"Cremation of Care" ritual at Bohemian Grove

If that's truly the aim of this little ceremony, which by the way I believe to be much more sinister than enjoying a cup of hot tea in the woods, then I hope they're not successful in cleansing themselves of their sins. I want them to rot in a miserable state of an afterlife, if there is such a thing.

"No Forgiveness (haha), No Salvation (haha)"

Originally posted by nukunuku
im sorry, the stinch of world leaders running naked around the woods, performing pagan rituals and dividing the world so it suits THEM does not go well with my idea of leadership.

Sounds like a bunch of guys goofing off to me. Hi jinks, that is to say.

I am not even a christian, if i were, and i was living in USA i would go completely berserk knowing that this is the kind of thing really goes on behind the curtains!

People don't care, because its just silliness. Alot of people in the US are used to the antics of Greek Fraternities and aren't going to get too concerned about it.

Also, who was at that owl ceremony? I mean, lots of people are associated with the group, fine. But was bush at the ceremony? I don't think that all people who've ever been associated with it go to everything all the time.
Hell, I bet bush did worse just as a regular college student, let along an SNBer, let alone as a BCer.
I recall one frat, for example, that used to have its pledges/initiates carry around a ziplock bag, to classes and to pass off to other initiates, of the senior members poo. Stupid? Heck yeah, and disgusting too. But what can ya say, when guys get together, they get stupid.

I am not sure if you will manage to convince anyone that they do this with good intentions. Have you watched the ritual ?

I've seen a bit of it. That ritual seems to be rather 'solem' tho, yes. THe pictures above however seem to confirm the goofiness of the whole thing tho. Its a mens club, apparently. Guys get silly when they're on their own. Look at college frats.

How exactly will you convince me its not evil

Why would I want to do that? I am not concerned with convincing other people. I am concerned with testing my ideas and seeing if they stand up to others criticism and evidences.

..it friggin looks like a satanic black mass!

So? What of its looks?

How will you convince me these are not mentally disturbed individuals that need professional help? Listen to what theyre saying!
Look at the games theyre playing! Mock children sacriifice, hiding under robes? This is what...A PRANK?

I don't think that the mock funerals and executions can be said to be 'pranks' or hijinx no. I do think that one can participate in those sorts of things and not be a murderer. Life is serious to some, and solemn serious events like these are often needed for individuals to internalize and incorporate that seriousness.

How can you compare budhism to cremation of care

They have buddhist statues there along with their owl statue. Apparently their group maintains an interest in comparative religion and mythology.

Will you try to convince us that cremating your care for nature and others is actually a good thing?

Demonstrate that they are performing the ritual in order to do things that are immoral and hurtful. How many books are out there now about not taking life so seriously and 'not sweating the small stuff'? Creamation of Care means not sweating the small stuff, in one interpretation.

HIGH JINX? Are you mental?

No, are you suffering from mental hysteria or on psychiatric medications?

Nice pics btw, dont forget to post the original flyer for the event, the picture of Reagan and others in the grove

I don't know about that. If you have it, post it.

he doesnt like to run around naked in the woods like the rest of them.

I don't see why it should be that much of a concern. Sounds like typical sorts of stuff on an extended 'guys night out'. Pranks, play-fighting, skits, etc etc. True, the owl ritual and the buddhist ritual and other stuff shows that they take it a bit more seriously and that they have some organization. But, really, I don't see anything going on there that's different from a college frat. Its like a cracked out version of 'Old School'

nerdling
I am perplexed by one thing alone, why has Alex Jones --or anyone else-- never returned?

It looks like its not 'easy' to get access, however thats a good question. I mean, that buddha statue probably isn't there anymore, is the owl? Is it even a statue, or is it a prop? We can see from the photos that at these outings lots of stuff goes on and that it quite possibly changes year to year.

[edit on 15-4-2005 by Nygdan]

Originally posted by nukunuku

Originally posted by sebatwerk
And you should get some conclusive evidence before you claim someting as being fact.

And by the way, I am the boss. But nice try.

Yeah, youre the boss, but you are certainly not THE BOSS....

and evidence is right there, you fail to see it.....youre looking at it, but you obviously dont want to see it....

DENY DENY DENY !

suit yourself, you must have your own reasons for it

I don't see this so-called "proof" because nobody has provided any (REAL proof, that is. Circumstance and heresay is not proof).

So where is it then? Show it to me? I've been very good at admitting I was wrong in the past with regards to certain issues, I certainly have no problem with this. If you show me CONCLUSIVE, UNDENIABLE PROOF then I will simply admit I was wrong. So go ahead, show me this "proof". And please leave out the heresay and assumptions.

Everything that you guys are saying about these "rituals" at the Bohemian Grove" are based completely on heresay! Do you guys realize that you have NO EVIDENCE that these events are in any way satanic, evil, demonic, or any of the other claims you guys made. You guys simply ASSUME so because of how they SEEM, and don't have the sllightest clue of how they really ARE. None of us do, but please understand that nobody here has all the answers, so do not post things as being fact when you really don't know. Do not judge a book by it's cover.

A man having anal sex with another man in a coffin????

Is the lid on the coffin shut when the boinking commences??

That Bohemian Grove stuff is freakin' strange! The only part I've heard about that I like is that you can take a wizz wherever you want. You can probably take a wizz on another member and they won't even care.

Peace

Originally posted by Dr Love
A man having anal sex with another man in a coffin????

Again, do you have evidence of this happening, or is it just a rumor?

Originally posted by sebatwerk
Again, do you have evidence of this happening, or is it just a rumor?

I don't know.............is it? That's what that little thing called a question mark is for.

And no, I personally don't have any evidence of any man boinking another man in a coffin. If I come across some, would you like to see it?

Peace

Noone is denying that what happens in the BG is strange to outsiders. I want to know why everyone automatically assumes that it sinister. Maybe its because it offends the religious beliefs your daddy told you were true and you accepted without argument?

Originally posted by sebatwerk
Everything that you guys are saying about these "rituals" at the Bohemian Grove" are based completely on heresay! Do you guys realize that you have NO EVIDENCE that these events are in any way satanic, evil, demonic, or any of the other claims you guys made. You guys simply ASSUME so because of how they SEEM, and don't have the sllightest clue of how they really ARE. None of us do, but please understand that nobody here has all the answers, so do not post things as being fact when you really don't know. Do not judge a book by it's cover.

Dude with the Illuminati avatar, listen up ok! His name is Alex Jones, yes Alex Jones the NWO conspiracy chaser who's done some remarkable work over the past few years exposing your buddies. If you want hard factual evidence regarding BG satanic acts then simply watch his video ok. It's pagan, it's anti-Christian, which makes it evil to most religious followers of Christ..

Sheesh man, give it a rest.. Big owl, mock sacrafices, skulls, evil napkins it's all there dude.. You're obviously defending your kind. Question is, would you even accept the factual evidence if it was presented you? I doubt it, you would just continue your disinformation objective...

Originally posted by Dr Love

Originally posted by sebatwerk
Again, do you have evidence of this happening, or is it just a rumor?

I don't know.............is it? That's what that little thing called a question mark is for.

And no, I personally don't have any evidence of any man boinking another man in a coffin. If I come across some, would you like to see it?

Peace

The question marks look like they are there not because you are unsure if it happened, but rather because you are questioning is that happening is not sinister or whatever. You just made it sound like it actually happened, that's all.

I've seen the video smart guy, you can't even hear what they are saying. If you took away all the eerie mood music jones put in there, it might not seem quite as scary.

Originally posted by syntaxer
Dude with the Illuminati avatar,

Saying that its an illuminati avatar is like saying your's is a monty python avatar.

If you want hard factual evidence regarding BG satanic acts then simply watch his video ok.

An owl is not satanic. A mock sacrifice is not satanic. Worshiping satan is satanic or being a satanist (which is different and apparently more hedonistic than worshippign satan) can be said to be satanic.

It's pagan, it's anti-Christian, which makes it evil to most religious followers of Christ..

That merely makes most religious followers of christ wrong. SOmething that is paganistic is not necessarily evil, and somethign that its 'anti-christian' is not necessarily evil.

Question is, would you even accept the factual evidence if it was presented you?

So has it or has it not been presented? Lets not pretend that there's anything more than the video here.

Originally posted by syntaxer
Dude with the Illuminati avatar, listen up ok! His name is Alex Jones, yes Alex Jones the NWO conspiracy chaser who's done some remarkable work over the past few years exposing your buddies. If you want hard factual evidence regarding BG satanic acts then simply watch his video ok. It's pagan, it's anti-Christian, which makes it evil to most religious followers of Christ..

Sheesh man, give it a rest.. Big owl, mock sacrafices, skulls, evil napkins

it's all there dude.. You're obviously defending your kind. Question is, would you even accept the factual evidence if it was presented you? I doubt it, you would just continue your disinformation objective...

Do you know what my avatar is!?!? DO YOU HAVE ANY IDEA WHAT YOURE TALKING ABOUT? If not, then don't try to sound like you have all the answers. I am a FREEMASON, nothing to do with Illuminati or Bohemian grove. Got it?

And regarding the Big owl, mock sacrafices, skulls, evil napkins, what's all there is something that SEEMS like it COULD possibly be weird, but there's also more logical, less sinister explanations for those things. Like we said before, all of those things you see in pictures can be explained as being classical themes, plain and simple.

All I am saying is that nobody has HARD EVIDENCE that those things are actually going on. You prefer to take heresay and claim it as fact. I prefer to be sure of what I'm saying, and to be able to support it with fact.

No court anywhere (except maybe in some 3rd world countries) would accept the "evidence" you guys have posted regarding what goes on at the BG. I just want you guys to admit this.

And last thing, I've seen lot's of peoplle being called "'disinformation agents" and be accused of trying to hide or protect something when they don't agree with your guys' views. It's real easy to just accuse someone and take the ignorant way out, isn't it? It's a lot harder to prove your case and have a real discussion based on fact, logic and evidence. How about you be a BIG BOY and discuss this like an adult, not a middle-schooler.

Originally posted by syntaxer
Sheesh man, give it a rest.. Big owl, mock sacrafices, skulls, evil napkins

it's all there dude.. You're obviously defending your kind. Question is, would you even accept the factual evidence if it was presented you? I doubt it, you would just continue your disinformation objective...

Evil Napkins? You bet! Nothing like rounding out an "Illuminati Icebreaker" with the appropriate party details... I've been using these for years:



Though lately I've been strangely compelled to start using these:



I'm not sure why, just a "feeling."

For those interested in a bev nap o'humor:

"Evil Napkins" and more...

Party Planner Monkeys, not just for Bohemian Grove shing-dings anymore…

HAHAHA! Classic!

There are some folks here who need these:





Dude, I have looked into Alex Jones' work, and I gotta say, some of it is quite compelling; some of it is far left field. You have to be careful with guys like Alex. He's got alot to say, and he's got the dough to back it up and keep himself on the air and getting his "message" out, but he puts his own spin on stuff. He uses the dsame tactics he accuses the Illuminati and NWO of using, whether you admit it or not. I have seen it first hand. The stuff he got at BG? Not very conclusive. He has a habit of being a bit of a sensationalist. I have seen his "911: Road to Tyranny" and I gotta tell you, I wasn't all that impressed. Alot of repitition and mood music. It's comparable to "Farenheit 911" though I don't think Alex's venture was quite a laughable as good ol' Micheal's.

Bottom line is, we don't know what goes on there and people that aren't members probably won't. Ever.

P.S. Bangin, this is backwards from the song -> "No Forgiveness (haha), No Salvation (haha)"

Heheh bet you didn't think one of "us" would recognize that, eh?

Personally, I thought "Portrait of an American Family" was by far their best album.

[edit on 4/15/05 by The Axeman]

Sorry, who said Alex Jones added the music, and that you couldn't hear what was actually said?

Its actually rather clear, sure you didn't just skip that part, because it didn't fit in with your beliefs of what businessmen and political leaders are into?

This is, of course, to the person that believes that people at Jonestown actually died from Kool Aid, or thinks its OK to joke that it didn't happen.

News flash, they didn't die from Kool Aid, not everyone, that is for sure. But lets not get into Jonestown, it ain't pretty, and it has had its tracks covered.

As for the Cremation, ask yourself, is this the kind of group that recruits based on how INTO Comparative Religion you are? How much you enjoy spending time with men ONLY, in a 'magickal' setting?

Or do they recruit based on your position, and Bohemian Grove is just where loyalty is ensured? Is it optional? Yeah right... Its a package deal, you get the bad with the good.

And this is where you go to pretend there is no 'downside', kind of interesting, considering you are surrounded by old men, and Male escorts have been hired to... Entertain? Or just serve?

Its obvious, the ritual is meant to bring them together as a group, and to serve as a sort of protection from someone in the group selling the rest out. Therefore, ALL must be put in comprosing situations, which they agree to willingly, as it happens to everyone. Its all a matter of taste, hence the Male escorts?

First you call me ignorant for having believing that some of the people at Jonestown died from drinking Kool-Aid, then you say that not "all" of them died that way... WTF? I never said they did, nor did I ever claim to be an expert on the Jonestown Massacre. I just used it as a avatar because I thought it was a fitting metaphor for denying ignorance. And tell me where I ever claimed that it never happened???

As for alex jones adding music? Watch the Dark Secrets trailer... he added horror movie music to advertise his video... The music playing during the actual ritual is a wonderful classical piece called "In The Hall of the Mountain King" by Edvard Grieg. Its quite well known, I heard it first in music class in elementary school.

[edit on 15-4-2005 by JonestownRed]

i will in no way try to prove anything to anyone here, as i said, plenty of evidence floating around for everybody to see. And dont talk crap about my religious beleifs as i am not religious per se, never once been to a church.
But my eyes are wide open, and i can still separate good from evil when i see it.

If you can relate to this kind of rituals and call it pranks and jinxes , thats fine with me, but i dont think this kind of behaviour is to be expected from people in high places in this society. If you dont mind your leaders erasing their conciousness FINE....they will pay their dues anyway, care on not care.

Democracy? I DONT THINK SO!


Known Members of Bohemian Grove

Both George Bushes
Ronald Reagan
Henry Kissinger
Casper Weinberger
Dick Cheney
Malcom Forbes
Stephen Bechtel (Bechtel Corp.)
James Baker
David Rockefeller
Tom Johnson (President of CNN and former publisher of LA Times.
William Randolph Hearst Jr.
Jack Howard
Charles Scripps (Of the Scripps-Howard Newspaper publishers)
Walter Cronkite (On the CBS board of management)

I am sorry i can not provide Senrak with written statements from all mentioned above, they were busy at the time



WHAT IS WRONG ABOUT THE GROVE:

"What's not right about this? When powerful people work together, they become even more powerful. The Grove membership is wealthy, and becoming more so, while the middle class is steadily becoming poorer. This close-knit group determines whether prices rise or fall (by their control of the banking system, money supply, and markets), and they make money whichever way markets fluctuate. They determine what our rights are and which laws have effect, by appointing judges. They decide who our highest officials shall be by consensus among themselves, and then selling candidates to us via the media which they own. Important issues and facts are omitted from discussion in the press, or slanted to suit their goals, but they are discussed frankly at the Grove. Is there true democracy when so much power is concentrated in so few hands? Is there any real difference between the public and private sectors when cabinet members come from the boardrooms of large corporations? Is the spending of billions on weapons, which are by consensus no longer needed, really the will of the people? Or is it the will of General Electric, General Dynamics, and the other weapons contractors represented at the Grove? "

above is from:
(www.sonomacountyfreepress.com...)

MORE FACTS:

The San Francisco Bohemian Club is unique among private men's clubs in that it holds an annual 16-day summer encampment where the 2,400 members are free to invite several hundred distinguished business associates and guests from around the world. Long days of glad-handing, off-the-record political discussions, government policy reviews, and the building of business friendships serve to facilitate consensus and ease of interaction among some of the top governmental and business leaders in the world. The collective corporate stock ownership by members and guests conservatively exceeds $100 billion.

On June 4, 1994 a presentation at the Grove from a University of California Berkeley professor stressed that, elites are important and must set the values for society that are translated into "standards of authority," and that elites cannot allow the "unqualified masses" to carry out policy. The speech was given an enthusiastic standing ovation by the over 1,000 men present and seemed to represent the feelings of many club members.

The Bohemian Club's summer encampment is the institutionalized embodiment of elite class privilege, a de facto celebration of race and gender exclusiveness, and a slap in the face to democratic process in the United States. Institutions of elite privilege like the San Francisco Bohemian Club run counter to the core American values of equality, due process and political openness. Americans deserve a public apology from the Bohemian

above is from www.counterpunch.org...
author Peter Phillips is a Professor of Sociology and Department Chair at Sonoma State University

GOOD LINK

www.sonomacountyfreepress.com...

a dissertation done by a student on the "sociology" of men's club's. The subject of the dissertation is the Bohemian Grove.

www.angelfire.com...





TRANSCRIPT OF THE RITUAL FOR THOSE THAT CANT HEAR IT:

The Owl is in His leafy temple
Let all within the grove be reverent before Him.
Lift up your heads oh ye trees
And be lifted up ye everlasting spires
For behold here is bohemia's shrine
And holy are the pillars of this house.

Weaving spiders come not here!

Hail, Bohemians!
With the ripple of waters
The song of birds
Such music as inspires the sinking soul
Do we invite you into Midsummer's joy.
The sky above is blue and sown with stars
The forest floor is heaped with fragrant grit
The evening's cool kiss is yours
The campfire's glow
The birth of rosy fingered dawn.
For behold, here is Bohemia's shrine
And holy are the pillars of his house
Shake off your sorrows with the city's dust
And cast to the winds the cares of life.
But memories bring back the well-loved names of gallant friends
Who knew and loved this grove
Dear boom companions of a long ago
Aye, let them join us in this ritual!
And not a piece be empty in our midst.
All of these battles to hold
In this gray autumn of the world
Or in the springtime of your heart.

Attend our tale
Gather ye forest folks!
And cast your spells over these mortals
Touch their world-blind eyes with carry-on
Open their eyes to fancy
Follow the memories of yesterday
And seal the gates of sorrow.

It is a dream
And yet, not all a dream
Dull Care in all of his works
Harbored it
As vanished Babylon and goodly Tyre
So shall they also vanish
But the wilding rose blows on the broken battlements of Tyre
And moss rends the stones of Babylon
For beauty is eternal
And we bow to beauty everlasting
For lasting happiness we turn our eyes to one alone,
And she surrounds you now.
Great nature, refuge of the weary heart,
And only balm to breasts that have been bruised.
She hath cool hands for every fevered brow
And gentlest silence for the troubled soul.
Her councils are most wise
She healeth well
Having such ministries as calm and sleep
She is ever faithful
Other friends may fail
But seek ye her in any quiet place
Smiling, she will rise and give to you her kiss
So must ye come as children
Little children that believe do not ever doubt her beauty or her faith
Nor deem her tenderness can change or die
Bohemians and priests!
The desperate call of heavy hearts is answered.
By the power of your fellowship, Dull Care is slain
His body has been brought yonder to our funeral pyre
To the joyous singings of a funeral march;
Our funeral pyre awaits the corpse of Care
O thou, thus ferried across the shadowy tide
In all the ancient majesty of death
Dull Care, ardent enemy of beauty
Not for thee the forgiveness or the restful grave
Fire shall have its will of thee
And all the winds make merry with thy dust
Bring fire!

Fools!
Fools!
Fools!
When will ye learn
That me ye cannot slay?
Year after year ye burn me in this grove
Lifting your puny shouts of triumph to the stars.
When again you turn your faces to the marketplace
Do you not find me waiting as of old?
Fools!
Fools!
Fools to dream you conquer care.

Say Thou mocking spirit!
It is not all a dream
We know thou waiting for us
When this out sylvan holiday has ended
We shall meet thee and fight thee as of old
And some of us prevail against thee
And some thou shall destroy
But this too we know
Year after year within this happy grove
Our fellowship bans thee for a space
Thine malevolence which would pursue us here
Has lost its power under these friendly trees.
So shall we burn thee once again this night
And, with the flames that eat thine effigy
We shall read the sign
Midsummer sets us free!

Ye shall burn me once again!
Not with these flames!
Which hither ye have brought
From regions where I reign
Ye fools and priests
I spit upon your fire!

O Owl! Prince of all mortal wisdom
Owl of Bohemia, we beseech thee
Grant us thy council

No fire…
No fire…
No fire…
Let it be in the world
Where care is nourished
On the hates of men
And drive Him from this grove.
One flame alone must light this fire
One flame alone must light this fire
A pure eternal flame
At last, within the lamp of Fellowship
Upon the altar of Bohemia.

O Great Owl of Bohemia!
We thank thee for thy adjuration.
Begone detested care!
Begone!
Once more, we banish thee!
Begone Dull Care!
Fire should have its will of thee!
Begone Dull Care!
And all the winds make merry with thy dust
Hail, fellowship's eternal flame!
Once again Midsummer sets us free!



OH MY THEYRE TALKING ABOUT AN OWL AND BABYLON

there goes that "its not an owl" statement....



pic:




here are some of your "leaders" having a nice cup of tea in the grove...proof that the big honchos DO go there.....and i doubt they leave at dawn

DIP THOSE COOKIES



Look, im not saying that Alex J is 100% right or anything, i am not a sensationalist, but i simply cant think that whats going on there is politically correct in any way.

now im going to get my medicine, thanx for reminding me Nygdan
[edit on 16-4-2005 by nukunuku]
[edited for abusive statement - nygdan]

[edit on 16-4-2005 by Nygdan]

Just the fact that world leaders, including our own freakin' Presidents, are participating in a ritual like this is cause for concern. If it's no big deal, why shouldn't the public have the right to know what's going on if they want to?
Mock sacrifices (real ones have been alleged) and worshiping an owl while wearing black hoods???

I wonder what the prerequisites are for becoming a member?

Peace

Originally posted by nukunuku

Democracy? I DONT THINK SO!

Democracy is defined by voting/representation, napkins and dancing have nothing to do with it either way.

Known Members of Bohemian Grove

How are they known members? What is a 'member' anyway? Do they attend many meetings and pay dues? Or were they just seen there once? Do they consider themselves members or do the other members consider them as such? If there is a photo showing the bushes there, were they members? Or were they guests of freinds in it? Or were they there because, well, what do politicians do if not attend social events?

The Grove membership is wealthy, and becoming more so, while the middle class is steadily becoming poorer.

The wealthy allways become more wealthy (well, more or less). You are ascibing a sinister slant to something that is not sinister.

This close-knit group determines whether prices rise or fall (by their control of the banking system, money supply, and markets),

Demonstrate that they have control of 'the banking system'. Define 'the banking system' and how it can 'make prices rise and fall'.

They determine what our rights are and which laws have effect, by appointing judges.

Judges in the US are voted on by the public, and federal judges are usually voted on by congress. Those judges have to work within the precedent of caselaw and the rule of law itself.

They decide who our highest officials shall be by consensus among themselves,

The BC? You are saying that the BC people are the secret sinister rulers of all that is?

there goes that "its not an owl" statement

Who said that the giant owl statue is not an owl? The babylonians did not worship moloch, a group of hebrews did.

here are some of your "leaders" having a nice cup of tea in the grove...proof that the big honchos DO go there.....a

And? Are they guests? members? Leaders of the group? Any pics of them doing anything more sinister than having tea? Are you suggesting that they are discussing how to manipulate the whole world right then and there?