Race Wars......UK

I'm not a racialist , but i can see whats happening in Britain, the Muslims and some others like to live in their own communities and build a Mosque to worship in , thats OK till you get to know that a lot of native British don't want that. Setting up a Pakistan in Britain is for some in this Country the beginning of the end where native Britain's have to be tolerant to other cultures that invade but don't integrate. I'm afraid its not going to work , the mainstream in Britain don't want them here and thats a fact.

Originally posted by sminkeypinkey
If you don't mean a "race war" then why be so melodramatic and use the term in connection with this terrible sick event?

I am well aware that there is a low-level of constant racist/sectarian attacks going on at the moment in the UK.

Attacks on Muslims have soared in London since the 7 July bombings, according to police figures.
There were 269 "religious hate" crimes, compared with 40 in the same period last year, the figures show.

Most were verbal abuse or minor assaults, but also include damage to property, including mosques and have a great "emotional impact", police said.

news.bbc.co.uk...

- Britain's racist element are doing nothing other than using current tensions as an excuse.
So why inflate the situation beyond it's reality?
You might cool it a little and concentrate on what most people are up to.

Instead of the actions of a couple of nutters how about the vigil in Liverpool tonight involving hundreds, huh?

Hundreds of people have attended a vigil in memory of murdered black teenager Anthony Walker.
Members of Anthony's close family were among the crowd which gathered at St George's Hall in Liverpool city centre.

news.bbc.co.uk...

- This was nothing to do with a "race war" it was simply the typical sordid and senseless abuse and violence of a defenceless young black lad by cretins looking for an excuse (and even though he was a devout Christian, the 'excuse' being the current unthinking Muslim nonsense - anyone referring to his killers as crazed 'Christians, hmmm?).

The people that murdered that young lad - without any provocation whatsoever - were bullying abusive hate-filled low-life, they were dangerous racists before, during and after the event.
If anyone is pretending recent events (ie the London attacks) was any excuse for this attack (or 'cause') they're simply talking garbage.

[edit on 2-8-2005 by sminkeypinkey]

This is a discussion board, the heading was merely to provoke some response and provoke argument as to whether it has some validity. You may be aware of the attacks going on in the UK, but others less informed are not.

Tell me why am I 'inflating the situation beyond its reality'?

I'm merely pointing out the facts to start a discussion. The reality is that the events throughout July has raised racial tensions and the evidence proves this.

Shall I clear my next posting with you first and see whether it meets with your approval?

Spacemunkey

Originally posted by Bulldog 52
I'm not a racialist , but......

- Yeah right; who couldn't see that one coming a mile off?

Muslims and some others like to live in their own communities and build a Mosque to worship in , thats OK till you get to know that a lot of native British don't want that.

- They do what all ex-pat groups do, they form an ex-pat community.
It happens with every 'people' the world over. Brits, Americans etc etc.
Nothing unusual about it at all.
(and given the way it has worked in the UK they usually end up in the crappy end of town to start with and all)

As for your "a lot" comment well it's clearly not that many as racist political groups get nowhere in the UK.

Setting up a Pakistan in Britain is for some in this Country the beginning of the end

- Of course such an idea is nothing less than ridiculous exaggerated nonsense.
I suppose your blood boils at the thought of a 'China town' too?

where native Britain's have to be tolerant to other cultures that invade but don't integrate.

- So do try and explain how this they "don't integrate" arguement/excuse works for those many many black people who do, hmmmm?

Or try explaining how come so much racist activity is in places where there are hardly any black people?

I'm afraid its not going to work , the mainstream in Britain don't want them here and thats a fact.

- No, it isn't a "fact".
You're just expressing your own personal ignorant notions, that's all.

Feel free to explain how when 'it' doesn't 'work' what happens then; what happens to those here, those born here etc etc that you and those like you "don't want"?
Where is this supposed 'mainstream' (who repeatedly ignore racist politics and political parties)?

It's just another unpleasant evidence free set of personal comment and rhetoric Bulldog making all sorts of wild sweeping generalised claims, it's becoming your hallmark these days.

Originally posted by spacemunkey
Shall I clear my next posting with you first and see whether it meets with your approval?

- Don't be such a drama-queen.

I am simply pointing out that "race war" was inappropriate and - obviously - detracting from the point you wished to make.

sminkeypinkey,
If it is not a "race war" would it suffice to interject that it is race-hate?
News articles have been reporting for quite some time that anti-semitism has been on a rise in the UK and Europe.
News articles have been reporting that racially motivated hate-crimes have been on the increase, as well.
Here is one mention that mentions:

Since July 7, London's Metropolitan Police said crimes motivated by religious hatred had soared by almost 600 per cent in the British capital.

Police figures showed there were 269 such incidents reported since the first blasts, compared with 40 over the same three-and-a-half week period in 2004.

--snip--

British Transport Police, which patrols the London Underground, have confirmed they are targeting specific ethnic groups – notably blacks and south Asians – for "intelligence-led" random ID checks and searches on the streets.

British race-hate crimes soaring

Whether it is from actual abuses to verbal abuses or simply looking cross-eyed, the significance of this is certainly not being over-hyped but more like being seemingly dismissed as nothing new or insignificant, wouldn't you say?




seekerof

As governments in free country's seem to enhance laws against racism, some countries get attacked from the inside from religious racism aka hatred of a people in a free society..

Sooner or later I feel there will be hell to pay for Countries housing or boring or supporting the hate groups that kill the innocent.

It's just a matter of when and what will be the trigger?

Dallas

Originally posted by Seekerof
If it is not a "race war" would it suffice to interject that it is race-hate?

- Yeah that would have been to the point and accurate; "race war" is IMO an absurd over-blown exaggeration of the situation.

See the link regarding the increase in sectarian crimes, the Police specifically mention most are very low level, thankfully.

Originally posted by Dallas
It's just a matter of when and what will be the trigger?

- This 'one spark' theory is just a crock.
Britain may be many things but it is not on the verge of a "race war" or mass racial disturbances.

Like I said earlier instead of focusing completely on the actions of the mentally deranged nutters who did that murder look at what the wider community thought of it, they turned out in their hundreds last night at that hastily arranged public open air memorial service.

Look at the memorial where that poor young lad was struck down, again ordinary people in their hundreds, if not thousands, have come to make their feelings of disgust and horror known.

We hear this 'tinderbox' rubbish from time to time but you watch the funeral when it happens and the white people stand together with their black neighbours, as they did with Stephen Laurence......... as they always do nowadays (if the service isn't private).
(Right back to the 1950s in London when finally they said enough and the white people came out - lining the streets for miles - to stand with their black neighbours following a racist murder at the mans funeral).

[edit on 3-8-2005 by sminkeypinkey]

I'm not sure how you managed to come with the comments you have based on my post, but think your thoughts here fell off track.

The UK isn't the only Country I'm speaking to. ie There are others.

Dallas

Can I just add that the title should not have been 'Race Hate' - reasoning being that the title 'Race Wars....UK' should have had a ? at the end (I missed putting it on and couldn't change it). so....

Race Wars.....UK?

It was simply a question to promote discussion - so their's no need to get all anal about it huh?

Spacemunkey

Levels of crime may be low in the UK but it certainly seems that violent crime and/or anti social behaviour seems to be spiralling, my opinion is that a lot of the perpetrators of any race or hate crimes are more than likely to be the ones behind the majority of violent assualts that occur with depressing regularity, they need very little excuse and are not representative of the majority. Just to add though that their has been a race crime problem in places like Bradford for years but this also involves Asian youths attacking white people. The problem goes both ways and should be condemned equally.

Originally posted by Dallas
The UK isn't the only Country I'm speaking to. ie There are others.

- Fair enough Dallas but in my defence I would point out the thread title specifically refers to the UK.

Originally posted by spacemunkey
Can I just add that the title should not have been 'Race Hate' - reasoning being that the title 'Race Wars....UK' should have had a ? at the end (I missed putting it on and couldn't change it). so....

Race Wars.....UK?

It was simply a question to promote discussion - so their's no need to get all anal about it huh?

Spacemunkey

Fine, it was meant to be a question.

Well. the answer is no. There is no race war in the UK. As Sminkey pointed out, racist behaviour is still very minor in occurance.

Well suppose your right on the title of your thread. You did label it .....UK.

I'm not from the UK but I will assume its OK to respond to it though.
And that I'm given the benefit of the doubt within my response..

Dallas

Originally posted by Dallas
You did label it .....UK.

- I didn't; it's not my thread mate.

I'm not from the UK but I will assume its OK to respond to it though.
And that I'm given the benefit of the doubt within my response

- There's no bar on anything like that here to the best of my knowledge, and good thing too IMO.

You work away pal.

Originally posted by enslaved83
Im sure that Iraq is a factor but I think your statement is rather unfair for two reasons. Firstly these people don't need any justification for their attacks. They hate the west and want to kill. They could use anything they wanted like for example "someone farted near the mosque the other day. I must avenge that fact!" But they choose Iraq.

I don't know any muslims myself, but I'd imagine that they aren't just mindless nutters that just hate the west for the sake of hating. I'm sure they have plenty of reasons to hate us, other than what some of them might think Allah or the Koran is telling them to do, that's what I think motivates some of them, very few though, to attack westerners.

... for a time some of my very best friends.. heck roommates even.

And I'VE NEVER EVER heard any of them EVER talk about killing anyone ever before.

Actually.. DURING gulf war one.. I was actually giving Islam a shot, as I had lost my faith in Catholisism and God in general.. they took me in, treated me like an equal.. answered my every question..

... you know what? It was almost the same as church when I was a kid.

Not much different at all really except, I found it less spooky then our imposing... semi violent (30 foot tall guy nailed to a giant cross and bleeding all over the place in front of us... "uh nice place you got here") ... dark, and errie, Church of St Andrew.

Nice well lit, nearly a big single room, with a little room at the back for our Sunday School, after regular mosque sessions... we'd pray, then talk about current events.. and community events. Everyone would make plans to see each other during the week and.. that was about that. There was no collection plate but they were trying to raise money to build a minaret addition to the place.

Those were nice days back then.

Remember how I said it was DURING the Gulf War One... nothing hatefull was ever said about the whole event... it was always a sort of...

"This is a terrible situation for all of us.. for all parties involved.. and we pray for peace and that causualties are kept to a minimum where the innocent are involved."

...that sort of thing.

God, I miss those days. You can't ever be 17 again, can you?

You know how you get rid of hate on this earth?

You DO THIS.. you make an elementary school class, at say Grade 6 or so... and you have them spend ONE MONTH... not nessesarilly participating, but observing and taking part in SOME (non-religious) way ... discussion at least inside each type of place of worship.. learning about ALL of the major religions.. instead of just 'religion class' that you get in Catholic school (where you learn about Jesus) the kids would learn as much from the classroom as they could, then they would attend a 'fake service' designed to show them what really goes on and how serene and beautiful most services in most places of worship really are. No more fear..

"Fear leads to hate, hate leads to the darkside."

..its all about fear.. its all about not understanding a particular person.

ACTUALLY.. let me mention.. my friends who first got me interested in Islam at that time.. (have you heard of Project Wyze.. or Dead Celeb Status.. those guys) ..we ran a Hip Hop radio show on the college station back then.. every Sunday.. all afternoon. Anyways.. the two older guys in our group, actually got together and wrote a "middle east peace plan" (no kidding) and since it recieved so much local attention they were sent to Israel to present it to (I don't remember who was in charge then.. Rabin?) some higher up, in what was actually a REALLY big deal they put together for them... it was a big show. Very very cool back then..

..you can see why I miss those days.. amazing times to watch my closest friends accomplish stuff like that.

- VMX

PS: Our one Jewish friend (who we'd tease and he'd tease us back.. we were really good buddies though - his sister was a good friend of mine too) blew his brains out with daddies rifle in his car at the highschool. No one knew why... ever.