Here is my understanding, now let’s get down to business:

A little help for the people of ATS: I'm keeping this very simple and straightforward.

Once upon a time there were the followers of the Sun God Amon-Ra and those high priests of the God Aton. The high-priests and followers of the God Amon-Ra often performed human sacrificial rituals. Later the Phoenician God, known as "Melqart" or "Baal" or "Baal-Amon" were interconnected with Amon-Ra and Sun worship and gained prominence in other parts of the world. There were many other Pagan Gods in those days but Amon-Ra was by far the largest religion practiced and became dominant; lasting about 3000 years, and up until the time of Christ.

Those followers of the God Aton came about around the 14 century BC and are known today as the earliest Nazarenes or Essenes. (Their descendants would later bring forth that virgin child we call Jesus (the Christ)). Many others have been of this line of true White Brotherhood (Thoth, Amenhotep IV, Confucius’s, Plato, Buddha, Moses IV and Khor-Aton etc and the list goes on. Even the Cathari peoples’ who were exterminated by the early church, were historically misaligned to be considered ONLY Manichean peoples, as they were much more like that of the Essene orders and were practicing Monotheism of the ONE - yet in it’s Multiplicity.

The heathens of the Greeks and Romans of course had their Gods and Goddesses but we’ll stick to just the Egyptian and Phoenician Gods for now to save time.

In the time of Amenhotep IV (an advanced soul) an attempt was made to bring the people back to the one true God of the Children of the Law of One and thus Amenhotep IV the was to re-awaken the earlier understanding of spiritual Monotheism (ONE - yet in it’s Multiplicity) and we now have the God Aton – the One God and the Spiritual Sun – Not the Sun God!!

Instead of accepting Atonism, the followers of Amon-Ra were afraid of losing their vast fortunes and influence and plotted to kill Amenhotep IV. They murdered him and eventually warped the true undertakings of the Atonist’s by re-writing history to show that Amon-Ra was the God of Amenhotep IV and Khor-Aton. They gave the new name to their new heir of Amon-Ra, as "Khor-Amon-Ra".

About 100 BC the Amon-Ra religion, as the Christian era began, died into later version of El (God Saturn), the child of El who was "Set" or "Seth", Osiris (Siris), Isis, and Horus worship. With Osiris linking them all together, many cults sprung off and became the worshipers of Seth the God of evil and betrayal whose followers perform human sacrifice up until even this very day. Horus is the all-seeing-eye and the owl at Bohemians Grove and Osiris (father Sun) and Isis, (the conceiver) of the messiah, Horus.

Many Pharaohs also took upon the name "SETI" instead of "Set" or "Seth". Sound familiar at all?

Can you guess why the Skull and Bones society practice a ceremony in the coffin, of a rebirth? This is symbolic of the Murder of Osiris by the betrayer Seth, his brother. Where do you think the Church of Set got their name? It was not from derived from the word “ha Satan” but from SET!

Although many people try to imply that the Goat of Mendes was made up by a catholic, I can assure you that it bares its true roots in the worshipping of the god EL (Saturnism) and the child, SET. And just as the peace symbol is in actual fact - an upside-down cross with its fire and water reversed and cracked or a satanic symbol, we are told the lie that it was designed to mean "PEACE". Yet no-one looks to see if the man who designed it was a conman (who stole the symbol of the Saracens saying it was an N and D interposed), supported Communism.

Saturn worship (color is black) is so common that it can be found almost anywhere. The black robe of the judge is but one example of the cultures influence but not necessarily of worship. Yet, El is being worshipped by those who also worship SET, Horus and Osiris.

Can you guess why the Eye of Horus is on the pyramid on the dollar bill? This is symbolic of Horus (who was robbed of his eye) rising from Isis and Osiris. The new Messiah is Horus and once again, the Owl at Bohemian grove represents Horus. It is not Moloch but Horus! Moloch is a ritual and not a God as such.

Now there are also those of the Great White Brotherhood who have come down through all ages, and in all faiths and religions, to help us get out of the darkness and find our way back home, so to speak.

We have an interesting task ahead of us. From the Goddess Columbia (the Statue of Liberty) to the Goddess of Dionysius (Washington DC), to our money (eye of Horus), to the streets of Washington DC, to our flags and corporations, - they all show El, Set, Osiris, Isis, and Horus worship!

It would take a fool to call this all coincidence! Can we merely assume they just liked to look at the symbols and forgot about Jesus or Buddha etc? Now we all had better start asking some real questions into where they are truly originating from and why they dominate a rather VERY Christian nation. Although, the Catholic Church may seem pagan to some, they are not supporting Seth worship or practicing human sacrifices are they? Most of their pagan-like symbolism is of the Zodiac and that is early Essene.

If any of you believe that our leaders are Christian or even Masons for that matter, you are being hoodwinked by some very old souls. Many of them choose to become Masons, knowing full-well that Masonry is a great place to hide and lay the blame on. My only real beef with Masonry is that Masons tend to have been deliberately fooled and used by the followers of Set and they will not investigate because the majorities are well-to-do people.

Those of the Great White Brotherhood never hid any truths from us! They gave it back to us when we lost it ourselves. They only kept those secrets from us that THEY KNEW would not serve to help us but would harm us greatly. But they themselves told us that one day we would understand these secrets ourselves, as they come from within our true nature. If they never hid from us but stood with us, then who are these so-called Greats today who say we cannot know anything without being rich, or having the right contact, or joining the right groups etc? Are they to imply they have done something so wonderful for this world that would care to protect us from ourselves? Well, I'd rather trust in God and myself then those idiots!

Our leaders do not believe in the teachings of Buddha or the Prince of Peace (Jesus). They follow a practice that goes back some 3000 years and we ALL have a very serious issue to deal with.

Anyone want to discuss this in more detail?

]

[edit on 30-9-2005 by realrepublican]

RR;

Great post and also we have to include that Sirius is in the midst of all the Isis myths.
Having read extensively many of Manly Hall's writings, he has the most truth of all in Secret Teachings of all Ages..It goes into depth how inter-related all teachings are.
I am a student of The Lucis Trust and have been many years, but I have never felt the need to put down the "children in faith', as we should all strive to spread light in the darkness of this world..BTW, I am not well to do.Gotta give you one [way up] for your great discernment.

[edit on 30-9-2005 by siriuslyone]

[edit on 30-9-2005 by siriuslyone]

It is deeper than that my friend.. Most of what you have in the bible, from the Birth of Jesus, and the Virgin Mary goes back to Egyptian Times, only to be called by the europeans paganism. Anyways... read this intresting book: The egyptian Book of the Dead...

Note well: I am not a Freemason.j ust a casual christian observer.

Great post

Thx siriuslyone....glad you liked it. What is your take on the old "Lucifer Trust"?

It is deeper than that my friend

I read parts of it many years ago - but not everything. I found it to be a great addition to the Dead Sea Scrolls. I agree also that paganism is only a word that a larger cult dumps upon the smaller.

>>>Thx siriuslyone....glad you liked it. What is your take on the old "Lucifer Trust"?

originally posted by realrepublican
Anyone want to discuss this in more detail?

Definitely. You're a good writer and this post is very well composed. I wish more of the posters on these boards took the effort to write something with a sense of quality to it. I'm interested in your perspective. What brought you to this area of study and what influenced your viewpoint? What makes you focus on these particular characters and appellations of characters from the Egyptian and Phoenician Mysteries?

My perspective on the material you've laid out is probably limited. I put a lot of time into comparative mythology-type research but by anyone's definition I'm still a novice, a fool really. The aforementioned Manly P. Hall "Secret Teachings of All Ages" recommendation, I think, is a significant one. I just started reading it myself directed by a link by a user on the ATS board. Just from what I've seen Hall's work is truly sublime. It's hard to believe Hall was in his mid twenties when he wrote it, he was a true prodigy.

The Secret Teachings of All Ages

There's an undercurrent of Gnosticism in what you've presented. To me it seems the Gnostics were in many ways continuing a tradition winding back to a prehistoric era. They addressed Christianity with the language and symbolism of "paganism". The pagans in general were obviously pantheistic, an attribute that only enhanced the ability of various secret societies in transmitting information through complexes of symbolic ciphers. At their roots, spirit and light draw from the same concepts and natural observations. A son of the Supreme Being is frequently if not always the sun god.

The Gnostic position greatly influenced Pauline Christianity, but the conceptions of Christ and their terrestrial/societal agendas were at their core quite diverse. As what became mainstream Christianity gained in numbers and influence, the alternative perspectives of Gnosticism and its pagan antecedents became increasingly seen as a political threat. Active campaigns were enacted to wipe these traditions off the face of the earth and out of history, a campaign that was more successful than it probably had any right to be. While mass murder, the razing and appropriation of temples and other holdings and the destruction of texts and art were the most violent expression of this another large factor was a program of disinformation on multiple fronts and levels. Whole chains of mythological systems became demonized. Generations became completely separated from the basic concepts that made up their very languages. I bet today less then one out of one hundred Americans have any idea where the names of the days of the week come from. Hardly anyone would grasp why the latin names of the days refer to a different but equal pantheon of gods. The uneducated masses dependent upon an aristocracy and priesthood for explaining all natural phenomenon was ill-equipped to understand complex systems of metaphors and allegories.

I'd like to have this conversation with you if possible. To me it seems the field is too big and covering too much time to be the sole propriety of any single group no matter how privileged a class they may have been. That individual organizations have branched off from a larger corpus to me seems a reasonable observation. Naturally not all of these groups are going to share the same philosophies, conceptions, methodologies or agendas. I'd like to talk more with you and everyone on this subject but I'm not sure how to the address the material. I'm hoping you might spell your observations out in a simpler manner for individuals who may not have had access to the same source material that you have or haven't reached a level yet to make your particular insights.

Cheers.

You are a pure soul and I am happy to read you.

As you are also, siriuslyone

[edit on 1-10-2005 by realrepublican]

Hi Cicada,

The ATS server went down, as I was writing back to you last night

Great to read your opinions also and I hope I can be of some service. I don’t want to come across as anything other than the average truth seeker.

I think that a good question for everyone today might be:

“since we are now entering into the new Age of Aquarius and we see the coming earth changes, strange symbols and signs everywhere from on our currency, company logos and government, to our books and movies, how can we discern the main difference between the 2 different versions of the New World Orders - The one of the true brotherly love, vs. the sinister one that seems to resemble or mimic the other, but is instead enfolding into fascism everywhere?”

How many people are asking something like this?

I am also a layman when compared to the greatness of the writings of such a man as Manly P. Hall. I read his books S.T.A.A. and the Lost Keys of Freemasonry before I even read the Bible (Oxford Press) in its entirety – I had previously only read parts of it. That undertaking made it that much easier for me to come to understand certain passages in the Bible which at first, I could not at all discern as to whether it was pure allegorical symbolism, or an actual historical event. I noticed other people misunderstood the allegory also and used that very bias to slam it upon the head of another. This kept me away from much of the typical church thinking at an early age. Also the very notion of eternal damnation, I felt was a huge blasphemy and an insult to God. To imply, that “we as Spirits” or Souls could burn in an eternal hell is the idea of a stupid human. I believe the notion hell is simply put - a lack of love – in all things and that it is only our choice since we chose this journey anyhow.

I read some of the Koran (Pickthall) after reading much of Manly’s work. One thing I bet you noticed about Manly was his great compassion and how he was able to cut to the substance of the matter. For example: he spoke so highly about the Mohammed of Islam and mentioned how few other Great men have been so misaligned and misunderstood. But he never held back to speak the truth that the Koran, like all Great books, is indeed filled with a consortium of hearsay and interpolations added by many of the rulers following the death of Mohammed. But were it not for Islamic tolerance, many of the greatest secrets would also have been lost due to the extremism of the early church. Not to mention many more Jews would have met their fate at the stake. Hall also mentioned how Alister Crowley knew only too well that he was playing with fire and that, just as Socrates discovered, our egoism can catch up with us in the end! Those people who jump into any dogmatic magical practice need to remember the words of the Great Manly P. Hall when he wrote about Crowley. Theolugy, not magic is key here.

The followers of Amon-Ra worshipped the actual elemental sun, but the Atonists’ understood the sun as being a Spiritual Representation of the One True God Aton who was called by Christ and many others "El Shaddai". Not “EL” as in Saturn, but the Infinite God of all the Suns, planets and universes etc. So while the so-called Christians were burning people alive for ridiculous things, they also managed to make a few enemies who (Karma permitting) may not have too much of an issue still seeing it disappear. These so-called Christians also managed to exterminate a highly spiritual and peaceful people named the “Cathari”. The Cathari practiced the ancient rites of the early Egyptian and Essene schools of Mystery and they understood the Kabala or Tree of life but called it the “symbol of life” - the name changed after St. John’s input. However, modern-day Christians are appalled by much of the actions of the early church – they were acting just like the Romans were! No wonder we called it Roman-Catholic, having much of the Roman influence even to this very day. You mentioned the zodiac - I noticed everything from our clocks and calanders, to our entertainment is based on the zodiac.

Speaking of the astrological aspect, the popes bathtub is a wondrous creation of embossed zodiac signs..
Being a Piscean, I decided to explore what the great seers, writers were what sign.
I will include this link, as it tells us about Hall. but he seems to be an enigma just the same as Robert Johnson at the Crossroads.
Enjoy.

www.mitchhorowitz.com...

Originally posted by realrepublican
of this line of true White Brotherhood (Thoth, Amenhotep IV, Confucius’s, Plato, Buddha, Moses IV and Khor-Aton etc and the list goes on.

What do you mean, 'white'? I dare say that not a single person on that list could walk down the streets of modern day NYC and be considered a regular white guy. Even plato and the ancient greeks were extremely dark.

Even the Cathari peoples’

There's a real question as to just how big the Cathars were, and in any case its probably incorrect to refer to a 'cathari' people, its a set of religious ideas, not an ethnicity.

as they were much more like that of the Essene

On what do you base this??

orders and were practicing Monotheism of the ONE - yet in it’s Multiplicity.

I think its generally accepted that teh cathars were Dualists tho, with an aetheral god of goodness and a wicked god of matter who created this material world, not that the two gods unify at an even higher level.

The One God and the Spiritual Sun – Not the Sun God!!

On what do you base this tho, he clearly identifies his sole monotheistic god with the all powerful sun.

whose followers perform human sacrifice up until even this very day.

Where is the evidence for the spread of this different religion across the world around 100 BC??

Can you guess why the Skull and Bones society practice a ceremony in the coffin, of a rebirth?

What purpose woudl that serve? How can we know what they interpret it as? The christians had a ritual of being born again, they did it with water. Their saviour dies and is put into his tomb, and is reborn again, and of course osiris is pyut intoa coffin and returns to life. We can't say that the SnBers are thinking of osiris rather than, say, jesus, or any number of other things that death and rebirth can be talking about.

Originally posted by Nygdan

What do you mean, 'white'? I dare say that not a single person on that list could walk down the streets of modern day NYC and be considered a regular white guy. Even plato and the ancient greeks were extremely dark.

That list is the Illuminati(emphasis on "the"),the name of the highest initiates of the group being discussed. Aside from those who reached Illuminati,this group actually had no known name but is sometimes referred to as the Great White Brotherhood. "White" here refers to illumination and garb,not their race. They often wore white robes to symbolize being illuminated by light.

edit:corrected wording

[edit on 1-10-2005 by Loungerist]

Hi Nygan.

......'cathari' people, its a set of religious ideas, not an ethnicity.

I agree that they were not an ethnicity as such, but they certainly had a culture.

: as they were much more like that of the Essene
On what do you base this??

Cathari came from the word (in Greek) katharos, meaning "pure". Catharism was in fact and still is, a form of early Christianity!

The Cathari were of many different backgrounds. They lived in Spain, Italy, France, Bulgaria, Albania, etc. The Cathari, just as the Essenes, abandoned the false teaching that God was a vengeful God as portrayed in the Old Testament. They believed in Reincarnation, as do the early Essene Christians. Pope Innocent III decided in the name of the church, that all Cathari should be burned at the stake for heresy.

Over one million Cathari (men, woman and children) met their fate as d declared heretics. By the middle of the 13th century, the doctrine of Reincarnation was almost wiped out.

"..... cathars were Dualists .....with an aetheral god of goodness and a wicked god of matter .... not that the two gods unify at an even higher level. "

In the highest levels of reality there cannot be more than one Absolute Being God. We are all in IT and nothing can exist, outside of it. We are one with God but in the worlds of separateness, we have created our own Gods to worship also. These are not God (the father) but elementals, which can serve as Gods. The Cathari were dualistic but they never accepted that matter or the material world as "evil" as many Gnostics. They understood that there is in reality - no separation between God and US. The Cathari knew that the archangel known as "Lucifer" was their brother and only is antagonistic to those who are still stuck lost deep in matter.

: The One God and the Spiritual Sun – Not the Sun God!!
On what do you base this tho, he clearly identifies his sole monotheistic god with the all powerful sun.

The spiritual sun is not the same thing as worshipping a sun or star. What are stars and suns other than elementals, which the archangels created " Let us create..." - God was speaking to the Archangelic forms? People worshipped cows, rivers and streams also. But those Greats who saw the bigger picture asked why they should only worship the Sun and the moon and lake and why not worshipping the creator of ALL!

Where is the evidence for the spread of this different religion across the world around 100 BC??

Sun worship was spread throughout the world before 100 BC. It died down around 100 BC, due in part to the Roman influence and that of Christianity. The old age die and the new age was that of the fish - Pisces.

"What purpose would that serve?" .... "We can't say that the SnBers are thinking of osiris rather than, say, jesus, or any number of other things that death and rebirth can be talking about. "

Common sense pretty much shows that being reborn again has nothing to do with going into a coffin. The advanced initiate knows that to be reborn is to represent that stripping away the egoism and to awaken to the Christ Consciousness. S&B do not swear allegiance to Christ or to Buddha, or Brahma, but they swear it to a material world where they can be at ease and thus to indulge in their passions without fear. Thus, they are now "thrice" born!

Thus is not related to the teachings of Jesus. But Osiris is the old father Sun and he was thrown into a coffin by Set and drowned. S&B support the death of Osiris by his brother Set. Remember that many have sacrificed humans to these Gods - including not only Set but also Horus.

At the Grove, the ritual that some say is to “Moloch”, is not correct. The Cremation of Care could be called "Moloch" over the Owl. The Owl is Horus. Horus is rising in the sky high above the pyramid; the eye of Horus is the all-seeing eye (the other eye Set took away from Horus) that shows up everywhere. Horus' symbol is that of an Owl. The Owl is great and most wise and will turn its head to see from one eye (its hidden on the 1 dollar bill)




[edit on 1-10-2005 by realrepublican]

Some ideas for Cicada and others - if you're interested in future research:

Now I have a warm spot for Freemasonry – They are very good people. So many Freemasons do not yet realize how important their history is. Was it not the Great Sleeping Prophet Edgar Cayce himself who said that the future in the New Age of Aquarius would belong to something like that brotherly love of the Mason, not necessarily Freemasonry but that brotherly love portion of it? If it were not for Freemasonry, many of the greatest truths would never have been protected and later revealed. Early Freemasons understood the notion of the Spiritual Sun, or as was known earlier as “Aton” and helped bring forward much of those Mystery school teachings. But later it degenerated into a tradition of sorts, but the Masons never worshipped the material Sun as a God. And although the Knights Templar, who fought against the Muslim Assassins (the Saracens – wearing the modern-day peace symbol as a sign of disrespect to the Christian), the knights also continued to preserve the earliest forms of the Essene teachings of Jesus and many others, who came before and after him. But the Church decided to rule over the people, just in the same way the Mullah‘s and Imams did it to the Islamic world after the Great Prophet Mohammed passed over. This pattern seems to repeat itself over and over again. In all the Great Empires, we see this happening.

My interest in spiritual truth means everything to me. I studied the writings of early Christian scholars like Origen and St. Augustine, and the 4 main books of the Bible, Mark, Mathew, John, and Luke. Interestingly enough, all the earliest Christians believed in re-incarnation - no surprise there. These advanced souls seemed so close to what I envisioned Jesus to be like. The Logos or Christ consciousness, are common terms to me. I started to slowly place the bits and pieces together and eventually came to the conclusion that the Bible, just like the Koran and many of the books were all interconnected to an Absolute Divine Truth. Even still the early fathers of all faiths altered some text.

I learned even more when studying the negative aspects that many conspiracy theorists were claiming. Just as some people had limited knowledge of the coming New Age of Aquarius, illuminati etc my interests were not at all limited to the Gods of Set, Osiris, and Isis etc. For example, the Gods of the Hindu - Brahma, Vishnu, Shiva, are Triune in nature, as are the Gods, Osiris, and Isis and Ra etc. But these God’s were always understood as being one in multiplicity (but not a multiple) But always we do have those degenerates who would attempt to poison God’s name by ruling over his fellow man. The leaders of today are really pushing their luck, for if they are as gifted in smarts as they claim to be, they must also be aware of the coming Karma-related earth changes and the new Age of spiritual enlightenment.

There were also the followers of Seth and Jehovah, a cruel and vengeful God. The early Sanhedrin Israelites are but only one example. Other descendants are those Set and Jehova worshipers may very well rule the world today (yet under many different names). The cruel God of Jehovah or Set was not accepted by most of the early Gnostics and the Essenes and many of their practices are spoken out against in New Testament. The Sanhedrin was the ones who Jesus spoke out to against saying “those who call yourselves Jews, but are not, and you do lie!” The Sanhedrin manipulated the Romans into murdering Jesus.

From my readings of the Dead Sea Scrolls and other books (for example: Mahayana Buddhism’s Tibetan Book of the Dead, the Hindu Upanishads and even some Classical Indian Vedanta philosophy), I thought I finally had enough to satisfy a huge appetite, but that was short lived. I will add that I found many answers to my questions in the various books and writings of Edgar Cayce. Not that he said anything more fantastic than the other, but it was the powerful way in which he brought together ALL religions and all faiths; he even explained the origins of man from before the time of Atlantis like I have never heard before. Thus it validates the Mayans’ and Samaritan texts along with the Bible and many, many more. Amilius and Thoth are but examples of names often not mentioned or granted much attention by modern day scholars. Yet, Thoth’s flying craft may still be hidden under the Sphinx? How else could the build the pyramids without changing the molecular structure of the stone to float on air? If you have studied anything of the Theosophists, you will notice how similar Cayce’s teachings are.


From that point forward, Atlantis was the only thing I could think about. I also read the writings of John Panial (Children of the Law of One), Alice Bailey (Lucis Trust) and I when I became stronger in my resolve I read some books on witchcraft and Satanism (black magic interested me in general) to “understand and know thy enemy” better and also to separate them from those who are offering true service to their fellow man. I have pieced together some modern day conspiracies (still ongoing!) and am trying to understand what is really going on today. I know Roswell was faked – this I know and that the little green men are more of Crowley’s little demons (from inner space) rather than from an outer space, as such. There are Guardian-like extra-terrestrials - if you want to call them that and they do not need to kidnap us or make deals with any government. They balance the Earth’s Karma. As for UFO’s: The Tesla-based ARV’s are lightening fast and terrain made, based on my research. Most of lies propagated by our all wise and most humble global elite have to do with instilling fear and controlling of the masses. Much of all this technology is now coming from Atlantis times – the people are incarnating here from Atlantis now.

I highly recommend you look into researching Edgar Cayce, if you have not already done so. All his teachings speak of something that ring bells of truth deep within us all. Some are not ready to hear the truth though. But even still, Cayce’s stuff on health is absolutely mind blowing!! Basically, Cayce is another great addition to bring understandings together. But beware of those corruptions of the true teachings also. I am absolutely convinced that there are some souls here (from Atlantian times) who have in effect been able to take over the minds of some of our politicians. I cannot yet determine just how far this has permeated into our daily lives but based on the current level of mistrust and knowing that many of teachers the Great White Brotherhood are winding up either dead or missing, things seem to point in that general direction. All the prophecies (from Nostradamus to the Mayan’s to Cayce etc) seem to end in the Age of Aquarius, so I take them very seriously. It’s almost as if we are about to write new one’s!

Have you also noticed the earth changes? They will get much worst and for those people who do not look for safety lands, they may join the fate of the early Atlantians. I learned that the flood in the Bible and mentioned in other texts was a real event which occurred just after Noah built the Arc, about 10,500 BC. His was the last of the 3 great disasters of Atlantis. Also the pyramid represents a holy workshop for us to go inside and contact our guardian Angels on each of its sides. However, the "Arc of the Covenant" was more like a giant capacitor which the Atlantians used inside the Great Pyramid-like structure to generate power, without wires, then the Ghost in Indiana Jones movies. But again, what is the real meaning the pyramid on the dollar bill? Those evil Belialians used pyramids to control the human-animals Nephilim (in Atlantis), so we have to wonder if the symbols we are seeing today are going to be used for good, are they simply corruptions of the true meanings. 10 million years ago came the first wavers into matter and they were sometimes mating with humans. These monstrosities or the son’s and daughter’s of Man were the offspring of the first wavers mating with man. These daughter’s of Men were called “Lilith” or “Nephilim” or “Annukai” and just as real as you and I are today - “for there were Giants in the Earth in those days!” This also explains the strange symbolism in Egypt of those “things” with the bodies of an animal and head of a man or beast etc. They were eventually freed by Thoth and others etc.

Gnosticism, I see it as a continuation of the earlier faiths and culture and including many parts of them. One of the Gnostic symbols is the 6-pointed Star of David. This is also on the 1-dollar bill. The symbol is not only Jewish but Early Christian or Essene and was used as early as Atlantian times. the Alchemists (Saint-Germaine), the Rosicrucian’s, the Templar Knights, School of Tao and Gnostic Essenes and many more were all interconnected to the early schools of wisdom. Much of it entered into Europe later, when still blossoming. Certain Gnostic orders worshipped the spiritual Sun behind Aton calling him other names also. St. Augustine was a Gnostic also and later became a Catholic. He was slightly critical of Gnostics, I thought. Later I realized that his major beef with them was that although he too believed in a dualistic approach to good and evil, he felt the Gnostic leaders had been too self-righteous. St. Augustine was also against the idea of astrology but I think he mostly opposed the giving up of our free will, in light of Astrology etc. However, I personally believe that free will and astrology compliment each other at a higher stage and that he may have had difficulty with this concept. Another attack on the early Gnostics by Christians is that they started making excuses for doing evil (cause that's their nature etc), thus acting like they could also pickup the balance of their evil deeds, by doing good later on when they so chose it. Thus, some would use their un-evolved egoism to assume that they could decide to give un-selfish love, when they were in fact being selfish etc.

Man’s nature is at times; able to insist that we do great things to balance the bad out, when we have in fact, only done wrong – for reasons we are often unaware of. Albert Pike also was aware of this Gnostic thought. He too, felt that we are dualistic in nature. Perhaps, if I have misinterpreted this you could help me there.

Cabbalists/Gnostic/Manichean understanding is very close the the White Brotherhood's. Slighy differnces is regarding the concept of evil. WB do not see evil as something real, or that the earth (matter) is evil – but only the absence of light is evil. Thus, to them evil is not needed for balancing something that's already perfect but rather evil is meant to force the personality to come to know through experience (good or bad) what are Love, Truth, and Mercy. Without evil, we are still but angels (no beginning and no end) and not wondering monads in time, space and place. But we can never become what we already are not, Pike said. So if we are already Gods, then it is only through self-realization - which comes naturally from stripping away the darkness or evil surrounding us, that we are free of matter. And as Manly P. Hall also put it, power of Lucifer (matter) is within our grasps. Pike and Hall seem to be very close the source of all truth, IMHO.

All the Best.



[edit on 1-10-2005 by realrepublican]

ah amon Ra. The father of monotheism.

Keep going, dont stop here, I want to here more.
This is really interesting an fills in alot of gaps that I have came across. its like all my missing puzzle peices.

Cool.

While I've frequently made notes for my posts (what can I say, I'm a virgo), this is the first time I've felt compelled to take notes from another member's posts. Again, very impressive.

siruslyone, thanks for the link on Hall. That was a really fascinating. I noticed something interesting while reading it. Hall's mother (no name given) was said to have been a chiropractor. I knew chiropractic began around the time that Hall was born so it was apparent that Hall's mother was a very fascinating person in her own right. She had to have been one of the earliest woman chiropractors. My girlfriend is a chiropractor so I asked her and she confirmed that chiropractic started around the turn of the century. She also thought a woman chiropractor practicing that early was an extreme rarity and that she may have been the first and that such information was researchable. Research panned out. D.D. Palmer founded what has become modern chiropractic in 1895. I haven't been able to make a direct connection to Hall (I'll work on it) but my quick search did turn up some intriguing information. The first woman chiropractor was Dr. Minerva Paxson. She was the first chiropractor to receive a license (in Illinois, the first state to issue chiropractic licenses). She was also the first chiropractor to practice in Canada. Hall was born in Ontario. After figuring this out I realized that the P. in Manly P. Hall stood for Palmer. I'll try to dig deeper. Even the Philosophic Research Society web site doesn't seem to have any information about Hall's mother.

realrepublican, thank you for your research advice. Just to be abundantly clear, I'm not a mason. If anything I'm a surrealist (visual arts background), which was really my first path into studying esotericism, along with a typically nerdish mythology passion. I see that Edgar Cayce is probably the next step I should take (I've still really only dipped my toes into Hall). This is actually something I've been hearing and I guess ignoring my whole life. My mother is something of a New Age/hippie stereotype and was always heavy into Cayce. My father (they weren't together) was a Buddhist (maybe the worst Buddhist ever) so I can really recognize that current underlying what you're presenting. Due to these influence, I suppose, I also recognized the hypocrisy inherent in mainstream christianity at a young age. I used to take great pleasure riding the bus to elementary school using logic to undermine the fragile philosophies of my christian classmates. I would describe myself as either an atheist or a pantheist depending on how you look at it. My personal conception is so far removed from the misconceptions of most religious people that I'd rather they thought I was a strict rationalist then try to have the conversation with them. When I say pantheist I do not mean something opposed to what you refer to as "the one in multiplicity". I believe in everything. I recognize a universal intelligence (for lack of a better term, words and symbols are only models and modeling is always limited) that is beyond our comprehension. I realize that all things manifested and unmanifested are aspects of this intelligence. This intelligence is infinite. Again for lack of better terms this infinity expresses itself as the opposites one and zero. Zero is an abstraction misunderstood by most, including those who hold the concept as a hallmark of higher thinking. Compared to nothing every phantasm, day dream, and even falsehood is real, so at least on this level dream time is an actual manifestation of existence, and thus an aspect of one. As any calculator will show you one is infinite. The manifested reality of the physical senses is the interaction of being and nothingness.

My mother was big on reincarnation. Naturally my father was as well. I never fully embraced the notion (perhaps because my mother told me I was the reincarnation of Lou Costello. I was hoping she'd say Botticelli or Winsor McCay). I appreciate the concept but academic study caused me to shy away from body/spirit dualism. I could always understand how reincarnation occurs on a physical level as the matter of our bodies breaks down into nutrients that are absorbed and redistributed to other life-forms, up a chain of manifestation as complex as that of any theology. I can also recognize reincarnation concepts in genealogy, the continued expression of genetic information over time, and I'm not opposed to notions of genetic memory. I can appreciate the concept on a spiritual level if I allow my self to see the spirit as an aspect of light. Light is the first principle of the universe, the energy animating our bodies is light. Our cells, including our DNA, emit and receive micro-bursts of light as a form of communication. Energy and matter are, they are never created or destroyed. At death the light leaves us and transfers to somewhere else. Humankind is at its infancy when it comes to understanding the nature of light. The photon itself exhibits dualistic principles, existing as both a wave and a particle.

I'd like to talk in detail about the material you've presented but I'm going to wait a bit. I've found my long posts frequently kill threads and I don't want to do that here. I also will benefit from a chance to compose my thoughts. Thanks again, best material I've seen on the ATS boards yet.


edited because ATS boars are not the same thing as ATS boards

[edit on 2-10-2005 by Cicada]

Yes, I'd also like to compliment realrepublican on a very interesting thread. I have a warm spot for the concept of reincarnation into the God-consciousness too, in fact you may all enjoy visiting here.

However I'm afraid freemasonry is likely to disappoint you from a historical connections point of view. Freemasonry is just one among a number of channels in which great information has been passed down through the centuries, but is unique in the respect that is does not claim new information in and of itself. It offers a different way of looking at pre-existing information and strongly exhorts the member to go elsewhere to get the real answers.

Freemasonry is exceptionally simple in its aims because the Great Truth is, in itself, exceptionally simple. It is men, both inside and outside of freemasonry, that have made it more complicated.

Originally posted by Chasrac64
Keep going, dont stop here, I want to here more.
This is really interesting an fills in alot of gaps that I have came across.

its like all my missing puzzle peices.

Great stuff Chasrac64. Glad you were able to find answers to some questions.

I'd like to talk in detail about the material you've presented but I'm going to wait a bit. I've found my long posts frequently kill threads and I don't want to do that here. I also will benefit from a chance to compose my thoughts. Thanks again, best material I've seen on the ATS boards yet.

You're most welcome Cicada. Thx again for the kind words and I hope to hear further open introspection - I'll be hanging around ATS for a little while, yet.

Freemasonry is exceptionally simple in its aims because the Great Truth is, in itself, exceptionally simple. It is men, both inside and outside of freemasonry, that have made it more complicated.

Hi Trinity!

I still have much to learn about you're understanding/version of Freemasonry. BTW, you must be a patient, yet "nice and plain" Mason, to put up with the likes of me!