Student loan problem. My solution for republicans to adopt

a reply to: iwanttobelieve70

We don't have a student loan problem.

We have a "paying it back" problem.

#TruthBomb

/thread

a reply to: iwanttobelieve70

Bits of paper and badges will never hold a candle to EXPERIENCE.

Get some, get momentum, and show the world what you are REALLY made of.

Education is the expectations of others forced on gullible minds because parents are often useless.

Thank you Xtrozero and TheRedneck.

From the dissertation:

I look at the costumes of drag kings in contemporary drag king cabaret and at women’s prison uniforms in the context of federal incarceration as material sites where dress, desire, and dance come together in U.S. statecrafting.

I can admit that American science has gone so far forward as Newton never dreamed.

I certainly don't think school is for everyone and there are trade schools, which end up usually being a well paid career. Some jobs like mine in the corporate side of the auto industry require a degree just to be hired, but honestly my previous work experience was wayyy more beneficial.

My oldest was approached for a job when she was just out of high school and in a media arts type of school, she was approached by a customer who owned a business while she was managing a fast food place. At 25 she now makes 67,000 and recently left there for another company that offered her what she asked for comparable to what she was making already and still did not require a degree. I think it's just luck sometimes. She is considering getting a degree still though because so many places do require them.

My youngest with college and law school will be looking at huge loans and her biggest concern is paying them off.

I think a set lower interest is a good idea for loans.

a reply to: TheRedneck

Well rounded education?

I would not agree with that one.

Half of the classes needed for a degree are a jobs program to teach the semi useless elective.

My daughter recently received her B.S. in nursing, half of her classes were useless credit time wasters required so that the institution can make more money and a jobs program for those teaching useless or semi-useless classes.

Well rounded now means indoctrinated.

This is a solution looking for a problem that does not exist.

If you do not want student loan/debt then do not go to school. Simple.

a reply to: Xtrozero

Well ya, but you still got an eng degree, how about Hospitality and Tourism degree with an average pay of 24k per year.

That would have to be some pretty cheap courses.

TheRedneck

originally posted by: Xtrozero
a reply to: TheRedneck


Well ya, but you still got an eng degree, how about Hospitality and Tourism degree with an average pay of 24k per year.

Yea, there are tons of jobs out there that people with degrees are doing that they shouldn’t be. You don’t need a degree to check people into a room or deposit your check at the bank. Those people wouldn’t be getting worthless degrees if they had to be judged on their ability to pay the loan back.

It would not be a bad thing for diploma mills to close up. Go to work, learn a trade, join the military and get our country back before we turn into Japan.

I got a B.S. and an M.S. and paid zero dollars out of pocket, options are out there for people to get a degree and pay little to nothing for it.

To many want the "college experience", and that is what they end up paying for.

Its not all on the kids, they are young, the parents should know better but *shrugs* what do I know, I am an over educated idiot.

a reply to: infolurker

Well rounded education?

I would not agree with that one.

Half of the classes needed for a degree are a jobs program to teach the semi useless elective.

Oh, how many times I have heard that!

What you are espousing is the biggest threat to academia IMO: the belief that academia only exists to make money. People go after a degree solely because it will help them make money, find a better job, get ahead in the world. Those things are fine, of course, but you will find that money is not the end-all, be-all of life. Sure, you'll get that job, but can you hold it? Advance? Will it make you happy?

So far I have never seen it happen.

On the other hand, I have known those who sought to learn for the sake of learning. They tend to do quite well, even when they learn through other venues than college. They get the good job, too, and they often advance farther and are happier in life.

And yet, the misconception persists... go to college, pass the tests, get the paper, get the job, make lots of money, and one will be happy by default. That's wrong. Seek happiness, seek knowledge, seek wisdom, and all those minor things will come to you of their own accord. We have turned life backwards.

Now it is going to turn us backwards. But I digress...

Those who concentrate in depth of knowledge and ignore width of knowledge will never understand the potential of that knowledge. They cannot, because everything else is unknown to them. They will forever be dependent on those who hold the knowledge they never gained, just as others with different knowledge are dependent on them. None will ever be truly free or truly happy.

So you disagree with all that? Then we'll have to agree to disagree.

TheRedneck

a reply to: PolyATS

There are other ways to go to school. I finished my BSEE degree without one red cent of student debt.

I had to work long hours... I ate many vienna sausages and ramen noodles... I did without many things, but I walked across that stage, took my degree from the President of the University and shook his hands as debt-free as i was when I first walked onto campus unemployed and broke. The first two years of classes were at a community college; the last two were at a prestigious Engineering University. And I hung that degree on my wall right beside the honors I also received.

It's a question of willpower. Is one willing to make the sacrifices necessary?

TheRedneck

originally posted by: TheRedneck
a reply to: Xtrozero

Well ya, but you still got an eng degree, how about Hospitality and Tourism degree with an average pay of 24k per year.

That would have to be some pretty cheap courses.

TheRedneck

Well they are free, its called high school...lol

originally posted by: iwanttobelieve70

Yea, there are tons of jobs out there that people with degrees are doing that they shouldn’t be. You don’t need a degree to check people into a room or deposit your check at the bank. Those people wouldn’t be getting worthless degrees if they had to be judged on their ability to pay the loan back.

It would not be a bad thing for diploma mills to close up. Go to work, learn a trade, join the military and get our country back before we turn into Japan.

I higher non-dgree people based on skills and I start them at 85 to 90k, as example.

A degree is just a signal to employers that you can set a goal and finish and have a minimum level of intelligence. It is just a way to weed out far more applicants than positions available. Degrees aren't needed for the vast majority of jobs.

I work in business and finance. You can literally go to a top Wall Street firm out of college and not know a lick of finance. They will teach out everything you need to know. I worked at a management consulting firm. Even though I majored in business, the firm still hired pretty much any major as long as the candidate was intelligent. We had a week or two training on the basics of finance and other skills needed. It isn't rocket science.

a reply to: iwanttobelieve70

We don't have a student loan problem nearly as much as we have a paying your debts problem.

If you willingly take on a debt knowing the burden it will place on you and can not pay it back, that is your problem, not society's problem. If you take on that debt with the intent of getting a degree ins some ridiculous woke bs that will offer you little to no career paths then you deserve to be in debt the rest of your life.

Go woke, go broke.

This is a good opportunity to turn this country around if we do the things I said. Give the people an out that need it and put the country to work while sticking it to the institutions that lean so far left they fall over.

a reply to: iwanttobelieve70

I have 2 thoughts to add to this conversation:

- People are right...the cost of living has shot up, employment shifted from manufacturing and industrial to service by and large, and no one really warned folks about this when they continued to invest in industries that were thriving but still being killed by our government and its trade deals. A big part of this falls on Clinton for his investment of effort into China without safeguarding the US economy and labor market. It should be illegal to offshore jobs for less than American workers make. I know that will come across as unpopular to many...but thats alright.

- The failure here lies on 2 groups: the government, and the banks. These are the 2 people that pulled the rug out (in the former case) and kept feeding cash into dead end degree fields (the latter). If a banker is going to dig into my rectum to loan me cash to buy a house, why would they then turn around and give a student loan to someone for a degree in Women's Studies?

Something is broke. Solutions should be offered.

a reply to: Xtrozero

High school is a joke: free day-care for teenagers.

During my first two years of college, I worked for the college as a math tutor. I was available for higher math, but the vast, vast majority of what i did was tutor those who had graduated high school and still couldn't do a lick of math. They didn't even have the math skills necessary for non-STEM degrees, like nursing and criminal studies. it seemed like every new student, regardless of high school grades or type of degree, had to take remedial math.

I had one guy who literally couldn't add two two-digit numbers together... high school graduate. Of course, when I got through with him, he was ahead of schedule and pretty darn good at math; he had an aptitude for it, but had never had it really taught to him. I see him every once in a while in town.

If anyone wants to point fingers at "useless" classes, there you go. They're useless only because the previous educators didn't educate, though.

Why do you think employers look for more than just a high school diploma now? There are some seriously incapable individuals sporting those diplomas!

TheRedneck

a reply to: TheRedneck

High school is a joke: free day-care for teenagers.

During my first two years of college, I worked for the college as a math tutor. I was available for higher math, but the vast, vast majority of what i did was tutor those who had graduated high school and still couldn't do a lick of math. They didn't even have the math skills necessary for non-STEM degrees, like nursing and criminal studies. it seemed like every new student, regardless of high school grades or type of degree, had to take remedial math.

Want to hear something weird? I was terrible at math, I mean terrible as in bringing home a D- in an Asian household.
I remember being grounded for 3 months and wasn't allowed to date. My parents hired a tutor, and my grade............
went DOWN. They were besides themselves.

Now here's the really weird part. For most of my career I was in IT in a "bean counter" math type of role. Not to toot my own horn but I was amazing at it. Somehow my lack of high school math made no difference working for Big Tech, Big Pharma and one of the biggest banks on earth. Maybe because I was so horrible at "math" in the way it was taught in school made me amazing in the real world aspect of math, statistics, trends and abstract patterns, etc. I'm sure I have some form of Autism or ADD, and I know one hilarious thing about my work.... Nobody could replicate it! It was so so simple for me, but impossible for everyone else. I was also able to identify patterns very easily and could see mistakes a mile away. That always got me brownie points.

Long story short, maybe high school math is overrated?

a reply to: JAGStorm

Math is simply taught incorrectly. We start out telling kids they have to memorize these tables... addition, multiplication... or else. So they do, and it is arduous. Then we suddenly start telling them to use reason and logic instead of memorization, or else. Does anyone explain why the whole concept changed form memorization to logic? Nope, just do as you're told.

When I was tutoring, the idea of individualized learning came out. It was a good thing. Students would fill out a quick survey at the beginning of class, the "which choice do you prefer? A or B" type thing. We were then able to identify how they learned in an individual level, and could apply that in our explanations.

Then a relative asked me to tutor his young son (3rd grade if I remember correctly) in math. Of course I was happy to. Well, turns out public school figured out individualized learning was a thing too... but then they went crazy. Individualized learning is supposed to let tutors and teachers know what methods may be easiest for students to understand, and they can then focus on those specific learning styles to help the student. But pubic school decided somehow that since there are all these different learning styles, everyone should learn them all!

That is the exact opposite of what it is to be used for!

So instead of helping students by individualizing their learning, it made every child struggle to learn how everyone else might learn, which meant each one was held back by being forced into learning styles that didn't work for them.

I have said it before many times and I will say it again: mathematics is the simplest course one will ever take. It's just a language, and one that is very powerful and very easy to understand. I can take anyone who wants to learn, and in six months have them loving math and being good at it. Anyone.

TheRedneck