Mother of Michigan Gunman Found Guilty of Manslaughter

originally posted by: whereislogic
a reply to: Kurokage

Scream louder in your agony. Your picture (avatar) apparently isn't clear enough for some people.

...
Sing it girl!

...

Too bad one can't take anything back on ATS, then again, now those with 'ears to hear' or 'eyes to see', and the ability to comprehend, can see that ATS indeed has a bad influence on both heart and mind. I was no longer talking to the human who made the account "Kurokage", at least not in my mind when I posted the first 2 sentences. I hope by quoting those videos again, it becomes a bit clearer who I was talking to in my mind (it does help if one watches those videos, and compares the picture used at 0:20 in the first video with Kurokage's avatar; and watches the video with the lady in its entirety, in particular her opening remarks and how she responds to that, my response was rather similar).

Romans 7:14-25

14 For we know that the Law is spiritual, but I am fleshly, sold under sin. 15 For I do not understand what I am doing. For I do not practice what I wish,* [Or “want to do.”] but I do what I hate. [whereislogic: worse, I even predicted I was going to be lured into it, almost as if that makes it OK; which technically is not what I meant when I said it. But if anyone interprets it that way, it's still my fault and I should have put more effort into avoiding falling into this trap.] 16 However, if I do what I do not wish, I agree that the Law is fine. 17 But now I am no longer the one doing it, but it is the sin that resides in me. 18 For I know that in me, that is, in my flesh, there dwells nothing good; for I have the desire to do what is fine but not the ability to carry it out. 19 For I do not do the good that I wish, but the bad that I do not wish is what I practice. 20 If, then, I do what I do not wish, I am no longer the one carrying it out, but it is the sin dwelling in me.

21 I find, then, this law in my case: When I wish to do what is right, what is bad is present with me. 22 I really delight in the law of God according to the man I am within, 23 but I see in my body another law warring against the law of my mind and leading me captive to sin’s law that is in my body. 24 Miserable man that I am! Who will rescue me from the body undergoing this death? 25 Thanks to God through Jesus Christ our Lord! So, then, with my mind I myself am a slave to God’s law, but with my flesh to sin’s law.

ATS keeps on drawing me in with the allure it has to me, and the probably false notion that I can do some good here, but I recommend everyone to leave this site be, and stay far away from it, even when I fail time and time again. Who's the stiff-necked fool now if I won't even listen to myself?

I also forgot to add "to me" in this comment:

originally posted by: whereislogic
a reply to: randomuser2034

... Just like "his Majesty" is always referring to the King Jesus Christ to me, no matter how someone else may want to use it. So if someone hears that expression used by Bob Marley, all they need to do, is interpret it as referring to Jesus Christ, the King of God's Kingdom. Then, the teaching ascribed to "his Majesty" as 'not make war' is 100% correct, he is after all the Prince of Peace.

Bringing us back to the closing remarks of Bob Marley here:

...

I'm curious. Do you feel the same about vehicles/knives/machetes/baseball bats/hammers etc. that are used in homicides? What about drugs? 112,000 OD's, record breaking numbers in 2023 in the USA, it's a shame.

Violent deaths are horrible, all of them. But don't blame the weapon of choice. Evil can make anything deadly. See my signature.

originally posted by: StoutBroux
I'm curious. ...

I find that a bit hard to believe, since what followed was a very standardized and common pro-gun argument in the form of a rhetorical question. Nothing wrong with rhetorical questions of course, and even those can be answered, but then there's little need to express curiosity. It may even be detrimental to any desire for an answer cause someone might view you as being dishonest about that (the claim concerning curiosity; I understand it was just your way of introducing the rhetorical question, so don't take this the wrong way, I mean someone else might get that impression).

I hope that was a polite and respectful way of responding without having to bother with a direct answer. It's not like the same argument hasn't been used by gun lovers and hobbyists 'protecting' themselves from cans and target papers (not sure how these are called) on a shooting range ad infinitum. Ad infinitum is a Latin phrase meaning "to infinity" or "forevermore". Pardon the hyperbole. And no doubt responded to with a counter-argument many times as well (albeit perhaps not that often on ATS, or even just on US television or other types of media).

Description of the video below:

"My family often tries to do things together as a family."

Hmm, where have I heard that before.

By the way, the father was also charged. A teacher had caught the kid (the shooter) looking for ammo on his phone during class, according to the kid it was because he had been to a shooting range with his mom: shooting was a family hobby.

I'm sure it's quite the thrill. Harmless 'quality' family time? Or profitable hobby for those selling overpriced guns and ammo (or profiting in some other way from the popularity of guns in the US)? All I wanna say is...

Question for everyone: Which positive message(s), idea(s), or "beneficial teaching" (2 Timothy 4:3,4) can you agree with in the following song?

Remember the Bible text I quoted in the OP?

2 Timothy 3:1-5:

But know this, that in the last days critical times hard to deal with will be here. 2 For men will be lovers of themselves, lovers of money, boastful, haughty, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, disloyal, 3 having no natural affection, not open to any agreement, slanderers, without self-control, fierce, without love of goodness, 4 betrayers, headstrong, puffed up with pride, lovers of pleasures rather than lovers of God, 5 having an appearance of godliness but proving false to its power; and from these turn away.

Anyone out there who can see something positive in that song? Or maybe the other one? (and is willing to express that in this thread? Which was sort of implied in those questions.)

“Finally, brothers, whatever things are true, whatever things are of serious concern, whatever things are righteous, whatever things are chaste, whatever things are lovable, whatever things are well-spoken-of, whatever things are virtuous, and whatever things are praiseworthy, continue considering these things.”—Philippians 4:8, New World Translation.

“Finally, brothers and sisters, whatever is true, whatever is noble, whatever is right, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is admirable—if anything is excellent or praiseworthy—think about such things.”—Philippians 4:8, New International Version.

Coming back to something I quoted before on page 1:

Proverbs 4:7:

Wisdom is the most important* [Or “the prime.”] thing, so acquire wisdom,

And with all you acquire, acquire understanding.

Understanding (Aid to Bible Understanding)

...

RELATIONSHIP TO KNOWLEDGE AND WISDOM

Understanding must be based on knowledge, and works with knowledge, though it is itself more than mere knowledge. The extent and worth of one’s understanding is measurably affected by the quantity and quality of one’s knowledge. Knowledge is acquaintance with facts, and the greatest and most fundamental fact is God, his existence, his invincible purpose, his ways. Understanding enables the person to relate the knowledge he acquires to God’s purpose and standards and thereby assess or evaluate such knowledge. The “understanding heart is one that searches for knowledge”; it is not satisfied with a mere superficial view but seeks to get the full picture. (Prov. 15:14) Knowledge must become ‘pleasant to one’s very soul’ if discernment is to safeguard one from perversion and deception.—Prov. 2:10, 11; 18:15.

Proverbs 1:1-6 shows that the “man of understanding is the one who acquires skillful direction, to understand a proverb and a puzzling saying, the words of wise persons and their riddles.” These must not be things said merely to pass the time away in idle conversation, for wise persons would not customarily waste time in such manner, but must refer to instruction, questions and problems that discipline and train the mind and heart in right principles, thereby equipping the learner for wise action in the future. (Compare Psalm 49:3, 4.) Knowledge and understanding together bring wisdom, which is the “prime thing,” the ability to bring a fund of knowledge and keen understanding to bear on problems with successful results. (Prov. 4:7) The person who is rightly motivated seeks understanding, not out of mere curiosity or to exalt himself, but for the very purpose of acting in wisdom; ‘wisdom is before his face.’ (Prov. 17:24) He is not like those in the apostle Paul’s day who assumed to be teachers of others but were “puffed up with pride, not understanding anything,” unwisely letting themselves become “mentally diseased over questionings and debates about words,” things that produce disunity and a host of bad results.—1 Tim. 6:3-5; see KNOWLEDGE; WISDOM.

1 Tim 6:4,5:

he is puffed up with pride and does not understand anything. He is obsessed with arguments and debates about words. These things give rise to envy, strife, slander, wicked suspicions, 5 constant disputes about minor matters by men who are corrupted in mind and deprived of the truth, thinking that godly devotion is a means of gain.

It even happens to the most intelligent (or cunning) among us.

Exactly how this video isn't in here is beyond me! Great pop song with the devilish story much like the real life events!

originally posted by: whereislogic
...
Question for everyone: Which positive message(s), idea(s), or "beneficial teaching" (2 Timothy 4:3,4) can you agree with in the following song?

Remember the Bible text I quoted in the OP?

2 Timothy 3:1-5:

But know this, that in the last days critical times hard to deal with will be here. 2 For men will be lovers of themselves, lovers of money, boastful, haughty, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, disloyal, 3 having no natural affection, not open to any agreement, slanderers, without self-control, fierce, without love of goodness, 4 betrayers, headstrong, puffed up with pride, lovers of pleasures rather than lovers of God, 5 having an appearance of godliness but proving false to its power; and from these turn away.

Anyone out there who can see something positive in that song? ...

“Finally, brothers, whatever things are true, whatever things are of serious concern, whatever things are righteous, whatever things are chaste, whatever things are lovable, whatever things are well-spoken-of, whatever things are virtuous, and whatever things are praiseworthy, continue considering these things.”—Philippians 4:8, New World Translation.

“Finally, brothers and sisters, whatever is true, whatever is noble, whatever is right, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is admirable—if anything is excellent or praiseworthy—think about such things.”—Philippians 4:8, New International Version.

...

Coming back to the bolded question above, the verb "see" has a double meaning in that question, I wasn't just asking about the lyrics, but also what you can literally see in the music video. It's OK to spell it out here, the question is phrased as such that there is no need to voice any disagreement with what you see for example at 4:10 - 4:30. So please don't do that either if you decide to spell it out here. No one is stopping you from spelling it out (in a particular sense, in another sense, someone actually is stopping you from doing that by means of propaganda and conditioning; which I may come back to some time from now if no one has spelled it out yet without immediately arguing against it or voicing their disagreement or adding unnecessary caveats*, such as: 'well, it's a nice ideal, but not realistic or practical because, yada yada yada'). And don't let the fear of men stop you either ("trembling at men is what lays a snare", quoted that one before).

*: And certainly don't be an ass like Randy here:

It's not OK, it's not "complex" (it's clear as crystal what the crux of the problem is as I mentioned in the OP), it's not funny, and it's exceedingly sad how so many Americans have gone (gun) crazy/mad/insane. Especially in terms of how they respond to the situation (as demonstrated by the other parents above), while pretending to care (or saying it, parrotting their hypocrite political leaders and talking heads on TV and elsewhere, the propagandists who benefit from the popularity of guns in the US, who definitely only care about themselves being "lovers of themselves" and "lovers of money", as the first 2 are described at 2 Timothy 3:1-5, and who are 'greedily exploiting you with counterfeit words.' 2 Peter 2:3; also quoted before, just not in the OP, 3rd comment. And those who simply don't want to give up their hobby, their love of guns and shooting, for whom the same things apply, 'not caring', lovers of self, lovers of money, don't even care about their own children or how all this is affecting the next generation, and yes, also the 2 Peter 2:3 thing since they are satisfying and justifying the satisfication of self, their own pleasures, "lovers of pleasures rather than lovers of God", by means of the same arguments and "counterfeit words" that they have been fed and the attitude they have been conditioned with, in a boastful, proud and haughty manner, betrayers of their own children and God, disloyal, etc. the whole list at 2 Timothy 3:1-5, including the descriptions in the subsequent verses that I also quoted by now).

I wanted to post the scene now where the school had turned into a warzone, where the kid characters had to dodge bullets to get from one place to another, but having some trouble finding it on youtube. So you can help me with that as well if you feel like it.

Also keep in mind that I introduced Michael Jackson's "Heal the World" song in the OP with the following text:

“For though we walk in the flesh, we do not wage warfare* [“We do not wage warfare.” Lit., “we are not doing military service.” ...; Lat., non . . . mi·li·ta'mus.] according to what we are in the flesh. For the weapons of our warfare are not fleshly, but powerful by God for overturning strongly entrenched things. For we are overturning reasonings and every lofty thing raised up against the knowledge of God;” (2 Cor 10:3-5)

“A careful review of all the information available goes to show that, until the time of Marcus Aurelius [121-180 C.E.], no Christian became a soldier; and no soldier, after becoming a Christian, remained in military service.” (The Rise of Christianity, by E. W. Barnes, 1947, p. 333) “It will be seen presently that the evidence for the existence of a single Christian soldier between 60 and about 165 A.D. is exceedingly slight; . . . up to the reign of Marcus Aurelius at least, no Christian would become a soldier after his baptism.” (The Early Church and the World, by C. J. Cadoux, 1955, pp. 275, 276) “In the second century, Christianity . . . had affirmed the incompatibility of military service with Christianity.” (A Short History of Rome, by G. Ferrero and C. Barbagallo, 1919, p. 382) “The behavior of the Christians was very different from that of the Romans. . . . Since Christ had preached peace, they refused to become soldiers.” (Our World Through the Ages, by N. Platt and M. J. Drummond, 1961, p. 125) “The first Christians thought it was wrong to fight, and would not serve in the army even when the Empire needed soldiers.” (The New World’s Foundations in the Old, by R. and W. M. West, 1929, p. 131) “The Christians . . . shrank from public office and military service.” (Editorial introduction to “Persecution of the Christians in Gaul, A.D. 177,” in The Great Events by Famous Historians, edited by R. Johnson, 1905, Vol. III, p. 246) “While they [the Christians] inculcated the maxims of passive obedience, they refused to take any active part in the civil administration or the military defence of the empire. . . . It was impossible that the Christians, without renouncing a more sacred duty, could assume the character of soldiers, of magistrates, or of princes.”—The Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire, by Edward Gibbon, Vol. I, p. 416.

Stop falling for it, wake up!


Context (next video in the playlist):

Jehovahs Witnesses- [a destructive cult?] Persecution of a peaceable people
Does the one below make more sense to you now? (it precedes the first one I embedded above)

Lyrics from Bob Marley's "So much things to say":

Well, I and I and I no come to fight flesh and blood
But spiritual wickedness in high and low places
So while they fight you down
Stand firm and give Jah thanks and praises [Jah as in Jehovah]
'Cause I and I no expect to be justified
By the laws of men, by the laws of men
Whole jury found me guilty
But prove, truth shall prove my innocency

Well, this thread seems appropiate now.

2024 Kansas City parade shooting (wikipedia)

Maybe we should debate some more as to Stan's mom's question: 'Why does this keep happening to us?' (paraphrasing, keyword: "Why") Cause you know, the answer isn't obvious at all, it's so "complex" (as the other parent says, who's that character?).

Yes, that was sarcasm, I try to avoid it as much as I can. But when so many people keep shooting themselves in the feet, and then ask why their feet hurt so much (if they ask at all), it gets a bit harder to resist responding like that. Besides, I'm still hoping no one is waiting for another person to pretend they care about the victims, including the children as they express their phony concern on TV, in politics or in the news media. You're better off with a 'told you so' (including the answer to the question "why") at this point. Even if you still don't wanna hear it. No matter how many times this keeps happening and the question "why?" is raised and debated, without ever getting to the crux of the problem. Let alone a solution (see Michael Jackson's song "Heal the World").

“For there will be a period of time when they will not put up with the wholesome* [Or “healthful; beneficial.”] teaching, but according to their own desires, they will surround themselves with teachers to have their ears tickled.* [Or “to tell them what they want to hear.”] They will turn away from listening to the truth and give attention to false stories.” (2 Timothy 4:3,4)

John 8:42-47

42 Jesus said to them: “If God were your Father, you would love me, for I came from God and I am here. I have not come of my own initiative, but that One sent me. 43 Why do you not understand what I am saying? Because you cannot listen to* [Or “accept.”] my word. 44 You are from your father the Devil, and you wish to do the desires of your father. That one was a murderer when he began, and he did not stand fast in the truth, because truth is not in him. When he speaks the lie, he speaks according to his own disposition, because he is a liar and the father of the lie. 45 Because I, on the other hand, tell you the truth, you do not believe me. 46 Who of you convicts me of sin? If I speak truth, why is it that you do not believe me? 47 The one who is from God listens to the sayings of God. This is why you do not listen, because you are not from God.”

Period. Case solved. (for those who agreed with me before, in particular concerning what I described in the OP as the crux of the problem, this obviously doesn't count; maybe they're afraid to speak up in this thread, and agree specifically with my description of the crux of the problem and/or the solution as proposed by Michael Jackson in "Heal the World" shown at 4:10 - 4:30, but remember, "trembling at men is what lays a snare", Pr 29:25)

From the wikipage linked earlier:

Kansas City Chiefs quarterback Patrick Mahomes wrote on social media that he was "praying for Kansas City".

Ah, they're such good listeners to God, I'm sure he'll listen too. (empty platitudes)

Yeah, sarcasm again. Last time. What else can I try? Or any person that actually cares?

Jesus: “All the works they do, they do to be seen by men. . . hypocrites!” (Matthew 23:5,13)

FYI: God doesn't listen to insincere prayers that are just for show.

Jesus talking again: “You hypocrites, Isaiah aptly prophesied about you, when he said, ‘This people honors me with their lips, yet their heart is far removed from me. It is in vain that they keep worshiping me, because they teach commands of men as doctrines.’” (Matthew 15:7-9) ("me" there is referring to Jehovah, see Isaiah, ah well...)

Isaiah 29:13

13 Jehovah says: “This people approach me with their mouth

And they honor me with their lips,

But their heart is far removed from me;

And their fear of me is based on commands of men that they have been taught.

Bob Marley Lyrics from the song below (verse 4):

Now they sitting on a time bomb; (Bomb-bomb-bomb! Bomb-bomb-bomb!)
Now I know the time has come: (Bomb-bomb-bomb! Bomb-bomb-bomb!)
What goes on up is coming on down, (Bomb-bomb-bomb! Bomb-bomb-bomb!)
Goes around and comes around. (Bomb-bomb-bomb! Bomb-bomb-bomb!) [whereislogic: of course, that doesn't count for the kids that got shot; 800 law enforcement officers were present, hmmm, it seems the "for protection" style arguments aren't quite panning out. Again: wake up! Please, for the sake of your children at least. Half of those that got shot were kids. You wanna throw in another 'guns don't kill people, yada yada'? It's time to get upset about these type of arguments. Well, some time ago actually.]

“So we should no longer be children, tossed about as by waves and carried here and there by every wind of teaching by means of the trickery of men, by means of cunning in deceptive schemes.” (Ephesians 4:14)

“However, the inspired word clearly says that in later times some will fall away from the faith, paying attention to misleading inspired statements and teachings of demons, by means of the hypocrisy of men who speak lies, whose conscience is seared as with a branding iron.”(1 Timothy 4:1,2).

Stop parotting their arguments and points please. Is that really too much to ask for? After all...

Don't be like these:

Accept the truth when it's shooting you in the face, well before actually. By then it's a bit late. Truth counts as "beneficial teaching" (2 Tim 4:3,4), well, if it's the truth about something important.

Proverbs 29:1

A man who stiffens his neck* [Or “who remains stubborn.”] after much reproof

Will suddenly be broken beyond healing.

Bob Marley lyrics:

How can you be sitting there
Telling me that you care
That you care?
When every time I look around,
The people suffer in the suffering
In every way, in everywhere
...
Some people got facts and claims
Some people got pride and shame
Some people got the plots and schemes
Some people got no aim it seems
...
Some people put the best outside
Some people keep the best inside
Some people can't stand up strong
Some people won't wait for long

More lyrics:

Don't let them fool ya
Or even try to school ya! Oh, no!
We've got a mind of our own
So go to hell, if what you're thinking isn't right!
Love would never leave us alone
A-in the darkness, there must come out to light


With illustrations (Bible texts are in German though, they are Eccl. 8:9; Dan 2:44; Matt 6:9,10):

Oh, the numbers have been adjusted on the wikilink:

one person was killed and 13 others were injured, 9 by gunshot ... Eight children were among the injured.

Missouri Governor Mike Parson was at the parade and posted on social media, "State law enforcement personnel are assisting local authorities in response efforts [...] As we wait to learn more, our hearts go out to the victims."

No they don't, stop pretending just "to be seen by men" (Matt 23:5), with empty platitudes. And who is "our", you can't speak for your partners in crime or what's truly going on in their hearts. You can't even tell what's going on in your own heart.

Jeremiah 17:9,10

The heart is more treacherous* [Or “deceitful.”] than anything else and is desperate.* [Or possibly, “incurable.”]

Who can know it?

I, Jehovah, am searching the heart,

Examining the innermost thoughts,* [Or “deepest emotions.” Lit., “kidneys.”]

To give to each one according to his ways,

According to the fruitage of his works.

Kansas City Mayor Quinton Lucas described the incident as tragic and said the country needed to figure out a way to prevent mass shootings from occurring.

Let's debate it some more, cause it's soooo complicated, it's not obvious at all what the crux of the problem is or how to fix it. (oops, there was the sarcasm again)

The Kansas City Chiefs organization expressed sorrow over the shooting, describing it as a "senseless act of violence" in a statement.

Oh, you mean like shooting people dead when they wave a knife at you from 10 meters away and clearly have some mental issues, possibly even going for 'suicide-by-cop'? Oh, I guess it's "yards" in the US.

The House of Representatives held a moment of silence, led by Kansas City-area House congressional members Emanuel Cleaver, Sharice Davids, Mark Alford and Ann Wagner.

Quite the show (why are these people specifically mentioned by name on the wikipedia page? Is that important?). Almost as boring as "The Walking Dead" or "Breaking Bad". Where they love to condition people to make them gun crazy as well. Still looking for that South Park scene with the kids dodging bullets at school (in the hallways, going from one place to another). Guess this one will have to do:

Time for some truth about Valentine's Day?

Valentine Day—Where Did It Come From? (Awake!—1992)

...

Brewer’s Dictionary of Phrase and Fable says: ...

“The ancient custom of choosing Valentines has only accidental relation to [the] saint, being essentially a relic of the old Roman Lupercalia . . . or from association with the mating season of birds. It was marked by the giving of presents and nowadays by the sending of a card on which cupids, transfixed hearts, etc., are depicted.”

And what does Cupid have to do with Valentine Day? The same source says: “Cupid (Lat[in] cupido, desire, love). The Roman god of love, identified with the Greek Eros. He is usually represented as a beautiful winged boy, blindfolded, and carrying a bow and arrows.”

Regardless of the true origin of the practice, it is evident that it is rooted in ancient pagan beliefs and in Christendom’s listing of so-​called “saints.” Valentine Day is also another excuse for commercial exploitation of an often uninformed public.​—2 Corinthians 6:14-18.

...

2 Corinthians 6:14-18

Do not become unevenly yoked with unbelievers. For what fellowship do righteousness and lawlessness have? Or what sharing does light have with darkness? 15 Further, what harmony is there between Christ and Beʹli·al? Or what does a believer share in common with an unbeliever? 16 And what agreement does God’s temple have with idols? For we are a temple of a living God; just as God said: “I will reside among them and walk among them, and I will be their God, and they will be my people.” 17 “‘Therefore, get out from among them, and separate yourselves,’ says Jehovah, ‘and quit touching the unclean thing’”; “‘and I will take you in.’” 18 “‘And I will become a father to you, and you will become sons and daughters to me,’ says Jehovah, the Almighty.”

Ahh (sigh), listening to Jehovah, a lost art. Especially when it also implies obedience to count as true 'listening'.

“For though we walk in the flesh, we do not wage warfare* [“We do not wage warfare.” Lit., “we are not doing military service.” ...; Lat., non . . . mi·li·ta'mus.] according to what we are in the flesh. For the weapons of our warfare are not fleshly, but powerful by God for overturning strongly entrenched things. For we are overturning reasonings and every lofty thing raised up against the knowledge of God;” (2 Cor 10:3-5)

First Line - the rest is on YOU


Wonder if he was LGBTQWERY - if it would be spun different .......

Schools ( STATE) actively usurping parents rights

--- The state separating children from the parents ... then the parents get blamed

meanwhile ...

JUSTICE?

WAKE UP

originally posted by: whereislogic
...

Bob Marley Lyrics from the song below (verse 4):

Now they sitting on a time bomb;
Now I know the time has come:
What goes on up is coming on down,
Goes around and comes around. [whereislogic: of course, that doesn't count for the kids that got shot; 800 law enforcement officers were present, hmmm, it seems the "for protection" style arguments aren't quite panning out. Again: wake up! Please, for the sake of your children at least. Half of those that got shot were kids. You wanna throw in another 'guns don't kill people, yada yada'? It's time to get upset about these type of arguments. Well, some time ago actually.]

“So we should no longer be children, tossed about as by waves and carried here and there by every wind of teaching by means of the trickery of men, by means of cunning in deceptive schemes.” (Ephesians 4:14)

“However, the inspired word clearly says that in later times some will fall away from the faith, paying attention to misleading inspired statements and teachings of demons, by means of the hypocrisy of men who speak lies, whose conscience is seared as with a branding iron.”(1 Timothy 4:1,2).

Stop parotting their arguments and points please. Is that really too much to ask for? After all...
...

Forgot one there (also quoted earlier in this thread). Put just under 1 Timothy 4:1,2.

“and because of them the way of the truth will be spoken of abusively. Also, they will greedily exploit you with counterfeit words. But their judgment, decided long ago, is not moving slowly, and their destruction is not sleeping.” (2 Peter 2:2,3)

Another edit (I bolded it, I definitely didn't get my 4 hours for editing):

From the wikipage linked earlier:

Kansas City Chiefs quarterback Patrick Mahomes wrote on social media that he was "praying for Kansas City".

Ah, they're such good listeners to God, I'm sure he'll listen too. (empty platitudes)

Yeah, sarcasm again. Last time. What else can I try? Or any person that actually cares?

Jesus: “All the works they do, they do to be seen by men. . . hypocrites!” (Matthew 23:5,13)

FYI: God doesn't listen to insincere prayers that are just for show. (“Also, when you pray, do not act like the hypocrites, for they like to pray standing in the synagogues and on the corners of the main streets to be seen by men. Truly I say to you, they have their reward in full. But when you pray, go into your private room and, after shutting your door, pray to your Father who is in secret. Then your Father who looks on in secret will repay you.” Matt 6:5,6; and don't go anouncing it to the world that you did so either, obviously, then you didn't get it, you're not listening, you're not hearing, you're not obeying; you are being a hypocrite when claiming to be Christian, a follower of Christ, who said this.)

Let's get the 'otherwise it would have been worse' style arguments out of the way as well, since that one was already made in this thread as well, so no need to repeat/parrot again. (by Nofear51, a rather ironic accountname, and ScarletDarkness)

I just turned on CNN, BBC News and Euronews, seems they've moved on already. 'Nothing to see here.' 'Go back to sleep.'

The Dutch article on our state news (propaganda) website now mentions some statistics from last year. Last year, on average, there were 2 mass shootings per day in the US (counting a shooting incident with at least 4 wounded or deaths as a mass shooting).

That number is so high, it is hard to believe or fathom.

Why So Many Violent Crimes Now? (Awake!—2003)

...

Easy Access to Destructive Weapons

As mentioned in the preceding article, a lone gunman in Tasmania, Australia, killed 35 people. He wounded 19 others. The man was armed with military-style semiautomatic weapons. This led many to conclude that easy access to such weapons is another factor in the rise of violent crimes.

One report shows that there were only 32 gun murders in Japan in 1995, most involving gangsters killed by other gangsters. In contrast, the United States had more than 15,000 gun murders. Why the difference? Japan’s stringent gun ownership laws have been cited by some as a reason.

Since I don't want to deprive you of the other reasons or answers to the "why" question in the article above, I'll quote some more below. But first, something from the preceding page.

Violent Crime—What Is Happening? (Awake!—2003)

FRANK and Gabriella strolled along the Oregon, U.S.A., seashore in the early morning hours, watching the sunrise. They had no inkling of what was about to happen. Minutes later, they were both dead, shot in the head at close range. Was it vengeance? Or jealousy? Neither. The gunman, a stranger, fulfilled a fantasy​—he wanted to know what it felt like to kill someone. [whereislogic: remember my remark earlier in this thread concerning the topic of shooting as a hobby and family quality time? "I'm sure it's quite the thrill." It's on this page, just below the video about "Target shooting" against those evil soda cans. A real threat those cans.]

“On Sunday 28th April 1996 Martin Bryant won the attention of the Western world by having the time of his life. Shooting everyone he met as he wandered through Port Arthur, Tasmania, he achieved a wonderful thrill of exultation and power.” (A Study of Our Decline, by Philip Atkinson) He also caused the deaths of 35 people!

...

A Different Type of Crime?

Crime has been with us for centuries, but the types cited above cause people to exclaim: “Why? How could anyone even think of doing such a thing?” Although common crimes, like thievery or fraud, may not turn many heads, there is an increasing category of deeds that grabs media attention and causes people to say to themselves, ‘This is senseless! What is happening to this world?’

These crimes are different. They are often shocking and vicious in nature. As in the examples above, they are usually committed against innocent people who do not know the perpetrators. In addition, there often seems to be no obvious motive to these violent crimes. The list of mindless acts goes on and on.

In April 1999 in Colorado, U.S.A., 2 students killed 12 students and a teacher before killing themselves in a school shooting. ...

...

All of this causes many to think: ‘What is happening? Was it like this before? What could be behind such awful crimes? What hope is there for reducing or eliminating such vicious crimes?’ The following articles will deal with these and other questions.

Why So Many Violent Crimes Now? (Awake!—2003)

ALL crimes are evil. But mindless or purposeless crimes are harder to understand. The fact that they are often without an obvious motive baffles investigators. ...

...

... Psychologist Gerard Bailes made this comment: “It turns the world into a totally alien, dangerous place in which we cannot predict what is going to happen.”

Why Do They Do It?

There is no one factor that explains all the varied acts of senseless violence. What makes some crimes more difficult to understand is their irrational nature. For example, it is hard to comprehend why a person would walk up to total strangers and stab them to death or why someone would drive by a house and shoot at random.

Some claim that violence is inherent in people. Others argue that senseless crimes cannot be explained as an unavoidable part of human nature.​—See the box “Doomed to Violence?”

Let's go there right now, cause here is where evolutionary mythology and lies by evolutionary propagandists comes into the picture as well (I think I already addressed it in this thread, but I'm not sure).

DOOMED TO VIOLENCE?

Some argue that the propensity for violence or killing has always been inborn in humans. Supporters of evolution maintain that we come from wild animals and have simply inherited their violent characteristics. Such theories would leave us doomed to an endless cycle of violence from which there is no hope of escape.

However, there is much evidence to the contrary. The theories mentioned above do not explain why in different cultures there are wide variations in frequency and types of violence. They do not indicate why in some cultures responding with violence seems to be the norm, whereas other societies report very little violence, with murder almost nil. Psychoanalyst Erich Fromm exposed cracks in the theory that we inherit aggression from primates by pointing out that although some of them are violent as a result of physical needs or for self-protection, humans are the only ones who have been known to kill for the sheer thrill of killing.

In their book The Will to Kill​—Making Sense of Senseless Murder, Professors James Alan Fox and Jack Levin state: “Some individuals are more prone to violence than others, yet free will still exists. The will to kill, though governed by numerous internal and external forces, still includes choice and human decision making, and thus accountability and culpability.”

I think I actually quoted that box in this thread (if I did quote it, it's more likely from the article: War—Why? (Awake!—1986); where the same evolutionary lies, pseudoscience, are quoted and discussed). Returning to where I left off in the article before:

Many experts believe that there are a host of factors and circumstances that are catalysts inclining people to commit irrational, violent acts. A report published by the FBI (Federal Bureau of Investigation) Academy in the United States goes so far as to say: “Homicide is not the act of a sober, sane, individual.” Some authorities would take issue with the wording of that statement. Nevertheless, many agree with what it implies. For some reason the thinking of those committing senseless crimes is not normal. Something has affected their reasoning to the point that they will do the unthinkable. What contributing factors move people to do such things? Let us look at several possibilities that experts have mentioned.

Breakdown of Family Life

...

Hate Groups and Cults

...

The Mass Media and Violence [whereislogic: and since that's a big one that I mentioned before concerning the entertainment industry hypocritically glorifying guns and violence, even marketing some guns by name...]

Some point to evidence that various forms of modern communication may encourage aggressive conduct. Regular exposure to violence depicted on television, in movies, in video games, and on the Internet is said to desensitize the conscience and inspire violent crimes. Dr. Daniel Borenstein, president of the American Psychiatric Association, stated: “At this time there are more than 1,000 studies based on more than 30 years of research demonstrating a causal connection between media violence and aggressive behavior in some children.” Before a U.S. Senate committee, Dr. Borenstein testified: “We are convinced that repeated exposure to entertainment violence in all its forms has significant public health implications.”​—See the box “Computer-Game Violence—​A Doctor’s Viewpoint.”

Specific cases are often cited to show that this is true. In the case of the triggerman involved in the cold-blooded murder of a couple watching the sunrise on a beach, mentioned in the preceding article, prosecutors presented evidence that the thrill killing was inspired by repeated viewing of a violent movie. In a school shooting where 15 people were killed, the two student perpetrators were said to have spent hours each day playing violent video games. Additionally, they repeatedly watched movies glorifying violence and killing.

Drugs

...

Easy Access to Destructive Weapons

...

People’s Inability to Cope

...

The Bible’s Answer

The Bible helps us to understand what is happening now and why people act in such extreme ways. It accurately describes attitudes we commonly see. For example, the list found at 2 Timothy 3:3, 4 states that people would have “no natural affection” and that they would be “without self-control, fierce, without love of goodness,” and “headstrong.” In another Bible book, Jesus was quoted as saying: “The love of the greater number will cool off.”​—Matthew 24:12. [whereislogic: I quoted 2 Timothy 3:1-5 before]

The Bible says: “In the last days critical times hard to deal with will be here.” (2 Timothy 3:1) Yes, what we see is evidence that we are living at the end of the present system of things. Conditions, along with people’s attitudes, are on a downhill slide. Can we expect an immediate solution? The Bible answers: “Wicked men and impostors will advance from bad to worse.”​—2 Timothy 3:13. [whereislogic: quoted that one as well, the rest says: "misleading and being misled" or "deluding and deluding themselves" from another translation. Which has to do with this phenomenon of parroting bad arguments and points, in a rather stubborn and 'preaching to the choir' manner.]

Does this mean that mankind is doomed to an endless cycle of vicious violence and escalating crime? Let us examine that question in our next article.

A Realistic Solution—Is It Possible? (Awake!—2003)

This episode is one of the main reasons why Stargate SG-1 is my favorite show. It shows how a more conservative minded military person like Jack O'Neill, comes to realize that Daniel Jackson was right (to ask some pertinent questions) all along, even though he's being very stubborn about it almost the whole episode, not wanting to hear what points Daniel is making or wants to make (stiff necked fool that he is, talking about Jack). It also brings to fruition the relationship between Jack and Daniel, and their mutual respect and willingness to hear eachother out, take eachother seriously, and reason with eachother in a reasonable manner. You really need to watch the whole episode to better understand what I'm talking about and why this is one of my favorite episodes in that show (even though the show promotes and markets the P90 gun by name).



I sadly can't find some of the best scenes at the dinner table, which are quite funny as well.

It's also nice to see Odo from Star Trek DS9, my 3rd favorite show (if you count Stargate Atlantis as a continuation of Stargate SG-1):

Stargate SG-1 (10)
Stargate Atlantis (9.5)
Babylon 5 (9.1)
Star Trek DS9 (9)

The subject of (nationalistic, or pro-military) propaganda comes up a lot in Babylon 5 (with organizations like the Nightwatch). The subject of 'the love of self' and 'the love of money' (the first 2 character attributes listed in 2 Timothy 3:1-5 concerning "the last days") comes up a lot in Star Trek DS9, with the Ferengi, who actually behave much like the humans in this world (those 2 weren't listed first for nothing):

And that's why guns (and gun ownership) is promoted so much in the US, and why politicians won't step in as they say they care (and will not pinpoint the crux of the problem, pretending it isn't clear by raising the same question again and again: "why?" Without answering correctly, let's debate it some more cause it's so "complex"), it's all about the money (and being "lovers of pleasures rather than lovers of God", shooting being a hobby and a thrill, the primary reason so many people in the US own guns, and shoot cans for "protection"; I was quoting from 2 Timothy 3:1-5 again). You know what, it's worth repeating in it's entirety anyway, 2 Timothy 3:1-9 (between brackets is mine):

But know this, that in the last days critical times hard to deal with will be here. For men will be lovers of themselves, lovers of money, boastful, haughty, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, disloyal, having no natural affection, not open to any agreement, slanderers [we have had some of that in this thread as well], without self-control, fierce, without love of goodness, betrayers, headstrong, puffed up with pride, lovers of pleasures rather than lovers of God, having an appearance of godliness but proving false to its power [I discussed some of that in my latest commentary concerning prayer]; and from these turn away. From among these arise men who slyly work their way into households and captivate weak women loaded down with sins, led by various desires, always learning and yet never able to come to an accurate knowledge of truth.

Now in the way that Janʹnes and Jamʹbres opposed Moses, so these also go on opposing the truth. Such men are completely corrupted in mind[i.e. mentally diseased, see rendering in the article about "understanding" that I used, which was concerning 1 Tim. 6:3-5, about those "obsessed with arguments and debates"], disapproved as regards the faith. Nevertheless, they will make no further progress, for their folly will be very plain to all, as it was with those two men.

Ah well... (I'll skip a bit more this time)
Understanding (Aid to Bible Understanding)

...

RELATIONSHIP TO KNOWLEDGE AND WISDOM

... The “understanding heart is one that searches for knowledge”; it is not satisfied with a mere superficial view but seeks to get the full picture. (Prov. 15:14) Knowledge must become ‘pleasant to one’s very soul’ if discernment is to safeguard one from perversion and deception.—Prov. 2:10, 11; 18:15. [whereislogic: like those pro-gun arguments and marketing/propaganda]

... The person who is rightly motivated seeks understanding, not out of mere curiosity or to exalt himself, but for the very purpose of acting in wisdom; ‘wisdom is before his face.’ (Prov. 17:24) He is not like those in the apostle Paul’s day who assumed to be teachers of others but were “puffed up with pride, not understanding anything,” unwisely letting themselves become “mentally diseased over questionings and debates about words,” things that produce disunity and a host of bad results.—1 Tim. 6:3-5; see KNOWLEDGE; WISDOM.

1 Timothy 6:3-5

If any man teaches another doctrine and does not agree with the wholesome instruction, which is from our Lord Jesus Christ, nor with the teaching that is in harmony with godly devotion, he is puffed up with pride and does not understand anything. He is obsessed with arguments and debates about words. These things give rise to envy, strife, slander, wicked suspicions, constant disputes about minor matters by men who are corrupted in mind and deprived of the truth, thinking that godly devotion is a means of gain.

It happens even to the most intelligent (cunning) among us:

I know, it's getting repetitive. But so are the pro-gun arguments and points. A red flag for propaganda (if what is repeated is not "the wholesome instruction, which is from our Lord Jesus Christ"; which is a good way to combat propaganda if you repeat that as well, training/conditioning the mind and heart in the right way).

Fraud in Science—A Greater Fraud (Awake!—1990)

...

“EVOLUTION is a fact.” This is the standard confession of faith that assures the scientific community of your orthodoxy. And for public consumption, the claim is often added: ‘It has been proved so often that there is no longer a need to repeat the proof.’ Very convenient, especially since the evolutionist has no proof to repeat. Yet, for years the statement has been made again and again, like some mystical chant: “Evolution is a fact.”

In April last year, in a book review in The New York Times Book Review magazine, biologist Richard Dawkins wrote: “We are here talking about the fact of evolution itself, a fact that is proved utterly beyond reasonable doubt.” He then said that to consider creation “in biology classes is about as sensible as to claim equal time for the flat-​earth theory in astronomy classes. Or, as someone has pointed out, you might as well claim equal time in sex education classes for the stork theory. It is absolutely safe to say that if you meet somebody who claims not to believe in evolution, that person is ignorant, stupid or insane (or wicked, but I’d rather not consider that).”

Stephen Jay Gould wrote an essay on evolution in the January 1987 issue of the science magazine Discover. Intent on overkill, in this five-​page article he proclaimed evolution to be a fact 12 times! Excerpts from the article follow:

...

At one point in the article, Gould said: “I don’t want to sound like a shrill dogmatist shouting ‘rally round the flag boys,’ but biologists have reached a consensus . . . about the fact of evolution.” But really, does that not sound like “a shrill dogmatist shouting ‘rally round the flag boys’”?

Molecular biologist Michael Denton referred to this glib talk about evolution’s being a fact and dismissed it with these words: “Now of course such claims are simply nonsense.” It’s much more than nonsense. It’s fraud. It deceives and misrepresents. It perverts the truth to induce another to part with something of value. Newspapers, radio, TV, nature series, science programs, schoolbooks from second grade on​—all drum this evolution-​is-a-fact litany into the public mind. ...

[I skipped a paragraph here] Evolutionists today use the same Pharisaic approach: ‘Believe as we do,’ they say. ‘All competent scientists believe evolution. All intelligent people believe it. Only the uneducated and the ignorant don’t believe it.’ By such intimidation and mental bullying, masses of people are herded into the evolutionists’ camp. They know nothing of the weaknesses and inadequacies of evolutionary theory or its unsound speculations and hypothesized impossibilities​—such as the origin of life from inanimate chemicals.* [whereislogic: called "the chemical evolution theory of life", a.k.a. "the hypothesis of abiogenesis" and "spontaneous generation"; a reminder for those who have been taught the misleading argument that 'evolution has nothing to do with abiogenesis/the origin of life'. For the footnote from the article you'll just have to click the link.] So they are swept along by the repetitious mantras recited by evolution’s propagandizers. The theory becomes dogma, its preachers become arrogant, and dissenters reap disdainful abuse. The tactics work. They did in Jesus’ day; they do today.

This four-​word propaganda line, ‘Evolution is a fact,’ is little (little in content), is a simple sentence (easily said), and is repeated persistently (even 12 times in one short essay). It qualifies as effective brainwashing propaganda, and with repetition it reaches the status of a slogan​—and slogans everywhere repeated are soon programmed into brains and tripped off tongues with little critical examination or skeptical dissection. Once a theory has been sloganized into community thinking, it no longer requires proof, and any who dissent are scorned. If such dissenters present rational refutation of the slogan’s validity, they are especially irritating and subjected to the only available response, namely, ridicule. [we've had some of that in this thread as well]

Evolutionists that specialize in the Big Lie that ‘Evolution is a fact’ also take another leaf out of Hitler’s book, for in it he said of the masses he controlled: “With the primitive simplicity of their minds they will more easily fall victims to a great lie than to a small one, since they themselves perhaps also lie sometimes in little things, but would certainly still be too much ashamed of too great lies.” A book of popular quotations lists this one among them: “If you tell a big enough lie and tell it often enough, many will believe it.” The one evolutionists tell is apparently big enough, and it’s certainly told often enough, for millions believe it.

It is a lie that is also a fraud because it is “an act of deceiving or misrepresenting,” an “intentional perversion of truth in order to induce another to part with something of value.” Teaching that man’s ancestors are animals, starting with some microbe and ending with some ape, evolutionists have “exchanged the truth of God for the lie.” By this lie, they induce many to part with something of great value​—their faith in God as their Creator.​—Romans 1:25.

This fraud does terrible damage. Its victims feel freed from the Creator’s laws, and they become a law to themselves: ‘No right or wrong. Fulfill all fleshly desires. Do your own thing. No need for any guilt trips.’ Enter the moral breakdown, unrestrained and full-​blown. Parted from their Creator and the true values of the Bible, they become spiritually impoverished and end up “like unreasoning animals born naturally to be caught and destroyed.”​—2 Peter 2:12.

“Propaganda will not lead to success unless a fundamental principle is considered with continually sharp attention: it has to confine itself to little and to repeat this eternally. Here, too, persistency, as in so many other things in this world, is the first and the most important condition for success. . . . The masses . . . will lend their memories only to the thousandfold repetition of the most simple ideas. A change must never alter the content of what is being brought forth by propaganda, but in the end it always has to say the same. Thus the slogan has to be illuminated from various sides, but the end of every reflection has always and again to be the slogan itself.”​—Mein Kampf, by Adolf Hitler. [whereislogic: 'guns don't kill people, yada yada'; 'otherwise it would have been worse, yada yada'; "guns protect the innocent", quoting Nofear51 directly. First response in this thread.]

There's also a box below that with examples of what was described in the 1st paragraph.