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Russia will be the European pariah for the next 100 years down to Putin's failed wet dream
originally posted by: CriticalStinker
originally posted by: twistedpuppy
a reply to: worldstarcountry
Russians are like Palestinians, they are sub-human dogs that deserve neither life nor liberty and should all be exterminated because they keep getting in the way of decades old plans laid out by globalists in the various think tanks.
Only I haven't yet heard about Ukrainians exterminating Russians. It's always the other way round.
Civilians did die in the conflicts that erupted in east Ukraine. But that was after Russia took Crimea and started sending folks in the west to try and spark rebellion so Russia could take the eastern land bridge. They didn’t want a separated Crimea, they needed the eastern sliver.
Of course, their narrative is that Ukraine and the west started all of this. But they went into Crimea, they sparked the unrest in the east only to fully invade Ukraine and start annexing land.
The west is merely providing arms to a defense agreement that was made thirty years ago when Ukraine gave up nukes.
originally posted by: twistedpuppy
a reply to: worldstarcountry
Russians are like Palestinians, they are sub-human dogs that deserve neither life nor liberty and should all be exterminated because they keep getting in the way of decades old plans laid out by globalists in the various think tanks.
Only I haven't yet heard about Ukrainians exterminating Russians. It's always the other way round.
originally posted by: CriticalStinker
originally posted by: twistedpuppy
a reply to: worldstarcountry
Russians are like Palestinians, they are sub-human dogs that deserve neither life nor liberty and should all be exterminated because they keep getting in the way of decades old plans laid out by globalists in the various think tanks.
Only I haven't yet heard about Ukrainians exterminating Russians. It's always the other way round.
Civilians did die in the conflicts that erupted in east Ukraine. But that was after Russia took Crimea and started sending folks in the west to try and spark rebellion so Russia could take the eastern land bridge. They didn’t want a separated Crimea, they needed the eastern sliver.
Of course, their narrative is that Ukraine and the west started all of this. But they went into Crimea, they sparked the unrest in the east only to fully invade Ukraine and start annexing land.
The west is merely providing arms to a defense agreement that was made thirty years ago when Ukraine gave up nukes.
You've never heard about Ukraine and Azov killing ethnic Russians in the Donbas and the east?
Ukraine never owned Nukes, they belonged to Russia and Ukraine couldn't even use those Nukes on their own all the launch capabilities where from Moscow....
You've never heard about Ukraine and Azov killing ethnic Russians in the Donbas and the east?
No the US had nothing to do with the coup and picking new leaders in Ukraine.....
..... that resulted in the Crimean people wanting to join Russia.
The Crimean people are still happy they joined Russia....
Any independently verified evidence of that?
originally posted by: twistedpuppy
a reply to: TheMisguidedAngel
You've never heard about Ukraine and Azov killing ethnic Russians in the Donbas and the east?
If you mean armed militias, then yes I heard about Azov killing them from time to time.
And yes I read and watched the reports from the siege of Mariupol, how the Russians bombed the city killing nearly 25000 civilians. The rest were struggling with cold, hunger and thirst. You want to say that Azov killed all these people and bombed the s**t out of the city? I think you overestimated them a little bit.
originally posted by: Freeborn
a reply to: TheMisguidedAngel
... that resulted in the Crimean people wanting to join Russia.
Any independently verified evidence of that?
The Crimean people are still happy they joined Russia....
Source?
But of course you know all that.
Now please tell us how its all America and the UK's fault.
During his 2016 presidential campaign, Donald Trump told George Stephanopoulos of ABC that “the people of Crimea, from what I’ve heard, would rather be with Russia than where they were.” Trump’s critics charged him with using Vladimir Putin’s talking points. Yet Trump, in this instance, was broadly correct.
In one area, however, the Russians have enjoyed success. The Russification of the peninsula is continuing apace.
Russification of Crimea is not an ad hoc policy imposed after the occupation. It is rooted in the ideology of Russkii MIr (“Russian World”). This concept, which is espoused by Putin, is itself part of a long historical tradition going back to the annexation of the Crimea by Catherine the Great in 1783.
The Russian World ideology insists that Russia is a supra-national civilisation that extends far beyond the present borders of the Russian Federation to include Ukraine, Belarus, Kazakhstan and other parts of the former Soviet Union. At the same time, the ideology is intolerant of any other expression of identity within its sphere and justifies the elimination of that identity, as is taking place in Crimea.
Putin swore to safeguard the different national traditions that existed in Crimea when he launched the annexation. These promises were broken immediately and have continued to be broken ever since.
Ukrainian and Tatar languages have been suppressed, political activists arrested and any expression of cultural identity other than Russian is forbidden. The national body of the Crimean Tatars, the Mejlis, has been suppressed and all other representative institutions are a sham, as those in Russia itself.
The voices of the people of Crimea are few and far between. Most refuse to speak out for fear of retaliation. However, Le Monde was able to gather testimonies from several people, via secure messaging or video calls. Some are still there, while others, like Bohdan, have fled in recent months. All participants requested anonymity to ensure their safety or that of their loved ones still on the peninsula. "Otherwise, tomorrow the FSB [Russian security services] will come knocking at my father's door," one of them said.
They spoke about how the war has changed their environment, their daily lives and their aspirations, even if the situation is much calmer than in the rest of Ukraine, which has been under Russian bombardment for the past two years. "Between February and September 2022, when I fled Crimea, it was horrifying, society was transformed," said Bohdan. In the streets and cinemas, posters bearing the symbol "Z" and others calling for people to join the Russian army appeared. The presence of the population, particularly men, in public spaces had notably diminished. "Everyone acted as if nothing was happening, whereas in town, every sign was a call to enlist and a reminder of the war."
So basically a ceasefire is off the table. I know, I know, "We can have a ceasefire if Russia gets out of Ukraine," but back in the real world that's not happening, so a ceasefire is effectively off the table.
originally posted by: BedevereTheWise
a reply to: YourFaceAgain
So basically a ceasefire is off the table. I know, I know, "We can have a ceasefire if Russia gets out of Ukraine," but back in the real world that's not happening, so a ceasefire is effectively off the table.
Why not? The conflict is costing Russia far more than the west.
The US withdrew from Vietnam and Afghanistan.
The Soviet Union withdrew from Afhganistan.
Putin has stayed in power on the back of improving living standards and military successes. With the suppression of reporting in Russia we really don't know what the internal impact of failure in Ukraine (and it absolutely is a faliure) will be.
originally posted by: YourFaceAgain
originally posted by: BedevereTheWise
a reply to: YourFaceAgain
So basically a ceasefire is off the table. I know, I know, "We can have a ceasefire if Russia gets out of Ukraine," but back in the real world that's not happening, so a ceasefire is effectively off the table.
Why not? The conflict is costing Russia far more than the west.
The US withdrew from Vietnam and Afghanistan.
The Soviet Union withdrew from Afhganistan.
Putin has stayed in power on the back of improving living standards and military successes. With the suppression of reporting in Russia we really don't know what the internal impact of failure in Ukraine (and it absolutely is a faliure) will be.
This has been going on for more than 2 years by now. If this failure was going to result in Putin's downfall, it would have already. In 2022, when this started, there were people predicting he'd be gone by the end of the year.
Whether you think Putin should pull out of Ukraine is irrelevant. What I'm talking about is whether he will or not. And he hasn't shown any indication that he's gonna. And that's the only way the West has signaled they'd accept a ceasefire. So a ceasefire is effectively off the table until the West's calculus changes, which as I said will only happen when voters get tired enough of this.
originally posted by: BedevereTheWise
originally posted by: YourFaceAgain
originally posted by: BedevereTheWise
a reply to: YourFaceAgain
So basically a ceasefire is off the table. I know, I know, "We can have a ceasefire if Russia gets out of Ukraine," but back in the real world that's not happening, so a ceasefire is effectively off the table.
Why not? The conflict is costing Russia far more than the west.
The US withdrew from Vietnam and Afghanistan.
The Soviet Union withdrew from Afhganistan.
Putin has stayed in power on the back of improving living standards and military successes. With the suppression of reporting in Russia we really don't know what the internal impact of failure in Ukraine (and it absolutely is a faliure) will be.
This has been going on for more than 2 years by now. If this failure was going to result in Putin's downfall, it would have already. In 2022, when this started, there were people predicting he'd be gone by the end of the year.
Whether you think Putin should pull out of Ukraine is irrelevant. What I'm talking about is whether he will or not. And he hasn't shown any indication that he's gonna. And that's the only way the West has signaled they'd accept a ceasefire. So a ceasefire is effectively off the table until the West's calculus changes, which as I said will only happen when voters get tired enough of this.
How long war Russia in Afghanistan? The US in vietnam?