Rebuttal to "I just got back from a FEMA Detainment Camp

The man works with deadly diseases and piles of dismembered corpses. I somehow doubt he's been scared away by little old me.

I understand the desire some have voiced about being respectful and courteous to our new member.

I also think there's a clear difference between being courteous, and being defferential.

This gentleman's post elicited responses of various sorts, ranging from pleasant greetings to irate sarcasm. This is pretty standard, and provides a good cross-section of the views of the populace. I don't see any reason for the repeated requests from members to tone it down.

This is business as usual, no? Am I missing something?

Dude made the decision to come here, probably with the best intentions. One can only hope he keeps coming back, and becomes a valued member of the community, but there won't be any ring-kissing on my watch, not while FEMA continues to spend astronomical quantities of taxpayer money on a daily basis, with questionable results and, apparently, zero accountability.

The membership of ATS is a collection of individuals, so it should come as no surprise when we don't all share one opinion. Anyone embarassed by the actions of some members should perhaps be more realistic, and simply settle for being embarassed regarding human beings in general.

As I said before, there are hard questions still hanging, questions that require real answers. Until those are forthcoming, I caution against being overly protective of this gentleman. Besides, assumedly he can take care of himself, being an adult with a military record and a number of other accomplishments.

Originally posted by WyrdeOne
As I said before, there are hard questions still hanging, questions that require real answers. Until those are forthcoming, I caution against being overly protective of this gentleman. Besides, assumedly he can take care of himself, being an adult with a military record and a number of other accomplishments.

Any professional, marine or not, when confronted with what sounds like 13 year olds yelling "BS! I'm gonna speed dial your phone a hundred times a day!" at him/her (to clarify, I am only talking about a couple of posts here) will likely not consider such a communication as worthy of his/her time. I am not being "protective" of this gentleman at all. I am being mindful of the best way to illicit the facts from an interview or communication. So I guess the mob is going to turn it's ire against me now because I have been interpreted as "going in to bat for the feds". Way to misread my intention. My apologies, my bad. Carry on as you were.

[edit on 2005-9-11 by wecomeinpeace]

I just want to say that I agree with wcip. Let's stay mature. Mr. Ed was a bit petty in some of his original comments, but I full well know that was defensiveness. As a community we're constantly having to get past each other's bad days. We need to make Ed feel welcome so that he will answer the questions that still are unanswered.



[edit on 9-11-2005 by Valhall]

with what sounds like 13 year olds yelling "BS! I'm gonna speed dial your phone a hundred times a day!" at him/her (to clarify, I am only talking about a couple of posts here)

wecomeinpeace:

I hope this was not directed at my post!

My post addressed discrepencies in his rebuttal.

If ??? this was in direct response to my post in particular:

I suggest you read Valhall's initial post [verbatim], then read his initial post/rebuttal [verbatim], then read my post [verbatim].

No where did I state, nor infer, that I intended, as you stated to repeatedly speed dial his phone!?

I simply stated that if his post/rebuttal was real [actually from him] that I would be in touch to discuss why, on several points in his so-called rebuttal, he made comments that skirted/contradicted many of the points brought up by Valhall's original post.

I am definitely not 13 [oooh to be again :O)]

If you have a proiblem with my post, please address it from a factual standpoint and post the errors contained within . . . I called to question his response on 2-3 areas of Valhall's original post and if you feel I did so erroneously, please enlighten me?!

If my comments regarding whether it was a real/fake posting (i.e. BS=BS or real=we gotta talk) came across as too aggressive . . . my apology :O( as that was not my intention.



[edit on 11-9-2005 by 12m8keall2c]

12m

Good show! I have a feeling Agent has contacted him in some manner as well. Some one had suggested I try to get an interview.

Wouldn't it be much better if a third party (i.e. you or anybody else) took care of that?

I think so.

Any professional, marine or not, when confronted with what sounds like 13 year olds yelling "BS! I'm gonna speed dial your phone a hundred times a day!" at him/her (to clarify, I am only talking about a couple of posts here) will likely not consider such a communication as worthy of his/her time.

If Ed had such a revelation, and we were indeed wasting his time, it would be in his best interest to beat feet, and I, for one, wouldn't begrudge him his escape. The aptmosphere is sometimes downright juvenile on ATS, but I sincerely believe the few good apples more than make up for the bunch.

He's going to have to come to the same realization as the rest of us have; if we're still here, we must have found something redeeming about the place.

I am not being "protective" of this gentleman at all. I am being mindful of the best way to illicit the facts from an interview or communication.

This gentleman is not the only FEMA employee in the country. He is an interesting personality, and he would be a valued addition to the ATS member family, but if he can't shrug off the fools and boast thick enough skin to ward off the troll blows, well, #, that answers that, don't it? If you can't adapt to the environment, you die. (In this case you log off, but you get my point.)

So I guess the mob is going to turn it's ire against me now because I have been interpreted as "going in to bat for the feds". Way to misread my intention.

I'm insulted that you perceive me as the voice of the mob, or worse, as its leader. I'm neither, just an individual with some questions and some opinions in equal measure.

ATS is actually not representative of the average American, since it has a specific audience and a specific draw. You're always going to encounter more anti-authority conspiracy theorists on a conspiracy site than you ordinarily would meet on the street. Most people 'out in the world' are doubtless sleeping secure in their beds, with the knowledge that they have hired others to run the country for them, regardless of performance indicators.

My apologies, my bad. Carry on as you were.

No need to apologize for your opinions and, rest assured, I will carry on.

I'm anxious to hear from Ed again, but I get the sense he has more important things to do than field questions on an internet conspiracy news site. He may have come here of his own volition, to dispel some rumors, or he may have been tasked with a minor PR reposte in response to Val's excellent eyewitness reportage.

We'll see, the proof will be in the pudding. Will Mr. Ed stick around and become a member of the community, or was he simply engaged in a drive by propagandizing on behalf of the subterranean FEMA overlords? Only time will tell.

Sorry this is my first post! I'm not sure it will work! But here goes! If we can't donate directly to the people that need our help what can we do to help them? I refuse to give my hard earned money to the Red Cross! But I would give all I possibly could to any family or person in need! It is not right in my opinion to not except any or all offers of help and or assistance to anyone in need!

Welcome Ed,

Coming from another ed hello! And thank you for giving what I believe to be a rational explanation to the events from the inside.

I do not know how familiar you are with these boards but there are a bunch that hate America no matter what it does even some citizens. Some that believe that Bush actually caused 911, they see conspiracies in everything sometimes to the point of laughter on my part. I have been here a little over a year and have seen it time and time again.

Here is one example,

Originally posted by WyrdeOneor was he simply engaged in a drive by propagandizing on behalf of the subterranean FEMA overlords? Only time will tell.

FEMA overloards?


I am definitely one of the minority in here, so far to the right that I get hammered a lot.

But please, even though some of these folks think the government boogie man is out to get them, some do not and know that this was a HUGE undertaking and that mistakes will be made. That is when you learn from them so that they don't happen again.

Thank you again for coming in and giving a voice to reason.....




[edit on 11-9-2005 by edsinger]

edsinger,

Are you verifying that lessons have been learned and that the situation as explained to me last Monday will not, in fact, proceed forward?

And, if so, where are you getting your information, because the other Ed hasn't verified that yet.

[edit on 9-11-2005 by Valhall]

Sorry this is my first post! I'm not sure it will work! But here goes! If we can't donate directly to the people that need our help what can we do to help them?

I've heard nothing but good things about the salvation army and habitat for humanity. Try those avenues perhaps?

I refuse to give my hard earned money to the Red Cross!

Good for you! It's refreshing to see people who share my opinion regarding those twits. I witnessed their methodology firsthand in NY on Sept 11, it was shocking. I wouldn't give them the sweat off my nethers. (They'd just lose it anyway)

But I would give all I possibly could to any family or person in need! It is not right in my opinion to not except any or all offers of help and or assistance to anyone in need!

I'm sure habitat will be working overtime to help these folks out. I've known several people connected to that organization, and I've been very impressed with all of them. If you want to take an active role in the recovery effort, you could do a lot worse than helping out habitat for humanity.

Best of luck to you in your search for an honest charitable organization.

Edited to include:
Edsinger
Living proof of the existence of acute humor allergies, thou art.


[edit on 11-9-2005 by WyrdeOne]

12m

Good show! I have a feeling Agent has contacted him in some manner as well. Some one had suggested I try to get an interview.

Wouldn't it be much better if a third party (i.e. you or anybody else) took care of that?

I think so.

Valhall,

If this is/was for me then

I've done my proverbial homework on the guy and, for the most part, he seems legit., but my concerns are moreso for his response to certain aspects of your original post.

Some of his responses contradict what you and yours saw, and experienced.

Junk food, harmful toys/devices, etc.

I just want to clear the air [per se] for myself.

Are his responses from first-hand knowledge, or what he has been told?


[edit on 11-9-2005 by 12m8keall2c]

12

If he will talk to you, will you try to get answers to my questions previously stated in this thread?

I'll be glad to u2u them to you. Let me know.

Originally posted by Valhall
edsinger,

Are you verifying that lessons have been learned and that the situation as explained to me last Monday will not, in fact, proceed forward?

And, if so, where are you getting your information, because the other Ed hasn't verified that yet.

I was replying to the fact that he stated WE ALL FAILED....as for the major questions you asked in your original threads, I think he did a fair job of explaining it so the "detainment' camps scenario can be dropped.

These people have a hard job ahead of them and mistakes will be made, but its on Internet sites like this that rumors can cause damage to what is a a very large task ahead of our nation.

You saw what you saw, you had questions, you now have answers.

One of the biggest that stands out to me was the cell phone towers were put up and the theories as to why. When he stated Cingular actually donated them, that should be the first clue.....I actually have Cingular and will soon drop them but that was a nice thing they did and in a way, my cell phone bill helped. (Separate item - They would not let me donate my rollover minutes of which I have around 3000, that pissed me off, so they just go away when someone could use them)

Val - It was a good article that was just what this site is all about, but you have your answers for the most part. I would hope that ed might have time to come back and take a look at what was said, but most here would probably just accuse him of some alien ray beam hurricane government weapon. He has MUCH more important things to attend to. As far as I am concerned, he did what he needed to do, before the rumors and accusations got out of hand in this time of national crisis.

[edit on 11-9-2005 by edsinger]

I think it is great that someone from FEMA took the time to address the concerns that Val's first discussion brought up. It made a lot of sense to me, despite a few forehead-smacking follys.

I think the whole food issue is understandable. In the age of warnings on hot cups of coffee you have to realise that the government have to cover all the bases. Think of the opportunity for litagations and law-suits that these camps could present?

Future Headline:

CLASS ACTION SUIT: "FEMA FED US NOTHING BUT POP-TARTS"

Yeah, I know the whole "razor in the apple" thing is urban legend, but don't hospitals still x-ray candy for kids at Halloween? Just in case? I still think that FEMA made a dog's dinner of the whole thing, but let's not get too nit-picky and remember a lot of the actions he has to take come from a society we created ourselves.

I hope the dude comes back and continues to discuss this topic, his inside opinion would be valuable.

Originally posted by edsinger

...but you have your answers for the most part.

[edit on 11-9-2005 by edsinger]

Actually, no I don't ed. Sorry, I really don't. I have bureaucratic reasons that confirm a lot of the things, but I don't have answers to some of the more important things.

Like do they get to come and go from the camp? That was not answered.

Why the military presence? Not addressed.

I have a set of questions posted in this thread that still need to be answered. Until then, NO, all of my concerns have not been addressed.

Originally posted by howmuchisthedoggy
I think the whole food issue is understandable. In the age of warnings on hot cups of coffee you have to realise that the government have to cover all the bases.

I don't know..... It is the logical explanation, and you would think that's what Val would have been told when she was there. But that is not what was said at the time. There is the problem. There is a big difference between obvious food contamination problems and someone saying it would be a problem because everyone wouldn't have one. Think about it.

I somehow doubt he will openly respond as edkostiuk on this site again.

After the reception he received, (which has nothing to do with disagreeing with him or challenging his statements), I bet he's done.

What I am sure of is that he will read these posts nonetheless. When he does, I want to remind Ed that he can always create a NEW and ANONYMOUS account and still participate in the ATS community. His experience and perspective would be an added value to this board, and his views could be shared in a manner that would not require future disclosure of his identity.

Just a thought, Ed. Hope you stick around.

Originally posted by ValhallLike do they get to come and go from the camp? That was not answered.

Well I thought that once cleared from medical hazards they would be. What do you think? You think that they will be interned like at Gitmo? Can you be serious? Can you take your conspiracy hat off for a minute and not think the worse of your nations representatives?

Originally posted by ValhallWhy the military presence? Not addressed.

Hmm I assume that is national guard not active but either way, I think security is VERY important. These people have been through one hell of a shock and the press is the last thing they need.

Let me give you an example, in the middle 80's a town of about 800 people less than 5 miles from my house was hit by a F4 tornado.....the national guard was the first to send TROOPS in and it was for many reasons. Thing is, at that time there wasn't no one jumping up and down claiming the Feds were invading the town of Allendale, or that the President or NWO was trying to take over the world for oil and quite frankly the citizens were thankful they were there.

And I know this is the wrong thread, but this tornado wiped out HALF of the town, literally, just foundations left. Not one single person died. The most serious injury was an infant that a mother in a mobile home shower tried to hold on to. That child is fine today as is the mother, but the devastation and NO warning , there should have been 10's of deaths if not more. There is a God and His Grace was with the town of Allendale that evening.

[edit on 11-9-2005 by edsinger]

This was really disappointing. Black mark on web discussion boards if this Official doesn't show up again. Rather than sensibly discuss the incredibly important topics at hand, we have people talking about IP spoofing and other bizzare conspiracies that aren't worth addressing, like Poptarts. Thousands dead, internal refugees mismanaged, a natural and a administerial disaster, and when one of the people who are working to tend to the problem shows up, we've got nothing. Valhall's incredible report gave our shtick some respectability, resulted in an impromptu response by the government, and we're hear squandering it.

lol oops i posted twice sry xD

[edit on 11-9-2005 by DevilSent91]