It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.
Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.
Thank you.
Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.
Originally posted by kegs
Why is the Christian creation theory viewed as the only alternative to evolution?
[edit on 21-8-2005 by kegs]
Originally posted by cybertroy
How about my challenge? You might get a little amusement out of it if nothing else.
Originally posted by cybertroy
Spring into action without any forethought as to what you will be doing. When you have accomplished this let me know.
Originally posted by Thomas Crowne
"No intelligent designer would put such a clumsy arrangement in a camcorder..."
...and yet, it works wonderfully for you, doesn't it?
Originally posted by Thomas Crowne
Yet, the "Theory" of evolution cannot in the least be defended as a theory, but is taught as fact in school and those in control of the school systems cannot tolerate anything competing against their religion.
Originally posted by Thomas Crowne
Don't worry, everybody Wang-Chung tonight! Just as long as the whiners in control are allowed their religious monopoly!
Originally posted by cybertroy
Until you are at least willing to take a good look at what I have to say, and actually give my "challenge" a shot, then you are shooting blanks with your rebuttals.
Originally posted by cybertroy
Discussion with you about this is over until you actually take my challenge.
Originally posted by cybertroy
Sorry folks, this went off on a tangent. Oh well, it wasn't disrelated.
For the record, spamandham didn't answer my challenge,
I challenge anyone to create something (a painting, a sculpture, a cake, etc.) without first getting an idea about it.
Originally posted by Aeon10101110
Without offending God in any way, we may use reason, which led inexorably to science. Moreover, it would be an offense not to think, being that it is one of our greatest gifts.
Originally posted by cybertroy
Hey Riley,
Thanks for the response. Let's debate, but let's keep it friendly.
I see what you are saying, but you first decided you were going to create something, or else you would have never started with your artistic creation.
I challenge anyone to create something (a painting, a sculpture, a cake, etc.) without first getting an idea about it.
You did have an idea
but it just wasn't a definite form, but you just knew you were going to create something. Fair enough? See, the idea and the decision to create something was there first.
The universe creating itself is pretty near impossible.
To me it's a degredation of what we really are, which is spiritual beings, to think things create themselves with no conscious force behind it.
For the purposes of this topic, in proving creation is a real thing, let the challenge be specifically:
"Sit down. Clear your mind. Go and make something without having any forethought of making something."
I wait.
Your reasoning is flawed as for an artist to have an idea to create.. they first need paint to work with [matter]- the painting cannot exist without a canvas existing beforehand [space]. This is not a sentient being. Of course the painting could not exist without the artist.. but without time and space neither could the artist. For a sentient being to exist it needs to be somewhere.. and for it to have a concept of space and time [obviously your god does has as it counted 7 days/ages.. when did it know to start counting?] it would need to exist within it as time cannot exist without space.
Atypical response to this: "God always was an always has been!" etc.. much more likely the universe has. For something to even have a thought requires space and time.. [sinapses may be small but thoughts still travel from a to b] and for god to have 'spoken' the universe into existence.. ever heared of sound waves? They require space as well.
Originally posted by spamandham
The challenge is absurd anyway. What difference does it make if you can not set out to do something (i.e. purposefully) without purpose? All that is being demonstrated is the definition of "purpose", not some grand metaphysical revelation.
This is a purposeless challenge. Hey!
I have.. this will be the THIRD time.
Originally posted by cybertroy
Here is how it will be done.
1) Try the experiment.
2) Then post your comments. Don't post arguments against creation until you have tried the experiment.
3) We will proceed at this point.
I'm not going to waste my time debating if you aren't at least willing to try the experiment.