnoticed by the crowd of 84,000. The very fact of this gives lie to the assertion that they were never in danger.

If the bombing had occurred even slightly differently -- perhaps closer to the stadium -- they would definitely have been in danger, from crowd panic, if nothing else. A bomb near a crowded stadium is at potentially as dire as a fire in a crowded theater.

Nothing has been offered to prove that the bomb exploded where and when it was intended to.

That's a big problem for me, and should be for anyone who finds the official version of this story to be fishy.

Meanwhile, the most significant story at the following link can be found in the reader comments:

OU releases more information

Note how many people are wondering -- like I am -- why this story has been squelched in the national media.

Indeed. Why? Does anyone know?

I would like to know.

Local News Reports Attempted Fertilizer Purchase, Muslim Ties

The following story from local Channel 9 adds several details to the story:

NewsOK Video

Among the notable details mentioned in the video:

- Joel Hinrichs tried to buy ammonium nitrate fertilizer -- usable for making bombs -- from a local feed store four days before the bombing, but was refused.

- Joel Hinrichs did, in fact, have a Pakistani roommate, whose name was not disclosed.

- Joel Hinrichs was reportedly seen at a local mosque -- the same mosque visited by Zacharias Moussaoui.

- A tentative but non-detailed timeline of events leading up to the bombing.

While I think it is too early to draw conclusions from these reports, I do think the nature of them warrants closer national attention than I am witnessing.

The absence of national coverage of this story continues to arouse my suspicion.

FBI Statement 10/4/2005

The original PDF file is here.

For those who don't have Acrobat Reader, I have included the text of the statement here, because it is brief. Since it is an official FBI statement, there shouldn't be any copyright issues:

FEDERAL BUREAU OF INVESTIGATION
3301 West Memorial Road • Oklahoma City, OK 73134 • 405-290-7770 • Fax: 405-290-3885

OKLAHOMA CITY, OKLAHOMA — Salvador Hernandez, Special Agent in Charge of the Federal Bureau of Investigation in Oklahoma, John C. Richter, United States Attorney, Western District of Oklahoma, and Elizabeth Woolen, Chief, University of Oklahoma Police Department, provided the following update regarding the investigation into the death of Joel Henry Hinrichs, III, which occurred October 1st on the campus of the University of Oklahoma.

Federal, state and local law enforcement are continuing their intensive investigation into the explosion. While it would be premature to comment on the specifics of the current investigation or draw any final conclusions before the investigation is completed, the following is provided in the interest of advising the public as to facts relevant to public safety:

* There is no known current threat posed by any additional explosive materials.

* At this time, there is no known threat from any other person(s) related to this incident.

* At this time, there is no known link between Hinrichs and any terrorist or extremist organization(s) or activities.

Appropriate authorities will be notified immediately should any information be developed that indicates a risk or threat to public safety.

The incident is being investigated by the FBI and the Joint Terrorism Task Force, University of Oklahoma Police Department, and Norman Police Department.

We want to thank the University of Oklahoma and our law enforcement partners for their continued cooperation in this investigation.

Okay, here's what the latest local news states:

www.newsok.com.../main

1. The FBI has found no evidence so far that he tried to enter Owen (Gaylord) stadium.
2. But there is one OU senior that has stated a guard at the stadium gate told him a kid bolted away from the stadium after refusing to have his backpack searched.
3. There are reports Hinrichs had a backpack.
4. Hinrichs had been having emotional problems for a bit - he dropped out of college 2003-2004 and then returned this year. His family and his friends described him as having "emotional difficulties".
5. Henrich's roommate, Fazal M. Cheema, who is a muslim, was tracked down at a party and him and three other muslim students were taken away and questioned. All were released.
6. Cheema is being described as a "very very nice guy".
7. Hinrichs' father says his son would go fanatical muslim "when pigs fly".
8. Authorities are still looking into the claim Hinrichs tried to purchase ammonium nitrate last week.
9. Hinrichs' father has been told by the FBI that the bomb his son made used high-density hydrogen peroxide and that more of the same was found in his apartment.

Things not said:

1. No mention of detonators.

2. No mention of a suicide note or explanatory note.

OU will tighten security at its home football games and expects Texas to tighten security at the upcoming OU/Texas game which will be at the Cotton Bowl in Dallas.

That's where it is so far.

[edit on 10-5-2005 by Valhall]

There is one thing I will point out that seems to me to point to that he either wanted to blow up near the stadium, or wanted to get to the stadium.

Please reference this campus map:

www.ou.edu...

He lived at Parkview apartments - location 85.

He was an aero engineering student so the majority of his classes would have been at Felgar Hall - location 102 (Aero and Mech Engr), Carson Engineering Center - location 105, the Physical Science Building - location 16, and possibly Sarkeys Energy Center - location 106, depending on what they use that facility for now. Even if he'd been to the library - location 22 - he was about a block away from it when he did the deed. There wouldn't be any readily conceivable reason for an aero engr student to be hanging at the micro-biology center on Saturday night...at least I can't think of one.

That indicates to me he at least wanted to be close to the stadium when he did this.


[edit on 10-5-2005 by Valhall]

Look, a potato chip that looks like Jesus for sale on E-bay got more coverage than this....Brad Pitt and Angelina Jolie sneeze and get more air time on CNN,FOX,etc...

A person BLEW themselves up, 100 yards from a stadium packed with close to 80,000 people and no major News media is curious. lol: That is the part that worries me the most.



This event is bieng censored, and I would like to know by whom.... Give us a reason, becuase hte only one I can think of is mass panic. This is a nightmare scenario. How do you investigate every college? Are there etra precautions in place this weekend at other college football games?

WOW...
did you hear the end of the video...
a plain clothes police officer overheard the entire conversation and was standing nearby while the purchase of ammonium nitrate was attempted...

he went outside and got the vehicles tag number, and reported his suspicion 4 days before this incident...
so there was warning of a possible "bomb" to law enforcement...
and now they will not comment on what investigation was done of Heinrichs before the suicide... but he was already on the radar before the game...

wow...
once again... we hear about how one hand knows something and could prevent a tragedy, but the other hand holds the horses back for some reason...
I still doubt the muslim tie... other than symbolic drama...
the roomate had only been a roomate for a few months, and he was at a party when they found him... Muslim extremists dont go to frat parties...(or stripclubs) remember it is an international school, and everyone knows a muslim classmate or roomate.

Just wanted to share an "ear-witness" account from a OU grad I work with who was at the game Saturday night with his grandfather. He stated that the explosion was QUITE audible in the stadium and described it as follows:

"...it was like a huge thunder clap that you immediately wondered where's the lightning that caused that? It was clear that most of the people in the stadium heard it and then people started looking around and then you could see people starting to look over the deck, but with the new parking garage in that direction there wasn't much you could see.

When it became apparent it wasn't thunder I thought maybe the engineering guys had shot their cannon at an inappropriate time. Then at half-time people that were sitting close to us started coming back to their seats and reporting the stadium had been sealed and people couldn't leave.

At the end of the game Boren came over the university sports radio and was instructing people who were leaving the stadium to avoid the area due west of the stadium and take Jenkins either north or south before attempting to head west."

[edit on 10-5-2005 by Valhall]

Could somebody explain to me why the fifth paragraph on this FBI statement was removed and replaced rather sloppily and hurriedly by a different typewriter that they didn't even bother centering up with the rest of the damned document?

www.ou.edu...

Yeah, and just following that wierd paragraph, is the mention of the joint terrorism squad being called in... without any reason cited before that...

the paragraph in question should be marked
exhibit A in following ATS theories...

I have a feeling that they are still looking for other bombs, or other people involved, and didn't want to spook the subjects...

at this point, if anyone else was involved... they would be somewhere else by now...

Oklahoma media just has released the nightmare scenario...

it was a terrorist attack...
he had two tickets, and several accomplices...

take a look...
oklahoma news channel 9

I think with these new revelations...
it is Ok to call the bastard whatever you want...
I wash my hands of the worthless waste of air...

Thank you O lord... for protecting all those innocent lives from the madness of one screwed up puppy...

Too bad a parent doesn't even know that his child has converted to ISLAM...
it would be an important thing to know.

How bout we all take a moment to reflect that there was a powerful influence here, that prevented tens or perhpas hundreds of deaths...



[edit on 6-10-2005 by LazarusTheLong]