NEWS: Youthful Marijuana Use Linked to Mental Illness

originally posted by alien
People can debunk all they like.

Those of us who actually work in the Mental Health field, dealing with it day in day out, already knew the outcome.

But hey...spark up another doobie...it will help keep us employed...

"some people do it with cigarette smokin, others cure headaches with i-buprofen, Your grandfather talks about slef respect, and then he takes drugs to keep his (rooster ) erect. But it's all drugs to mee, it all drugs to meeeeeee!"

-Chapelle's show

You can't possibly tell me that the drugs prescribed for these ilnesses ane any better for you.

My roommate, is Bi-polar and on LITHIUM! holy crap, that's the best you all could come up with, lithium? Meanwhile he is on a court orderd program of ANABUSE doses. Let me ask you this, who are these organizations to think thay have jurrisdiction over his body, because they have a peice of paper that says they completed six or so years of psychological witch hunts. Not to mention the fact that they are certified to treat the most unknown and sensitive organ in the body. It is like an automobile repairman forced to fix a rolls-royce turbo jet.

Today we live in a society where our childern are so overmedicated, and misdiagnosed; that i have yelled and screamed my head off at parents, who at the slightest signs of hyperactivity, are calling up the psychologists sayin they think thier child is ADHD. I chose to use a NATURAL substance that is referenced in many religious texts, as a spiritual tool.

Go pop some pills, send your kidneys to an early grave (i'll be laughing so hard from the effects of the doobie, that the early deaths caused by drugs that are unresearched and unnatural, won't make me depressed) meanwhile the drug companies laugh all the way to the bank.




[edit on 5-5-2005 by Eyeofhorus]

[edit on 5-5-2005 by Eyeofhorus]

Just a side note - a quick deisclaimer: - I'm a staunch defender of the use of marijuana, for medical and recreational use, as well as the rights of the individual to make their own choices.

This case highlights one particular hang up for me though, and I wouldn't like to rely solely on the findings of 'scientific' reports, because there is clearly a lot of bias, and government propaganda regarding weed. I have one nagging doubt in my mind though, based on my own observation, and anecdotal evidence from a friend who is a psychiatric nurse.

I'm not sure that kids should be smoking pot until they're out of adolescence; there's a lot going on in someones head at that age, and there's the potential for weed to exacerbate their inevitable emotional lows. In my humble opinion, a developing mind is best left to develop without the influence of mind altering drugs.

Originally posted by Mayet
Statistics also show a huge amount of psychiatrists who neck themselves and a hugely high incidence of mental health workers who have mental "issues" of their own......
Let them eat cake i say.......
Oh I am sure if you wish to debunk my post google can give exact estimates......

Since you mentioned it, I had to find out for myself.
The Merck Manual of Diagnosis and Therapy

Professional persons, including lawyers, dentists, military personnel, and physicians, seem to have higher-than-average suicide rates. The rate among physicians is high largely because of women physicians, whose annual rate of suicide is 4 times that of a matched general population. For physicians < 40 yr old, suicide is the leading cause of death. Overdosage with drugs is a more common method among men and women physicians than among the general population, possibly because physicians have easy access to drugs and know what constitutes a fatal dose. By medical specialty, the rate is highest among psychiatrists.

From the lack of any professional mannerisms, the lack of even a shred of evidence, factual or even anecdotal, in Aliens post I'm betting "working" in the mental health field is really another one of these "i volunteer at a mental hospital", or "I clean the bedpans", or "I answer the phones" people, and the highest degree Alien has is when he/she gets a fever. I've run into these people before, no qualifications, but always running at the mouth with nothing useful or factual to add to a conversation.

I challenge Alien to show us work that he or she has published. I've provided quotes from published sources from around the globe. Let me guess, Alien will decline to expose his or her identity, because the post above pretty much lacks any ethics, and in fact, breaks the law if he or she is a doctor.
As a physician you can not recommend people to take drugs for the sole purpose of keeping your job security.

Dead give away that "working in mental health field", is not "psychiatrist", or "physician".

I agree, which brings me back to my first post. Maybe the psychological problems are caused by bad parenting. If kids are allowed acces to this drug at twelve, then maybe there are other problems that need to be addressed. Maybe the parents don't have a close/nurturing relationship with the child, maybe the child feels unwanted, maybe too much independence is the problem. Independence is knowledege that they must develop later in life (16-20) Not at eight. There is your problem right there. How could you blame marijuanna, i blame the parents for allowing him/her to smoke. Parenting is a job, and if i was the overseer of the company these parents would be fired. You cannot blame marijuanna alone for thier psychological troubles. It is easy to blame drugs and dismiss these cases as drug related, rather than following up to find if there is deeply rooted developmental problems as result of parental treatment.

The neo-con movement is quick to offer law changes to make marijuanna a crimimal item. The people at the forefront of this movement are the parents that don't take the time to inform children of these things. They don't discuss drugs with them, why it isn't ok for them to do drugs. And that maybe one day in the future if the potential exists, i will introduce them to it if curious in a controled environment. But more than likely not. Your children are out there learning things from other kids. Let me ask you parents, would you rather tell your child about drugs, or do you want them to find out from someone elses kid, whose parents you don't know? I bet I know your answer.

You cannot expect the government to do your parenting for you in a free country, it just doesn't work. So stop stepping on my toes with all these rules and laws, because you all are too lazy to talk to your children, or you are afraid. Anyone who says that their job doesn't allow them time to accomplish this would obviously be lying, considering they have spare time to post on a discussion board they must have tme to talk to thier children about drugs.

As far as the ties to mental illness, i don't really know how true this information is. They have lied to us before about the dangers of marijuanna (see Legalizer's posts) what's stopping them from lying to me again? it seems consistent with the current trend. I know that I and my three friends all tried it before the age of twelve, two of us before the age of ten. (my bipolar roommate deinitely started smoking after he was diagnosed) We are all fine! No surprise here. And thats a FACT!

[edit on 5-5-2005 by Eyeofhorus]



[edit on 5-5-2005 by Eyeofhorus]

From SFChronicle 09-21-04

Children account for 7 percent of the total of antidepressants prescriptions written. Last year, there were 145 million prescriptions written for antidepressants, up 8 percent from 2002, according to IMS.

Thats 8,750,000 children under the age of 18 on anti-depressants.
The numbers have been falling since the news of their dangers has come out.

Compared to about 600,000 in the same age group who use cannabis monthly.
Anti-depressant dosage is usually two or more times daily.
The average age of cannabis use is 17.1 (happy birthday!), the instance of 12 year olds is only 2% of the total weed smoking population.

The cross over of over 8 million+ kids on anti-depressants, kids undiagnosed for mental illness, and kids who smoke pot, totaly negates the governments findings, because they did not account for a single vector of this data. Which makes their "research" unscientific bunk. They did not account for quantity of herb use, lifestyle, economics, diet, or any other factors.

Did they ask how much sugar intake these pot smoking kids had?
How about caffeine, its addictive and available in chocolate and soft drinks, there is no carding kids who drink coffee, I've been a coffee junkie since I was 8.

Chocolate and caffeine laced drinks were sold at my school, in fact its a bit of cliche that kids are encouraged to go door to door, to the houses of strangers, and sell this drug in its chocolate form.

Not a single person in this thread will argue: Silly Rabbit, Trips are for Kids!

What every single one of us experienced and educated people have argued is, you can't
believe what the Drug Czar and his media partners say, not for a minute.

After all the DEA and other LE's are the people who bust down the doors of sick people and take their medecine.
Sometimes they KILL

Bruce Lavoie
On August 3, 1989, Lavoie lay peacefully sleeping in the room he shared with his young son in the village of Hudson, New Hampshire. At five in the morning he was awakened by a loud noise as his whole home was shaken violently. A battering ram had smashed his front door, and a dark band of armed men rushed into his small apartment. Rising to defend his son, Lavoie was shot to death as his little boy watched helplessly. They found one cannabis cigarette butt.

Annie Rae Dixon

Age 84 and bedridden when she was killed by police in a 1992 drug raid in East Texas. No drugs were found in the home. A 28 year-old officer said his automatic pistol accidentally discharged when he kicked open Mrs. Dixon's bedroom door.

Earlier that night, an informant was given $30 to go into the Dixon home where he claimed he could buy drugs. He emerged with crack coc aine, but police did not search him either before and after the purchase. The informant reported that a few young women and children lived there, but he didn't know about the sick woman. Police got a search warrant and returned to the house just after 2 am. They sprinted up the ramshackle porch and smashed the front door with a battering ram. As they swept in, the officer kicked in the door to Ms. Dixon's bedroom and fell, slamming his elbow against the door and firing the gun. The officer said he collapsed and "started throwing my guts up crying because I knew I had shot somebody that didn't have no reason to be shot."

And now they use explosive weapons against US citizens

Police in Niagara Falls, NY, are under fire after a flash bang grenade thrown into an apartment during a marijuana raid last week left a local woman hospitalized with serious burns. Rhiannon Kephart, 18, was in bed at the Niagara Falls residence when the Niagara Falls Police Quick Entry Team tossed the incendiary device into the apartment, where it exploded, burning her.Police conceded that Kephart was neither a target of the raid nor trying to impede their heroic endeavors, the Buffalo News reported.

Sometimes resulting in Death

A Harlem woman died of a heart attack after police hurled a flash grenade into her apartment during a mistaken raid yesterday morning.
Heavily armed NYPD Emergency Service Unit cops smashed down the woman's door at 310 W. 143rd St., believing that guns and drugs were in the sixth-floor apartment, Police Commissioner Raymond Kelly said.

Instead, they found Alberta Spruill, 57, a beloved church member and longtime city employee, who was getting ready to go to work when the grenade went off about 6:10 a.m. - creating a deafening boom and a blinding flash.

Cops handcuffed Spruill, who cried as cops began probing her tidy, two-bedroom apartment. A police captain quickly realized cops had hit the wrong location, Kelly said.

At 6:32 a.m., Spruill felt chest pains and was rushed to Harlem Hospital. She went into cardiac arrest in the ambulance and died at the hospital about 8 a.m. - less than two hours after her home was invaded.

For all those ignorant [explitive]'s out there that support the criminlization of cannabis, and therebye the drug war against US and world citizens, take note, you support government without control, without responsibility, without respect. You support racism, oppression, corruption at every level and murder.

You have been informed, you can no longer hide behind ignorance.






[edit on 5-5-2005 by Legalizer]

Pure crap and I don't even smoke the stuff. I don't understand the reasoning behind trying to keep so many people from doing it. I mean if you drink you do stupid things that often involve people getting hurt, with pot I am told you get so mellowed out and happy you just love the world and overeat maybe, oh yeah there is that one bad side affect of being paranoid sometimes. Pot smokers does it give you a perception of something or a clarity that maybe they don't want us to have? I don't understand what is so bad about pot. But I do know that I don't believe anything the man (60's expression) tells me. I believe they are definitely doing it no I take that back it might be a better world if they did.

Pure crap and I don't even smoke the stuff. I don't understand the reasoning behind trying to keep so many people from doing it. I mean if you drink you do stupid things that often involve people getting hurt, with pot I am told you get so mellowed out and happy you just love the world and overeat maybe, oh yeah there is that one bad side affect of being paranoid sometimes. Pot smokers does it give you a perception of something or a clarity that maybe they don't want us to have? I don't understand what is so bad about pot. But I do know that I don't believe anything the man (60's expression) tells me. I believe they are definitely doing it no I take that back it might be a better world if they did.

Applause, everyone let's have around of applause, come on, put em together.

Way to go legalizer. I qualified for state in Lincoln douglass debate in high school, as well as competed in CX debate, and let me tell you what, I wouln't even bother arguing with those figures. That argument is water tight.

I live in Vancouver, B.C.

The undisputed capital in pot cultivation

I've smoked the sticky for four years. untill i quit two months ago for mental health reasons.
Too many pot smokers are trying in vain to keep the friendlyness of MJ's good name intact. This is terrible for the 35% of people it causes psycosis for. (me being one of them)

I miss it's sweet taste so much, but it is truth that it can be a mind destroyer, don't belive? Come on out here and smoke some local at one of our smoke-easy resturants and find out for yourself.

www.erowid.org...

If your lucky to not feel tese effects, enjoy it and avoid the nocibo effect.

yeah but as already said, what came first, the chicken or the egg...were you already self medicating to hide yourself from a deeper darker issues.

Originally posted by goose
Pot smokers does it give you a perception of something or a clarity that maybe they don't want us to have?

I find that it sometimes does. But individual experiences are a variable.

I talked about the notion you raised in a post a while back, but can't seem to find the thread at the moment.

Upon smoking weed, perception is heightened in all areas, visually, aurally and also mentally. This can lead to all kinds of perceptual alterations: some positive, some negative; from enjoying different music, through to paranoia.
Most pertinent to your question though is that given the right circumstances and frame of mind, the act of logical discernment becomes somewhat heightend and more thorough. It becomes hugely stimulating mentally, you can almost feel the neural cylinders firing. I don't think it would be portraying a false pretence to say that you can cut through false ideas and general bull like a hot knife through butter, although as I said, this does rely on the right frame of mind and stimulus.
I think this may be one reason why 'the man' doesn't want you to smoke pot. Such a mental state is not conducive to the average person's 'function' within a nation.

That said, I have and will continuously strive to apply the same scepticism to the above notion that I apply to the ideas that become the subject of such thought, because it would be too ironic to loose objectivity and use a pseudo-intellectual mechanism to try and be a discerning thinker. And I also wouldn't promote the idea that weed necessarily makes you a better thinker, or that you need weed to apply critical thought to a situation.


typo

[edit on 5-5-2005 by Paul]

[edit on 5-5-2005 by Paul]

Originally posted by VaporTrail
I live in Vancouver, B.C.

The undisputed capital in pot cultivation

I've smoked the sticky for four years. untill i quit two months ago for mental health reasons.
Too many pot smokers are trying in vain to keep the friendlyness of MJ's good name intact. This is terrible for the 35% of people it causes psycosis for. (me being one of them)

I miss it's sweet taste so much, but it is truth that it can be a mind destroyer, don't belive? Come on out here and smoke some local at one of our smoke-easy resturants and find out for yourself.

www.erowid.org...

If your lucky to not feel tese effects, enjoy it and avoid the nocibo effect.

Was it overuse or misuse of the drug that caused the psychotic break? You sound like a former "hey, hey, hey smoke weed everyday" kind of guy. Does that kind of behivor constitute responsiblle use of the drug? Maybe if you didn't use it so much you would not have formed the mental bond to it that strained your brain, chemically. Is this true, i am merely guessing. But these are all things to be considered.

What is so wrong with logic guys? Are you afraid of its power to pursuade?

[edit on 5-5-2005 by Eyeofhorus]

[edit on 5-5-2005 by Eyeofhorus]

I saw a news documentary and I think it is the Netherlands it is legal to buy 5 or 9 grams (sorry can't recall correct amount). I wonder what their stats are as far as mental illness compared to ours. Also it turns out that even though its legal less people toke than in the US. Anyone know where you can find such data.

Originally posted by Eyeofhorus

Was it overuse or misuse of the drug that caused the psychotic break? You sound like a former "hey, hey, hey smoke weed everyday" kind of guy. Does that kind of behivor constitute responsiblle use of the drug? Maybe if you didn't use it so much you would not have formed the mental bond to it that strained your brain, chemically. Is this true, i am merely guessing. But these are all things to be considered.

What is so wrong with logic guys? Are you afraid of its power to pursuade?

Very good points All things are better in moderation. Too of anything, whether its food, pot, alcohol, or vitamin C is going to give you problems

Chicken With Egg

In other news, the Office of National Drug Control Policy (ONDCP) released a report this week which suggests that children prone to serious mental illnesses (SMI) are more likely to try marijuana.

[edit on 5-5-2005 by Paul]

Originally posted by Legalizer

"Love Kills"- This is a public health warning.

[edit on 5-5-2005 by Legalizer]

All I have to say is this:

You have voted Legalizer for the Way Above Top Secret award. You have two more votes this month.

Best post I have seen in a while.

Originally posted by Paul

Very good points

All things are better in moderation. Too of anything, whether its food, pot, alcohol, or vitamin C is going to give you problems

I agree, there are so many good points in here. I think its criminal to kick peoples doors down for a little bag of pot....theres names for governments like that and the first one that comes to mind is the 3rd Reich.

Uncle Sam needs to clean up their own act before talking down to casual drug users. Perhaps the phamicuidical industry does not like competition....God forbid we stop taking their mind-bending pills.

As usual our government goes way overboard and uses Gestapo tactics against innocent drug users. Its time to let Non-violent drug offenders outta jail and free up the space for violent criminals.


Maximu§


[edit on 013131p://444 by LA_Maximus]

yes i smoked every day, more than once. But so does 80% of the pot smokers in my city! It's just the way things are done here. But i'll agree that smoking more is more effective than smoking less.

As for isues underlying, well anyone would be lieing to deny this, nobody just picks up a new stimulant or depressent with no need to try somthing new. But i will state that i was incredably stable before i started smoking. No A student, but i could concentrate.

Basicly i'm hopeing for legalization for a simple reason. The govt. will make a brand that closer resembles 60's pot, somthing nice and light that us low threshold smokers can handel.

Right now it's a contest between growers to produce the most powerful, mind tickleing weed imaginable. And it's getting kinda rediculos!

Originally posted by Legalizer
From the lack of any professional mannerisms, the lack of even a shred of evidence, factual or even anecdotal, in Aliens post I'm betting "working" in the mental health field is really another one of these "i volunteer at a mental hospital", or "I clean the bedpans", or "I answer the phones" people, and the highest degree Alien has is when he/she gets a fever. I've run into these people before, no qualifications, but always running at the mouth with nothing useful or factual to add to a conversation.

I challenge Alien to show us work that he or she has published. I've provided quotes from published sources from around the globe. Let me guess, Alien will decline to expose his or her identity, because the post above pretty much lacks any ethics, and in fact, breaks the law if he or she is a doctor.
As a physician you can not recommend people to take drugs for the sole purpose of keeping your job security.

Dead give away that "working in mental health field", is not "psychiatrist", or "physician".

...hahahahaaaaaaa...

Yes. I volunteer at a hospital and the highest degree I have is when I get a fever. Good one.

Sorry to disappoint you but I'm not a psychiatrist...I'm a Community Mental Health Nurse...and have been doing that for the past 8 1/2 years.

Have I got a degree...why yes...a BA, also an Comp RN Cert for the work I do.

You can believe what you will dear friend...those here to know me know what I do. More importantly, those I work with know far more about me than the snap judgement you made which has about as much accuracy as a one-winged plane...

Now...lets not go making personal attacks...like can be found in the first paragraph of yours I quoted there...or you might just get smacked with a Warn or worse.

Wooo...is that a threat?? Take it however you want it.


Peace,
ALIEN