The Genesis Account...

well according to the bible, Jesus is God, there are many places where it states that Jesus and God are one. they are the same person. Jesus was in the Garden praying to himself but he was praying to himself because he was in a physical body. physical body is often led to temptation and the flesh always wants to do something other than what the spirit wants to do.

RIGHT ON!

quote///Praying to himself because he was in a physical body. physical body is often led to temptation and the flesh always wants to do something other than what the spirit wants to do.

Watch and pray that you may not enter into temptation. The spirit is willing enough, but the flesh is weak (Mat. 26,41).

By pious and deep meditation study the prayer which the Lord offered to the Father in the Garden of Gethsemane at the hour of His agony which preceded His Passion and Death on the Cross.
With that prayer meet and conquer every affliction. My Father, prayed the Saviour, if it is possible, let this Chalice pass from me. Yet not as I will, but as Thou wilt (Mat. 26,39).

Not as I will.....the human nature of Christ felt affliction..
Yet not as I will, but as THOU WILT.....speaking of the heavenly Father...

The Chalice of Christ

Excellent article on Christ’s Prayer in the Garden.....Quote, read below///

"Thou hast prayed that the voluntary cup of the redeeming Passion be removed as if it were not voluntary" (Sunday Matins, Tone 5, Canticle 8 of the canon), thus demonstrating two desires of two natures and asking God the Father to render His human will unwavering in its submission to God's will (Exact Exposition, 3:24).
And there appeared an angel unto Him from heaven, strengthening Him [His human nature] (Luke 22:43).
Nevertheless, while offering His self sacrifice, Jesus prayed with increased fervor, until He became bathed in a bloody sweat. And for His reverence and His constant submission to His Father's will, the Son of Man was heard.

Thus strengthened and encouraged, Jesus rose from His prayer (Exact Exposition, lbid.).
Now He was sure that His human nature would not waver any more, that soon the burden of human sins would be lifted from Him, and that, through His obedience to God the Father, He would bring to Him errant human nature. He walked up to His disciples and said,
Sleep on now,
and lake your rest Behold, the hour is at hand, and the Son of Man is betrayed into the hands of sinners.
Rise, let us be going: behold, he is at hand that doth betray Me (Matt. 26:4546), rise and pray, lest ye enter into temptation (Luke 22:46).

Christ's Prayer

IX
helen

I think then that you should read those scriptures about jesus praying. Then ask God for the answer. Let him tell you the truth. I can only say that Jesus was not talking with him self. Did not jesus say that he does not know his own coming in the end of days. and continues to say only God know. SO JESUS DOES NOT KNOW, BUT GOD KNOWS. So to me Gods in heaven, and his son on earth. And still revelations shows us in chapter 4 and 5 that Jesus is seprate from God. God sit's in the throne, Jesus comes and takes a scroll out of God's hands.Jesus got on his knees to talk with God. Jesus says on the cross dieing ( God why has THOU forsaken me. Why has God in heaven, forsake jesus on earth. Jesus was not talk with himself on the cross. (why do I forsake myself) sounds a little stupid if you ask me.


I do believe God and Jesus are one, in spirit, one in mind, but to believe in trinity is wrong. God said thou salt one God, not three, God didnt say it was ok to make 3 in one either. God is God of all, Jesus is his Son and his right hand worker and follower. The holy ghost comes from God"s spirit. Jesus is in contuol of everthing God wants.Jesus is a powerful Son of God.

I take it your anit-bible.

Of course, because someone doesn't step right in line with you, they must be anti-Bible or anti-Christian or whatever, right?

The following quote is all you'll ever need to know about the Bible and you will spend the rest of your life trying to live up to it.

Jesus said, "A new command I give you: Love one another. As I have loved you, so you must love one another. By this all men will know that you are my disciples, if you love one another."

In this one statement lies all of salvation and nowhere else. So go forth, be a disciple of Christ and love with your whole heart as Jesus did.

Thus Spoke Me

So you believe in God and jesus???? and the bible??? or not???

[edit on 27-8-2005 by slymattb]

Did not jesus say that he does not know his own coming in the end of days. and continues to say only God know. SO JESUS DOES NOT KNOW, BUT GOD KNOWS. So to me Gods in heaven, and his son on earth.

remember that Jesus was in a physical body with physical limits with a little bit of power. Jesus did not have infinite power when he was down here. he limited himself. so he probably limited himself from knowing the day that he would return.

EC

" I have said ye are Gods, all of you are children of the most high.” Psalms, Ch. 82, Verse 6

Originally posted by BlackGuardXIII
" I have said ye are Gods, all of you are children of the most high.” Psalms, Ch. 82, Verse 6

Total agreement on that one! I really dont get this belief that if it is written in a book(the bible) that was written by men), it has to be true above all else. You say the earth is 6,000 years old? Then where did dinosuar fossils come from? Why is it that there are some religions from the Indu vally that are 30,000 years old? Why is it that carbon dating, proves something like hemp clothing was 10,000 years old, are you saying the earth is younger than marijuana? Why is it that dogs have been with mankind for over 14,000 years?

What is the deal, I dont think Jesus would want Christians acting the way they do. Just try and see the other side for once!

Stop doing this ----> LOL



[edit on 27-8-2005 by LoneGunMan]

I dont know if you know this, but carbon dating 14 is now prove to be wrong over years. Do a web search on it. CD14 does work to a point, over the more years the more its likely to be wrong. CD 14 is now not fact or evidents anymore.
Here one web site www.specialtyinterests.net... check it out. But there are more sites about CD14 and better ones than this.

Originally posted by slymattb
I dont know if you know this, but carbon dating 14 is now prove to be wrong over years.

No it hasn't been.. it's been taken out of context and attacked for political reasons by people who don't understand it.

Do a web search on it. CD14 does work to a point, over the more years the more its likely to be wrong.

www.howstuffworks.com..." target="_blank" class="postlink" rel="nofollow"> www.howstuffworks.com...

Because the half-life of carbon-14 is 5,700 years, it is only reliable for dating objects up to about 60,000 years old.

The hemp he/she mentioned was ten thousand years old so I'd say it's faily reliable.. anything older than 60K and they would use other dating methods.

[edit on 28-8-2005 by riley]

Because the half-life of carbon-14 is 5,700 years, it is only reliable for dating objects up to about 60,000 years old.

My point is that CD14 can be wrong, you said it your self (it is only reliable for dating objects up to about 60,000 years old.) So anything older that was use by CD14 would be wrong. Ill have to study cd14 again its been a minute, But I believe cd14 was proven to be wrong over generations, and not years.

But in any case this is why I said do a web search on the matter.

Originally posted by slymattb
My point is that CD14 can be wrong, you said it your self (it is only reliable for dating objects up to about 60,000 years old.) So anything older that was use by CD14 would be wrong.

Could be wrong.. but they would use other methods to date anything older.. as it is they use numerous methods to date anything regardless of age to verify their conclusions.

Ill have to study cd14 again its been a minute, But I believe cd14 was proven to be wrong over generations, and not years.

It hasn't been. If it was scientists would not use it.. and I don't think they do after 60k. If you want to find the scientific facts behind the methods try find sites without bible bias.. they are more accurate and less political.

[edit on 28-8-2005 by riley]

Originally posted by slymattb
When I wrote the quote before this one. I was not saying that Jesus is God. In fact the quote's says Jesus is God's Son. Jesus's say (father why have you forsaken me.0 God was in heaven forsaking Jesus. well Jesus was on the cross. My point in Jesus praying. Is to say he was talking with God, And not him self.

If this was directed at me, yes, I understood what you were saying. I was using the "death scene" as an example of Christ speaking to God whom He called "Father", rather than "we" "us" "our", as some would have us believe regarding Gensis 1:26. And your saying "My point in Jesus praying. Is to say he was talking with God, And not him self." IS similar to what I'm saying regarding Genesis 1:26.

When I wrote the quote before this one. I was not saying that Jesus is God. In fact the quote's says Jesus is God's Son. Jesus's say (father why have you forsaken me.0 God was in heaven forsaking Jesus. well Jesus was on the cross. My point in Jesus praying. Is to say he was talking with God, And not him self.

as weird as it sounds. Jesus was talking to himself. remember he is in the flesh. a human body. human body does not look good when there is a bunch of sin dumped upon it.

EC

Originally posted by slymattb

So you believe in God and jesus???? and the bible??? or not???

[edit on 27-8-2005 by slymattb]

Of course I believe in Jesus. His existence is a well documented fact that most any historian can attest to. I would even go so far as to say that I am a disciple of Jesus'.

I would also say that I'm fairly convinced in the existence of a Supreme Being. But, since I can't find any empirical evidence one way or the other on the Subject, I wouldn't dare try to impose that belief on anyone else. That would be, in most circles, considered extremely rude.

I also believe in the Bible. I have one sitting on the end table next to my bed at home, so I'd pretty much have to. I think it's a very interesting literary work, probably one of the best of it's kind. However, I also know that it was written during a time when the world was flat and at the center of the universe, when food made you sick because it wasn't kosher instead of being contaminated by microbial life, people had seizures because of possession instead of epilepsy, stoning to death was considered acceptable punishment for picking up sticks on the Sabbath, and so on ad infinitum. In other words, I don't think the Bible should be taken literally. I think there is quite a bit to be learned from the Bible, but I am certain that it does not contain a literal account of the history of the Earth and Mankind. I think that there are passages in the Bible that can be very inspiring and enlightening, but I'm against those people who would try to force their belief on others and codify it into law.

If you want to really understand the Bible, you are going to need a number of advanced degrees. To start with... theology, philosophy, history, political science, law, literature, psychology, paleontology, archaeology, anthropology, astrophysics, chemistry, microbiology... I could go on. But unless someone had a large portion of that education, I find it doubtful that they might have something that I would find either interesting or pertinent on the subject of the Bible.

As I mentioned before, John 13:34-35 is all anyone needs to understand from the Bible and most people will spend their whole lives trying to live up to it. So, go forth... be a disciple... stop wasting your life in pedantic contention over the Bible.

" I have said ye are Gods, all of you are children of the most high.” Psalms, Ch. 82, Verse 6

selective reading. kinda like selective hearing, only you can read the same thing over and over again and read what was said before that verse. read the entire chapter and understand it.

EC

Originally posted by Thus Spoke Me
Of course I believe in Jesus. His existence is a well documented fact that most any historian can attest to.

No it isn't. While it's certainly possible there was a historical figure from which the Jesus myth grew, it is certainly not a given, and is highly suspect.

Originally posted by Star of Curiosity
Jesus nor the Holy Spirit ever proclaimed to be Creator. So, again, who is "Us" that is doing the creating in that verse? That's really all I'm looking at here. It doesn't make sense interpreted as it is. Since the Trinity is one and the same being, there would be no reason for God to speak to Himself.

Originally posted by Evolution Cruncher

Helen, in regards to Genesis 1:26 in your post, who is speaking here? Who is "Us" ? If the Bible is to be taken literally, and this is God speaking, and God is the Creator, why are there 2 ours and an us in that verse?

if you read John 1:1 and I John 5:7 it says that there are three. God is Jesus and Jesus is God and Jesus is also the holy spirit, and the holy spirit is also God. they are all one but also separate.

Jesus was in the beginning, in the spiritual form. he was with God and at the same time, was God. kind of a hard concept to grasp, but that is what he was talking about. he wasnt talking to the angels. we are not made in the image of angels. we are made in the image of God.

EC

Jesus in fact did claim to be the Creator, as he said "Before Abraham was, I AM."

Originally posted by DanD9
Jesus in fact did claim to be the Creator, as he said "Before Abraham was, I AM."

There are two other interpretations of this passage.

1) 'before' refers to importance, not time. The expression is somehwat of a play on words with the intent of saying that Jesus was more important than Abraham.

2) A play on words in which Jesus is pointing out that Abraham is dead, but he is in the present

Either of these would have been highly inflamatory and resulted in the action the crows took.

There are two other interpretations of this passage.

1) 'before' refers to importance, not time. The expression is somehwat of a play on words with the intent of saying that Jesus was more important than Abraham.

2) A play on words in which Jesus is pointing out that Abraham is dead, but he is in the present

Either of these would have been highly inflamatory and resulted in the action the crows took.

ok first off, those two dont make any sense whatsoever. John 1:1 clearly states that Jesus is and is with God, meaning that the trinity does exist and is so.
I John 5:7 states that all three are one.

there are numerous verses found where the trinity is implied.
why would God refer to himself as our saviour, isnt Jesus supposed to be our saviour and not God? I mean God cant be our saviour just like Jesus cant be the creator according to your logic.

EC

Originally posted by Evolution Cruncher

There are two other interpretations of this passage.

1) 'before' refers to importance, not time. The expression is somehwat of a play on words with the intent of saying that Jesus was more important than Abraham.

2) A play on words in which Jesus is pointing out that Abraham is dead, but he is in the present

Either of these would have been highly inflamatory and resulted in the action the crows took.

ok first off, those two dont make any sense whatsoever. John 1:1 clearly states that Jesus is and is with God, meaning that the trinity does exist and is so.
I John 5:7 states that all three are one.

there are numerous verses found where the trinity is implied.
why would God refer to himself as our saviour, isnt Jesus supposed to be our saviour and not God? I mean God cant be our saviour just like Jesus cant be the creator according to your logic.

EC

This isn't my logic. These are merely other interpretations I've heard Christian scholars put forth over the years. I simply presented them because no-one else did.