Cities in Europe and Britain may be under attack

a reply to: RussianTroll

You are right about the proxy war.

However Russia is dirt poor compared to NATO and they will go broke fighting long before NATO members even blink at the money they are spending fighting Russia.

Did Russia forget when they lost the last proxy war against the U.S. in Afghanistan? 🤣

Now imagine if NATO were to get involved directly. Bro NATO would obliterate Russia very easily and quickly. Putin likes to point out his ICBM's but the U.S. isn't worried because those missiles would have to penetrate not one but two of the world's most advanced and effective missile defense systems.

The amount of ICBM's that would actually make it through would be trivial. However the retaliatory strike by the U.S. and its allies would completely destroy Russia back to the stone age.

a reply to: Alien Abduct

The USA only has a limited ability to destroy incoming ICBM Alien Abduct.

Russia is estimated to have around 6000 nuclear warheads.

There is no missile defence system in existence that's a match against such a large number of incoming targets.

Which is precisely the kind of attack that Russia would mount.

Your correct all the same the rest of the world would indeed return the favour and glass Russia.

But the fact of the matter is the anti ballistic missile systems we have in place would be lucky to destroy 10%/20% of the incoming warheads.

a reply to: andy06shake


That we know of.

The U.S. has a pretty large black budget and certain topics like subs, EW, and missile defense are never discussed by those that would know what we actually have deployed.

Unlike russia, we don't brag about our latest gear and parade it through the streets to strike fear in our neighbors.

Likely still nowhere near enough though.

a reply to: PatriotGames4u

Its not something that's should ever be put to the test PatriotGames4u put it that way.

My understanding is that current US systems for intercepting intercontinental ballistic missiles cannot be completely relied upon to counter even a limited nuclear strike.

You might stop the likes of what North Korea would lob in your direction but not any sort of Russian first strike swarm attack.

As to what's to be had black budget wise, it remains to be seen.

We would stop more of there's than they did of ours, so there is that.

My island gets glassed form one end to the next with just one Russian ICBM plus accompanying warhead payload, so we are toast, our subs would return the favour all the same.

a reply to: andy06shake

Agreed.

I'm not claiming anything different, only that none of us knows what our actual capabilities are.

As it should be.

a reply to: PatriotGames4u

originally posted by: PatriotGames4u
a reply to: andy06shake

Agreed.

I'm not claiming anything different, only that none of us knows what our actual capabilities are.

As it should be.

We also don't know how incapable the Russian nuclear force is. The UK with almost twice the GDP struggles to pay for a nuclear force a fraction of the size of Russia.

Given the abject failure of Russias conventional forces its difficult to see how Russia has managed to maintain its theoretical nuclear capability.

That said of course even a few successfully launched ICBMs could seriously ruin a lot of people day.

a reply to: ScepticScot


Agreed.

a reply to: ScepticScot

Well if Russia's ICBM are anything like there APC and tanks there is not much to worry about.

Jokes aside through they just tested there newest nuclear launch toys last week and it seem to have performed as planned.

Say they only managed to get 20% of the warheads up and away, that's still about 1200 nukes incoming.

Then we launch, and ours do work, everybody is still pan bread on this little island ScepticScot, one Russian Satan 2 plus accompanying payload is all it takes to make Scotland go bye'bye, same with the majority of the rest of the island.

I wonder if Ukraine would ever consider taking the fight to Russian soil?
It would certainly infuriate Putin, and raise the stakes somewhat.

Also, the Russian posturing is quite funny when you realise that they are having trouble with Ukraine on its own.

Now, imagine highly motivated troops from Poland and the Baltic States who are concerned about Russian expansion.
Then add in the full scale deployment of all U.S, British, French, assets just by themselves.
Russian troops, supplies, motorised units, and, most importantly, morale, would be destroyed.

Let's hope it doesn't get to that...

a reply to: Godabove09


Ukraine is already conducting small attacks on critical military sites in russia's western region, but nobody else is getting involved unless the putin madman hurls nukes or invades a NATO country.

a reply to: Godabove09

Think that's already happened Godabove09 with oil storage depot and supply lines.

Russian don't seem none to happy about it.

See they are up for dishing it out, but spit the dummy out when Ukraine hit them square in the puss back.

Comical really. LoL

I guess I was suggesting hitting Russian cities with air power (if that's even possible) and incursions into the bordering regions.

Which, as the posts above intimate, is already happening to a degree.

originally posted by: andy06shake
a reply to: Godabove09

Think that's already happened Godabove09 with oil storage depot and supply lines.

Russian don't seem none to happy about it.

See they are up for dishing it out, but spit the dummy out when Ukraine hit them square in the puss back.

Comical really. LoL

Yes, if you attack a person's homeland you should fully expect for your own to be at risk.

a reply to: Godabove09

Wont get any disagreement from me on that score.

Just a shame people have to die for Putin's wet dream aka a return of Russia to some kind of former glory that's never apt to materialise.

originally posted by: Alien Abduct
a reply to: RussianTroll

The amount of ICBM's that would actually make it through would be trivial. However the retaliatory strike by the U.S. and its allies would completely destroy Russia back to the stone age.

Just one nuke getting through is not trivial, especially if it starts WW3 with nukes going off everywhere. Once the first one goes off, it may be a free for all with Israel-Iran exchanges and others. The more retaliation, the more fallout there will be around the globe.
Don't expect some miracle defense system to be able to cope with 6,000 warheads plus decoys.

originally posted by: Godabove09
I guess I was suggesting hitting Russian cities with air power (if that's even possible) and incursions into the bordering regions.

Which, as the posts above intimate, is already happening to a degree.

The Russians control the air, for the most part, and only cruise missiles or artillery of some sort would likely have a chance of attacking. The loss of Ukrainian aircraft to Russian fighters has reduced the ability for ground attack and the S-400 and S-500 air defense systems are among the most advanced in the world.

originally posted by: pteridine

originally posted by: Godabove09
I guess I was suggesting hitting Russian cities with air power (if that's even possible) and incursions into the bordering regions.

Which, as the posts above intimate, is already happening to a degree.

The Russians control the air, for the most part, and only cruise missiles or artillery of some sort would likely have a chance of attacking. The loss of Ukrainian aircraft to Russian fighters has reduced the ability for ground attack and the S-400 and S-500 air defense systems are among the most advanced in the world.

Ah yes the dreaded S 400,and 500. that can be defeated with small drones that are very hard to target. Or overwhelm with swarm attacks.

originally posted by: yuppa

originally posted by: pteridine

originally posted by: Godabove09
I guess I was suggesting hitting Russian cities with air power (if that's even possible) and incursions into the bordering regions.

Which, as the posts above intimate, is already happening to a degree.

The Russians control the air, for the most part, and only cruise missiles or artillery of some sort would likely have a chance of attacking. The loss of Ukrainian aircraft to Russian fighters has reduced the ability for ground attack and the S-400 and S-500 air defense systems are among the most advanced in the world.

Ah yes the dreaded S 400,and 500. that can be defeated with small drones that are very hard to target. Or overwhelm with swarm attacks.

All defense systems can be defeated with a time on target attack. The problem for the Ukrainians may be executing the operations. Drones are size limited and enough throw weight will be needed to effect significant damage. The logistics and planning of such an operation may be difficult given the command structure of the Ukranian forces, at this point, and their likely preoccupation with survival.

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