Hellfire is a Lie

a reply to: Topcraft

I tend to agree as the book was written and interpreted by humans.

originally posted by: Topcraft
a reply to: Blue_Jay33

Believe what you wish.

Edit: Mind if I ask what Bible you use?

I typically quote from Biblehub, I try to capture the bible version that best captures the point I am trying to make.
For example Matthew 24:14

a reply to: ThirdEyeofHorus

The death of the soul is confusing to some, because if it returns to God's memory it's like it's still alive in a way to God, but it isn't alive at all.
But it is 100% dependent on God recreating a body and reviving it's soul in the coming resurrection.

To make it easier to understand, imagine you die, but your memories and personality are stored in a massive computer bank, the DNA of your body is also stored. You are then cloned from the DNA and redownloaded with the memories 300 years in the future when all the technology is available. Science fiction has already showed us this.
You simply are not alive in those 300 years until you take your first breath in that new body.
Similarly the billions of souls sleeping in God's memory will not be alive again until they takes their first breath.
Spiritual Cryogenics with no physical body.

a reply to: randomuser

The Threat of Hellfire was a Scare Tactic used by some in the Catholic Church to Keep the Sinners from getting to Out of Hand .

For those trying to say Catholics didn't believe in hell, my grandmother was a Catholic that taught the Catechism in school. Hell was definitely part of the teaching.

The Catechism of the Catholic Church affirms the existence of hell and its eternity, stating that the souls of those who die in a state of mortal sin descend into hell immediately after death, where they suffer the punishments of hell, 'eternal fire.

She saw the light so to speak later in life, I owe her a lot for her intelligence and wisdom. She saw some very evil things done by the church, it's why she got out.
But she stayed a Christiaan and started to really study the bible away from the clergies influence.
This is why I say being a Christiaan is more than the title of your current religious organization whatever that is.

I honestly don't think the human race is going to advance until we all realize that we do not know whats next and focus on ourselves working together to survive longer and leave this Planet and inhabit others . The religious thinking is nothing but a road block none of us know whats next that's the reason I'm against the death penalty .

Think if we focus our energy on longevity and space travel , See mind's like Einstein and others need more time think about if he was still alive today all those years of his mind and others .

a reply to: Ravenwatcher

You raise a good point about the death penalty, some people given enough time can return from the dark side and get covered with Jesus sacrifice, and can be spared. But others given many decades stay with the dark side of their humanity, they embrace it and don't even try to fight it, such is the nature of sin.

The bible says those resurrected from death in the coming new world system; that want to disturb the peace and harmony of the new human family will die again, and there is no coming back from this "Second Death", it is oblivion and non-exitance.
Just like a landlord evicts tenants that are disturbing all the other people in a building, after multiple warnings, God with evict people from life on his planet.

originally posted by: Zanti Misfit
a reply to: randomuser

The Threat of Hellfire was a Scare Tactic used by some in the Catholic Church to Keep the Sinners from getting to Out of Hand .

Indeed it was and 'there is no butter in hell'. My favorite sermon scene.

A similar thing is happening today. The religious leaders of Christendom KNOW Jehovah's Witnesses speak and preach the truth, but they lie to them and tell them they are from the Devil..

You don't speak the truth. The fact is, nobody does. There is not a single person alive who knows the true nature of reality, and what actually happens (if anything) after death. Science is working on it, and I know that I would much sooner listen to scientists who form their theories with experimentation and testing, over people who just straight up make things up to explain what they can't understand, and lie in order to manipulate and control people. The bible is full of the latter, and severely lacking in the former.

originally posted by: MetalChickAmy

A similar thing is happening today. The religious leaders of Christendom KNOW Jehovah's Witnesses speak and preach the truth, but they lie to them and tell them they are from the Devil..

You don't speak the truth. The fact is, nobody does. There is not a single person alive who knows the true nature of reality, and what actually happens (if anything) after death. Science is working on it, and I know that I would much sooner listen to scientists who form their theories with experimentation and testing, over people who just straight up make things up to explain what they can't understand, and lie in order to manipulate and control people. The bible is full of the latter, and severely lacking in the former.

If I speak of my own initiative you are correct. 100% agree. I am short-lived and my knowledge and wisdom comes from what I personally observe and see as is yours and everyone else's.

But God can give us wisdom that surpasses human knowledge. And his word is found in the pages of the Bible:

"The very essence of your word is truth, And all your righteous judgments endure forever."-Psalm 119:160.

"My son, if you accept my sayings
And treasure up my commandments,
By making your ear attentive to wisdom
And inclining your heart to discernment;
Moreover, if you call out for understanding
And raise your voice for discernment;
If you keep seeking for it as for silver,
And you keep searching for it as for hidden treasures;
Then you will understand the fear of Jehovah,
And you will find the knowledge of God.
For Jehovah himself gives wisdom;
From his mouth come knowledge and discernment."
-Proverbs 2:1-6.

By paying attention to God's word we learn many truths you cannot anywhere else. Such as of the resurrection hope. That most humans are sleeping in death and will live again in the future paradise on earth under Jesus' kingdom rule.

These are assured promises that will come true.

“Look! The tent of God is with mankind, and he will reside with them, and they will be his people. And God himself will be with them. And he will wipe out every tear from their eyes, and death will be no more, neither will mourning nor outcry nor pain be anymore. The former things have passed away.”-Revelation 21:3-4.

We can trust what God's word says on this matter. He will resurrect the dead, they will live in harmony and peace, in perfection of life, with no more sorrow or pain or sickness or death:

"And the One seated on the throne said: “Look! I am making all things new.” Also he says: “Write, for these words are faithful and true.”-Revelation 21:5.

a reply to: MetalChickAmy

You don't speak the truth. The fact is, nobody does. There is not a single person alive who knows the true nature of reality, and what actually happens (if anything) after death.

I have an illustration for this point, you have a plane full of three hundred people, the plane crashes and they all die.
But each person on that plane had their own perspective of what happens when we die but their perspective is not reality no matter how hard they believe it.
All 300 were of different belief systems.
Christians, for example might think they are going to heaven if they are good, or hell if they are very bad, some might think they are asleep in death waiting a resurrection back to earth.
Muslims, Jews, Hindu's, Buddhists, Sikhs, Satanists, Agnostics, Atheists, evolutionists, and many others all have different idea's.
Here is the thing, one group is 100% correct, when they all die that is the actual reality of death for all 300, not what the other 299 believe.
Your mission, should you choose to accept it, is to find out which group is correct, and when you do you will have found the absolute truth of reality, and as the bible says it will truly set you free.
John 8:32

Then you will know the truth, and the truth will set you free

a reply to: andy06shake

Which begs the question, is kama nothing more than another control construct designed to reatard free thought and expression under punishment of what might happen in the next verse.

I think in general, yogic thought is not to think of karma as punishment(though it may feel like it at times), but rather as the soul learning the lessons of cosmic law. Even in Buddhism, the thought is not how to not feel suffering, but to not be attached to either pain or enjoyment. If you have ever encountered a Buddhist monk, have you not felt the sweetness of their demeanor? In Hindu thought, a yogi or yogini has an objective to not be attached to the fruits of one’s labor.
The ultimate goal is Union with God.
If one is more interested in having a beer at the local saloon, then perhaps the path of of the yogi is not for such individual, and that is the free will of the soul.
I am not going to try to prove to you that this is true, but rather to initiate the seed of thought for the future, whether it be in this life or the next.
In the wisdom of the Baghavad Gita, Krishna appears to Arjuna the charioteer and tells him it is his duty to perform in the war as a charioteer. He also discourses on the soul and the Spirit
human.libretexts.org...(Getty_and_Kwon)/03%3A_India/3.01%3A_The_Bhagav ad_Gita

Just as the soul acquires a childhood body, a youth body, and an old age body during this life; similarly, the soul acquires another body after death. This should not delude the wise.

The Spirit is neither born nor does it die at any time. It does not come into being, or cease to exist. It is unborn, eternal, permanent, and primeval. The Spirit is not destroyed when the body is destroyed.

Death And Transmigration Of Soul Just as a person puts on new garments after discarding the old ones; similarly, the living entity or the individual soul acquires new bodies after casting away the old bodies.

Perhaps you will enjoy to read more rather than to stay in the crustiness of the dogma of dialectical materialism.
Have a good day, mate!🪷

The death of the soul is confusing to some, because if it returns to God's memory it's like it's still alive in a way to God, but it isn't alive at all. But it is 100% dependent on God recreating a body and reviving it's soul in the coming resurrection.

Perhaps I have misunderstood you then. However, I still say the soul does not die just because the body dies. It is clear in the Bhagavad Gita, which I have just posted. It is clearly described that the soul transmigrates but that the Sprit is eternal.
I think it is more a point of semantics. You are still saying the soul dies. The soul does not die, but transmigrates to a newly formed body, until it can gain its Union with God(Hindus call it Nirvana). Until then, though, the soul is not permanent.
The Second Death, on the other hand, is more the point of the soul not gaining the Union, but rather what happens after the continued refusal of the soul to bend the knee to the Universal God. This is my understanding.

a reply to: ThirdEyeofHorus

I'm out and about and into all sorts today buried up to my neck.

You have a good day also.

Many, many years ago I was very interested into the Near Death Experience topic. I started with the happy stories as usual, with people going to Heaven, talking to Jesus or God himself or meeting relatives that had already passed away. However, there are also stories of people going to hell. The description of the horrors, pains and tortures that they saw are not compared to anything here on Earth, not even in the scariest horror movies. As Catholic, I believe in the testimony of Saints such as Faustina or Father Pio who confirm that hell exists (like if what the Bible says is not enough). God doesn't sent us there, we do with our actions.

One of the biggest problems I have accepting the bible in its entirety is the idea of ETERNAL damnation. It's easier to believe punishment is for correcting bad behavior to retrain for good behavior. Punishment is to fix problem behavior. If you love your child you punish to correct and improve them, not to be sadistic. I don't see the point in eternal punishment. Makes more sense to me that we need to learn and grow spiritually and that punishment would be a quick and useful tool.

a reply to: Kammlersgrdaughter77

Good thing then that God does not punish people in hell according to the Bible. What crime, however horrible, could cause a God of love to torture a person endlessly? (1 John 4:8)

Myth 2: The Wicked Suffer in Hell (One Myth Leads to Another)