The Return of Jesus Christ

21.8. But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.

Here, Second DEATH is the eternal torments of hell.......fire that consumes ....fire burns everything up.....consuming all in its way.......

The first death was flesh.....our BODY.......at JUDGEMENT DAY.....all will receive according to their worth....
This is the second death.
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“The fearful who do not have courage in the battle with the devil, the sinners, those given to passions and vices, will be condemned to the second death, that is, the eternal torments of hell.” (Archbishop Averky)

The Lord thus describes this event: "Do not marvel at this: for the hour is coming in which all who are in the graves will hear His voice [of the Son of God] and come forth; those who have done good, to the resurrection of life, and those who have done evil, to the resurrection of condemnation" (John 5:29).

When the Sadducees expressed doubt as to the possibility of physical resurrection, the Lord reproached them, saying: "You are mistaken, not knowing the Scriptures nor the power of God" (Mt. 22:29).
The Apostle Paul expressed the importance of faith in the resurrection in these words: "If there is no resurrection of the dead, then Christ is not risen. And if Christ is not risen, then our preaching is empty and your faith is also empty … For if the dead do not rise, then Christ is not risen.
And if Christ is not risen, your faith is futile; you are still in your sins! Then also those who have fallen asleep in Christ have perished.
If in this life only we have hope in Christ, we are of all men the most pitiable. But now Christ is risen from the dead, and has become the first fruits of those who have fallen asleep. For since by man came death, by Man also came the resurrection of the dead. For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ all shall be made alive" (1 Cor. 15:13-22).

The Resurrection of the Dead will be general and simultaneous for both the righteous and sinners: "And shall come forth — those who have done good, to the resurrection of life; and those who have done evil to the resurrection of condemnation" (John 5:29; Acts. 24:15).
But the appearance of the resurrected righteous will differ substantially from that of the resurrected sinners: "Then the righteous will shine forth as the sun in the Kingdom of their Father" (Mt. 13:43), said the Lord of the saved. Commenting on these words of the Savior, St. Ephraim the Syrian says that "the ones will resemble light, while the others will resemble darkness."

The Resurrection of the Dead

Explanation of Revelation is as it was in the early church.....many fathers have interpreted Revelation and all came to the same conclusion.......to try and and use our own logic is not right because we cannot put ourselves in the position of the early church fathers who were humble... prayed,fasted and followed in the footsteps of Christ......as Jesus Christ said......Fasting and prayer is needed to cast out demons,there is no OTHER WAY....you cannot seperate the two and pretend to understand Jesus Christand the scriptures........All the Old prophets FASTED.....and used prayer in their lives everyday,with tears and true repentance......how can WE put ourselves in their position and say we understand the scriptures based on our OWN THINKING!

IX
helen

Originally posted by helen670
Explanation of Revelation is as it was in the early church.....many fathers have interpreted Revelation and all came to the same conclusion.......

That they were in agreement with each other doesn't mean that they were in agreement with God--regardless of whether they 'all came to the same conclusion' or not--the word 'conclusion' means they were thinking their own thoughts instead of receiving revelation--God reveals Himself and man cannot find Him unless He seeks for God to show His righteousness. 'Seeking' and 'thinking' are two different things altogether.

to try and and use our own logic is not right because we cannot put ourselves in the position of the early church fathers who were humble... prayed,fasted and followed in the footsteps of Christ......

Only God can put us in the position to know Him--and God humbles us through trial--it is not a special virtue to be humble, rather it is the result of God's refining furnace of affliction. Can we not pray, ourselves, all of us--just as they did? Can we not each strive to walk in the footsteps of our Savior? Was that something only given to them to do--or is it a way of life recommended for all of us?

God is no respector of persons--and therefore there is no difference between you and I, nor between us and those who came before--or after! No matter how they might be esteemed of men and religious 'authorities.'

Did not Christ, Himself, say:

He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him. Jphn 14:21

and:

Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him. John 14:23

????

as Jesus Christ said......Fasting and prayer is needed to cast out demons,there is no OTHER WAY....you cannot seperate the two and pretend to understand Jesus Christand the scriptures........

No--He said that all was required was faith--and the prayer and fasting is not on the part of the would-be exorcist, but on the one possessed by devils. IOW--He was speaking of repentence--through prayer and the fasting before the day of Atonement.

He also in instructs His disciples 'Heal the sick, cleanse the lepers, raise the dead, cast out devils: freely you have received, and so freely give,' and 'he that believes on me, the works that I do he will do also; and he will do greater works than these, because I go to my Father.'

All the Old prophets FASTED.....and used prayer in their lives everyday,with tears and true repentance......how can WE put ourselves in their position and say we understand the scriptures based on our OWN THINKING!

Any person who tries to understand the scriptures according to their own thinking is certainly going to stumble! But it has absolutely nothing to do with things we can do ourselves--God makes these things known at His determination--the same this very day as He's always done--by His own preparation and provision of prophets, apostles, and angels. God sends His word--it is not something we can direct ourselves toward.

Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation. For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost. 2 Peter 1:20-21

No amount of 'righteousness' according to the mind of man is going to persuade the Holy Spirit outside of God's will--fasting means nothing in general, for it is not what goes in that defiles but what comes out. Jesus and the 12 didn't fast--or if they did, they didn't tell about it, just as He instructed them. If the church fathers thought this was necessary--where did the breakdown in communication occur between what Christ taught and the resultant traditions? Certainly not in the teachings of Christ--which were consistent through and through--and not at all the same as what is now held to as 'tradition.'

Christ made it perfectly clear, time and again, that what He requires is obedience to His commands--love, love, and love some more--and to believe that the words He said were true. This is for everyone--no one more and no one less--so-called church 'authorities' included.

To deny the possibility for yourself, and/or for others, is a belief that robs both you and those who take your words as in agreement with scripture. Agreeing with men is not agreeing with God.

He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him. Jphn 14:21....
and:

Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him. John 14:23

That's right.
He that hath MY COMMANDMENTS.......which means all the Commandments..His teachings to the Apostles.....He fasted in the 40 days as the Prophets of the Old Testament FASTED in the Old Testament....Jesus Christ came to FULLFILL the Old Testament , not to TAKE AWAY...He fullfilled the COMING OF THE MESSIAH.....From the SET OF THE CHURCH to it's priests,deacons and Bishops......all are taken and brought up in the New Covenant which is the New Testament......all is as was....EXCEPT God revealed Himself in the FLESH OF JESUS CHRIST ...The Son of God...all the Old Testament Prophecies point to this.

Fasting is not only done in need of Exorcism.......

n the Old Testament, the holy Prophets of God Moses and Elias both fasted for forty days, thereby becoming worthy to converse with Christ on Mount Tabor (Ex. 34:28; Matth. 17:3).
Prophet Daniel ate no food for 3 weeks (Dan. 10:2-3) and Ezra for 7 days (Ezr. 8:21-23).
King David prayed and fasted and received through the Prophet Nathan forgiveness for his sins from God (2 Sam. 12:16-20).
The pious Judean woman Judith fasted "all the days of her widowhood," except except on sabbath eves and sabbaths, new moon eves and new moons, feastdays and holidays (Judith 8:6). Ninevites prayed and fasted "the greatest of them even to the least of them" and turned away God's wrath for their great sins (Jonah 3:5-10).
The Israelites fasted by God's will during the terrible desolation from the palmerworm and the locust (Joel 1:14, 2:12-15).
In order to please God, the Israelites fasted on the 4th, 5th, 7th and 10th months, as we see from the book of the Prophet Zachariah (Zach. 8:19).
Following the example set by the Savior, the holy apostles and other righteous persons of the New Testaments sanctified fasting through their own lives and teachings.....

more

If you notice, fasting began in the garden of Eden......ONE COMMANDEMENT.....DO NOT EAT , for you will surely die.......DIE they did because food became LUST of the flesh ......the fruit looked good(although it was similar to the other fruits)....it was the WANTING of that fruit.....

If one consumes little food,then one tends to feel better.....this is a proven fact..that is why fasting for the body is good......FASTING does not mean abstaing from FOOD only.
It cleanses the SOUL ....God dwells in the body of who's body is clean......for a mans body is like a vessel......if a cup is dirty,and it is not cleansed properly, that it ACCUMILATES all sorts of waste.......this is like our SOUL....if we do not take care of our soul then it also becomes filthy and harder to make clean.


The need for Babtism ,Fasting and the temptations of the devil

God allowed the FREE WILL of the First people .......this continues to the New Testament......Jesus Christ after the Babtism(to show us why Babtism is NECASSARY) went straight away into the wilderness and WAS tempted by the devil for 40 days......which shows us that WE too are tempted and many times fall......BUT are called to repentance through His body and Blood(also pre-figured in the Old Testament.....many times with the Prophets....

......This is that bread which came down from heaven: not as your fathers did eat manna, and are dead: he that eateth of this bread shall live for ever." (John 6:52-58)

and another...

And Elias the Thesbite, of the inhabitants of Galaad, said to Achab: As the Lord liveth, the God of Israel, in whose sight I stand, there shall not be dew nor rain these years, but according to the words of my mouth. [2] And the word of the Lord came to him, saying: [3] Get thee hence, and go towards the east, and hide thyself by the torrent of Carith, which is over against the Jordan; [4] And there thou shalt drink of the torrent: and I have commanded the ravens to feed thee there. ... [6] And the ravens brought him bread and flesh in the morning, and bread and flesh in the evening; and he drank of the torrent. (3 Kings:17:1-4,6 Douay-Reims)

Holy Prophet Elias(one of the two winesses that will return to earth )

Also ///

Moses promised, and would provide "in the evening flesh to eat and in the morning bread to the full" (Exod. 16:8).

many more here

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"These are the words which Moses spoke to all Israel" (1:1). "Moses wrote this law and delivered it to the priests" (31:9)

Significance of the Old Testament Prophets

Queenannie/Tradition is certainly true ....As it was in the Old Testament.....

The Apostle Paul passionately appeals to the Christians at Corinth, "that all of you agree and that there be no dissensions among you, but that you be united in the same mind and the same judgment" (I Cor. 1:10). He insists that all church leaders "hold firm to the sure word as taught, so that he may be able to give instruction in sound doctrine and also to confute those who contradict it" (Titus 1:9). Our Lord’s prayer for unity in John 17 has everything to do with His followers being sanctified "in the truth" (v. 17).
And again, His promise to be present with those who gather in His Name is predicated by His saying, "if two of you agree . . ." (Matt. 18:19).
Then, of course, there is Paul’s unparalleled reference to "one Lord, one faith, one baptism" (Eph. 4:5).
From the time of our Lord there began developing a body of truth, a particular interpretation of the divine events; and the Church leaders from the time of the Apostles were given to preserving and building on that sacred "tradition." So the Apostle Paul exclaims, "stand firm and hold to the traditions which you were taught by us, either by word of mouth or by letter" (II Thess. 2:15).
"I commend you," Paul says to the Corinthian believers, "because you . . . maintain the traditions even as I have delivered them to you" (I Cor. 11:2). [2]

The Scriptural message was given to men not in paper and ink. God’s Word was first placed in men’s souls; His words were engraved and imprinted in spirit and not by letter. Our Lord’s message was first presented orally and only later written down (see Luke 1:1–3).

Early in the Church the Word of God began to develop and take on specific form and expression. A common understanding, a "tradition," if you please, began developing under the leadership of the Holy Spirit. The Apostles and their converts taught and founded churches all over the Mediterranean world and left them with its oral Tradition (see Acts 2:42; II Thess. 2:15, 3:6, etc.).

Scripture and Tradition

Evangelist John says: And there are also many other things which Jesus did, the which, if they should be written every one, I suppose that even the world itself could not contain the books that should be written. Amen (Jn. 21:25). Again the same Evangelist declares in one of his epistles: Having many things to write unto you, I would not write with paper and ink: but I trust to come unto you, and speak face to face, that our joy may be full (2 Jn. 1:12).

On Holy Tradition

Just as before the books of the Old Testament were written the people were guided in the knowledge of God and on the path of salvation only by Holy Tradition (Tradition with a living voice, orally),
so too were they precisely before the writing of the books of the New Testament.
The Holy Tradition was the guide by which the first Christians were directed to the path of salvation.
The first to impart the teachings of the New Testament with a living voice to the ears of the people was our Saviour Jesus Christ Himself, who for three and a half years continually taught the people, distributing His Gospel without, however, writing anything.
Inasmuch as He was carrying out obedience to His Father, He didnt send His Apostles to write but to preach the Gospel to the whole world, saying to them: Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit: Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and lo, I am with you always, even unto the end of the world. Amen (Mat. 28:19-20)

more here

Therefore, brethren, stand fast, and hold the traditions which ye have been taught, whether by word, or our epistle (2 Thess. 2:15).

also......
The teachings of the Church of Christ are safeguarded by the Holy Spirit and cannot err (Mat. 10:17-20, John 4: 16-26, 1 Tim. 3:15). Its very founder, Jesus Christ governs it in an unseen way, until the end of the ages (Mat. 28:20)

IX
helen

It's such Bla Bla Bla and it goes on and on just like all the other blogs by people with short hair and long winded lines, OH HOW LEARNED AND SCHOOLED we two are and we just keep on and on. The fire has died and still they think it is worth watering the ambers more then to fan the flames
of discontent.prophetseeker

baptism is laying down with Jesus, and I believe is nessary.

Absolutely necessary--and we are to literally walk in His footsteps--which He walked first of all--in order to forge the path and lead us on our way (among other things).

But if we don't 'wipe the slate clean' from our own point of view (since God already has) we will be working against the Holy Spirit as it works upon our souls, if we continue to worry, obsess, or in any way allow thoughts of sin and resultant guilt and regret to creep back in and eat away at what should be new and unmarred.

The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ: 1 Peter 3:21

Once the conscience is cleansed--and the soul is justified--there should be 'no more conscience' of sin. That means not minding sin--not thinking of it. God desires to free our minds before the actual setting free from our bondage to death--we are given the 'peace which passeth understanding' when the stresses of 'sin' are removed from our lives.

For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified. Whereof the Holy Ghost also is a witness to us: for after that he had said before, This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, saith the Lord, I will put my laws into their hearts, and in their minds will I write them; And their sins and iniquities will I remember no more. Hebrews 10:14-17

Romans 6:6 Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.

lol both helen and queen, your both great people of the lord and are saved. if we did not know something God will not punish us, for we did not know. all of should just walk with the lord.