out of curiosity, are we 100% sure man is responsible for climate change?

I ask this as in the recent past, there was some ambiguity. it wasn't 100%, but they were pretty sure.
So when we make policy, is it really a good idea to make policy based on an unknown variable? The climate is a complex thing. The Sun, the moon, the oceans, the wind, the tectonic plates, animal migratory patterns, all could have either a small or a large effect on the climate.

We are coming out of an ice age. Or as our government states, we are still in one.

Like all the others, the most recent ice age brought a series of glacial advances and retreats. In fact, we are technically still in an ice age.

link to climate.gov

And if you look at the map in the link, it shows where the ice was at the peak of the last ice age. If you notice the details, you may see that the land mass was greater as well, and when the ice sheets melted, the ocean level raised. All this happened, without man's influence. knowing that, and understanding that there could even be factors to this that we never even thought of, can we say with total certainty that we completely understand MAN is responsible for the current warming?

pretty sure the planet's climate has been changing for millions of years
even without humans

originally posted by: network dude
I ask this as in the recent past, there was some ambiguity. it wasn't 100%, but they were pretty sure.
So when we make policy, is it really a good idea to make policy based on an unknown variable? The climate is a complex thing. The Sun, the moon, the oceans, the wind, the tectonic plates, animal migratory patterns, all could have either a small or a large effect on the climate.

We are coming out of an ice age. Or as our government states, we are still in one.

Like all the others, the most recent ice age brought a series of glacial advances and retreats. In fact, we are technically still in an ice age.

link to climate.gov

And if you look at the map in the link, it shows where the ice was at the peak of the last ice age. If you notice the details, you may see that the land mass was greater as well, and when the ice sheets melted, the ocean level raised. All this happened, without man's influence. knowing that, and understanding that there could even be factors to this that we never even thought of, can we say with total certainty that we completely understand MAN is responsible for the current warming?

I guess it depends on whether or not you believe in science or in this case climate science.

Scientists predict global temperature increases from human-made greenhouse gases will continue. Severe weather damage will also increase and intensify.

So when does commons sense prevail? Are rising temperatures worldwide happening? Is weather more severe and increasing in intensity? Are people commenting in unison "This is unprecedented" "It's never been this bad before" "Never seen anything like this before in my long lifetime" "The skies are no longer in alignment".

a reply to: quintessentone
And yet all of these environmental states appeared before and just as severe. There used to be water in death valley. Did the natives cause that with teepee fires?

The short answer is no, we don't know if man is a significant variable.

I think it is common sense that man can have an impact locally, but I am not necessarily convinced it is doing anything globally and to what degree. With that said, I do think we need to be stewards of our environment where feasibly possible so I am not against some regulation. Like all things there is a balance.

The problem is trying to force technology solutions that aren't based in reality. Electric cars are great and a good alternative for some folks. This doesn't mean though we should be regulating v8s out of existence. The free market will determine which is best and adapt as necessary.

Climate has always been changing. Considering we can't reliably predict the weather locally a few days out, I question the accuracy of any models predicting climate change years and decades out on suspect data. There are simply too many variables.

We should certainly be reluctant to make large policy changes based on suspect data. I'd expect robust debate from all sides which we don't seem to be getting.

originally posted by: Halfswede
a reply to: quintessentone
And yet all of these environmental states appeared before and just as severe. There used to be water in death valley. Did the natives cause that with teepee fires?

True, but not at the accelerated rate over a very short period of time, now why is that?

I remember the 1970s as a lot hotter than today , I do not ever remember rain in my 6 weeks of summer holiday bar a quick thunder storm , But I hear rubbish being thrown out from news stations about the hottest year on records . Winter jacket on yesterday and monsoon rain again today

You stick a cup of water in a microwave and it heats up , you blanket microwave energy all over the planet and it heats up , but how do they explain all the other planets heating up ?

a reply to: quintessentone

science and scientist say safe and effective and men can get pregnant and we cause climate change .

All the ones you ever read about or see on TV are paid to make the science say that for an agenda.

If you havent figured that out by now then god help you.

Are we sure 100 men are responsible for climate changes?

a reply to: network dude

I believe that those who were/are pushing "climate change" formerly named "global warming" have already given the answer to this question when they came up with a thousand different lies and deceptions to convince everyone in the world that it was actually real--(Man made).

But they never believed it themselves or they would not have lied about it and deceived so many.

There have been all kinds of doomsday predictions that have not come to fruition. In my 50 year life time I've heard ice age, global faminine, acid rain, ozone layer, and global warming. Global warming of course was rebranded to "climate change" which is so open ended you can't hold anyone accountable since the climate is always changing.

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: Halfswede
a reply to: quintessentone
And yet all of these environmental states appeared before and just as severe. There used to be water in death valley. Did the natives cause that with teepee fires?

True, but not at the accelerated rate over a very short period of time, now why is that?

That is not true. There are many recorded periods of very short and very extreme changes -- even worse than the last few decades.

just some very basic tracking: en.wikipedia.org...#/media/File:Vostok_Petit_data.svg

In particular look at the figure on the right with temp/CO2 etc.

Nothing is 100% certain except for death . I believe there is nothing man can do to change the climate but an all out nuclear ☢️ holocaust. And even that is not 100% certain unless we do it and see the results. a reply to: network dude

One of the main stream papers here in Denmark, just today brought an article that cites a reseach paper from South Korea, the pertains to prove that Earth is off its axis by 78 cm because of ice melting AND humans pumping up water from the ground for consumption.....

And they mean the Geo Pole, not the magnetic pole.

Seriously...

So now, they are saying our water utlilization is directly affecting the water distribution on Earth, to a degree where its causing a wobble.

Have to go find that f'ing article to see who sponsored it!

EDIT

Found it:

Drift of Earth's Pole Confirms Groundwater Depletion as a Significant Contributor to Global Sea Level Rise 1993–2010

This work was supported by the Korea Institute of Marine Science & Technology Promotion (KIMST) grant funded by the Ministry of Ocean Fisheries (RS-2023-00256677; PM23020), and National Research Foundation of Korea (NRF) Grant (No. 2023R1A2C1004899). J.C. is supported by PolyU SHS and LSGI Internal Research Funds, and C.R.W. is supported by NASA Grants 80NSSC22K0906 and 80NSSC20K0820. We appreciate Y. Wada for providing the groundwater depletion model data.

originally posted by: Halfswede

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: Halfswede
a reply to: quintessentone
And yet all of these environmental states appeared before and just as severe. There used to be water in death valley. Did the natives cause that with teepee fires?

True, but not at the accelerated rate over a very short period of time, now why is that?

That is not true. There are many recorded periods of very short and very extreme changes -- even worse than the last few decades.

just some very basic tracking: en.wikipedia.org...#/media/File:Vostok_Petit_data.svg

In particular look at the figure on the right with temp/CO2 etc.

Exactly, due to volcanic activity that can't be attributed to the accelerations today.

originally posted by: flice
One of the main stream papers here in Denmark, just today brought an article that cites a reseach paper from South Korea, the pertains to prove that Earth is off its axis by 78 cm because of ice melting AND humans pumping up water from the ground for consumption.....

And they mean the Geo Pole, not the magnetic pole.

Seriously...

So now, they are saying our water utlilization is directly affecting the water distribution on Earth, to a degree where its causing a wobble.

Have to go find that f'ing article to see who sponsored it!

EDIT

Found it:

Drift of Earth's Pole Confirms Groundwater Depletion as a Significant Contributor to Global Sea Level Rise 1993–2010

This work was supported by the Korea Institute of Marine Science & Technology Promotion (KIMST) grant funded by the Ministry of Ocean Fisheries (RS-2023-00256677; PM23020), and National Research Foundation of Korea (NRF) Grant (No. 2023R1A2C1004899). J.C. is supported by PolyU SHS and LSGI Internal Research Funds, and C.R.W. is supported by NASA Grants 80NSSC22K0906 and 80NSSC20K0820. We appreciate Y. Wada for providing the groundwater depletion model data.

Maybe it is not this or that reason, maybe it is many reasons because we keep ripping the guts out of Mother Earth and that must have an effect.

originally posted by: notcisjustnormal
a reply to: quintessentone

science and scientist say safe and effective and men can get pregnant and we cause climate change .

All the ones you ever read about or see on TV are paid to make the science say that for an agenda.

If you havent figured that out by now then god help you.

Actually with the advancements in genetics men can now create children with DNA from two women and one man, also from two women only. It's only a matter of time that a child could be created from two men's DNA.

God help you in denying the science that tries to warn us to save lives and humanity.

a reply to: network dude

Nope , we are like ants trying to roll a stone uphill , at some point the weight of it is going to crush us.

I believe as we've cleaned the atmosphere of the solar blocking carbon we pumped up there through the industrial revolution and beyond the natural warming we have delayed is coming upon us , frost fairs in London where the Thames would regularly freeze over don't happen now for a reason.

a reply to: flice

This image is from that report I posted...
If anyone with more knowledge would help calm it down a bit?

Are they suggesting that the axis shift is causing a trend for the Geo Pole to move towards that point? :O



Link to research paper again:
Drift of Earths Pole

a reply to: network dude

They can only speculate that man is responsible for climate changes.
I submit they are full of crap though.

How long has modern man been around? How far can we go back in recorded history to see if the climate change theory is even possible?

Industrialization that generates any sort of pollutants has only been around for maybe 150-200 years, if that long.
Coal burning, oil burning etc.

Man’s modern recorded history has only been a blink on the planetary history scale.

Is pollution a problem? It sure is but not to the point they make it out to be.