Question for the religious....

Q: What do you think happens to those who do not believe as you do, after death? If they are doomed, do you think this is a fair action taken by your deity? If they are not doomed, then why adhere to the tenets of your faith?

In other words, if you are a Christian, do you think all non-Christians are going to Hell? etc. And, if not, then why should they bother going to church, etc.? I'm just curious, as if one group is actually right (not something I'm advocating here, but a "what if"), then that means billions are wrong, so we're talking of the fate of billions here....

Try to imagine only Christians going to heaven. Well what happens to the Jews and the Muslims? Only Christians? The idea of only Christians going to heaven is ridiculous. They spout their belief that if you do not believe in Christ you're going to hell. They'll say it to your face but they're wrong.

In Islam, whoever believes in God and the final judgment and whoever works good deeds has their reward. Doesn't matter if your Muslim, Christian, Jew, Buddhist, etc.

I do not know what will happen to a unbeliever. Unbeliever being a person who doesn't believe at all. Only God can judge them.

earth religions are silly, we are, there was no time when we weren't and there is no time when we aren't

Originally posted by Illmatic67
Only God can judge them.

What if there is no God. What if when you die, thats it, your just dead. Going to sleep without waking up.
I am not an athiest or Christian. I am a skeptic. I believe
the religions of the world are all only in place to create balance and answer the question, What is it all for?
If the masses dont believe that there is something greater, the world would be chaos. There would be no
structure no reason for there to be.
I have asked several people the question, what if?
Several try to read scriptures to me but in the end they dont know the answer. They tell me, well we will never really know but dont you think living a life of prosperity and good health ,helping others to be happy and finding solace in your work as a good person will really
make your life now more complete?
Sounds crazy to me. Do I believe Im going to hell because I believe this way? I think you have to believe in it to answer that question.

Today the community I live in people go to church on Sundays because it is the "in" thing to do. To be seen with your family at church on Sunday is doing your part for the communities delicate balance to make people see that you in fact are the perfect family. When in reality the people that I know go to church and claim to be Christians are dope addicts,adulterers,child molesters, drunks and the list goes on. The people I know in this perfect American city are holy and they are going to heaven as long as god only watches what they do on Sundays. Because on Sundays the truth is that they are doing they're part.
What does it have to do with religion , nothing. Not a damn thing.


Mark

well we will never really know

That's where they are wrong...we'll know, in the end... One way or the other....

we jediists believe that no one religion holds the truth. The truth is omnipresent within the ideals of each.

[Edited on 2-9-2003 by TheManWithThePlan]

Gazrok,

Why exactly do you want to know? If you want to know what a TRUE Christian believes then read the Holy Bible, Muslim read the Koran, etc. Just asking a Christian, Muslim, Buddhist, etc. will get you a lot of incorrect answers since many religious people don't really understand their own religion.

Well, I am Muslim and I agree with what Illmatic67 said.
What matters is your faith in higher being, judgement day and that you are a good person.

Also there is no "our God" "their God", there is only one GOD, who has spoken through many prophets.
There are many religions but only one source.

Originally posted by paperclip
Well, I am Muslim and I agree with what Illmatic67 said.
What matters is your faith in higher being, judgement day and that you are a good person.

Also there is no "our God" "their God", there is only one GOD, who has spoken through many prophets.
There are many religions but only one source.

If you�re Muslim and you believe what you just said then how do you interpret this from your Koran:

"The only true faith in God's sight is Islam." (Surah 3:19)

"Believers, do not make friends with any but your own people...They desire nothing but your ruin....You believe in the entire Book...When they meet you they say: 'We, too, are believers.' But when alone, they bite their finger-tips with rage." (Surah 3:118, 119)

"Make war on them until idolatry shall cease and God's religion shall reign supreme." (Surah 8:36-)

"It ill becomes the idolaters [non-Muslims] to visit the mosques of God..." (Surah 9:17)

"Fight against such as those to whom the Scriptures were given [Jews and Christians]...until they pay tribute out of hand and are utterly subdued." (Surah 9:27-)

"It is He who has sent forth His apostle with guidance and the true Faith [Islam] to make it triumphant over all religions, however much the idolaters [non-Muslims] may dislike it." (Surah 9:31-)

"Believers, make war on the infidels who dwell around you. Deal firmly with them." (Surah 9:121-)

...I'm not judging...just wondering.

[Edited on 2-9-2003 by Hyperspace]

Originally posted by Hyperspace

If you�re Muslim and you believe what you just said then how do you interpret this from your Koran:

"The only true faith in God's sight is Islam." (Surah 3:19)

"Believers, do not make friends with any but your own people...They desire nothing but your ruin....You believe in the entire Book...When they meet you they say: 'We, too, are believers.' But when alone, they bite their finger-tips with rage." (Surah 3:118, 119)

First of all, Islam is not a religion.

Islam means submission. What that verse means is if God's true religion is submission. Jews submit and so do Christians. They all surrender and submit to God in Islam, that is what that means.

Originally posted by Illmatic67

Originally posted by Hyperspace

If you�re Muslim and you believe what you just said then how do you interpret this from your Koran:

"The only true faith in God's sight is Islam." (Surah 3:19)

"Believers, do not make friends with any but your own people...They desire nothing but your ruin....You believe in the entire Book...When they meet you they say: 'We, too, are believers.' But when alone, they bite their finger-tips with rage." (Surah 3:118, 119)

First of all, Islam is not a religion.

Islam means submission. What that verse means is if God's true religion is submission. Jews submit and so do Christians. They all surrender and submit to God in Islam, that is what that means.

This makes it sound different then what you�re saying:

"It is He who has sent forth His apostle with guidance and the true Faith [Islam] to make it triumphant over all religions, however much the idolaters [non-Muslims] may dislike it." (Surah 9:31-)

hmmmm

Sura [9:31] They have set up their religious leaders and scholars as lords, instead of GOD. Others deified the Messiah, son of Mary. They were all commanded to worship only one god. There is no god except He. Be He glorified, high above having any partners.

Not quite what you put there in your post....
What is your source?

also ( refering to your previos quotes of Qur'an):
3:118] O you who believe, do not befriend outsiders who never cease to wish you harm; they even wish to see you suffer. Hatred flows out of their mouths and what they hide in their chests is far worse. We thus clarify the revelations for you, if you understand.

[3:119] Here you are loving them, while they do not love you, and you believe in all the scripture. When they meet you they say, "We believe," but as soon as they leave, they bite their fingers out of rage towards you. Say, "Die in your rage." GOD is fully aware of the innermost thoughts.





[Edited on 2-9-2003 by paperclip]

Man, your quotes are loaded with mistakes!

This is what those Suras really say:

[9:17] The idol worshipers are not to frequent the masjids of GOD, while confessing their disbelief. These have nullified their works, and they will abide forever in Hell.

[9:27] Ultimately, GOD redeems whomever He wills. GOD is Forgiver, Most Merciful.

[9:121] Nor do they incur any expense, small or large, nor do they cross any valley, without having the credit written down for them. GOD will surely reward them generously for their works

[8:36] Those who disbelieve spend their money to repel others from the way of GOD. They will spend it, then it will turn into sorrow and remorse for them. Ultimately, they will be defeated, and all disbelievers will be summoned to Hell.

Masjid=house of God, refers to mosques, churches, sinagogues and all other places of worship.

Here is the source:

www.deceptioninthechurch.com...


Are you sure it's the some book your looking up...we have a different spelling.

Why exactly do you want to know? If you want to know what a TRUE Christian believes then read the Holy Bible, Muslim read the Koran, etc. Just asking a Christian, Muslim, Buddhist, etc. will get you a lot of incorrect answers since many religious people don't really understand their own religion.

Ahh...and now you get to the crux of my arguement and question.... I am fully aware of what the Bible, Koran, etc. state... What I am more interested in, is the interpretation of individual followers. Do they really believe that non-believers are doomed? And, if so, do they believe that this is the act of a kind and loving God?

No, I do not. My reason is that hebrew's are not christians but they will still go to heavan because they are Gods chosen people, but if you mean people like athiests...then it all depends on the person. But as illmatic said, "Its really up to God" and its not our place as humans to judge.

Man, you better look for a non-propaganda translation of Qur'an. That site has completely misquoted the book! Its not even translation, its non-existant what they quoted!

Here is a link to authorised english translation of Qur'an:

link

Also, here is a site which compares different translations:

link

Originally posted by Gazrok

Why exactly do you want to know? If you want to know what a TRUE Christian believes then read the Holy Bible, Muslim read the Koran, etc. Just asking a Christian, Muslim, Buddhist, etc. will get you a lot of incorrect answers since many religious people don't really understand their own religion.

Ahh...and now you get to the crux of my arguement and question....

I am fully aware of what the Bible, Koran, etc. state... What I am more interested in, is the interpretation of individual followers. Do they really believe that non-believers are doomed? And, if so, do they believe that this is the act of a kind and loving God?

I'm sure there are literally countless interpretations...plenty to make this the longest ATS thread ever if everyone posted on their "interpretation."

Just like anything else in life...example: the countless interpretations of the U.S. Constitution (gun rights..etc.).



[Edited on 2-9-2003 by Hyperspace]

Originally posted by paperclip
Man, you better look for a non-propaganda translation of Qur'an. That site has completely misquoted the book! Its not even translation, its non-existant what they quoted!

Here is a link to authorised english translation of Qur'an:

link

Also, here is a site which compares different translations:

link

That site has a few translations, not all. I just asked a question about what I found; if it's inaccurate then I�m sorry. Quite frankly, I don't give a rats a$$ about the Muslim religion and if that offends someone...I don't care.

I'm done with this topic.

Well, I'm not asking for interpretations for everything, just that if they truly believe that non-followers are doomed, and then if they feel that it is just.... Personally, I find it distasteful, to say the least, that ANY God would let billions meet their doom, just for not believing in them, but in essence, this is the dogma for many religions. I'm merely trying to point this out, and force a little re-examination of such beliefs, with the knowledge that if such a believer is correct, then it would essentially make their God quite the bigot....