Utah Rave Video: Must See.

WestPoint, I read the whole thing...

What's your point about my post anyway? To degrade what I said?
How useless.. I suppose i'll just file that little diddy under g.

the "cops" were just doing their job...

of course, excessive force is neccessary, when they are dealing with 100s of people...

i feel that this event is horrible for the crowd, but "they" were just doing their "jobs"...

Well, I watched the whole video.
To be honest, What I saw could be covered by a dea/fbi raid on any rave which we all know will have many illegal drugs.
Don't get me wrong, I am sure they used unecessary ruffness and acted like (imo) jack booted nazi thugs.
Another sign of the times is it also looks a lot like any episoid of "cop" tv shows.
It saddens me that I find it disturbing but not unusal.

thats insane, so now were not even allowed to have a party?

I have personally provided sound and lighting for numerous "raves" and other outdoor events - this one looks smaller than some ive done.

With that being said - I have never witnessed any DEA/ATF/SWAT, ect being called in to break up a large scale party. The last rave I provided sound for WAS broken up - but by uniformed POLICE and SHERIFF officers. None of them had automatic weapons or camos, or dogs. There was a helicopter present, and a few paddywagons to carry the evildoers away.

These issues bother me: Why so many officers from different counties? Why the need for dogs and camo laden special forces? Do young, drunk teens substantiate that amount of force and planning? Was there no other crime to be found on a Saturday night in three counties?

Seems like alot of effort for a relatively common occurance, raves that is.
I dont doubt there was resistance, I dont doubt there were drugs. Last month here in California, there was a bank robbery in progress shown on the local tv media. The perp had hostages. None of those officers or SWAT team members wore camo. If I was there at that rave - in the midst of that chaos, I would have labeled them ARMY too. Personal freedoms and rights are a cherished commodity, no one else sees this particular instance a bit threatening to those rights?

I wasnt there - so I cant offer anything more than an opinion on the facts that are available. It just appears out of the ordinary.

pretty hilarious u have the crowd and the commandos interacting together like everything is normal. u think the ravers be running and screaming and saying they gonna kill us all!!!!! instead u see one of those "commandos" telling to turn off the dam music and to leave the place.

Commodity Exchange

Originally posted by bl0t
Personal freedoms and rights are a cherished commodity, no one else sees this particular instance a bit threatening to those rights?

Laws adopted by democratic societies are also a cherished commodity. Without them, there is lawlessness.

Without law, rights are meaningless.

If this event was lawful -- and so far, no one has bothered to actually prove that -- then there is cause for concern.

If the event was unlawful, then while I agree that the camo and balaclava routine is silly to the point of absurdity, what's really going on here is that the people who organized an illegal event are trying to use the Internet to garner sympathy and sway public opinion.

As it is, the usual suspects are firing up their spew-o-matics in rather pathetic attempts to add this to the existing pile of anti-U.S. propaganda.

I find that interesting, but as a student of mind control and propaganda, not as someone sympathetic to the fight for the right to party.

i just noticed something...

this is about a rave...

what is the point of a rave???

answer: do drugs (mostly exstacy) and look at all the pretty colors...

with that being said, cops rushing in to break it up is nothing like a police state...

cops, are totally understandable. but SWAT or Army or whatever these guys were was definitely NOT your friendly neighborhood cop. i would like to know why they were called in on this particualr, and rather small, rave? and what made them jump on those specific persons?

not to mention the fact that it was filmed with no interruption. i'm starting to think its a hoax.

Originally posted by Kitsunegari
cops, are totally understandable. but SWAT or Army or whatever these guys were was definitely NOT your friendly neighborhood cop. i would like to know why they were called in on this particualr, and rather small, rave? and what made them jump on those specific persons?

not to mention the fact that it was filmed with no interruption. i'm starting to think its a hoax.

100s (wasn't it 100s) of people is small???

regular cops cannot handle this...

so, call in the big boys...

Excellent point majic - I agree with your assessment. I just find the size and nature of the force being deployed to deal with this particular situation a bit extreme - and out of the ordinary. I dont think this video would have received this much notoriety if it had been a standard issue party break-up.

People often refer to the movement for progress as "taking baby steps". Take small steps towards progress - so things appear normal in the long run, and your point of reference doesnt become askew. This particular action to enforce the law is no baby step. It is a leap beyond what is generally accepted as normal response to quell wrongdoings. Maybe the powers that be should be taking a more aggressive stance towards enforcing our laws. This video illustrates a break from the norm - it stands out from other such incidents because it is extraordinary. I have seen house parties with hundreds of people in attendance. No green army lookin guys. I have seen large format concerts (thousands in attendance)break into utter chaos via a fist fight - no green army lookin guys called in to solve the situation. I referenced personal rights and freedoms to elaborate on the idea that escalating to this type of military style response to be a scary vision of the future, if this were to become the norm.

If a police officer were to arrest me for breaking the law - I would be scared but I would abide by his/her commands. If the individuals on the video arrested me - in the same fashion they restrained the others - I would piss myself. Either way the law is enforced. 50 standard issue police officers could have dealt with the situation - without the psuedo army men, and without all the media coverage this situation is receiveing.

Addendum - I am a law abiding citizen - I try my best to back the local police. This incident leaves a bad taste in my mouth. IMHO.

Baby Leap

Originally posted by bl0t
This particular action to enforce the law is no baby step. It is a leap beyond what is generally accepted as normal response to quell wrongdoings.

I disagree. Nothing I saw looked like anything new, except maybe the GI Joe outfits.

Most of the people there came in no direct contact with deputies at all, and many were milling around watching. The cops had some people on the ground, and yes, that's how you restrain people if they're giving you attitude, and no, there is no constitutional right to give cops attitude.

As for how brutal the event was, I've been at a few that were far worse. This was no riot, just a crackdown, bust and dispersal, as best I can tell.

I didn't see any dogs or teargas or water cannons. I didn't see anyone getting clubbed. People are showing their bruises on the Internet and you've got to check your contrast to see most of them.

I know brutal. This ain't brutal.

Fascion Sense

Originally posted by bl0t
I referenced personal rights and freedoms to elaborate on the idea that escalating to this type of military style response to be a scary vision of the future, if this were to become the norm.

Nothing I saw looked like it would be handled any differently from any other situation I've seen like that.

As best I can tell, the main reason the sheriff is catching so much grief is because he chose to make an unfortunate fashion statement, and it freaked some people out.

Yes, I prefer to see sheriff's deputies dress like peace officers instead of army men. Yes, I'm laughing at them.

No, I don't think the cops did anything illegal, just silly and apparently not the best PR move in law enforcement history.

As for event organizers, I'm still waiting for them to post copies of the mass gathering permit online.

Come on guys, don't pee on my leg and tell me it's raining. :shk:

tsA, that many people is small for a Rave. not in general. and im just judging by what i could see in the vid. i could be totally wrong, there could have been upwards of a thousand people there for all i know. just from what was videoed, it looked rater small.

Originally posted by Kitsunegari
tsA, that many people is small for a Rave. not in general. and im just judging by what i could see in the vid. i could be totally wrong, there could have been upwards of a thousand people there for all i know. just from what was videoed, it looked rater small.

no problem...

you know, i am against police states and police using great force when it is not needed...

but, in this case, i am leaning toward the "cops" were doing their job...

yeah i know. i just would like to know why exactly they were sent in with such force?

Originally posted by Kitsunegari
yeah i know. i just would like to know why exactly they were sent in with such force?

me too...

we will probably never know though haha...

lol, yeah, i guess not.

This looks a bit fishy too me, i get the sense that it's all staged managed,
for what reason i have no clue, i was a part of the real rave culture in England back in the late eighties, then nearly all of the rave's were raided,
and it was a little bit more kaotic that that. Plus the video and sound quality seems to be too good, and directed in some way, i'm not trying to be a conspiracist for conspiracys sake, but this video is fake public media.
doesn't anybody else think so?

All the best... ian