Ford Joining Budweiser

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: JohnTitorSociety

originally posted by: PorkChop96
a reply to: quintessentone

Usually it's numbers from old game releases that they use to figure out their demographic. But yes, I guess you could say prediction comes into play a little bit

It’s more real time than that. The baseline is certainly “prior releases” but a large AAA game will spend half a million dollars focus testing on social media to see if the game’s demos have changed, are changing or if there is a large untapped subset of TAM.

A sophisticated marketing operation can explain by US zip code a very close approximation to the actual current TAM for an upcoming release and know all of the demographics of the constituent members of the TAM.

I’ve worked on projects where we could definitively say “our addressable market among men is abnormally low in Southeastern Conference states, particularly within 100 miles of a city with an SEC college football program” and our best domestic territories are in New England, Tri-State, Midwest, Pacific States and so on.

Marketing and advertising are not an exact science, but ignoring obvious fundamentals is done at a company’s peril.

With CoD their female base is continually rising, have you bothered to check to see if your female or other sectors of society numbers are rising?

I’m not currently involved in any FPS projects with a near frame timeline, so I haven’t had a reason to get current on the numbers — I was just using some real world data and examples from times I was involved in similar games with similar demographic profiles.

By extension of comparison GTA is way more popular among women than CoD (emergent gameplay is generally more popular with hardcore women gamers than rail shooters), so keeping that in mind does CoD want to bet the farm against one of the most successful game franchises in history (GTA) on a gamble that is more likely to not pay off than pay off?

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: Moon68

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: Moon68

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: PorkChop96
a reply to: quintessentone

That's almost like targeting a single "women" for a beer made mainly for men(allegedly) Just kind of dumb

Had to throw that in the ring, I'll be quiet now

Not just any woman, a Call of Duty "ELITE" champion, there is a difference.

Guess you missed this tidbit?

" Call of Duty has enough women playing to justify a targeted ad campaign for CoD to women who play at 20% TAM)."

I guess you did not read the article at the link. Kelsie 'Kels' Krieg disagrees with you and obviously thinks the whole scene can be improved.

“I truly hope me getting this far on the world stage will encourage other females to get involved - I want to rubbish the stereotypes that people have, especially in such a male-dominated scene.

Again, inclusivity is what consumers want.

Which actually solidifies JTS' statement of " Call of Duty has enough women playing to justify a targeted ad campaign for CoD to women who play at 20% TAM)."

If her becoming "elite" brings more females to CoD, cool, good for her and them. Ultimately though, such targeted ads and her promotion aren't going to move the demographic needle any appreciable distance.

There's no way to tell until they try it. Everything else is prediction and guesswork. Take the Ford F-150 rainbow paint job 2 years ago, did it attract more diverse consumers? I'd say yes indeedie.

“There’s no way to tell until you try it” is a surefire way to get shot down in a board meeting for any proposal that involves a big ad spend based on speculation or even educated guesses. It’s simply not how it works.

a reply to: quintessentone

All most of, if not all of, the companies care about is profit

originally posted by: JohnTitorSociety

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: Moon68

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: Moon68

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: PorkChop96
a reply to: quintessentone

That's almost like targeting a single "women" for a beer made mainly for men(allegedly) Just kind of dumb

Had to throw that in the ring, I'll be quiet now

Not just any woman, a Call of Duty "ELITE" champion, there is a difference.

Guess you missed this tidbit?

" Call of Duty has enough women playing to justify a targeted ad campaign for CoD to women who play at 20% TAM)."

I guess you did not read the article at the link. Kelsie 'Kels' Krieg disagrees with you and obviously thinks the whole scene can be improved.

“I truly hope me getting this far on the world stage will encourage other females to get involved - I want to rubbish the stereotypes that people have, especially in such a male-dominated scene.

Again, inclusivity is what consumers want.

Which actually solidifies JTS' statement of " Call of Duty has enough women playing to justify a targeted ad campaign for CoD to women who play at 20% TAM)."

If her becoming "elite" brings more females to CoD, cool, good for her and them. Ultimately though, such targeted ads and her promotion aren't going to move the demographic needle any appreciable distance.

There's no way to tell until they try it. Everything else is prediction and guesswork. Take the Ford F-150 rainbow paint job 2 years ago, did it attract more diverse consumers? I'd say yes indeedie.

“There’s no way to tell until you try it” is a surefire way to get shot down in a board meeting for any proposal that involves a big ad spend based on speculation or even educated guesses. It’s simply not how it works.

Well with CoD since female players are on the rise, this criteria has a fighting chance.

I guess Ford has enough money to take chances.

originally posted by: ketsuko
a reply to: JohnTitorSociety

I guess this comes from the prevalent attitude that the only reason certain demographics don't do certain things is because of some form of hostility, -ism, or bias against them.

In other words, I am not playing CoD because of some factor quite outside my distaste for the genre in general. I prefer single player story based games

I think that’s a fair assessment. Until I worked on a TON of crpgs I preferred playing crpgs.

Then I preferred the more frenetic multiplayer shooter because it would keep me from nitpicking the game if I was worrying about getting domed and winning.

My general impression after 17 years in the game biz is “people generally play what they want to play” - I played Angry Birds but I’m definitely not in their marketing sked for being a great target for their marketing. I’m too old and don’t spend enough time playing games on a smartphone and don’t spend much if anything on micro transactions in the game.

Not marketing Angry Birds to me/demographically similar cohorts, is the correct decision, those cohorts already had lower adoption and represented a much smaller percentage of TAM than other more broad demo targets.

Not seeing Angry Bird ads didn’t make me feel like the developers didn’t want me to play Angry Birds — I just knew I was not in the top 4 marketing quads for that particular game.

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: JohnTitorSociety

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: Moon68

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: Moon68

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: PorkChop96
a reply to: quintessentone

That's almost like targeting a single "women" for a beer made mainly for men(allegedly) Just kind of dumb

Had to throw that in the ring, I'll be quiet now

Not just any woman, a Call of Duty "ELITE" champion, there is a difference.

Guess you missed this tidbit?

" Call of Duty has enough women playing to justify a targeted ad campaign for CoD to women who play at 20% TAM)."

I guess you did not read the article at the link. Kelsie 'Kels' Krieg disagrees with you and obviously thinks the whole scene can be improved.

“I truly hope me getting this far on the world stage will encourage other females to get involved - I want to rubbish the stereotypes that people have, especially in such a male-dominated scene.

Again, inclusivity is what consumers want.

Which actually solidifies JTS' statement of " Call of Duty has enough women playing to justify a targeted ad campaign for CoD to women who play at 20% TAM)."

If her becoming "elite" brings more females to CoD, cool, good for her and them. Ultimately though, such targeted ads and her promotion aren't going to move the demographic needle any appreciable distance.

There's no way to tell until they try it. Everything else is prediction and guesswork. Take the Ford F-150 rainbow paint job 2 years ago, did it attract more diverse consumers? I'd say yes indeedie.

“There’s no way to tell until you try it” is a surefire way to get shot down in a board meeting for any proposal that involves a big ad spend based on speculation or even educated guesses. It’s simply not how it works.

Well with CoD since female players are on the rise, this criteria has a fighting chance.

I guess Ford has enough money to take chances.

“Take a risk” is never what the Board of Directors wants to hear about an established brand unless the brand is hemorrhaging users/consumers/players/etc.

originally posted by: PorkChop96
a reply to: quintessentone

All most of, if not all of, the companies care about is profit

That is the million dollar question, which ones really care?

originally posted by: JohnTitorSociety

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: JohnTitorSociety

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: Moon68

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: Moon68

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: PorkChop96
a reply to: quintessentone

That's almost like targeting a single "women" for a beer made mainly for men(allegedly) Just kind of dumb

Had to throw that in the ring, I'll be quiet now

Not just any woman, a Call of Duty "ELITE" champion, there is a difference.

Guess you missed this tidbit?

" Call of Duty has enough women playing to justify a targeted ad campaign for CoD to women who play at 20% TAM)."

I guess you did not read the article at the link. Kelsie 'Kels' Krieg disagrees with you and obviously thinks the whole scene can be improved.

“I truly hope me getting this far on the world stage will encourage other females to get involved - I want to rubbish the stereotypes that people have, especially in such a male-dominated scene.

Again, inclusivity is what consumers want.

Which actually solidifies JTS' statement of " Call of Duty has enough women playing to justify a targeted ad campaign for CoD to women who play at 20% TAM)."

If her becoming "elite" brings more females to CoD, cool, good for her and them. Ultimately though, such targeted ads and her promotion aren't going to move the demographic needle any appreciable distance.

There's no way to tell until they try it. Everything else is prediction and guesswork. Take the Ford F-150 rainbow paint job 2 years ago, did it attract more diverse consumers? I'd say yes indeedie.

“There’s no way to tell until you try it” is a surefire way to get shot down in a board meeting for any proposal that involves a big ad spend based on speculation or even educated guesses. It’s simply not how it works.

Well with CoD since female players are on the rise, this criteria has a fighting chance.

I guess Ford has enough money to take chances.

“Take a risk” is never what the Board of Directors wants to hear about an established brand unless the brand is hemorrhaging users/consumers/players/etc.

I guess the Ford's Board of Directors needed revenge because...

According to Ford, "the #VeryGayRaptor was initially created digitally" after someone on social media described a blue-colored version of the popular truck "very gay."

www.out.com...

I guess Ford has enough money to do whatever they want.

Oh, Bently is in on it too.

Not wanting to miss out on celebrating Pride, luxury auto brand Bentley also introduced a rainbow Pride-themed car of their own last year.

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: JohnTitorSociety

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: JohnTitorSociety

originally posted by: ketsuko
We could also talk about the Dove gaming ad in this thread. No, it's not about LGBTQ+BBQ, but it is about a company pandering to slice demographic. In this case, girls who are overweight and want to play overweight game avatars ... to sell soap?

That seems like a good example of a marketing team producing a confusing ad that doesn’t highlight the benefit of the product. I see this specific failure all the time — the ad runs and I have no idea what is being sold, why it is being sold and sometimes it is not even clear what the primary brand is.

I worked as an exec in video games for a long time, we had a game based on a movie that had a 96% male audience. This is insanely high (Call of Duty hovers around 80% last I checked by comparison).

The marketing team wanted to target women gamers for a game with an expected 96% male audience.

I fired them.

What percent of gaming customers and profits did you effectively cancel out?

Zero. Targeting 4% of the audience instead of 96% of the audience is a guaranteed path to failure.

From an arithmetic POV, assuming the new marketing team effectively addressed TAM, the net revenue gain would be 92%.

Imaging targeting female players for Call of Duty (80% male users) using this female player in ads.

"Kelsie Krieg, 22, from Aberdeen, recently made history becoming the first woman to qualify for an elite Call of Duty tournament."

www.thesun.co.uk...

If you didn't, I'd fire you.

I’ve never worked on Call of Duty and you’ve never been in a position to fire me.

Marketing funds are not unlimited, until CoD maximizes its impressions and conversions with its largest cohort it is cost in effective to target 2nd, 3rd, 4th quad.

CoD is a 4 quad tent pole so all the quads will get marketed to (including the 20% of women in the CoD TAM) but the process, if executed properly, locks in the #1 quad (cohort) via repeated impressions and CTAs 7-21 depending on the product and then targets the other 3 quads (which includes the 20% women CoD players in the TAM) and then if there is money left over and you’ve saturated your mainline market, then you can take fliers on guesses and risks.

But not until the beachhead is secure — if CoD doesn’t secure the marketing beachhead thousands of people lose their jobs, men and women, default on the mortgages, lose health benefits and so on.

originally posted by: JohnTitorSociety

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: JohnTitorSociety

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: JohnTitorSociety

originally posted by: ketsuko
We could also talk about the Dove gaming ad in this thread. No, it's not about LGBTQ+BBQ, but it is about a company pandering to slice demographic. In this case, girls who are overweight and want to play overweight game avatars ... to sell soap?

That seems like a good example of a marketing team producing a confusing ad that doesn’t highlight the benefit of the product. I see this specific failure all the time — the ad runs and I have no idea what is being sold, why it is being sold and sometimes it is not even clear what the primary brand is.

I worked as an exec in video games for a long time, we had a game based on a movie that had a 96% male audience. This is insanely high (Call of Duty hovers around 80% last I checked by comparison).

The marketing team wanted to target women gamers for a game with an expected 96% male audience.

I fired them.

What percent of gaming customers and profits did you effectively cancel out?

Zero. Targeting 4% of the audience instead of 96% of the audience is a guaranteed path to failure.

From an arithmetic POV, assuming the new marketing team effectively addressed TAM, the net revenue gain would be 92%.

Imaging targeting female players for Call of Duty (80% male users) using this female player in ads.

"Kelsie Krieg, 22, from Aberdeen, recently made history becoming the first woman to qualify for an elite Call of Duty tournament."

www.thesun.co.uk...

If you didn't, I'd fire you.

I’ve never worked on Call of Duty and you’ve never been in a position to fire me.

Marketing funds are not unlimited, until CoD maximizes its impressions and conversions with its largest cohort it is cost in effective to target 2nd, 3rd, 4th quad.

CoD is a 4 quad tent pole so all the quads will get marketed to (including the 20% of women in the CoD TAM) but the process, if executed properly, locks in the #1 quad (cohort) via repeated impressions and CTAs 7-21 depending on the product and then targets the other 3 quads (which includes the 20% women CoD players in the TAM) and then if there is money left over and you’ve saturated your mainline market, then you can take fliers on guesses and risks.

But not until the beachhead is secure — if CoD doesn’t secure the marketing beachhead thousands of people lose their jobs, men and women, default on the mortgages, lose health benefits and so on.

Your 20% TAM is not stagnant, not with female player number rising constantly.

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: JohnTitorSociety

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: JohnTitorSociety

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: Moon68

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: Moon68

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: PorkChop96
a reply to: quintessentone

That's almost like targeting a single "women" for a beer made mainly for men(allegedly) Just kind of dumb

Had to throw that in the ring, I'll be quiet now

Not just any woman, a Call of Duty "ELITE" champion, there is a difference.

Guess you missed this tidbit?

" Call of Duty has enough women playing to justify a targeted ad campaign for CoD to women who play at 20% TAM)."

I guess you did not read the article at the link. Kelsie 'Kels' Krieg disagrees with you and obviously thinks the whole scene can be improved.

“I truly hope me getting this far on the world stage will encourage other females to get involved - I want to rubbish the stereotypes that people have, especially in such a male-dominated scene.

Again, inclusivity is what consumers want.

Which actually solidifies JTS' statement of " Call of Duty has enough women playing to justify a targeted ad campaign for CoD to women who play at 20% TAM)."

If her becoming "elite" brings more females to CoD, cool, good for her and them. Ultimately though, such targeted ads and her promotion aren't going to move the demographic needle any appreciable distance.

There's no way to tell until they try it. Everything else is prediction and guesswork. Take the Ford F-150 rainbow paint job 2 years ago, did it attract more diverse consumers? I'd say yes indeedie.

“There’s no way to tell until you try it” is a surefire way to get shot down in a board meeting for any proposal that involves a big ad spend based on speculation or even educated guesses. It’s simply not how it works.

Well with CoD since female players are on the rise, this criteria has a fighting chance.

I guess Ford has enough money to take chances.

“Take a risk” is never what the Board of Directors wants to hear about an established brand unless the brand is hemorrhaging users/consumers/players/etc.

I guess the Ford's Board of Directors needed revenge because...

According to Ford, "the #VeryGayRaptor was initially created digitally" after someone on social media described a blue-colored version of the popular truck "very gay."

www.out.com...

I guess Ford has enough money to do whatever they want.

Oh, Bently is in on it too.

Not wanting to miss out on celebrating Pride, luxury auto brand Bentley also introduced a rainbow Pride-themed car of their own last year.

The chances of Ford’s BoD even being aware of this event is near zero. It’s something the marketing team either had leeway to do or didn’t but did it anyway.

The BoD doesn’t really review creative for advertising. They are looking at discounted cash flow statements, total scope of production and marketing, TAM, cost of capital, etc.

Something like this is only going to get BoD attention if they notice blowback (in the numbers or online).

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: JohnTitorSociety

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: JohnTitorSociety

originally posted by: quintessentone

originally posted by: JohnTitorSociety

originally posted by: ketsuko
We could also talk about the Dove gaming ad in this thread. No, it's not about LGBTQ+BBQ, but it is about a company pandering to slice demographic. In this case, girls who are overweight and want to play overweight game avatars ... to sell soap?

That seems like a good example of a marketing team producing a confusing ad that doesn’t highlight the benefit of the product. I see this specific failure all the time — the ad runs and I have no idea what is being sold, why it is being sold and sometimes it is not even clear what the primary brand is.

I worked as an exec in video games for a long time, we had a game based on a movie that had a 96% male audience. This is insanely high (Call of Duty hovers around 80% last I checked by comparison).

The marketing team wanted to target women gamers for a game with an expected 96% male audience.

I fired them.

What percent of gaming customers and profits did you effectively cancel out?

Zero. Targeting 4% of the audience instead of 96% of the audience is a guaranteed path to failure.

From an arithmetic POV, assuming the new marketing team effectively addressed TAM, the net revenue gain would be 92%.

Imaging targeting female players for Call of Duty (80% male users) using this female player in ads.

"Kelsie Krieg, 22, from Aberdeen, recently made history becoming the first woman to qualify for an elite Call of Duty tournament."

www.thesun.co.uk...

If you didn't, I'd fire you.

I’ve never worked on Call of Duty and you’ve never been in a position to fire me.

Marketing funds are not unlimited, until CoD maximizes its impressions and conversions with its largest cohort it is cost in effective to target 2nd, 3rd, 4th quad.

CoD is a 4 quad tent pole so all the quads will get marketed to (including the 20% of women in the CoD TAM) but the process, if executed properly, locks in the #1 quad (cohort) via repeated impressions and CTAs 7-21 depending on the product and then targets the other 3 quads (which includes the 20% women CoD players in the TAM) and then if there is money left over and you’ve saturated your mainline market, then you can take fliers on guesses and risks.

But not until the beachhead is secure — if CoD doesn’t secure the marketing beachhead thousands of people lose their jobs, men and women, default on the mortgages, lose health benefits and so on.

Your 20% TAM is not stagnant, not with female player number rising constantly.

I didn’t say the 20% TAM is stagnant. I haven’t checked it for CoD in several years — it might be 33% for all I know — it’s not publicly available info usually, but it may have been made public in a public corporate call or statement or incidentally in a press release or news interview.

I wouldn’t be surprised if CoD still hovers around 80% men.

But I also wouldn’t be surprised if the numbers have moved a non-trivial amount since I last needed to check for work, and they are hovering around 2:1.

But GTA and other games that are still “hardcore AAA PC + console” have had a much more broad set of demos and CoD for years and years.

CoD isn’t competing in a vacuum. They are competing against everything that is “entertainment.”

Did everyone see Bentley's rainbow edition?

www.bentleymotors.com...

Add Bentley to the list.

Bud: I am jumping off a bridge.
Adidas: Hey, I will follow ya.
Ford: Right behind ya! What could possibly go wrong.


Me: Hello Broker, I want to short some stocks........

originally posted by: charlyv
Bud: I am jumping off a bridge.
Adidas: Hey, I will follow ya.
Ford: Right behind ya! What could possibly go wrong.


Me: Hello Broker, I want to short some stocks........

Do you mean like 'dukes of hazzard' style?

a reply to: quintessentone

Eh, Thelma & Louise

a reply to: quintessentone

Nah, that took talent.

originally posted by: charlyv
a reply to: quintessentone

Nah, that took talent.

So closer to Smokey and the Bandit?

Bentley say: I'm good, no backlash because I'm elite.

a reply to: JohnTitorSociety

Perhaps they all know that the crap is about to hit the fan, so they have decided to go out with a bang.

Nothing to look forward to. Nothing to lose. So going out with a middle finger raised high, and with rainbow colored items left sitting on the shelf or rusting in the fields, might just make them feel better.

a reply to: NightSkyeB4Dawn

That's counter productive. Why be suicidal? Things may be about to go pear shaped, but the economy will go on. It always has. My husband works for a German company that pre-dates WWI. How many times did that one face doom?