Retired U.S. Army colonel Douglas Macgregor: "Israeli self-destruction in Gaza"

originally posted by: Mawdano

Afghanistan is a militarized-radicalized state since Soviet fights. It will take long time to fix. That's what is happening in Gaza. The more civilians killed, the more Afgan-like it's going to become. That is why either support the Palestinian people instead of bombing them OR nuke them because bombing them will support Hamas in getting more recruits.

Afghanistan was like that long before the Russians by like 1000+ years. No one has created anyone. Russia didn't create the Taliban, the US didn't create ISIS, Saudi didn't create the main groups in Yemen, Israel didn't create Hamas, and neither did Iran. All were here for a very long time, long before any of our countries came into existence. They all have levels of religious, cultural, and social extremism while all are endlessly trying to be top dog in the process.

To them that is just their chosen way of life, to us it is horrendous and unacceptable, but as I have said many times I'm not sure we can judge them and expect them to change to something we think is right.

a reply to: Xtrozero

Did you see Biden when he said that USA/KSA cooperated to create ISIS?

originally posted by: FullHeathen

Bye bye Incirlik and Izmir Air Station?

This means that after 20 years since the signing of the treaty which was in 1949, thus 1969, any member state that wishes to leave just has to inform the United States that it wants to leave, and then after a year it formally leaves.

I think Tuirkey can just say see ya and give the middle finger for a year. They are close to Russia anyway, so I have always wondered why they are in NATO. I think the reason is more to keep control of them than they being a part of the anti-Russian team. Just like the Treaty of Lausanne was the final one put into place to control Turkey.

originally posted by: gortex
a reply to: MoreCoyoteAngels

Israel is destroying itself and us along with it , your flippant remark may gain you stars but it also shows your ignorance of the seriousness of the current situation.

and your pointless appeal shows you have delusions of grandeur. They are going to do what they are going to do, regardless of your feelz.

a reply to: Xtrozero

To them that is just their chosen way of life, to us it is horrendous and unacceptable, but as I have said many times I'm not sure we can judge them and expect them to change to something we think is right.

A settler state will produce the kind of ignorance you'd need to bring down your own state with plain barbarism.

"What happened to the Canaanites?"

What happened to them, and why is it happening again?

originally posted by: Mawdano

Did you see Biden when he said that USA/KSA cooperated to create ISIS?

Well, I guess if Biden said it I was wrong... This is not a point I'm going to debate as you and maybe others pull snippets of what one person said or another. I spent years over there and the thing is anyone even 5 degrees from some original start is long dead. Taliban are just a warlord group like all the others, but they happen to be religious extremists too, that is what makes them different, for example.

ISIS formed when smaller extremist groups joined together, but the extremism has been there forever. The typical goal is to march along and kill all the men and just take over their land, women, and children. It's like they just say, I'm now your husband and all this is mine. The other part is more like Hamas which has much of this other mentality of we will just take, but in their case, they will get a fast pass to heaven if they die while killing Jews, their mothers and families are rewarded with money, blessings, and cheers from the community, who would not want that? We are in 2023 so those fighting today were like 10 in 2010, so the Moques are the breeders of this reality and extremism and that also wasn't created by foreign influences as they all fight for power. After the removal of Sadam the Sunni and Shea started to kill each other on a massive scale...it doesn't take the US to create 1000 years of hate.

But hey if Biden says...lol

a reply to: Xtrozero

Yes, Biden and other officials from coalition have given details of creating Islamic terrorism plan. Sure there are people who act on their own but official funding and help makes it global problem.

a reply to: Xtrozero

Treaty of Lausanne

Reading up on that now.
Wow.
No Kurdistan
No prosecution for Armenian genocide
Deportations and population exchanges between Greece and Turkey

==========
Makes me wonder: Should countries make treaties outside of U.N. auspices?

UNRWA pretty much leaves Palestinian refugees as permanent refugees. If Arab states and Israel could make a treaty about relocating Palestinians and granting citizenship in Arab countries, would the U.N. go along or fight it?

Kind of late. Should have been done decades ago.

Here we are: woulda, coulda, shoulda.

a reply to: gortex

It makes even more sense when you hone in on the political dynamics at play here:

A 30-year veteran of the Israel Defense Forces — and former head of the country's military intelligence unit — accused Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu of caring more about his own political "survival" than the actual war he's waging in Gaza.

Speaking to an Israeli radio station, 103FM, in an interview that aired Thursday, retired Maj. Gen. Amos Malka said Netanyahu was only looking out for himself.

"His judgment in the conduct of the war is flawed and leans towards the blame game and a plan to evade responsibility," Malka said.

Malka served in the IDF for three decades, retiring in 2002 after serving as its director of defense intelligence. Last year, a state news agency in Iran identified Malka as one of five Israelis it said were targets for retaliation over Israel's assassination of Iranian military officials.

Netanyahu is focused on his own political 'survival,' not the war in Gaza, says ex-IDF intelligence chief

McGregor was correct about Ukraine and he's correct about Israel. Funny how the op only now sees him as a legitimate source...

Anyway.

This is an unsustainable path for Israel and America. We are unable to fend off Russia in Ukraine and we won't be able to fend off the Muslim world in Israel. There can be peace it's just not down the barrel of a gun.

Hamas didn't occur inside a vacuum therefore we must address the issues that got us here first. The issue is for Israel to exist in the first place they had to relocate(apartheid) a few million people.


This obviously isn't an attempt to justify the recent violence from Hamas. But I'm not going to ignore what Israel has done to bring us to this point either. I denounce the violence from both sides and currently Israel is conducting a genocide against people many of whom are non-combatants, being housed in what can best be described as on open air prison camp.

Saying "they can just leave" is like saying to a homeowner who has squatters "you can just leave". They will never be let back if they leave. You don't want more people flooding our border?

Stop advocating for American foreign policies that displace millions of people! Only to turn around an complain about it like some uneducated moron..

We call a kid throwing a rock at a cop in Hong Kong a protester.

We call a kid throwing a rock at a soldier in Gaza a terrorist.

I struggle to see the difference...

a reply to: JAY1980

McGregor was correct about Ukraine and he's correct about Israel. Funny how the op only now sees him as a legitimate source...

So you think I have to agree with everything he says if I agree with something he says ?

Nobody is in that category in my book.

originally posted by: network dude

originally posted by: gortex
a reply to: MoreCoyoteAngels

Israel is destroying itself and us along with it , your flippant remark may gain you stars but it also shows your ignorance of the seriousness of the current situation.

and your pointless appeal shows you have delusions of grandeur. They are going to do what they are going to do, regardless of your feelz.

And what part of what I posted equals my "delusions of grandeur" ?
Israel is destroying itself and the remark was flippant , ignorance is as ignorance does.

originally posted by: putnam6
It escalated to a different level now, the IDF hit the Bentley and Benz dealer, Luxury One which had just opened in Gaza last August.

x.com...

So nobody sees the incredible irony of a Luxury One high-end Benz, Bentley, and BMW etc. dealership in the "open-air prison" of Gaza.

a reply to: gortex

This general was a flunkee. Take a look at what he participated in along with his support for Communists. Just because he was a general doesnt mean he was loyal to the USA. Hes a traitor to the United States. I will intentionally NOT attach links as look at what he has said anout Ukraine, Russia and others.

Fox News’ Invasion Expert Is a Trump-Appointed Putin Propagandist Who Thinks Russia Is Being ‘Too Gentle’

MacGregor

He’s turned to Douglas MacGregor — a former Army colonel and Trump appointee with a history of racism — to help answer that question and generally make sense of what’s happening overseas.

a reply to: JAY1980

There was barely a population there prior to Isreal. It was just desert unlivable until they brought in irrigation. What you call Palestinians is Jordanians that cane to Israel seeking work. The Arabs that owned land still do yes they have Arab land owners in Israel but they call themselves Israeli citizens.

Gaza was taken from Egypt during the six day war it used to be considered part of the Sinai.in fact Israel offered to return it to Egypt however they declined. The reason is Hamas no Arab country wants to deal with them they are far to radical


As far as choices Israel only has one irradicate Hamas or they will be attacked again and again. Hamas doesn't care about Palestinians they spend their money on weopons instead of infrastructure .

They rely on the good will of Israel to even feed the people in gaza. Israel supplies food water and construction materials Hamas is supposed to pay for this however they don't. And this is the reason Egypt doesn't want ro open its gates to gaza they are afraid if they start supplying gaza that Israel will quit putting them on the hook to continue like Israel has to. Bottom line is even the PA doesn't want to deal with Hamas. Every one knows they are terrorists that hide behind gazan families they use mosques and hospitals as basses to attack and when a rocket launcher is taken out they have so many stored there that it takes out a couple of blocks. Which severly increases casualties.

a reply to: dragonridr

I won't reply to your claims because they are simply hoax. I'll let Israel prime minister reply

There was barely a population there prior to Isreal. It was just desert unlivable until they brought in irrigation

a reply to: dragonridr

Pointed that out time and time again to people.....some people just don't want to know though.

No Arab/Muslim country wants to inherit the Palestinian problem.
Egypt are terrified if they opened the border up that Hamas will infiltrate into their and carry out attacks on Israel from Egyptian territory.
They point blank refused the offer of the return of Gaza.

Israel provides enormous amounts of aid and supplies to Gaza.

20% of the Israeli population are Arab/Palestinian and many have risen to positions of power and prominence.
Many serve with honour and pride in the Israeli Armed Services, Police and Security Forces.

Its Hamas who refuse to consider peaceful co-existence and a Two State Solution and who point blank refuse to give up their clearly and often re-iterated statement that they intend to bring about the destruction of the Israeli state and rid 'Palestine' of all Jews by whatever means necessary.

a reply to: Freeborn

Hamas thinks that Palestinian people have the right to defend their land. Although Hamas doesn't represent the Palestinian people and it is an illegal organization but any nation have the right to fight occupation.

The Hamas problem on the other hand is Israeli created problem



Former Israeli officials such as Brig. Gen. Yitzhak Segev, who was the Israeli military governor in Gaza in the early 1980s. Segev later told a New York Times reporter that he had helped finance the Palestinian Islamist movement as a “counterweight” to the secularists and leftists of the Palestine Liberation Organization and the Fatah party, led by Yasser Arafat (who himself referred to Hamas as “a creature of Israel.”)

“The Israeli government gave me a budget,” the retired brigadier general confessed, “and the military government gives to the mosques.”

“Hamas, to my great regret, is Israel’s creation,” Avner Cohen, a former Israeli religious affairs official who worked in Gaza for more than two decades, told the Wall Street Journal in 2009. Back in the mid-1980s, Cohen even wrote an official report to his superiors warning them not to play divide-and-rule in the Occupied Territories, by backing Palestinian Islamists against Palestinian secularists. “I … suggest focusing our efforts on finding ways to break up this monster before this reality jumps in our face,” he wrote.

They didn’t listen to him. And Hamas, as I explain in the fifth installment of my short film series for The Intercept on blowback, was the result. To be clear: First, the Israelis helped build up a militant strain of Palestinian political Islam, in the form of Hamas and its Muslim Brotherhood precursors; then, the Israelis switched tack and tried to bomb, besiege, and blockade it out of existence.

While this information has been accessible for quite some time, no one has explained it as effectively as our own Ron Paul back in the day. He revealed how the United States and Israel played a role in the creation of Hamas as a countermeasure against Yasser Arafat, the Palestinian political leader and chairman of the Palestine Liberation Organization (PLO).

revolver.news...


Israel got what they have paid for, and not one is responsible for the Hamas problem but the terrorist funder state of Israel.

a reply to: Mawdano

Quite possibly so.

But the reality of the situation in the here and now is that Hamas are carrying out brutal and barbaric attacks on the Israeli state.
They are carrying out indiscriminate attacks on civilian populations quite often from locations situated close to, inside or underneath places like schools, hospitals and houses.

Hamas rules Gaza, legally or illegally is irrelevant - they are in power and control.
They operate without opposition in Gaza and resist all attempts at mediation and absolutely refuse to recognise Israel's right to exist and will do ANYTHING using whatever means necessary and possible to drive all Jews out of the land it thinks belongs to them.

No long term solution will be possible as long as they are a viable entity.

I'm not naive enough to think Israel is whiter than white and free from any blame or responsibility but we have to be realistic and deal with the here and now, not what could have been or even should have been.

The situation is that Hamas is an insidious organisation and are 100% committed to bringing about an Islamic/Arab and Jew free Palestinian state stretching from the River Jordan to The Mediterranean Sea - nothing else will be considered.
They care nothing about the amount of death and destruction, be it Palestinian or Israeli, that will result in bringing about this aim and goal.

Hamas has to be eliminated one way or another if there is to be a long term peaceful resolution.

Once that is achieved then maybe it will be time for more introspective finger pointing and apportioning of blame.

And lets not forget other Arab/Muslim states culpability in all this.

a reply to: Freeborn

I don't have a disagreement with you on this point.

I just would like to repeat that Israel should be held responsible for creating Hamas, and protect the civilians. I don't mean Palestinian civilians only, but Israeli too.

The Israeli government is absolute failure in protecting both. This government should be kicked.

Personally, I think a two states solution is a "good" solution, and Hamas being not willing to listen to Israeli offers is something I find to be odd. BUT the way Israeli government behave is unacceptable.