Putin Speech on Ukraine at 3AM EST on Agenda Free Tv

What a clown Putin is , nothing but lies and delusional rants from him allways.

a reply to: putnam6

Thanks for all those highlights, I think it did a good job at summing up the speech so I don’t have to watch the whole thing.

This one struck me as the most interesting, though they all offer a good glimpse into the thinking behind the conflict

Putin : The West doesn't give a damn who to bet on in the fight against us. The main thing is that they fight with our country, fulfill their will, serve as a weapon against Russia.

What stuck out to me was the self awareness, introspection, and a level of correctness.

Just odd that they acknowledge that while also playing into it.

a reply to: MykeNukem

Czech Republic, Hungary, Poland, Bulgaria, Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania, Romania, Slovakia, Slovenia, Albania, Croatia, Montenegro, North Macedonia.

And what do all those countries have in common?
I'll save you the bother; they all suffered for years under Russian control and have no desire to experience it again.

They chose to approach NATO because they have a genuine fear of Russian expansionism.

No-one forced them, no-one asked them - they approached NATO.

And as independent countries they have every right, or do you believe Putin has a right to determine their domestic policies?

Ukraine?
Ukraine was unequivocally told that they had no chance of joining NATO for the foreseeable future.
NATO said it would be at least 20 years before they even considered giving them a Membership Action Plan, (MAP).

Sweden and Finland?
Both quite happy sitting on the fence being neutral.....until Putin ordered his troops into Ukraine.

Georgia?
Well, recent Russian activity there hasn't exactly endeared them to the Georgians.

I accept that nothing is entirely black and white in a world full of grey but Putin really is talking #e and to echo what has been said before can go and # himself.

RAND Corporation 2019:

Over Extending and unbalancing Russia

Read carefully, compare to the situation we have today and then somebody should try to tell me again that this all is only Putins fault, that only Putin is the bad guy here. The problem is, there is no good guy or good side in this elitist game of global chess. It´s those evil bastards on top of the pyramid who play us peasants, who create misery and devastation, wars to make profits. And they send us peasants to the battlefields, not themselves, not their own flesh and blood, not their families, not their children. While they hide in their luxury bunkers with the help of blood money they gathered over decades. With the help of all of our tax money, they didn´t ask, they just took and take it to create hell on earth for us peasants. There you can see how stupid we peasants are, paying for our own misery.

Many are simply forced to pay, against their will, and have no other choice, knowing that there is no good side. But many think they are on the right side, following, supporting the good guy, the good side in this evil game. How can somebody support the "leaders" of any side of this evil game, this is something i don´t get into my head.

You just have to be honest with yourself, look at all the facts without prejudice, then you can't really believe you're on the right side, on the good side. No matter which side it is, because in truth there are no longer any different sides at all. There is only them evil bastards on top of the pyramid and us peasants below, who carry those evil bastards.

Maybe we all should simply stop to carry these bastards, worldwide?
Cheers

a reply to: DerBeobachter

Stalin, er - I mean Putin had his reasons?

Everyone has their reasons

I'll say it: only Putin is the bad guy here. His willing minions after him. I say willing for a reason


I don't need to go to your link. He's responsible for all the death and destruction in Ukraine and the deaths of his own countrymen

This whataboutism happening is just embarrassing

We don't live in a black and white world, but sometimes things really are as obvious as they seem

One loser with some serious small dick energy is holding the entire world hostage. Honestly, its pretty simple

a reply to: AugustusMasonicus
And? You need to apply before your application is considered.

Yea, I was just making the point that you don't just decide to join NATO, there is a process.

I wish they would. And anyone else who wants to join. Mutual security is a good thing.

I agree mutual security is a good thing, and I'll add it's worked in the past.

My concern is that there isn't really a security issue at this point, not from any NATO members, anyway. Russia knows what would happen if it attacked a NATO country. I have no problem with what would happen, either.

My other concern is that instead of providing security, we're going to instigate WWIII if NATO get's involved without Ukraine being a member.

I'm not sure what happens if they were made a member while this whole shimozle is going on? I don't think it would be good though.

Other than NATO, I really don't concern myself with it, as I don't consider it my business or NATOs.

I'm sure as soon as hostilities are ended they will have their application presented to the full membership.

I'm hoping hostilities somehow come to an end too. I can't foresee that happening in the near future though, but anything is possible.

From what I can gather you went to Ukraine to help out in some way? I commend you for that and for walking the walk, That earns my respect all day. I'm all about that. That's who really suffers here, is the people. Whether Ukraine or Russia.

My opinions are on the politics, not the people of either country.

originally posted by: MykeNukem
Yea, I was just making the point that you don't just decide to join NATO, there is a process.

So, semantics. Nice.

My concern is that there isn't really a security issue at this point...

Tell that to Finland and Sweden as well as the Baltic states who think otherwise. They've seen this Russian dog and pony show before.

I'm not sure what happens if they were made a member while this whole shimozle is going on?

They won't, this has been made clear.

originally posted by: Thrumbo
a reply to: putnam6

The Biden jokes in this thread had me rolling. So hilarious cant stop laughing

And its like everyday, I read Biden jokes in most threads I read and im always lmao

Thanks guys keep them coming feels like high school again

[/GIANT SARCASM TAG]

Yeah it does feel like high school again, with the class drama queen complaining.

a reply to: AugustusMasonicus
So, semantics. Nice.

Well there is a difference between "apply" and "join".

Call it whatever, but I was just pointing that out.

Tell that to Finland and Sweden as well as the Baltic states who think otherwise. They've seen this Russian dog and pony show before.

That's their prerogative. They have a right to it. Not my business until they're NATO, IMO.

They won't, this has been made clear.

Until then I think NATO should stay out of it. That's always been my opinion.

originally posted by: MykeNukem
Well there is a difference between "apply" and "join".

Not when you know exactly what I was talking about.

That's their prerogative. They have a right to it. Not my business until they're NATO, IMO.

Not according to Putin and his nut jugglers. NATO expansion = bad. Apparently, it's not so bad for the countries that want to apply and join.

Until then I think NATO should stay out of it.

NATO is out of it. The component countries of NATO (and others) are still free to help as they see fit. Just like China and India can take advantage of the situation and milk Russia for cheap energy.

a reply to: AugustusMasonicus
Not when you know exactly what I was talking about.

Maybe other readers didn't though?

No according to Putin and his nut jugglers. NATO expansion = bad. Apparently, it's not so bad for the countries that want to apply and join.

I'd say it's more people that recognize that the motives aren't as pure as they claim. NATO expansion has little to do with Russia anymore IMO.

NATO is[/]i out of it. The component countries of NATO (and others) are still free to help as they see fit. Just like China and India can take advantage of the situation and milk Russia for cheap energy.

Sure, countries can do what they want, I have nothing against that. It's the consequences we all will have to live with that concerns me.

I wouldn't expect anything different from China or India, either. Why wouldn't they? They'll all soon be allies in WWIII probably.

originally posted by: MykeNukem
Maybe other readers didn't though?

I was talking to you.

I'd say it's more people that recognize that the motives aren't as pure as they claim. NATO expansion has little to do with Russia anymore IMO.

Oh, there's another country in the region that impacts the security of Finland, Sweden, The Batlics and Ukraine? Who might that be?

Sure, countries can do what they want, I have nothing against that. It's the consequences we all will have to live with that concerns me.

And my concerns are more about appeasing the crocodile.

a reply to: Spiramirabilis
Trying to see the whole picture is whataboutism? And then you think you need to answer "whataboutism" with whataboutism? Too funny!

Yeah, don´t read links, keep eyes and ears closed and just believe the good lies. And follow your brave and good leader to the abyss where he will push you down to save his ass when the time is right.

You say that we don't live in a black and white world and sometimes things really are as obvious as they seem. If you don´t want to look at the whole picture and only believe into those things brought to your by your leaders propaganda machinery, than of course everything is as obvious as it seems for you. Especially if you don´t accept any other truth than yours or the truth brought to you your leaders propaganda machinery.

And since when is the Ukraine the entire world? I bet a few months ago you didn´t even know where the Ukraine can be found on a globe . Tbh, i see small dicks in suits and ties on all "sides". Some hold these parts of thew world hostage, some other parts. The more i try to find a good side in this evil game, the more i realize that there is no good side, not even sides anymore as i explained before.

But you can only realize this when you are honest with yourself and the reality around you, when look at all the facts without prejudice, when you don´t deny facts that don´t fit into your worldview and maybe shatter your dreams of being always and forever on the good "side".
Cheers

a reply to: AugustusMasonicus
I was talking to you.

Yep. When you said that any country could just decide to "join" NATO, I felt that needed a correction.

What's the big deal?

Oh, there's another country in the region that impacts the security of Finland, Sweden, The Batlics and Ukraine? Who might that be?

Not sure.

The "in the region" qualifier limits my response. There could indeed be countries that impact the security of those other countries, politically at least.

And my concerns are more about appeasing the crocodile.

They used to be a crocodile back in the Cold War era. Now? I'm not so sure who the current crocodile is.

The usual bizarre comedy show from Pooty. Crazy made up stories, the exact opposite to reality and propaganda bordering on the absurd. It's the soviet way and he's still the soviet KGB man.

The audience looked unimpressed with the new propaganda talking points. Apparently now the west started it and Pooty didn't want to invade at all who knew. I guess he was too dumb to thwart the evil west's latest dastardly plan to destroy Russia lol. I guess that's why they all told him not to invade, he had a blocked ear and thought they said invade. Anyway still their fault.

Missing the usual nuke everyone comedy routine I'm disappointed. Pooty looked and sounded a bit weak and no doubt the sharks are circling in the Kremlin. Good times in Russia lol.

a reply to: DerBeobachter

My grandfather was Ukrainian. I have Ukrainian friends

No dice

You have some thinking to do

originally posted by: Kenzo

What a clown Putin is , nothing but lies and delusional rants from him allways.

They seem to enjoy it in Russia. Until they get drafted to the front as cannon fodder that is.

a reply to: DerBeobachter

Maybe we all should simply stop to carry these bastards, worldwide?

Maybe. What would that mean more practically speaking?

originally posted by: MykeNukem
Yep. When you said that any country could just decide to "join" NATO, I felt that needed a correction.

What's the big deal?

It's pedantic.

Not sure.

So besides Russian you're not sure who else is threatening European stability? Is it Andorra? Maybe San Marino? Take a shot.

They used to be a crocodile back in the Cold War era. Now? I'm not so sure who the current crocodile is.

When you invade multiple neighbors over the past couple of decades and take their sovereign territory, you're the crocodile. But they just need some breathing room.

With these great power conflicts, I examine each incident on its own merits.

Putin did the right thing in Syria, where NATO/Israel/US/ Turkey and the Gulf states were willing to allow genocide on the Syrian people to take out Assad. Putin sent Russian troops in to stop that war( which the above powers juiced up and secretly backed the jihadists).

But in this case, Putin is the bad guy in attacking an independent country.

Just as the US was the bad guy in Iraq and Libya, Putin is wrong in this case.

Judge every case on its own moral or immoral merits.